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Tags 2020 elections , donald trump , joe biden

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Old 30th November 2020, 01:20 AM   #3481
Pixel42
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Originally Posted by Captain_Swoop View Post
“Democrats suffered crushing down-ballot loss across America.” @nytimes.
This is true. All statehouses won, and in Washington we did great. So I led this great charge, and I’m the only one that lost? No, it doesn’t work that way. This was a massive fraud, a RIGGED ELECTION!
He knows that all the votes were on the same ballots, right?
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Old 30th November 2020, 01:41 AM   #3482
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I'm at the point where I wished the Democrats and Biden would call Trump's bluff:

ask to redo the election, given all voters the chance to cure their ballots, have the OSCE in to monitor.
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Last edited by The Great Zaganza; 30th November 2020 at 01:42 AM.
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Old 30th November 2020, 01:42 AM   #3483
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I'm at the point where I wished the Democrats and Biden would call Trump's bluff:

ask to redo the election, give all voters the chance to cure their ballots, have the OSCE in to monitor.
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Last edited by The Great Zaganza; 30th November 2020 at 01:51 AM.
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Old 30th November 2020, 01:45 AM   #3484
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Originally Posted by Pixel42 View Post
He knows that all the votes were on the same ballots, right?
Like Trump cares about anyone or thing except himself.

I'm guessing he hasn't given it a second thought.
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Old 30th November 2020, 01:52 AM   #3485
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Listening to MSNBC they report that a number of people, including Ivanka who apparently has some influence, had an intervention telling Trump that every time he loses in court he's making himself look bad. And though they may not have said it to him directly, MSNBC reports Trump is going through unforced error after unforced error and each time he loses in court it's like reliving the pain. So the intervention was to stop him from spiraling up again and again resulting in his acting out in anger i.e. losing control.
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Old 30th November 2020, 01:59 AM   #3486
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It's all Rudy's fault for bringing cold coffee.
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Old 30th November 2020, 02:00 AM   #3487
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Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
Listening to MSNBC they report that a number of people, including Ivanka who apparently has some influence, had an intervention telling Trump that every time he loses in court he's making himself look bad. And though they may not have said it to him directly, MSNBC reports Trump is going through unforced error after unforced error and each time he loses in court it's like reliving the pain. So the intervention was to stop him from spiraling up again and again resulting in his acting out in anger i.e. losing control.
Since before the 2016 election, no one in the Trump entourage has leaked more self serving stuff than Jared and Ivanka.
Five years on, and the US media still give them cover as "sources" or "person who spoke on the condition of anonymity", when they leak about themselves.
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Old 30th November 2020, 02:11 AM   #3488
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Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza View Post
I'm at the point where I wished the Democrats and Biden would call Trump's bluff:

ask to redo the election, give all voters the chance to cure their ballots, have the OSCE in to monitor.
That is exactly what Trump wants. He wants people to think that, at least, there is some question about the result. He want to put it into minds that maybe, just maybe, this isn't right.

Trump want to project that there were all kind of problems with this elections. That this election was not done well.

Trump is lying. Every election has a few minor problems. This election appears to have had fewer problems than any other election. By a long degree. I would agree that this was the most secure and accurate in the history of America, and probably the world.

As much as Trump tries to project an image of fraud, the evidence and processes show that elections in the United States of America are extremely secure and accurate and can withstand anybody trying to overturn the results of the elections by the people in this democracy.
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Old 30th November 2020, 02:17 AM   #3489
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That's my point: Trump wants the election results to be suspect.

What he doesn't want is a repeat that would probably make him lose even more and rehabilitate the integrity of the elections.

Dems should call for a 2nd vote, including all down-ballot offices: Republicans would literally kill Trump before they let that happen.
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Last edited by The Great Zaganza; 30th November 2020 at 02:19 AM.
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Old 30th November 2020, 02:23 AM   #3490
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Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza View Post
That's my point: Trump wants the election results to be suspect.
Calling a repeat election would (a) imply an admission that they were, and (b) leave him able to claim that both were rigged.

It's not going to happen - apart from anything else the Constitution wouldn't allow it - but doing anything other than following the correct procedure at this point is giving in to Trump's tantrums. Any parent of an unruly toddler should know that's a bad idea.

Dave
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Old 30th November 2020, 02:34 AM   #3491
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Donny is not just a bad loser, he's a ******* awful winner. He whined continuously about the 2016 election, and he won that one by "a landslide". Even his catch-cry of "You're fired!" is a whine about some employee.

Just face it. Donny's motivation to get out of his stinking, orange-stained cess of a bed every day is the fresh opportunity to whine about something. Anything, even if it is the same old horse-**** that he whined about yesterday which has been thoroughly debunked three ways from Sunday in Technicolor all the way through to Christmas 2030. So even if he got everything he wanted, which he has so far in his life, he would still find a reason to whine. He is an Olympian-level ******* whiner. he could whine for the USA and become world-champion.

So now that he is getting nothing he wanted, guess what he is going to do.

Yep, you got it.
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Old 30th November 2020, 06:03 AM   #3492
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Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza View Post
That's my point: Trump wants the election results to be suspect.

What he doesn't want is a repeat that would probably make him lose even more and rehabilitate the integrity of the elections.

Dems should call for a 2nd vote...
Bad idea. This election, according to his own administration, was already the most accurate and problem-free in history. It’s beyond naive to think that Trump would magnanimously accept the result of any repeat election. If he lost, he’d automatically claim it was rigged as well. Always has, always will.
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Old 30th November 2020, 06:32 AM   #3493
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Originally Posted by Fast Eddie B View Post
Bad idea. This election, according to his own administration, was already the most accurate and problem-free in history. It’s beyond naive to think that Trump would magnanimously accept the result of any repeat election. If he lost, he’d automatically claim it was rigged as well. Always has, always will.
Sure.

My point is that REPUBLICANS, first and foremost McConnell, would never allow a second election to happen, because most likely they would do worse.
By calling the bluff, Democrats might be able to turn the ire of the Trump crowd against the GOP instead.
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Old 30th November 2020, 06:50 AM   #3494
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Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza View Post
Sure.

My point is that REPUBLICANS, first and foremost McConnell, would never allow a second election to happen, because most likely they would do worse.
By calling the bluff, Democrats might be able to turn the ire of the Trump crowd against the GOP instead.
There will be one soon enough in 2022.

And I know you weren't making an actual, serious, suggestion of having a repeat election. There's no provision for doing that. It would suggest that politicians could get together and make deals on when and how Americans vote. That's not the system. We had an election. Barring some extraordinary remedy from a judge who found flaws with this one, the people involved can't get together and change when we vote as if it were some kind of barroom bet when someone calls double or nothing.
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Old 30th November 2020, 06:54 AM   #3495
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Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza View Post
By calling the bluff, Democrats might be able to turn the ire of the Trump crowd against the GOP instead.
You're basing this on the assumption that the Trump crowd react to real world events in some way that can be rationally analysed, right?

Dave
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Old 30th November 2020, 06:57 AM   #3496
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There's simply no mechanism for a second election in our system. Congress sets the date of the election. The election happened. To say the least, it's constitutionally unclear if you could change the results of the November election so figure time for courts. The electoral college meets in two weeks and there's a non-negotiable January deadline.
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Old 30th November 2020, 06:59 AM   #3497
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Trump Tweets

Why won’t Governor @BrianKempGA, the hapless Governor of Georgia, use his emergency powers, which can be easily done, to overrule his obstinate Secretary of State, and do a match of signatures on envelopes. It will be a “goldmine” of fraud, and we will easily WIN the state....
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6m
....Also, quickly check the number of envelopes versus the number of ballots. You may just find that there are many more ballots than there are envelopes. So simple, and so easy to do. Georgia Republicans are angry, all Republicans are angry. Get it done!

I’m not fighting for me, I’m fighting for the 74,000,000 million people (not including the many Trump ballots that were “tossed”), a record for a sitting President, who voted for me!
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Old 30th November 2020, 07:06 AM   #3498
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Quick response posted to Twitter:

1) Governor Kemp does not have this power 2) Signature matching already happened twice, first when the voter applied for the ballot and then the ballot was received. Ballots w/ mismatched signatures that the voter does not cure are not counted and not included in this recount.”
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Old 30th November 2020, 07:13 AM   #3499
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Originally Posted by Captain_Swoop View Post
Trump Tweets

Why won’t Governor @BrianKempGA, the hapless Governor of Georgia, use his emergency powers, which can be easily done, to overrule his obstinate Secretary of State, and do a match of signatures on envelopes. It will be a “goldmine” of fraud, and we will easily WIN the state....
Donald J. Trump
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6m
....Also, quickly check the number of envelopes versus the number of ballots. You may just find that there are many more ballots than there are envelopes. So simple, and so easy to do. Georgia Republicans are angry, all Republicans are angry. Get it done!

I’m not fighting for me, I’m fighting for the 74,000,000 million people (not including the many Trump ballots that were “tossed”), a record for a sitting President, who voted for me!
Kemp is getting a primary challenger.
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Old 30th November 2020, 07:14 AM   #3500
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Originally Posted by Dave Rogers View Post
You're basing this on the assumption that the Trump crowd react to real world events in some way that can be rationally analysed, right?

Dave
No, I'm basing it on their desperation to find any path forward that keeps their Savior in power.
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Old 30th November 2020, 07:19 AM   #3501
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Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza View Post
Sure.

My point is that REPUBLICANS, first and foremost McConnell, would never allow a second election to happen, because most likely they would do worse.
By calling the bluff, Democrats might be able to turn the ire of the Trump crowd against the GOP instead.
I'm pretty sure you're right. The problem is, it's not worth it to normalize Trump's shenanigans even as a bluff.
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Old 30th November 2020, 07:22 AM   #3502
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Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza View Post
No, I'm basing it on their desperation to find any path forward that keeps their Savior in power.
That isn't going to happen, and nothing that does happen will change their belief system.

Dave
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Old 30th November 2020, 07:24 AM   #3503
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Originally Posted by Craig4 View Post
Kemp is getting a primary challenger.
Doug Collins?
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Old 30th November 2020, 07:32 AM   #3504
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Originally Posted by Dave Rogers View Post
That isn't going to happen, and nothing that does happen will change their belief system.

Dave
It seems that I'm not making myself clear.

The Rudy/Sideny sideshow has demonstrated that the Trump fanatics will clasp at any straw and blame the most loyal Republicans for not doing so, too.

If Dems propose that Republicans just have to do another election, and Republicans have to go on camera saying that they won't/it's not possible, they will be perceived as the Deep State that wants Trump out, just as Kemp already is.
The move is counting on Trump fans rather turn against the GOP than abandon him.
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Old 30th November 2020, 07:34 AM   #3505
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Why would Republicans have to go on camera?
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Old 30th November 2020, 07:37 AM   #3506
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Originally Posted by Norman Alexander View Post
Just a note, there was a THIRD order made that told a few counties to preserve the state of their voting machines. It's all standard stuff regardless and nothing special about it. Basically the court is saying "leave things as they are for now until we can look at this case in its entirety" and they can't look at the case as whole until the defendants submit their reply to the (mess of a) lawsuit. That won't happen until later on this week.

As some lawyers on the Twitter have noted, there is not much time left for anything to actually happen. Given that the court doesn't seem to be moving things along particularly quickly, that points to the whole thing just getting tossed out.

They will also run into some very big problems because of the fact that:

1. The voting machines print out a paper ballot that the voter can examine are securely stored.
2. A hand recount of ALL those paper ballots was done
3. The count for those ballots matched what was reported by the machines.

So they are going to have to come up with some explanation, with evidence, of how the machines could have been altering votes when the physical ballots match.

Last edited by bonzombiekitty; 30th November 2020 at 07:42 AM.
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Old 30th November 2020, 07:57 AM   #3507
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Trump Retweeted

TRUMP IS STILL OUR PRESIDENT@9NEWSNANCY
“@RandPaul wants an explanation on WHY Trump's "defeat" happened in FOUR DATA DUMPS between 1:34 am & 6:31 am.
We all know Trump won this election.
If we don’t fight for truth here — we will FOREVER get evil by default.
#FreeAndFairElections
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Old 30th November 2020, 08:10 AM   #3508
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Originally Posted by Captain_Swoop View Post
Trump Retweeted

TRUMP IS STILL OUR PRESIDENT@9NEWSNANCY
“@RandPaul wants an explanation on WHY Trump's "defeat" happened in FOUR DATA DUMPS between 1:34 am & 6:31 am.
We all know Trump won this election.
If we don’t fight for truth here — we will FOREVER get evil by default.
#FreeAndFairElections
1.) It didn't. In some states (IIRC MI and WI), Trump lost the lead in a couple large dumps because large metropolitan areas, which have a lot of votes and lean heavily dem to begin with, released their counts o f mail in votes (which lean even MORE dem) in one shot.
2.) In other states, like PA and GA, they released series of small counts over a few days as they processed the huge number of mail in ballots.
3.) In AZ, we sorta saw the opposite of #2. AZ slowly processed votes that leaned to Trump after initially processing the heavy Biden ones. So Trump ate into Biden's lead over several days but never had enough.
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Old 30th November 2020, 08:25 AM   #3509
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Originally Posted by Mader Levap View Post
That "not masturbate" thing is actually clever, even if they do not know about it themself. It will increase aggression and stress levels, making Proud Boys more prone to violence.
Nah. I think they just want to save up their "energy" for the weekly circle jerks.
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Old 30th November 2020, 08:50 AM   #3510
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Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza View Post
I'm at the point where I wished the Democrats and Biden would call Trump's bluff:

ask to redo the election, given all voters the chance to cure their ballots, have the OSCE in to monitor.
You can't be serious? Trump lost by 6.3 million votes. No do overs.
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Old 30th November 2020, 09:01 AM   #3511
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Looks like Cook Political made some corrections. Last update saw Trump lose 10K in votes and Biden added 30K.

Biden: 80,288,103

Trump: 73,974,526

Difference:6,313,577
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Old 30th November 2020, 09:03 AM   #3512
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The Governor and SoS of Georgia tried hard to rig the election for Trump and Republicans in general. They did so in a way that they could "plausibly" deny they were doing so. Now Trump wants them to nullify the election in a way that they would be announcing to the world that they're outright cheating.
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Old 30th November 2020, 09:06 AM   #3513
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Originally Posted by bonzombiekitty View Post
1.) It didn't. In some states (IIRC MI and WI), Trump lost the lead in a couple large dumps because large metropolitan areas, which have a lot of votes and lean heavily dem to begin with, released their counts o f mail in votes (which lean even MORE dem) in one shot.
2.) In other states, like PA and GA, they released series of small counts over a few days as they processed the huge number of mail in ballots.
3.) In AZ, we sorta saw the opposite of #2. AZ slowly processed votes that leaned to Trump after initially processing the heavy Biden ones. So Trump ate into Biden's lead over several days but never had enough.
And even in the states with big "data dumps", it didn't actually happen that way. i was watching the Oakland County election web site, and precincts trickled in, but they wouldn't be consolidated and reported to the state's web site until various certifications happened by city clerks, or whatever the process was. I don't know the specifics of the process, but the votes didn't just miraculously appear in a "dump". The state count might have had a sudden spike as the Detroit City Clerk gave a nod to pass their data to the state, but there would still be records of those votes coming in precinct by precinct.

(Oakland County is one of the suburban counties north of Detroit. Detroit is in Wayne County, so I was watching cities in Oakland County report votes)
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Old 30th November 2020, 09:28 AM   #3514
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Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
Looks like Cook Political made some corrections. Last update saw Trump lose 10K in votes and Biden added 30K.

Biden: 80,288,103

Trump: 73,974,526
52:48
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Old 30th November 2020, 09:30 AM   #3515
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Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza View Post
That's my point: Trump wants the election results to be suspect.

What he doesn't want is a repeat that would probably make him lose even more and rehabilitate the integrity of the elections.

Dems should call for a 2nd vote, including all down-ballot offices: Republicans would literally kill Trump before they let that happen.
When you n I were boys, "literally" meant "actually, in fact." For me, it still does. Not you? Sometimes, I bet.

But of course we would NEVER even HINT that elements deep inside the Gruesome Old Party might seek a final solution to the tRump Syndrome.
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Old 30th November 2020, 09:38 AM   #3516
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Originally Posted by sackett View Post
When you n I were boys, "literally" meant "actually, in fact." For me, it still does. Not you? Sometimes, I bet.

But of course we would NEVER even HINT that elements deep inside the Gruesome Old Party might seek a final solution to the tRump Syndrome.
Literally means 'by using literature'.
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Old 30th November 2020, 09:49 AM   #3517
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FYI: For all of you keeping track.

Arizona will be certifying the election in about an hour. 11:00 AM Mountain time

Wisconsin will be certifying the election in 4 and half hours at 3:30 PM Central time
( Wisconsin moved certification up one day) The deadline was tomorrow. Why wait till the last minute?
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Old 30th November 2020, 09:49 AM   #3518
The Great Zaganza
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Originally Posted by sackett View Post
When you n I were boys, "literally" meant "actually, in fact." For me, it still does. Not you? Sometimes, I bet.

But of course we would NEVER even HINT that elements deep inside the Gruesome Old Party might seek a final solution to the tRump Syndrome.
Originally Posted by Dr.Sid View Post
Literally means 'by using literature'.
you are of course both correct.

But seriously: if McTurtle thought he could make space for Pence at this point, he would do so.
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Old 30th November 2020, 10:13 AM   #3519
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Originally Posted by Dr.Sid View Post
Originally Posted by sackett View Post
When you n I were boys, "literally" meant "actually, in fact." For me, it still does. Not you? Sometimes, I bet.

But of course we would NEVER even HINT that elements deep inside the Gruesome Old Party might seek a final solution to the tRump Syndrome.
Literally means 'by using literature'.

What, they're going to 'throw the book at him'?


Though, akin to stoning, a punishment of, or death by, having literature thrown at you would bring a new meaning to the term 'booking'.
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Old 30th November 2020, 10:15 AM   #3520
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Originally Posted by Pixel42 View Post
He knows that all the votes were on the same ballots, right?
Probably not.
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