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17th August 2022, 11:39 AM | #1081 |
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Sufficiently advanced Woo is indistinguishable from Parody "There shall be no *poofing* in science" Paul C. Anagnostopoulos Force ***** on reasons back" Ben Franklin |
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17th August 2022, 11:50 AM | #1082 |
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Did I say "Trump"? No, I said the President.
Again, stop assuming everyone sees everything through the partisan lens you do.
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"As long as it is admitted that the law may be diverted from its true purpose -- that it may violate property instead of protecting it -- then everyone will want to participate in making the law, either to protect himself against plunder or to use it for plunder. Political questions will always be prejudicial, dominant, and all-absorbing. There will be fighting at the door of the Legislative Palace, and the struggle within will be no less furious." - Bastiat, The Law |
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17th August 2022, 11:53 AM | #1083 |
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I didn't say he could. But if ZiprHead was correct, then there would have been a record of who signed the classified documents out of storage. But since he's NOT correct (at least in general), then there may be no such record.
I shouldn't have to explain that not everything I say is an attempt to defend Trump, and yet I'm still having to explain. |
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"As long as it is admitted that the law may be diverted from its true purpose -- that it may violate property instead of protecting it -- then everyone will want to participate in making the law, either to protect himself against plunder or to use it for plunder. Political questions will always be prejudicial, dominant, and all-absorbing. There will be fighting at the door of the Legislative Palace, and the struggle within will be no less furious." - Bastiat, The Law |
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17th August 2022, 11:56 AM | #1084 |
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Sufficiently advanced Woo is indistinguishable from Parody "There shall be no *poofing* in science" Paul C. Anagnostopoulos Force ***** on reasons back" Ben Franklin |
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17th August 2022, 11:59 AM | #1085 |
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"If everyone in the room says water is wet and I say it's dry that makes me smart because at least I'm thinking for myself!" - The Proudly Wrong. |
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17th August 2022, 12:07 PM | #1086 |
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I didn't bring it up. ZiprHead did. None of your assumptions about what I'm saying are actually true. Seriously, go back, read ZiprHead's post, read my post WITHOUT the assumption that I'm trying to defend Trump, and you'll find that there's nothing objectionable to what I said.
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"As long as it is admitted that the law may be diverted from its true purpose -- that it may violate property instead of protecting it -- then everyone will want to participate in making the law, either to protect himself against plunder or to use it for plunder. Political questions will always be prejudicial, dominant, and all-absorbing. There will be fighting at the door of the Legislative Palace, and the struggle within will be no less furious." - Bastiat, The Law |
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17th August 2022, 12:08 PM | #1087 |
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1. He'd never do that. 2. Okay but he's not currently doing it. 3. Okay but he's not currently technically doing it. 4. Okay but everyone does it. 5. He's doing it, we can't stop him, no point in complaining about it. 6. We all knew he was going to do it which... makes it okay somehow. 7. It's perfectly fine that's he's doing it. |
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17th August 2022, 12:12 PM | #1088 | ||
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No I'm not going back and read your posts without assuming your doing the thing you always do, and are doing now, and will always do.
The Former President of the United States of America, illegally removed classified material and stored it improperly. This is a fact and it is not in dispute. I want to hear your excuse. You have one. I know you do. You know you do. What is it? |
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"If everyone in the room says water is wet and I say it's dry that makes me smart because at least I'm thinking for myself!" - The Proudly Wrong. |
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17th August 2022, 12:17 PM | #1089 |
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TS and above classification documents have a chain of custody, which means "signing out" by someone when taken from secure storage. It may be "inconvenient" but for top secret data, I think convenience is low on the priority.
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1. He'd never do that. 2. Okay but he's not currently doing it. 3. Okay but he's not currently technically doing it. 4. Okay but everyone does it. 5. He's doing it, we can't stop him, no point in complaining about it. 6. We all knew he was going to do it which... makes it okay somehow. 7. It's perfectly fine that's he's doing it. |
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17th August 2022, 12:17 PM | #1090 |
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17th August 2022, 12:21 PM | #1091 |
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It's also a well-known thing in the IT community that the more secure something is that the less convenient it will be.
I'm sure, as someone will either confirm or deny, that the convenience decreases the more secure a document is, even for the POTUS. Trump just assumed he owned the documents, and that he could take them or leave them as he damn well pleased. He had multiple warnings, and requests. I hope they throw the book at him. |
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17th August 2022, 12:21 PM | #1092 | ||
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This is circular reasoning. You assume I'm doing something, and then you never bother to check if I'm actually doing it, because your assumption must be correct, because you always make that assumption, which then proves that it's correct.
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"As long as it is admitted that the law may be diverted from its true purpose -- that it may violate property instead of protecting it -- then everyone will want to participate in making the law, either to protect himself against plunder or to use it for plunder. Political questions will always be prejudicial, dominant, and all-absorbing. There will be fighting at the door of the Legislative Palace, and the struggle within will be no less furious." - Bastiat, The Law |
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17th August 2022, 12:33 PM | #1093 |
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Says who?
Classified information is supposed to be stored in secure locations, but I know of no generalized requirement, even at the top secret level, that they must be signed in and out for each viewing. Furthermore, multiple rooms in the White House (including the Oval Office) are SCIF secure rooms, so material doesn't even have to leave to be viewed. |
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"As long as it is admitted that the law may be diverted from its true purpose -- that it may violate property instead of protecting it -- then everyone will want to participate in making the law, either to protect himself against plunder or to use it for plunder. Political questions will always be prejudicial, dominant, and all-absorbing. There will be fighting at the door of the Legislative Palace, and the struggle within will be no less furious." - Bastiat, The Law |
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17th August 2022, 12:38 PM | #1094 |
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17th August 2022, 12:40 PM | #1095 |
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17th August 2022, 12:45 PM | #1096 |
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Pacifism is a shifty doctrine under which a man accepts the benefits of the social group without being willing to pay - and claims a halo for his dishonesty. Robert Heinlein. |
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17th August 2022, 12:46 PM | #1097 |
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Zensmack (LastChild, Laughing Assassin, RazetheFlag, Wastrel, TruthbyDecree) - Working his way up the sock puppet chain, trying to overtake P'Doh. Or, are they the same? Quote me where I said conspiracists use evidence. - mchapman |
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17th August 2022, 12:49 PM | #1098 |
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17th August 2022, 12:50 PM | #1099 |
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"As long as it is admitted that the law may be diverted from its true purpose -- that it may violate property instead of protecting it -- then everyone will want to participate in making the law, either to protect himself against plunder or to use it for plunder. Political questions will always be prejudicial, dominant, and all-absorbing. There will be fighting at the door of the Legislative Palace, and the struggle within will be no less furious." - Bastiat, The Law |
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17th August 2022, 12:51 PM | #1100 |
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As previously demonstrated in this thread, you're wrong. As a member who held top secret clearances told you, you're wrong.
But, even if by some miracle your defense of Trump...wait, your argument to shield Trump from legal consequences of breaking the law (is that better?) wasn't wrong, the damn basement in Mar-a-Lago with a chintzy padlock on the door isn't a SCIF secure room. So your attempt to clear Trump's name fails even then. |
17th August 2022, 12:51 PM | #1101 |
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"As long as it is admitted that the law may be diverted from its true purpose -- that it may violate property instead of protecting it -- then everyone will want to participate in making the law, either to protect himself against plunder or to use it for plunder. Political questions will always be prejudicial, dominant, and all-absorbing. There will be fighting at the door of the Legislative Palace, and the struggle within will be no less furious." - Bastiat, The Law |
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17th August 2022, 12:53 PM | #1102 |
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17th August 2022, 12:53 PM | #1103 |
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"As long as it is admitted that the law may be diverted from its true purpose -- that it may violate property instead of protecting it -- then everyone will want to participate in making the law, either to protect himself against plunder or to use it for plunder. Political questions will always be prejudicial, dominant, and all-absorbing. There will be fighting at the door of the Legislative Palace, and the struggle within will be no less furious." - Bastiat, The Law |
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17th August 2022, 12:54 PM | #1104 |
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Zensmack (LastChild, Laughing Assassin, RazetheFlag, Wastrel, TruthbyDecree) - Working his way up the sock puppet chain, trying to overtake P'Doh. Or, are they the same? Quote me where I said conspiracists use evidence. - mchapman |
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17th August 2022, 12:55 PM | #1105 |
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"As long as it is admitted that the law may be diverted from its true purpose -- that it may violate property instead of protecting it -- then everyone will want to participate in making the law, either to protect himself against plunder or to use it for plunder. Political questions will always be prejudicial, dominant, and all-absorbing. There will be fighting at the door of the Legislative Palace, and the struggle within will be no less furious." - Bastiat, The Law |
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17th August 2022, 12:56 PM | #1106 |
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No, it's absolutely not. People with phones are in there all the time.
And the President doesn't get the classified stuff, he gets a distilled product without sources or methods. What Trump took came from an actual SCIF, he must have asked for the original documents, because he planned to keep them. |
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17th August 2022, 12:59 PM | #1107 |
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"If everyone in the room says water is wet and I say it's dry that makes me smart because at least I'm thinking for myself!" - The Proudly Wrong. |
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17th August 2022, 01:00 PM | #1108 |
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None of us know. Seriously, none of us know what actual documents were found at Mar a Lago, or where they came from. The point is what could have happened.
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"As long as it is admitted that the law may be diverted from its true purpose -- that it may violate property instead of protecting it -- then everyone will want to participate in making the law, either to protect himself against plunder or to use it for plunder. Political questions will always be prejudicial, dominant, and all-absorbing. There will be fighting at the door of the Legislative Palace, and the struggle within will be no less furious." - Bastiat, The Law |
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17th August 2022, 01:00 PM | #1109 |
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By my own admission, your attempts to clear Trump's name are weak and/or failing. But they're still attempts, Zig.
You're in here trying to prove that the TS/SCI documents Trump took to Mar-a-Lago were "possibly" all stuff he had in the oval office, and that none of that TS/SCI stuff had any way of tracing who currently has it. |
17th August 2022, 01:02 PM | #1110 |
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And what's your evidence that I keep doing it?
That you keep assuming it.
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"As long as it is admitted that the law may be diverted from its true purpose -- that it may violate property instead of protecting it -- then everyone will want to participate in making the law, either to protect himself against plunder or to use it for plunder. Political questions will always be prejudicial, dominant, and all-absorbing. There will be fighting at the door of the Legislative Palace, and the struggle within will be no less furious." - Bastiat, The Law |
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17th August 2022, 01:04 PM | #1111 |
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"If everyone in the room says water is wet and I say it's dry that makes me smart because at least I'm thinking for myself!" - The Proudly Wrong. |
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17th August 2022, 01:04 PM | #1112 |
Penultimate Amazing
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Uh, no. You're really bad at reading comprehension.
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But again, I'm not. You have assumed I am, because that's just what you do, but it's not true. |
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"As long as it is admitted that the law may be diverted from its true purpose -- that it may violate property instead of protecting it -- then everyone will want to participate in making the law, either to protect himself against plunder or to use it for plunder. Political questions will always be prejudicial, dominant, and all-absorbing. There will be fighting at the door of the Legislative Palace, and the struggle within will be no less furious." - Bastiat, The Law |
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17th August 2022, 01:06 PM | #1113 |
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Yes we're all misunderstanding in the exact same way, go with that.
We're being unreasonable to assume you're defending Trump because you always defend Trump and are currently in the process of defending Trump. |
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"If everyone in the room says water is wet and I say it's dry that makes me smart because at least I'm thinking for myself!" - The Proudly Wrong. |
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17th August 2022, 01:07 PM | #1114 |
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17th August 2022, 01:09 PM | #1115 |
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This whole "In literally every single discussion I'm going to do nothing but parrot the exact same talking point lies to defend Trump... but don't you dare call me a Trumper!" thing is old and just way to hijack the discussion.
You are intentionally saying things which you know to be factually untrue in order to make what Trump did sound better. That's defending him. Words mean things. |
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"If everyone in the room says water is wet and I say it's dry that makes me smart because at least I'm thinking for myself!" - The Proudly Wrong. |
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17th August 2022, 01:11 PM | #1116 |
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Zensmack (LastChild, Laughing Assassin, RazetheFlag, Wastrel, TruthbyDecree) - Working his way up the sock puppet chain, trying to overtake P'Doh. Or, are they the same? Quote me where I said conspiracists use evidence. - mchapman |
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17th August 2022, 01:12 PM | #1117 |
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Sufficiently advanced Woo is indistinguishable from Parody "There shall be no *poofing* in science" Paul C. Anagnostopoulos Force ***** on reasons back" Ben Franklin |
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17th August 2022, 01:13 PM | #1118 |
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17th August 2022, 01:13 PM | #1119 |
Great minds think...
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And again, it doesn't matter what they're classified as, or where they were stored. I'm not sure why it's even that interesting of a sidebar.
Who cares? He's in deep **** because he's a dope. |
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17th August 2022, 01:13 PM | #1120 |
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How is a lack of a paper trail a defense of Trump? That makes no sense. It isn't. Seriously: if you assume (for the sake of argument) I'm right about a lack of a paper trail, does that get Trump off the hook? No, it doesn't. I don't think it does. You don't think it does. Probably no one does. Conversely, if I'm wrong, that doesn't get Trump in any deeper trouble either. So why on earth would you think that this is a defense of Trump, when I'm not claiming it is, no one thinks it is, and I know no one thinks it is?
You've got the stupidest theory of argumentation I've probably ever seen. |
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"As long as it is admitted that the law may be diverted from its true purpose -- that it may violate property instead of protecting it -- then everyone will want to participate in making the law, either to protect himself against plunder or to use it for plunder. Political questions will always be prejudicial, dominant, and all-absorbing. There will be fighting at the door of the Legislative Palace, and the struggle within will be no less furious." - Bastiat, The Law |
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