Origins of Covid - Page 12

angrysoba · 26th March 2021, 04:49 AM

Quote:

GENEVA (AP) — A team of international and Chinese scientists is poised to report on its joint search for the origins of the coronavirus that sparked a pandemic after it was first detected in China over a year ago — with four theories being considered, and one the clear frontrunner, according to experts.

...

Team member Vladimir Dedkov, an epidemiologist and deputy director of research at the St. Petersburg Pasteur Institute in Russia, summarized the four main leads first laid out at a marathon news conference in China last month about the suspected origins of the first infection in humans. They were, in order of likelihood: from a bat through an intermediary animal; straight from a bat; via contaminated frozen food products; from a leak from a laboratory like the Wuhan Institute of Virology.

Link

gsgs · 31st March 2021, 02:53 AM

but who is "they " ?
WIV ? Hubei ? Beijing ?
Remember, the top Hubei politicians were fired by Beijing for
early Jan-2020-coverup .
Remember the Shi-interview, how she couldn't speep and was relieved when the
sequences came out.
Remember the early papers, the WHO-mission in Feb.2020
Then the appointment of Zong Nanshan (SARS1) as a demonstration of new
openness and transpartency.
Then the Xi Jinping speach to the world and the declared new openness.

This doesn't make sense, if they(Beijing) knew about a lab-connection
(at that time) and wanted to cover it up

Lplus · 31st March 2021, 03:45 AM

Originally Posted by gsgs

but who is "they " ?
WIV ? Hubei ? Beijing ?
Remember, the top Hubei politicians were fired by Beijing for
early Jan-2020-coverup .
Remember the Shi-interview, how she couldn't speep and was relieved when the
sequences came out.
Remember the early papers, the WHO-mission in Feb.2020
Then the appointment of Zong Nanshan (SARS1) as a demonstration of new
openness and transpartency.
Then the Xi Jinping speach to the world and the declared new openness.

This doesn't make sense, if they(Beijing) knew about a lab-connection
(at that time) and wanted to cover it up

As you say - IF. That's the operative word here.

angrysoba · 1st April 2021, 05:52 AM

For better or worse, here is the report...

https://www.who.int/publications/i/i...v-2-china-part

Okay, so I did not know this bit....

Quote:

The
Wuhan CDC laboratory moved on 2nd December 2019 to a new location near the Huanan market. Such
moves can be disruptive for the operations of any laboratory.

gsgs · 2nd April 2021, 08:57 PM

Originally Posted by angrysoba

For better or worse, here is the report...
{URL deleted}
Okay, so I did not know this bit....

---------------------
I remember they talked about it in spring 2020 . Only 300m,
much closer than the WIV. But they didn't do the bat-experiments there,
those were done in Beijing , so people lost interest in CCDC (afair)

Andersen twitter-thread :
[search for it, I'm not allowed to post links/urls)
@K_G_Andersen

angrysoba · 3rd April 2021, 04:33 AM

Originally Posted by gsgs

---------------------
I remember they talked about it in spring 2020 . Only 300m,
much closer than the WIV. But they didn't do the bat-experiments there,
those were done in Beijing , so people lost interest in CCDC (afair)

Andersen twitter-thread :
[search for it, I'm not allowed to post links/urls)
@K_G_Andersen

Okay, thanks. I'll try to find it.

I suppose the point is that there are actually a number of labs throughout China doing research on SARSr coronaviruses, as well as further afield. Perhaps saying, "Ah, look, the Wuhan Institute of Virology is here in Wuhan" as being a coincidence is just a case of the sharpshooter fallacy. If Covid-19 had been found in Beijing or Guilin, maybe the same questions could have been raised about how it was a coincidence that people were doing virus research there.

Anyway, in the meantime, this is from TWiV. They talk a little about the findings of the report and address the different possibilities of lab escape. Of course, there are strong and weak versions of this theory.

The Strong Version is that it was engineered there, maybe through gain-of-function or something along those lines.

The Weak Version is that somehow it got out on someone's clothes or something like that.

I suppose the inbetween ones are that they had found it, sequenced it and put it on the database, then took it down when they feared it got loose and some lab people got sick, and then tried to cover it up, but failed, and since then they have been stone-walling and got Peter Daszak and some others in to help cover it up for them.

The virologists on TWiV and, I would say most around the world, seem to give this a low probability and say so on this podcast. Vincent Racaniello does say he has been trying to get Daszak on his show to talk about it, but Daszak hasn't replied.

https://youtu.be/LqGPuFoYiNY?t=3935

angrysoba · 8th April 2021, 05:19 AM

So Vincent Racaniello was on one of his Q&As and is asked about the origins of Covid. Obviously he doesn't know but sketches a plausible way in which it may have spiller over. In his answer he also mentions that Peter Daszak and two others from the WHO study on the origins of Covid will be appearing on TWiV:

https://youtu.be/6TLXKkHr1C4?t=3038

26th March 2021, 04:49 AM	#441
angrysoba Philosophile Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Osaka, Japan Posts: 29,606	Quote: GENEVA (AP) — A team of international and Chinese scientists is poised to report on its joint search for the origins of the coronavirus that sparked a pandemic after it was first detected in China over a year ago — with four theories being considered, and one the clear frontrunner, according to experts. ... Team member Vladimir Dedkov, an epidemiologist and deputy director of research at the St. Petersburg Pasteur Institute in Russia, summarized the four main leads first laid out at a marathon news conference in China last month about the suspected origins of the first infection in humans. They were, in order of likelihood: from a bat through an intermediary animal; straight from a bat; via contaminated frozen food products; from a leak from a laboratory like the Wuhan Institute of Virology. Link
	__________________ "The thief and the murderer follow nature just as much as the philanthropist. Cosmic evolution may teach us how the good and the evil tendencies of man may have come about; but, in itself, it is incompetent to furnish any better reason why what we call good is preferable to what we call evil than we had before." "Evolution and Ethics" T.H. Huxley (1893)

31st March 2021, 02:53 AM	#442
gsgs New Blood Join Date: Mar 2021 Posts: 5	but who is "they " ? WIV ? Hubei ? Beijing ? Remember, the top Hubei politicians were fired by Beijing for early Jan-2020-coverup . Remember the Shi-interview, how she couldn't speep and was relieved when the sequences came out. Remember the early papers, the WHO-mission in Feb.2020 Then the appointment of Zong Nanshan (SARS1) as a demonstration of new openness and transpartency. Then the Xi Jinping speach to the world and the declared new openness. This doesn't make sense, if they(Beijing) knew about a lab-connection (at that time) and wanted to cover it up
gsgs New Blood Join Date: Mar 2021 Posts: 5	Last edited by gsgs; 31st March 2021 at 03:36 AM.

31st March 2021, 03:45 AM	#443
Lplus Muse Join Date: Jul 2018 Posts: 654	Originally Posted by gsgs but who is "they " ? WIV ? Hubei ? Beijing ? Remember, the top Hubei politicians were fired by Beijing for early Jan-2020-coverup . Remember the Shi-interview, how she couldn't speep and was relieved when the sequences came out. Remember the early papers, the WHO-mission in Feb.2020 Then the appointment of Zong Nanshan (SARS1) as a demonstration of new openness and transpartency. Then the Xi Jinping speach to the world and the declared new openness. This doesn't make sense, if they(Beijing) knew about a lab-connection (at that time) and wanted to cover it up As you say - IF. That's the operative word here.
Lplus Muse Join Date: Jul 2018 Posts: 654	__________________ Those who are most fanatical in their condemnation of others are often mortally afraid that, in their deepest subconcious, they agree with those who they are condemning. Communism actively works against the fundamental urge of the human animal to survive and prosper, even at the expense of others, whilst Nazism relies on that urge.

1st April 2021, 05:52 AM	#444
angrysoba Philosophile Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Osaka, Japan Posts: 29,606	For better or worse, here is the report... https://www.who.int/publications/i/i...v-2-china-part Okay, so I did not know this bit.... Quote: The Wuhan CDC laboratory moved on 2nd December 2019 to a new location near the Huanan market. Such moves can be disruptive for the operations of any laboratory.
	__________________ "The thief and the murderer follow nature just as much as the philanthropist. Cosmic evolution may teach us how the good and the evil tendencies of man may have come about; but, in itself, it is incompetent to furnish any better reason why what we call good is preferable to what we call evil than we had before." "Evolution and Ethics" T.H. Huxley (1893) Last edited by angrysoba; 1st April 2021 at 05:56 AM.

2nd April 2021, 08:57 PM	#445
gsgs New Blood Join Date: Mar 2021 Posts: 5	Originally Posted by angrysoba For better or worse, here is the report... {URL deleted} Okay, so I did not know this bit.... --------------------- I remember they talked about it in spring 2020 . Only 300m, much closer than the WIV. But they didn't do the bat-experiments there, those were done in Beijing , so people lost interest in CCDC (afair) Andersen twitter-thread : [search for it, I'm not allowed to post links/urls) @K_G_Andersen
gsgs New Blood Join Date: Mar 2021 Posts: 5

3rd April 2021, 04:33 AM	#446
angrysoba Philosophile Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Osaka, Japan Posts: 29,606	Originally Posted by gsgs --------------------- I remember they talked about it in spring 2020 . Only 300m, much closer than the WIV. But they didn't do the bat-experiments there, those were done in Beijing , so people lost interest in CCDC (afair) Andersen twitter-thread : [search for it, I'm not allowed to post links/urls) @K_G_Andersen Okay, thanks. I'll try to find it. I suppose the point is that there are actually a number of labs throughout China doing research on SARSr coronaviruses, as well as further afield. Perhaps saying, "Ah, look, the Wuhan Institute of Virology is here in Wuhan" as being a coincidence is just a case of the sharpshooter fallacy. If Covid-19 had been found in Beijing or Guilin, maybe the same questions could have been raised about how it was a coincidence that people were doing virus research there. Anyway, in the meantime, this is from TWiV. They talk a little about the findings of the report and address the different possibilities of lab escape. Of course, there are strong and weak versions of this theory. The Strong Version is that it was engineered there, maybe through gain-of-function or something along those lines. The Weak Version is that somehow it got out on someone's clothes or something like that. I suppose the inbetween ones are that they had found it, sequenced it and put it on the database, then took it down when they feared it got loose and some lab people got sick, and then tried to cover it up, but failed, and since then they have been stone-walling and got Peter Daszak and some others in to help cover it up for them. The virologists on TWiV and, I would say most around the world, seem to give this a low probability and say so on this podcast. Vincent Racaniello does say he has been trying to get Daszak on his show to talk about it, but Daszak hasn't replied. https://youtu.be/LqGPuFoYiNY?t=3935
	__________________ "The thief and the murderer follow nature just as much as the philanthropist. Cosmic evolution may teach us how the good and the evil tendencies of man may have come about; but, in itself, it is incompetent to furnish any better reason why what we call good is preferable to what we call evil than we had before." "Evolution and Ethics" T.H. Huxley (1893)

8th April 2021, 05:19 AM	#447
angrysoba Philosophile Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Osaka, Japan Posts: 29,606	So Vincent Racaniello was on one of his Q&As and is asked about the origins of Covid. Obviously he doesn't know but sketches a plausible way in which it may have spiller over. In his answer he also mentions that Peter Daszak and two others from the WHO study on the origins of Covid will be appearing on TWiV: https://youtu.be/6TLXKkHr1C4?t=3038
	__________________ "The thief and the murderer follow nature just as much as the philanthropist. Cosmic evolution may teach us how the good and the evil tendencies of man may have come about; but, in itself, it is incompetent to furnish any better reason why what we call good is preferable to what we call evil than we had before." "Evolution and Ethics" T.H. Huxley (1893)