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Tags documentaries , michael moore

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Old 8th August 2019, 04:07 AM   #1
Solitaire
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Michael Moore Documentary: Planet Of The Humans

Quote:
Michael Moore Documentary: Planet Of The Humans

Gibbs, who produced Moore’s “Bowling for Columbine” and “Fahrenheit 9/11,”
didn’t set out to take on the environmental movement. He said he wanted
to know why things weren’t getting better. But when he started pulling on
the thread, he and Moore said they were shocked to find how inextricably
entangled alternative energy is with coal and natural gas, since they say
everything from wind turbines to electric car charging stations are tethered
to the grid, and even how the Koch brothers are tied to solar panel production
through their glass production business.

“It turned out the wakeup call was about our own side,” Gibbs said in
a phone interview. “It was kind of crushing to discover that the things
I believed in weren’t real, first of all, and then to discover not only are
the solar panels and wind turbines not going to save us ... but (also)
that there is this whole dark side of the corporate money ... It dawned
on me that these technologies were just another profit center.” Both
know the film is going to be a “tough pill to swallow.” It was a difficult
eye-opener for them as well.
Okay.

I don't see how any of this is a surprise.

P. S. I wonder if they'll mention nuclear.
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Old 8th August 2019, 04:22 AM   #2
dann
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Originally Posted by Solitaire View Post
P. S. I wonder if they'll mention nuclear.

Why? It's not as if nuclear isn't tethered to the grid or isn't just another profit center, i.e. corporate money.
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Old 8th August 2019, 01:12 PM   #3
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I don't understand why "tethered to the grid" is a bad thing. Did Moore think that people are charging their electric cars directly from windmills?
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Old 8th August 2019, 01:13 PM   #4
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Even people on the Left don't pay much attention to Michael Moore anymore.
Never liked him much as a filmmaker. Always though his humor was forced, and he was never one fourth as witty and clever as he thought he was.
And his painting of repressive regimes on the Left in bright colors simply because they were "anti Capitlaist" always went down badly with me.
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Old 8th August 2019, 01:16 PM   #5
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"It dawned on me that these technologies were just another profit center.”

Is he saying he only just now figured out that we're paying people to make the stuff we want?

At some point during the production of this documentary, it must have dawned on him that he expected a paycheck for his work, right?
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Old 8th August 2019, 06:14 PM   #6
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Originally Posted by Brainster View Post
I don't understand why "tethered to the grid" is a bad thing. Did Moore think that people are charging their electric cars directly from windmills?
That's it! Cars with roof windmills!
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Old 8th August 2019, 09:22 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by dann View Post
Why? It's not as if nuclear isn't tethered to the grid or isn't just another profit center, i.e. corporate money.
They are?
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Old 8th August 2019, 10:40 PM   #8
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You know that "heavily subsidised by governments" (from your article) is how corporate money becomes profitable nowadays.
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"Stupidity renders itself invisible by assuming very large proportions. Completely unreasonable claims are irrefutable. Ni-en-leh pointed out that a philosopher might get into trouble by claiming that two times two makes five, but he does not risk much by claiming that two times two makes shoe polish." B. Brecht
"The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is required for their real happiness. The demand to give up the illusion about its condition is the demand to give up a condition which needs illusions." K. Marx
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Old 8th August 2019, 10:48 PM   #9
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Originally Posted by dann View Post
You know that "heavily subsidised by governments" (from your article) is how corporate money becomes profitable nowadays.
You only read the first paragraph didn't you...
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Old 8th August 2019, 10:55 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by shemp View Post
That's it! Cars with roof windmills!

Can these cars go directly downwind faster than the wind?
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Old 9th August 2019, 05:29 AM   #11
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Originally Posted by PhantomWolf View Post
You only read the first paragraph didn't you...

No, I read it all. If you are thinking of nuclear energy as a way to produce nuclear weapons that doesn't make it less interesting (or profitable) for private investors.
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"Stupidity renders itself invisible by assuming very large proportions. Completely unreasonable claims are irrefutable. Ni-en-leh pointed out that a philosopher might get into trouble by claiming that two times two makes five, but he does not risk much by claiming that two times two makes shoe polish." B. Brecht
"The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is required for their real happiness. The demand to give up the illusion about its condition is the demand to give up a condition which needs illusions." K. Marx
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Old 9th August 2019, 05:52 AM   #12
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If Michael Moore said the sky was blue I would go outside and check.

The guy is a buffoon.
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Old 9th August 2019, 06:09 AM   #13
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Originally Posted by lionking View Post
If Michael Moore said the sky was blue I would go outside and check.

The guy is a buffoon.
And it would assuredly be grey when you looked.
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Old 9th August 2019, 06:51 AM   #14
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Not the color of a television tuned to a dead channel?
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Old 9th August 2019, 01:34 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Not the color of a television tuned to a dead channel?
Only on a dark and stormy night.
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Old 9th August 2019, 01:44 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by a_unique_person View Post
Can these cars go directly downwind faster than the wind?

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Old 10th August 2019, 07:59 PM   #17
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Originally Posted by dann View Post
No, I read it all. If you are thinking of nuclear energy as a way to produce nuclear weapons that doesn't make it less interesting (or profitable) for private investors.
No, I was meaning this part...

Quote:
The report published by the German Institute for Economic Research (known as DIW Berlin) reviewed the development of 674 nuclear power plants built since 1951, finding that none of the plants was built using ‘private capital under competitive conditions’.

“The results showed that in all cases, an investment would generate significant financial losses. The (weighted) average net present value was around minus 4.8 billion euros,” the study says.

“Even in the best case, the net present value was approximately minus 1.5 billion euros. The authors included conservative assumptions with high electricity prices, low capital costs, and specific investment. Considering all assumptions regarding the uncertain parameters, nuclear energy is never profitable.”

The report authors are also pessimistic about the future of nuclear power, concluding that nuclear power will remain unprofitable into the foreseeable future.
If you care to provide evidence otherwise rather than just making claims, then I'm all ears.
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Old 10th August 2019, 08:24 PM   #18
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The Nuclear Power Dilemma (2018)

Quote:
More than one-third of US nuclear plants are unprofitable or scheduled to close. On average, it would cost $814 million annually to bring unprofitable plants back to a breakeven point. Plants owned by merchant generators that sell power into competitive wholesale markets face a higher risk of closure than regulated utilities that recover their costs from ratepayers.
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Old 10th August 2019, 11:05 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by PhantomWolf View Post
Wow, that must have been quite the lemon-flavored tablet to swallow for the UCS, forced to admit that keeping nuclear plants online is better than letting them be retired. In fact, you could sense that they were coming quite close to supporting new plants. Of course, they hid that behind the veil of the carbon tax, which they hasten to assure us won't cost much:

Quote:
A national carbon price and/or low-carbon electrify standard (LCES) would help avoid an overreliance on natural gas, while costing the average US household only $0.74 to $1.03 per month.
It's going to magically not cost much but somehow do wonders for CO2 emissions? Pull the other one.
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Old 11th August 2019, 12:42 AM   #20
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Originally Posted by PhantomWolf View Post
No, I was meaning this part...

If you care to provide evidence otherwise rather than just making claims, then I'm all ears.

What do you think this means? "none of the plants was built using ‘private capital under competitive conditions’."

Let me give you a hint: It doesn't stop after, "none of the plants was built using 'private capital'."
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"Stupidity renders itself invisible by assuming very large proportions. Completely unreasonable claims are irrefutable. Ni-en-leh pointed out that a philosopher might get into trouble by claiming that two times two makes five, but he does not risk much by claiming that two times two makes shoe polish." B. Brecht
"The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is required for their real happiness. The demand to give up the illusion about its condition is the demand to give up a condition which needs illusions." K. Marx

Last edited by dann; 11th August 2019 at 12:43 AM.
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Old 11th August 2019, 02:55 AM   #21
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Originally Posted by dann View Post
What do you think this means? "none of the plants was built using ‘private capital under competitive conditions’."

Let me give you a hint: It doesn't stop after, "none of the plants was built using 'private capital'."
Still waiting for you to do more than make claims. Claims without evidence cam be dismissed without evidence, but instead I have shown reports that say Nuclear Powered Stations are not profitable, and the evidence is that unless Governments back them to make them viable and break even, then plans to build them are mothballed and ended because they can't be made to be financially sound at all. You haven't shown otherwise.
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Old 11th August 2019, 02:57 AM   #22
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Originally Posted by Brainster View Post
Wow, that must have been quite the lemon-flavored tablet to swallow for the UCS, forced to admit that keeping nuclear plants online is better than letting them be retired. In fact, you could sense that they were coming quite close to supporting new plants. Of course, they hid that behind the veil of the carbon tax, which they hasten to assure us won't cost much:



It's going to magically not cost much but somehow do wonders for CO2 emissions? Pull the other one.
one of the papers I came across noted that Nuclear will not be competitive until there is a $45/1000kw carbon tax in place.
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Old 11th August 2019, 05:04 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by dudalb View Post
Even people on the Left don't pay much attention to Michael Moore anymore.
Never liked him much as a filmmaker. Always though his humor was forced, and he was never one fourth as witty and clever as he thought he was.
And his painting of repressive regimes on the Left in bright colors simply because they were "anti Capitlaist" always went down badly with me.
Agreed, except that those repressive regimes aren't really anti-capitalist.


Originally Posted by PhantomWolf View Post
one of the papers I came across noted that Nuclear will not be competitive until there is a $45/1000kw carbon tax in place.
And this illustrates precisely why not everything should be prrofit driven.
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Old 11th August 2019, 05:58 PM   #24
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Quote:
and even how the Koch brothers are tied to solar panel production
through their glass production business.
I'll never look at a window the same way again.
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Old 12th August 2019, 07:57 AM   #25
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Originally Posted by Solitaire View Post
Okay.

I don't see how any of this is a surprise.

P. S. I wonder if they'll mention nuclear.
Michael Moore is basically the Alex Jones of the left.
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Old 12th August 2019, 08:00 AM   #26
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Originally Posted by a_unique_person View Post
Can these cars go directly downwind faster than the wind?
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Old 12th August 2019, 08:07 AM   #27
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Originally Posted by rockysmith76 View Post
Michael Moore is basically the Alex Jones of the left.
Not quite, but good enough.
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