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Tags Amanda Knox , Italy cases , Meredith Kercher , murder cases , Raffaele Sollecito

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Old Yesterday, 09:40 AM   #2201
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Originally Posted by Bill Williams View Post
Neither of them had bloody footprints at the crimescene.
Do have a look at the luminol evidence.
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Old Yesterday, 09:40 AM   #2202
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Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
According to the Florence written reasons 10 Feb 2017 and as upheld by the final Supreme Court, he lied to police at least five times, changing his story more times than Trump at a Russiagate meeting.

He has only himself to blame if he got arrested.
None of this addresses the list of your falsehoods which Welshman has compiled.
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Old Yesterday, 09:58 AM   #2203
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Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
Do have a look at the luminol evidence.
You keep recycling long-since discreditted evidence. There is no luminol evidence.
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Old Yesterday, 10:33 AM   #2204
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Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
Your citation will come soon.
When is "soon"?
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Old Yesterday, 10:35 AM   #2205
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Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
Do have a look at the luminol evidence.
Luminol is NOT evidence for the presence of blood. It is only a presumptive test for blood. You know this, and you dismiss without reason the contradiction of the negative TMB test results and the absence of confirmatory tests for blood.

If Stefanoni absolutely believed that the Luminol identified actual blood stains she should have performed a confirmatory test but she didn't. Should be remembered by you that Stefanoni herself said under oath that it wasn't blood.

But you won't. You will ignore all the facts and repeat your lies for the ten thousandth time.
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Old Yesterday, 10:38 AM   #2206
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Originally Posted by Stacyhs View Post
Did RS ever deny listening to music that morning? Or did he just not mention it, perhaps thinking it was inconsequential since it had nothing to do with his whereabouts? Hell, if asked by the police what time I got up that morning, I doubt I'd mention the 4 AM trip to the toilet.

I'll ask you again: Do you really believe that, 2.5 years after the definitive judgment, a now DEFUNCT PR company is paying people to "reinvent" the reputation of an EX-client? Really?

And please stop with the "Marriott crib sheet" nonsense. It got old a long time ago as most inanities do after being heard several times.
Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
No, you cannot blame the police this time. This fake alibi is 100% at Raff's door.

As for blaming the police, you cannot deny that RS had no lawyer present which was required by law and that the interrogation was not recorded against all sense, logic, and the recent police recording history. You cannot deny that his "confession" included events proved to have happened the night before.

He lied. He gave police a provably fake alibi.

He never corrected it.

His phone and his PC were switched off the duration of the murder and for the rest of the night until next morning.

If he is Amanda's alibi, then guess what, both their alibis are provably fake.

Stop justifying the unjustifiable.
You failed to address my questions, instead misdirecting to unrelated topics. How about answering my questions?

1. Did RS ever deny listening to music that morning?

2. Do you really believe that, 2.5 years after the definitive judgment, a now DEFUNCT PR company is paying people to "reinvent" the reputation of an EX-client? Really?

Last edited by Stacyhs; Yesterday at 10:58 AM.
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Old Yesterday, 10:46 AM   #2207
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Originally Posted by Stacyhs View Post
Um..no, Marasca did not.

Both convicting courts were overturned. It doesn't matter what they "found".
If tertiary, or even secondary, transfer was "ruled out" then explain how the DNA of at least two other men were found on that bra hook. Did they also touch MK's bra?
If tertiary, or secondary, transfer was ruled out, then why did Marasca find that NO evidence was found of either RS or AK in MK's bedroom? He obviously ruled on the side of C&V's findings and not Stefanoni's.
Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
As Boemia, expert shoe/foot and fingerprint analyst testified and as submitted by the prosecution, there was a ladies size 36 - 38 clear shoeprint on the pillow underneath the body.

Boemia used proper measuring equipment and grids, Vinci paid by the defence had nothing but conjecture.

As you can see it is a single footprint with clear outlines (not a man's half a footprint) with a heel measuring 40mm. This is the size associated with 36 - 38 in women's trainers.

Amanda Knox takes size 37.


There is her personal calling card in the murder room.
Sigh. Once again you avoid directly answering my questions:

1) If tertiary, or even secondary, transfer was "ruled out" then explain how the DNA of at least two other men were found on that bra hook. Did they also touch MK's bra?

2) If tertiary, or secondary, transfer was ruled out, then why did Marasca find that NO evidence was found of either RS or AK in MK's bedroom?

Boemia was paid by the prosecution so your innuendo that he is somehow more reliable/honest than Vinci is irrelevant. But nice try. Your allegation that Vinci had nothing but "conjecture" is not supported by the facts. Marasca/Bruno does not accept that is Amanda's shoeprint as they found no evidence of her in the bedroom at all which indicates they rejected Boemia. Who, by the way, was a fingerprint expert, not a footprint expert.

Now how about answering what I originally asked?
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Old Yesterday, 10:47 AM   #2208
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Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
Do have a look at the luminol evidence.
Do have a look at the TMB results.
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Old Yesterday, 11:09 AM   #2209
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Originally Posted by Stacyhs View Post
Do have a look at the TMB results.
Exculpatory evidence is not allowed.

Vixen always ignores those or didn't you know?
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Old Yesterday, 11:11 AM   #2210
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Originally Posted by Stacyhs View Post
When is "soon"?
Tomorrow.
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Old Yesterday, 11:54 AM   #2211
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Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
It's a shame they got themselves arrested with their fake alibis and bloody footprints all over the murder scene.
The lies continue. Why?

Why?

Why do you lie, Vixen? Why?

I'm going to reverse it. Bill says, "Citation, please". I'm not going to be this polite.

I'm going to say you're a damn LIAR. Prove me wrong and until such I will hold you in absolute contempt. The onus is firmly on you.

It's disgraceful to defame, denigrate and abuse people unknown to you you, yet hated by you, on the basis of outrageous damn lies.

Last edited by Mike1711; Yesterday at 12:29 PM.
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Old Yesterday, 12:29 PM   #2212
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Originally Posted by Mike1711 View Post
The lies continue. Why?

Why?

Why do you lie, Vixen? Why?

I'm going to reverse it. Bill says, "Citation, please". I'm not going to be this polite.

I'm going to say you're a damn LIAR. Prove me wrong and until such I will hold you in absolute contempt. The onus is firmly on you.

It's disgraceful to defame, denigrate and abuse people unknown to you you, yet hated by you, on the basis of outrageous damn lies.
Hey!! I'm trying to get me kicked out of the thread! Don't you beat me to it!!!!
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Old Yesterday, 01:35 PM   #2213
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Proof of the guilter disinformation campaign here.
  • Never answer a question put to you.
  • Wait a while, then simply repeat the claim as if it had never been questioned.
  • Occasionally "answer" the question with a non sequitor or a strawman.
  • Occasionally provide a link, but link to a citation which does not address the question
  • Claim you've already posted proof.
  • Ignore counter-proof, just bull ahead by repeating bogus claims.
The anatomy of trying to continue wrongful convictions, ironically 2 1/2 years following exoneration.
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Old Yesterday, 03:03 PM   #2214
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Originally Posted by Bill Williams View Post
Hey!! I'm trying to get me kicked out of the thread! Don't you beat me to it!!!!
😂 - 👏 - together we can do it! But I'm really tired of circular and non sequitur arguments.

Reciting or repeating lies unknowingly reflects poorly on a person, but knowingly perpetuating a lie (about someone you don't even know which is even more horrendous) is downright disgraceful.

How many times have certain (I won't name her/him or them) for fear of being kicked off this forum, knowingly lied? For goodness sake why can't she/he or they desist from lies? If she/he or they believe the PIP are wrong prove it with truth. Isn't that what being a skeptic is all about?

Repeating lies over and over is just tiresome.
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Old Yesterday, 03:10 PM   #2215
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Originally Posted by Bill Williams View Post
It's a sad day when speaking the truth is seen as a transgression.

The principals of this case have mostly gotten on with their lives, with occasional run-ins with people, well-meaning or otherwise, who throw it back at them. Occasionally either of them give formal presentations to others who've been wrongfully convicted/prosecuted, including to bar associations and law schools. Both RS and AK are now waiting on the ECHR to decide on matters somewhat distant from the main, original allegations of murder and mayhem.

But it is us who cannot seem to move on, in this far-off corner of the internet.

Me - I am hoping that some of the pre-March 2015 guilters who have stopped posting anywhere (ones that I'd had PM's with) would send a PM and we can have one last go at it.

Truly - all it would take for me to be gone would be if Vixen would finally concede that there are no forensic-DNA experts anywhere in Italy or in the rest of the world who would stand by Stefanoni's work. (Vixen would also have to keep to that concession for a year, including correcting others who made the same mistake.)

No, Novelli does not count. He'd verified at the 2011 trial that Stefanoni had not followed international protocols regarding multiple amplifications. No, Torricelli does not count. She'd agreed that it had been a concern that the collection process in the bathroom had been questionable, in that there was perhaps a third, unidentified DNA presence mixed in with the mixed Knox/Kercher DNA. This was in the bathroom that Kercher and Knox had shared, but the possibility of a third female presence raised more questions as to the shoddiness of the forensic collection.

Then I'm gone. As Jack Twist had said, "I wish I knew how to quit you".
Bill, I agree. However it is important that the truth be told. My own daughter in London was convinced AK and RS were guilty based on her circle of friends in London's opinions.

I pointed her to reality and now she is informed.

The guilters must not be allowed to go unanswered.
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Old Yesterday, 03:15 PM   #2216
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Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
It's a shame they got themselves arrested with their fake alibis and bloody footprints all over the murder scene.
Their "fake alibis" remain in tact.
Highlighted is another lie. If you believe I'm wrong show me the evidence.
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Old Yesterday, 04:28 PM   #2217
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Originally Posted by Mike1711 View Post
The lies continue. Why?

Why?

Why do you lie, Vixen? Why?

I'm going to reverse it. Bill says, "Citation, please". I'm not going to be this polite.

I'm going to say you're a damn LIAR. Prove me wrong and until such I will hold you in absolute contempt. The onus is firmly on you.

It's disgraceful to defame, denigrate and abuse people unknown to you you, yet hated by you, on the basis of outrageous damn lies.


Here we go logical fallacy no. 102: special pleading. Mike1711 has no actual argument just a plea to people's basest emotions to, 'trust me'.

Read the court documents: read what the forensic experts say.

No, they are not 'all corrupt'. They are the brightest and best young brains graduating today against much competition to get into these jobs. It is a gross insult for you to claim they are 'all corrupt'.
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Old Yesterday, 04:29 PM   #2218
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Originally Posted by Bill Williams View Post
Hey!! I'm trying to get me kicked out of the thread! Don't you beat me to it!!!!
We humour you. <fx walks slowly backwards towards the door.>
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Old Yesterday, 04:31 PM   #2219
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Originally Posted by Bill Williams View Post
Proof of the guilter disinformation campaign here.
  • Never answer a question put to you.
  • Wait a while, then simply repeat the claim as if it had never been questioned.
  • Occasionally "answer" the question with a non sequitor or a strawman.
  • Occasionally provide a link, but link to a citation which does not address the question
  • Claim you've already posted proof.
  • Ignore counter-proof, just bull ahead by repeating bogus claims.
The anatomy of trying to continue wrongful convictions, ironically 2 1/2 years following exoneration.
It's 'non sequitur'.

Where is LJ when you need him?
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Old Yesterday, 04:34 PM   #2220
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Originally Posted by Mike1711 View Post
�� - �� - together we can do it! But I'm really tired of circular and non sequitur arguments.

Reciting or repeating lies unknowingly reflects poorly on a person, but knowingly perpetuating a lie (about someone you don't even know which is even more horrendous) is downright disgraceful.

How many times have certain (I won't name her/him or them) for fear of being kicked off this forum, knowingly lied? For goodness sake why can't she/he or they desist from lies? If she/he or they believe the PIP are wrong prove it with truth. Isn't that what being a skeptic is all about?

Repeating lies over and over is just tiresome.
As Pacelli said: 'Amanda Knox is the great slanderer, the diabolical deceiver', on behalf of his client who was dragged out of bed in the early hours front of his young family and thrown into prison as a rapist-murderer by 'Luciferina'.

Who is the great deceiver?
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Old Yesterday, 04:36 PM   #2221
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Originally Posted by Mike1711 View Post
Bill, I agree. However it is important that the truth be told. My own daughter in London was convinced AK and RS were guilty based on her circle of friends in London's opinions.

I pointed her to reality and now she is informed.

The guilters must not be allowed to go unanswered.
Mike1711, your heroics on your white stead are commendable, I'm sure, but time's up! Time to admit you were foxed.
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Old Yesterday, 04:38 PM   #2222
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Originally Posted by Mike1711 View Post
😂 - 👏 - together we can do it! But I'm really tired of circular and non sequitur arguments.

Reciting or repeating lies unknowingly reflects poorly on a person, but knowingly perpetuating a lie (about someone you don't even know which is even more horrendous) is downright disgraceful.

How many times have certain (I won't name her/him or them) for fear of being kicked off this forum, knowingly lied? For goodness sake why can't she/he or they desist from lies? If she/he or they believe the PIP are wrong prove it with truth. Isn't that what being a skeptic is all about?

Repeating lies over and over is just tiresome.
Boy do I appreciate your sentiment. I've lost it a few times myself. But I've never understood why if you believe in your position on a subject why the need to distort and obfuscate the facts?

I really wish that ISF would terminate this thread in its entirety. Amanda and Raffaele are real people. Not some abstract idea. What Vixen and Machiavelli post regularly is libelous and unconscionable.
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Old Yesterday, 04:40 PM   #2223
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Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
As Pacelli said: 'Amanda Knox is the great slanderer, the diabolical deceiver', on behalf of his client who was dragged out of bed in the early hours front of his young family and thrown into prison as a rapist-murderer by 'Luciferina'.

Who is the great deceiver?
You. Pacelli is a liar.
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Old Yesterday, 04:42 PM   #2224
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Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
Here we go logical fallacy no. 102: special pleading. Mike1711 has no actual argument just a plea to people's basest emotions to, 'trust me'.

Read the court documents: read what the forensic experts say.

No, they are not 'all corrupt'. They are the brightest and best young brains graduating today against much competition to get into these jobs. It is a gross insult for you to claim they are 'all corrupt'.
That's not special pleading. For someone in Mensa, you should know that.

spe·cial plead·ing

noun
argument in which the speaker deliberately ignores aspects that are unfavorable to their point of view.
appeals to give a particular interest group special treatment.

This is what you do.
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Old Yesterday, 05:07 PM   #2225
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Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
You. Pacelli is a liar.
So if you were thrown into prison by some scum falsely claiming you were a rapist-murderer in front of your kids you wouldn't consider them utterly evil?
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Old Yesterday, 05:18 PM   #2226
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Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
So if you were thrown into prison by some scum falsely claiming you were a rapist-murderer in front of your kids you wouldn't consider them utterly evil?
Of course you KNOW that Amanda isn't a rapist-or a murderer. You also know that he wasn't thrown into prison as a result of Amanda's action but the moronic police actions. You can believe that the police had no responsibility to act properly during their interrogations but even the Italian Supreme Court disagrees.
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Old Yesterday, 08:13 PM   #2227
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Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
Boy do I appreciate your sentiment. I've lost it a few times myself. But I've never understood why if you believe in your position on a subject why the need to distort and obfuscate the facts?

I really wish that ISF would terminate this thread in its entirety. Amanda and Raffaele are real people. Not some abstract idea. What Vixen and Machiavelli post regularly is libelous and unconscionable.
Do Vixen or Machiavelli condone the death threat on TJMK?
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Old Yesterday, 08:27 PM   #2228
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Originally Posted by Bill Williams View Post
Do Vixen or Machiavelli condone the death threat on TJMK?
They certainly tolerate it. Was it Grahame Rhodes? He seems to be a regular at making thinly veiled threats.
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Old Yesterday, 08:35 PM   #2229
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Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
They certainly tolerate it. Was it Grahame Rhodes? He seems to be a regular at making thinly veiled threats.
AFAIK it hasn't been moderated. Maybe Vixen will show the high standards she claims for herself and notify the moderators over there, and tell them to take iit down.

Then again probably not. That's how she rolls.
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Old Yesterday, 09:44 PM   #2230
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Originally Posted by Stacyhs View Post
When is "soon"?
Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
Tomorrow.
Why not today? it's been almost 12 hours since you posted "tomorrow". Still searching for it?
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Old Yesterday, 10:10 PM   #2231
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Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
Here we go logical fallacy no. 102: special pleading. Mike1711 has no actual argument just a plea to people's basest emotions to, 'trust me'.

Read the court documents: read what the forensic experts say.

No, they are not 'all corrupt'. They are the brightest and best young brains graduating today against much competition to get into these jobs. It is a gross insult for you to claim they are 'all corrupt'.
I see. So only Gill, Budlowe, Hampikian, Vinci and the other defense forensic experts are "all corrupt", right?

Who exactly are these "brightest and best young brains graduating today" connected to this case that you are referring to? Names, please.

Stefanoni's work has been demolished by C&V who pointed out the errors in her work. Their finding has been supported by three of the world's leading forensic scientists, all of whom have Ph.D's in biology or genetics. Who has supported "Dr" (B.S. in biology) Stefanoni? is Stefanoni corrupt? Nah. I've never thought so. She just wasn't very good at her job.
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Old Yesterday, 10:16 PM   #2232
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Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
As Pacelli said: 'Amanda Knox is the great slanderer, the diabolical deceiver', on behalf of his client who was dragged out of bed in the early hours front of his young family and thrown into prison as a rapist-murderer by 'Luciferina'.

Who is the great deceiver?
This random quote does in in no way underpin your earlier statement (the one which drove me to calling you a liar - the one about multiple footsteps belonging to RS/AK - THAT one). Address THAT one.

What Pacelli said is evidence of absolutely nothing by the way, other than the activity his own inventions. No one is arguing that AK wasn't coerced into making false statements by the police. ...but this is another argument for another day.

Please address the subject of my interchange with you - (THIS ONE - "It's a shame they got themselves arrested with their fake alibis and bloody footprints all over the murder scene"). Vixen. I really want you to make me apologise for calling you out on this outrageous lie of yours and withdraw calling you a damned liar!

C'mon Vixen you can do it! No you can't! Liar!

Last edited by Mike1711; Yesterday at 10:22 PM.
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Old Yesterday, 10:36 PM   #2233
Stacyhs
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Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
As Pacelli said: 'Amanda Knox is the great slanderer, the diabolical deceiver', on behalf of his client who was dragged out of bed in the early hours front of his young family and thrown into prison as a rapist-murderer by 'Luciferina'.

Who is the great deceiver?
Originally Posted by Mike1711 View Post
This random quote does in in no way underpin your earlier statement (the one which drove me to calling you a liar - the one about multiple footsteps belonging to RS/AK - THAT one). Address THAT one.

What Pacelli said is evidence of absolutely nothing by the way, other than the activity his own inventions. No one is arguing that AK wasn't coerced into making false statements by the police. ...but this is another argument for another day.

Please address the subject of my interchange with you - (THIS ONE - "It's a shame they got themselves arrested with their fake alibis and bloody footprints all over the murder scene"). Vixen. I really want you to make me apologise for calling you out on this outrageous lie of yours and withdraw calling you a damned liar!

C'mon Vixen you can do it! No you can't! Liar!
Vixen has claimed before that Lumumba was dragged out of his bed. I see she's still at it despite the fact that I previously posted his own account of that morning where he says he was already up and feeding his son. Not that it made the experience any less traumatic for him. I'm just pointing out that, despite being corrected, she still repeats this deception.

Last edited by Stacyhs; Yesterday at 10:39 PM.
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Old Today, 01:28 AM   #2234
Vixen
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Originally Posted by Stacyhs View Post
Why not today? it's been almost 12 hours since you posted "tomorrow". Still searching for it?
Give it until circa 3:00 pm your time.
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Old Today, 01:37 AM   #2235
Vixen
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Originally Posted by Mike1711 View Post
This random quote does in in no way underpin your earlier statement (the one which drove me to calling you a liar - the one about multiple footsteps belonging to RS/AK - THAT one). Address THAT one.

What Pacelli said is evidence of absolutely nothing by the way, other than the activity his own inventions. No one is arguing that AK wasn't coerced into making false statements by the police. ...but this is another argument for another day.

Please address the subject of my interchange with you - (THIS ONE - "It's a shame they got themselves arrested with their fake alibis and bloody footprints all over the murder scene"). Vixen. I really want you to make me apologise for calling you out on this outrageous lie of yours and withdraw calling you a damned liar!

C'mon Vixen you can do it! No you can't! Liar!

You don't know about the luminol evidence? Really?


http://themurderofmeredithkercher.com/Luminol_Traces

and

http://themurderofmeredithkercher.co...Photo_Appendix


Empty barrels and all that.
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Old Today, 01:54 AM   #2236
Vixen
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Originally Posted by Bill Williams View Post
Do Vixen or Machiavelli condone the death threat on TJMK?
How am I responsible for anyone's action but my own?
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Old Today, 03:37 AM   #2237
Matthew Best
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Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
Mike1711, your heroics on your white stead are commendable, I'm sure, but time's up! Time to admit you were foxed.
It's white "steed".

Where is LJ when you need him?
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Old Today, 04:21 AM   #2238
Bill Williams
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Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
How am I responsible for anyone's action but my own?
I am asking if you condone it.

Your refusal to comment is your action.
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