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7th October 2021, 03:43 AM | #2121 |
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“If only it were all so simple! If only there were evil people somewhere insidiously committing evil deeds, and it were necessary only to separate them from the rest of us and destroy them. But the line dividing good and evil cuts through the heart of every human being. And who is willing to destroy a piece of his own heart?” Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn, The Gulag Archipelago |
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7th October 2021, 11:09 PM | #2122 |
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Australia hit 30 million vaccination doses today. That's 81.5% first dose and 60.2% second dose.
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8th October 2021, 07:14 PM | #2123 |
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1. He'd never do that. 2. Okay but he's not currently doing it. 3. Okay but he's not currently technically doing it. 4. Okay but everyone does it. 5. He's doing it, we can't stop him, no point in complaining about it. 6. We all knew he was going to do it which... makes it okay somehow. 7. It's perfectly fine that's he's doing it. |
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12th October 2021, 06:31 AM | #2124 |
Penultimate Amazing
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Percentage of what?! Share of people vaccinated against COVID-19, Oct 11, 2021: AUS |
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/dann "Stupidity renders itself invisible by assuming very large proportions. Completely unreasonable claims are irrefutable. Ni-en-leh pointed out that a philosopher might get into trouble by claiming that two times two makes five, but he does not risk much by claiming that two times two makes shoe polish." B. Brecht "The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is required for their real happiness. The demand to give up the illusion about its condition is the demand to give up a condition which needs illusions." K. Marx |
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12th October 2021, 11:47 AM | #2125 |
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Um the population?
https://www.health.gov.au/initiative...ers-statistics |
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12th October 2021, 11:49 AM | #2126 |
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12th October 2021, 01:11 PM | #2127 |
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Слава Україні! **** Putin! |
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12th October 2021, 04:16 PM | #2128 |
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I think the understood standard is eligible population. Babies not likely to vector covid.
I do think 90% 6 years and up will make very liveable difference in many countries but I'm quite happy with Queensland keeping the borders locked out and no covid so no restrictions other than mandatory contact tracing. Wait it out...will be a while - should edit the title to End of the Beginning. |
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12th October 2021, 04:53 PM | #2129 |
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I don't think that is the universally understood standard at all. Most trackers I see that compare countries take in the whole population. The one that you linked to said 63.4% of people over 16, but in many countries you can be vaccinated over the age of 12. It would be silly to compare countries only in terms of eligibility and at the very least a request to clarify does not deserve an eye-roll emoji.
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12th October 2021, 05:34 PM | #2130 |
Observer of Phenomena
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Yes, in Australia it's generally expressed as the percentage of the population aged 12+, since that's the population that the vaccines are authorised for.
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So take that quantum equation and recalculate the wave by a factor of hoopty doo! The answer is not my problem, it's yours. Three Word Story Wisdom |
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12th October 2021, 09:23 PM | #2131 |
Schrödinger's cat
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In the UK it's percentage of the total population that's used (currently 67.4% fully vaccinated).
I prefer that as it's easier to compare with estimates of the percentage required for herd immunity. |
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"If you trust in yourself ... and believe in your dreams ... and follow your star ... you'll still get beaten by people who spent their time working hard and learning things" - Terry Pratchett |
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12th October 2021, 11:00 PM | #2132 |
Penultimate Amazing
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Be careful with that one. Sweden has been doing the same thing, which has led Swedish journalists and politicians to celebrate Sweden's superiority in the field of vaccinations with headlines like, 'Best in the Nordics,' when in fact Sweden was worst. They compared Sweden's percentage of 16+ with the other Nordic countries, which all used percentage of the whole population. Even without the international comparisons, it confuses people when a country changes its subset of vaccine-eligibles, e.g. from 16+ to 12+. Since some countries vaccinate 16+, others 12+ (and Cuba 2+), the best percentage for international comparisons is percentage of population. If you use any others, you should make it clear what you are doing. |
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/dann "Stupidity renders itself invisible by assuming very large proportions. Completely unreasonable claims are irrefutable. Ni-en-leh pointed out that a philosopher might get into trouble by claiming that two times two makes five, but he does not risk much by claiming that two times two makes shoe polish." B. Brecht "The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is required for their real happiness. The demand to give up the illusion about its condition is the demand to give up a condition which needs illusions." K. Marx |
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12th October 2021, 11:41 PM | #2133 |
Observer of Phenomena
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Having just said that, the Therapeutic Goods Administration has just issued a release granting a provisional determination to Pfizer for children between 5 and 11:
Quote:
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So take that quantum equation and recalculate the wave by a factor of hoopty doo! The answer is not my problem, it's yours. Three Word Story Wisdom |
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13th October 2021, 06:14 AM | #2134 |
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Not on the official daily figures; that's been the percentage of the eligible population, and that's changed over time (it's now those aged 12 and up, so currently 85.6% 1st dose, 78.6% 2nd dose).
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13th October 2021, 07:49 AM | #2135 |
Schrödinger's cat
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Oh.
I get the figure from the Guardian front page (updated daily), which gives percentage of total population, and assumed they were just quoting the official daily figure. |
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"If you trust in yourself ... and believe in your dreams ... and follow your star ... you'll still get beaten by people who spent their time working hard and learning things" - Terry Pratchett |
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13th October 2021, 08:11 AM | #2136 |
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I wonder if there is some “nudge” thinking that goes into reporting eligible numbers. If the numbers are bigger, then those who are not yet vaccinated feel odd ones out. Most people don’t want to be the weirdo contrarians.
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13th October 2021, 09:47 PM | #2137 |
Penultimate Amazing
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Maybe. But it could also be that the government wants to report a higher percentage because it looks like they are doing a better job. It's good to know both numbers though.
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2nd November 2021, 07:39 PM | #2138 |
Penultimate Amazing
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And... its been approved for kids under 12 (in the U.S. at least)....
From: CTV News U.S. health officials on Tuesday gave the final signoff to Pfizer's kid-size COVID-19 shot...The Food and Drug Administration already authorized the shots for children ages 5 to 11...But the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention formally recommends who should receive FDA-cleared vaccines. Hopefully my home country (Canada) will do likewise, and it will help limit the spread even more. (Of course there is the question about whether it makes logical sense to vaccinate children in western/wealthy countries when so many countries are having trouble getting doses for even older/more at risk people.) |
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3rd November 2021, 04:55 AM | #2139 |
Penultimate Amazing
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I think that this is much like telling kids who won't eat broccoli that poor people in the third world go hungry and would love to have it. There is no real connection between the two things. The medicine companies won't start giving those vaccines to people in poor countries for free if rich countries would only stop buying them. It's not how a market economy works. ETA: By Nov 15, kids age 2+ in Cuba will have had three shots of the Cuban vaccines.
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Share of people vaccinated against COVID-19 And it's working. Daily new confirmed COVID-19 cases per million people Daily new confirmed COVID-19 deaths per million people But it won't work as well in the USA as in Cuba. In Cuba, people tend to trust the vaccines, so Cuban parents won't be as vaccine hesitant as parents in the USA. There also aren't many zealous antivaxxers in Cuba to spread the message of stupidity. Education, education, education.
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It is obvious that a country like that is an abomination and shouldn't be allowed to exist. |
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/dann "Stupidity renders itself invisible by assuming very large proportions. Completely unreasonable claims are irrefutable. Ni-en-leh pointed out that a philosopher might get into trouble by claiming that two times two makes five, but he does not risk much by claiming that two times two makes shoe polish." B. Brecht "The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is required for their real happiness. The demand to give up the illusion about its condition is the demand to give up a condition which needs illusions." K. Marx |
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4th November 2021, 07:34 AM | #2140 |
Penultimate Amazing
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Location: Canada, eh?
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True, drug companies wouldn't just donate unused vaccines to poor countries.
Its possible that the wealthier countries could pay for the vaccine doses and give them to the poorer countries. (There are already various mechanisms in place for that.) But that would not happen if wealthy countries are keeping doses for boosters/younger children. |
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4th November 2021, 07:45 AM | #2141 |
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I think in most official UK figures it is the number eligible to be vaccinated; that is why the percentage drops when the age range is extended. This is a better measure of performance of the vaccine program. In age groups over 30 it is >90% vaccinated.
With regards to herd immunity, the better figure might be the percent of the population with circulating antibodies, this is routinely surveyed in England, and includes both post vaccination and post infection immunity. But would exclude those who do not develop immunity post vaccination or infection. One observation was that overall immunity was falling (although still >90%) as some of those previously vaccinated or infected lost immunity over time. This was one driver to introducing an early booster (at six months). |
4th November 2021, 06:50 PM | #2142 |
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The Prime Minister just announced that Australia as a whole will reach 80% of 16+ fully vaccinated by the end of today.
sauce |
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So take that quantum equation and recalculate the wave by a factor of hoopty doo! The answer is not my problem, it's yours. Three Word Story Wisdom |
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5th November 2021, 05:27 AM | #2143 |
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/dann "Stupidity renders itself invisible by assuming very large proportions. Completely unreasonable claims are irrefutable. Ni-en-leh pointed out that a philosopher might get into trouble by claiming that two times two makes five, but he does not risk much by claiming that two times two makes shoe polish." B. Brecht "The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is required for their real happiness. The demand to give up the illusion about its condition is the demand to give up a condition which needs illusions." K. Marx |
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5th November 2021, 05:35 AM | #2144 |
Penultimate Amazing
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Denmark is now at 88% of 12+, 76% of population fully vaccinated, and the elderly and other particularly susceptible groups have had booster shots, but the number of new infections is rising rapidly as we are heading into winter - unlike Australia. |
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/dann "Stupidity renders itself invisible by assuming very large proportions. Completely unreasonable claims are irrefutable. Ni-en-leh pointed out that a philosopher might get into trouble by claiming that two times two makes five, but he does not risk much by claiming that two times two makes shoe polish." B. Brecht "The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is required for their real happiness. The demand to give up the illusion about its condition is the demand to give up a condition which needs illusions." K. Marx |
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5th November 2021, 05:47 AM | #2145 |
Penultimate Amazing
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Quote:
It seems to be working, but not all Cuban provinces have received the same vaccine. Many have had shots with the other Cuban vaccine Abdala. And at least one province (Cienfuegos, I think) had two shots of the Chinese vaccine and one shot of Soberana Plus as booster shot. Share of people vaccinated against COVID-19: CUB~USA~AUS~GBR Daily new confirmed COVID-19 cases per million people: USA~GBR~CUB~AUS |
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/dann "Stupidity renders itself invisible by assuming very large proportions. Completely unreasonable claims are irrefutable. Ni-en-leh pointed out that a philosopher might get into trouble by claiming that two times two makes five, but he does not risk much by claiming that two times two makes shoe polish." B. Brecht "The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is required for their real happiness. The demand to give up the illusion about its condition is the demand to give up a condition which needs illusions." K. Marx |
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6th November 2021, 06:52 AM | #2146 |
Nitpicking dilettante
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Vaccine boosters being rolled out a month early, 5 months after 2nd jab instead of 6.
(I haven't been invited yet, I had mine at the end of May, so am already past 5 months.) ETA: That is a misleading headline, they are inviting people 5 months after their second jab, but the appointment won't be until at least 6 months after it. The official word is:
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The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts.Bertrand Russell Zooterkin is correct Darat Nerd! Hokulele Join the JREF Folders ! Team 13232 Ezekiel 23:20 |
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9th November 2021, 10:39 AM | #2147 | ||||||
Nitpicking dilettante
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I'm not sure why it's taking so long to finish vaccinating the eligible population in the UK. Looking at the numbers getting their third jab, it's clearly not a supply issue.
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The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts.Bertrand Russell Zooterkin is correct Darat Nerd! Hokulele Join the JREF Folders ! Team 13232 Ezekiel 23:20 |
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9th November 2021, 11:45 AM | #2148 |
Penultimate Amazing
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I have already mentioned trypanophobia as a likely reason why many people don't get vaccinated. Some people who claim that it is all about freedom may be hiding behind it as an excuse.
This is interesting: Share among unvaccinated people who would get a COVID-19 vaccine this week if it was available to them (Our World in Data) I think that in all of those countries, there is no "if" at this point. The vaccines actually are available for everybody - of a certain age. It is astonishing how similar the percentage of people with vaccine hesitancy is on Oct 15, 2021 - between 8.9 and 11.7 percent - except for the two countries, Australia and Japan, where many were still unvaccinated because they didn't yet have access to the vaccines. Voluntary vaccinations were the way to go for the first seven or eight months of the vaccine rollout, but at this point it seems to be necessary to either make life more difficult for people who aren't vaccinated or to make vaccinations mandatory. The mere threat of reintroducing 'coronavirus passports' as a necessity for people to get access to bars and restaurants etc. has already made more unvaccinated people sign up for vaccinations in Denmark. The vast majority of the vaccine hesitant probably aren't real antivaxxers, and if they are unvaccinated because of trypanophobia, the fear of unemployment may help them overcome their fear of needles. Some of them may even want to be 'forced' to get vaccinated. I Denmark, some of the people who claimed that they didn't want the vaccines because they weren't tested well enough now seem to be persuading themselves and each other that since everybody else seem to have survived getting vaccinated, it is probably OK to do so. Notice that the "between 8.9 and 11.7 percent" corresponds to the 10 percent mentioned here:
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/dann "Stupidity renders itself invisible by assuming very large proportions. Completely unreasonable claims are irrefutable. Ni-en-leh pointed out that a philosopher might get into trouble by claiming that two times two makes five, but he does not risk much by claiming that two times two makes shoe polish." B. Brecht "The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is required for their real happiness. The demand to give up the illusion about its condition is the demand to give up a condition which needs illusions." K. Marx |
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9th November 2021, 12:02 PM | #2149 |
Penultimate Amazing
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Cuba waited for all school children to get fully vaccinated before they reopened schools yesterday:
¡De regreso a las aulas! (+Video) (Granma.cu, Nov 9, 2021) Zurück in die Klassenzimmer! (Granma.cu, Nov 9, 2021) But even so, they are still wearing face masks. (Looks like FFP2 to me.) Apparently, Cubans don't want their children to get long Covid, unlike European countries where children younger than 12 are expected to get immunity by infection ... |
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/dann "Stupidity renders itself invisible by assuming very large proportions. Completely unreasonable claims are irrefutable. Ni-en-leh pointed out that a philosopher might get into trouble by claiming that two times two makes five, but he does not risk much by claiming that two times two makes shoe polish." B. Brecht "The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is required for their real happiness. The demand to give up the illusion about its condition is the demand to give up a condition which needs illusions." K. Marx |
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9th November 2021, 04:03 PM | #2150 |
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"I have already mentioned trypanophobia as a likely reason why many people don't get vaccinated. Some people who claim that it is all about freedom may be hiding behind it as an excuse."
I always inform the heroic health care workers that "I'm gonna flinch" when getting an injection. Regarding COVID I was not sure they actually injected me as I felt nothing. On the other hand when getting a shingles vaccine (cost $250 USD) I wanted something to remember it by. Injections about 90 south of the bicep are quite memorable. |
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.. The stars were suns, but so far away they were just little points of light ... The scale of the universe suddenly opened up to me. It was a kind of religious experience. There was a magnificence to it, a grandeur, a scale which has never left me. Never ever left me. Carl Sagan |
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9th November 2021, 10:57 PM | #2151 |
Penultimate Amazing
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Since zooterkin was wondering about vaccination rates in the UK:
Quote:
Quote:
If it affects one in ten people, it is probably much more than ten percent of vaccine hesitancy. |
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/dann "Stupidity renders itself invisible by assuming very large proportions. Completely unreasonable claims are irrefutable. Ni-en-leh pointed out that a philosopher might get into trouble by claiming that two times two makes five, but he does not risk much by claiming that two times two makes shoe polish." B. Brecht "The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is required for their real happiness. The demand to give up the illusion about its condition is the demand to give up a condition which needs illusions." K. Marx |
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9th November 2021, 11:05 PM | #2152 |
Observer of Phenomena
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The ACT is now at over 95% of the eligible population double-dosed, and case numbers are in the low teens. Most restrictions are being eased this Friday.
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So take that quantum equation and recalculate the wave by a factor of hoopty doo! The answer is not my problem, it's yours. Three Word Story Wisdom |
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10th November 2021, 10:14 AM | #2153 |
Show me the monkey!
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Does anyone know how long the Moderna booster shot takes to reach full efficacy?
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10th November 2021, 10:42 AM | #2154 |
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Heh, same here. My second shot, I was just a bit distracted, I guess I might have been either saying something (or listening to someone saying something to me) just at that point, and before I realized it it was done. I remember wondering at that point, Hey, did she actually plunge the thing in, or did she just somehow pretend to?! Yeah I know, silly thought, which is why I didn't say anything about it, either to the nurse or to anyone else at all. This is the first I've spoken of it, or, I guess, the first I've even thought of it, since then. |
10th November 2021, 10:51 AM | #2155 |
Penultimate Amazing
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I heard two weeks but cannot now recall whether it was official or just an estimate, probably from the weekly VT government update.
Oddly, although I barely felt the first two Moderna shots, I had quite a sore arm from the booster. I hardly felt the needle at all, but the reaction came on later and lasted almost exactly 24 hours before fading away. By contrast, my wife, who got the Pfizer, had a fair amount of soreness and reaction from the first two, and nothing from the booster, leading her to wonder, like some others, if it had taken. I don't know what the variables are here - maybe just what bit of muscle fiber the needle hits. |
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Like many humorless and indignant people, he is hard on everybody but himself, and does not perceive it when he fails his own ideal (Molière) A pedant is a man who studies a vacuum through instruments that allow him to draw cross-sections of the details (John Ciardi) |
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11th November 2021, 07:47 AM | #2156 |
Penultimate Amazing
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11th November 2021, 08:37 AM | #2157 |
Penultimate Amazing
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the booster should be the third dose, 6 + months after the second. But as far as I know it is still estimated at two weeks.
By then the glow-in-the-dark nanobots will have distributed themselves and finished pairing their signals with the secret monitors in your refrigerator, and will be sending your brainwaves to the illuminati, who will, with their usual efficiency, use them to burn your toast for the next few decades until you cry out in frustration, "I'm going to buy a new toaster," revealing your secret passwords, as one does in such situations. They will then, with their usual panache, use the information to send you an unwanted garden gnome. You will never understand why there are suddenly ants in your kitchen, but you should be very afraid. Two weeks. Enjoy it while you can! |
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Like many humorless and indignant people, he is hard on everybody but himself, and does not perceive it when he fails his own ideal (Molière) A pedant is a man who studies a vacuum through instruments that allow him to draw cross-sections of the details (John Ciardi) |
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11th November 2021, 11:04 PM | #2158 |
Penultimate Amazing
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If that is what you expect ...
Quote:
A Danish professor of psychology mentions that ...
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/dann "Stupidity renders itself invisible by assuming very large proportions. Completely unreasonable claims are irrefutable. Ni-en-leh pointed out that a philosopher might get into trouble by claiming that two times two makes five, but he does not risk much by claiming that two times two makes shoe polish." B. Brecht "The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is required for their real happiness. The demand to give up the illusion about its condition is the demand to give up a condition which needs illusions." K. Marx |
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12th November 2021, 06:32 AM | #2159 |
Philosopher
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Posts: 5,759
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Here is a plot, for states of the United States, showing case rates versus vaccination rates. (I posted this graph yesterday in the thread on Corona Virus Conspiracy Theories Part III, but the graph and data are more appropriate for this thread.)
That's a straightforward plot of data obtained from
Here are the numerical data from which the plot was generated: Code:
41.12 15607 # West Virginia 44.37 16711 # Idaho 44.53 18436 # Wyoming 45.16 17079 # Alabama 46.19 17061 # Mississippi 47.94 20133 # North Dakota 48.04 16426 # Louisiana 48.12 18922 # Tennessee 48.43 17154 # Arkansas 48.78 15493 # Georgia 50.12 15447 # Indiana 50.15 14202 # Missouri 50.47 17581 # South Carolina 50.58 16444 # Oklahoma 50.96 17142 # Montana 51.16 16944 # Kentucky 52.21 13566 # Ohio 53.08 19725 # Alaska 53.25 14280 # North Carolina 53.43 17953 # South Dakota 53.48 14495 # Nevada 53.60 16476 # Arizona 53.67 15304 # Kansas 53.76 14744 # Texas 53.85 13308 # Michigan 54.35 17707 # Utah 55.95 15825 # Iowa 56.63 15146 # Nebraska 58.72 15685 # Wisconsin 60.13 6029 # Hawaii 60.20 17233 # Florida 60.48 15043 # Delaware 61.04 13634 # Illinois 61.30 12561 # Pennsylvania 61.61 14747 # Minnesota 61.87 12617 # California 62.10 13458 # Colorado 62.57 13762 # New Mexico 63.16 9233 # District of Columbia 63.24 8924 # Oregon 63.37 10478 # New Hampshire 63.70 11010 # Virginia 64.03 9801 # Washington 66.38 9394 # Maryland 66.79 13639 # New Jersey 67.28 13385 # New York 70.12 12612 # Massachusetts 71.15 11409 # Connecticut 71.17 8153 # Maine 71.44 17226 # Rhode Island 71.77 6877 # Vermont |
12th November 2021, 09:51 AM | #2160 |
Penultimate Amazing
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That is pretty convincing, but I assume that the best vaccinated states are also more likely to have other measures in place, like mask mandates, for instance.
I am surprised to see that even Vermont is behind so many Western European countries. Share of people vaccinated against COVID-19 |
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/dann "Stupidity renders itself invisible by assuming very large proportions. Completely unreasonable claims are irrefutable. Ni-en-leh pointed out that a philosopher might get into trouble by claiming that two times two makes five, but he does not risk much by claiming that two times two makes shoe polish." B. Brecht "The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is required for their real happiness. The demand to give up the illusion about its condition is the demand to give up a condition which needs illusions." K. Marx |
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