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Tags Venezuela incidents , Venezuela issues , Venezuela politics

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Old 12th September 2018, 05:01 AM   #281
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
Watch out, Henri. aleCcowaN gets very offended when people use "America" to refer to the United States of America.

I'm not surprised at all you plenty agree with Henri McPhee's piece of propaganda.
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Old 12th September 2018, 06:30 AM   #282
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Originally Posted by dann View Post
Critics of Chavez/Maduro always mention the "cheap oil" that Venezuelans "send" to Cuba. I'm not really sure if the oil is as cheap as they claim, but if you're trying to persuade Venezuelans that the Alianza Bolivariana para los Pueblos de Nuestra América (ALBA) is a one-sided affair that benefits Cuba at the expense of Venezuela, you should at least try to calculate the going rate.
I don't have it, but I've tried to form at least an impression of it based on these figures from 2012:




So that would be three barrels of oil for a doctor (in today’s prices approximately 150 US$ if I understand it correctly) – not to forget Cuban nurses, teachers and others.
To me it doesn’t sound expensive. How many barrels does a US doctor go for these days?!

(I know that you would have to look at the current doctor-for-oil exchange rate, but I’m just trying to find out if it seems to be as steep as critics of Chavez/Maduro claim. That doesn’t seem to be the case, but maybe one of our economists has a better estimate. It wouldn't surprise at all me if Cuba turned out to be the disadvantaged country in the current situation.)
Im 90% certain that is absolute advantage and not comparative advantage....unless Venezuela thinks they could do a cheaper job of making doctors.
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Old 12th September 2018, 03:17 PM   #283
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Originally Posted by aleCcowaN View Post
I'm not surprised at all you plenty agree with Henri McPhee's piece of propaganda.
"you plenty"? I'm the only one who said anything. And other than not having a problem with the use of the word "America" to mean "United States of America", I didn't express any opinion about what Henri said. Is that what you mean by propaganda?
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Old 12th September 2018, 03:35 PM   #284
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
Is that what you mean by propaganda?

What is "that"?
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Old 12th September 2018, 03:39 PM   #285
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Chavist Fascism and the Crisis.
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Old 12th September 2018, 04:45 PM   #286
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Originally Posted by aleCcowaN View Post
What is "that"?
Referring to the United States as America.
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Old 12th September 2018, 10:45 PM   #287
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
Referring to the United States as America.

No, it was the whole "interference ... unfair ... give peace a chance" meme.
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Old 13th September 2018, 04:55 AM   #288
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Originally Posted by aleCcowaN View Post
No, it was the whole "interference ... unfair ... give peace a chance" meme.
My reading of Henri’s post is that he was being sarcastic, that this was a dig at people who believe it and not a direct expression of his own beliefs. Did you read it as being sincere? Perhaps Henri can clarify.
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Old 13th September 2018, 05:10 AM   #289
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Um, you have encountered Henri before haven't you?
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Old 13th September 2018, 05:20 AM   #290
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Originally Posted by Tolls View Post
Um, you have encountered Henri before haven't you?
I know I've seen his name before, but honestly, I don't remember much about him. So it's entirely possible I'm misreading him. Which would be funny in its own way.
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Old 13th September 2018, 06:13 AM   #291
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
I know I've seen his name before, but honestly, I don't remember much about him. So it's entirely possible I'm misreading him. Which would be funny in its own way.
I highly recommend looking up his body of work.
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Old 13th September 2018, 07:11 AM   #292
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
My reading of Henri’s post is that he was being sarcastic, that this was a dig at people who believe it and not a direct expression of his own beliefs. Did you read it as being sincere? Perhaps Henri can clarify.
You're definitely misreading. And check out the "WW2 and Appeasement" thread for numerous examples of Henri "clarifying".
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Old 13th September 2018, 07:44 AM   #293
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
You're definitely misreading. And check out the "WW2 and Appeasement" thread for numerous examples of Henri "clarifying".
Fair enough. It was just such a simplistic and cliched response that I figured it had to be parody. Poe strikes again, I guess.
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Old 13th September 2018, 08:15 AM   #294
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
Fair enough. It was just such a simplistic and cliched response that I figured it had to be parody. Poe strikes again, I guess.
Henri's body of work in a nutshell.
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Old 19th September 2018, 01:18 AM   #295
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
If Chile is an emerging economy, does that make Venezuela a withdrawing economy?
No, it's a submerging economy for sure.
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Old 19th September 2018, 02:20 AM   #296
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Originally Posted by Tolls View Post
Um, you have encountered Henri before haven't you?
I am not familiar with this particular specimen, but I know the breed. They write like the tovarishes who make a living from developing fake Facebook profiles to manipulate citizens into voting Trump, Maduro or the Brexit.

Originally Posted by mopc View Post
No, it's a submerging economy for sure.
That's why, for sure, the IMF's outlook forecasts a 3.4% growth for this OECD member's economy this year. And the country managed to grow an average of 1.4% a year during last Bachelet (socialist) presidency in spite of copper prices being a 30% lower in average than those of the period 2007-2013. All that growth under either socialist or conservative governments, in spite of the end of the "super ciclo" of copper, with prices dropping from 4.60$ per pound on February 14th 2011 to 2.70$ last September 14th.


ETA: Dutch disease las pelotas!
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Last edited by aleCcowaN; 19th September 2018 at 02:24 AM.
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Old 26th September 2018, 10:19 AM   #297
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Time for a coup
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Old 26th September 2018, 10:48 AM   #298
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Naaahhh! A couple of hundreds of army men have been arrested or expelled in the last few weeks to avoid that (by giving an example to other thousands of their mates). Generals (they almost tripled the number of generals in the USA) are almost all in it for the corruption money. So...


... no danger.
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Old 27th September 2018, 11:33 PM   #299
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Originally Posted by The Don View Post
Why isn't this refugee crisis getting the coverage it deserves? Is it because the Venezuelan government is silencing the press ? Is it because countries in the region are well enough off to (just about) cope? Is the US and her allies letting the crisis run its course in the hope and expectation that it will topple the Venezuelan government?
Most of the governments in the region - Brazil especially - have been complicit in making of the Venezuelan regime.

Plus Venezuelans seem to be less prone to certain bouts of the mysterious mental illness that makes people crash vechiles into crowds, shoot up bars they used to frequent and fly huge passenger planes into buildings, making them less of a percieved threat than some other populations.

Lastly, what do you intend to do, exactly? Venezuela is like Somalia, the infrastructure is falling apart, most educated people have already fled, you have a large armed populace that imposes their will through force or threat of force and so on. You'd need a million men, minimum, to occupy and hold the country for a few years just to reestablish order. That's three times what was available for the war in Iraq in 2003, eight to ten times what the occupation forces were. Who's going to pay for it all? That's why the Iraq war was such a failure, repeating it in Venezuela seems utterly stupid.

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Old 28th September 2018, 02:31 AM   #300
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What makes this so true :


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Old 28th September 2018, 06:43 AM   #301
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Originally Posted by aleCcowaN View Post
What makes this so true :


http://i68.tinypic.com/25sq6tc.jpg
Nothing?
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Old 28th September 2018, 07:42 AM   #302
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Nothing?
Yeah, that really doesn't make any actual sense.
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Old 29th September 2018, 07:20 PM   #303
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Originally Posted by McHrozni View Post
Most of the governments in the region - Brazil especially - have been complicit in making of the Venezuelan regime.

Plus Venezuelans seem to be less prone to certain bouts of the mysterious mental illness that makes people crash vechiles into crowds, shoot up bars they used to frequent and fly huge passenger planes into buildings, making them less of a percieved threat than some other populations.

Lastly, what do you intend to do, exactly? Venezuela is like Somalia, the infrastructure is falling apart, most educated people have already fled, you have a large armed populace that imposes their will through force or threat of force and so on. You'd need a million men, minimum, to occupy and hold the country for a few years just to reestablish order. That's three times what was available for the war in Iraq in 2003, eight to ten times what the occupation forces were. Who's going to pay for it all? That's why the Iraq war was such a failure, repeating it in Venezuela seems utterly stupid.

McHrozni
Plus, the refugee crisis is making it into the press (see for example http://www.chicagotribune.com/sns-re...925-story.html, which I read in print.)

It may not be making the front page headline, because everything is 24/7 Trump (except Chicago, where the Van Dyke trial regarding Laquan McDonald gets to billing due to its riot potential).
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Old 30th September 2018, 09:23 AM   #304
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Anyone care to join back reality -and leave out kinky fantasies involving T.Roosevelt- and comment about the new Venezuelan "one-salary-fits-all"?


Not that any general is going to notice he's living just with 50$ a month .
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Old 30th September 2018, 12:42 PM   #305
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Originally Posted by aleCcowaN View Post
Anyone care to join back reality -and leave out kinky fantasies involving T.Roosevelt- and comment about the new Venezuelan "one-salary-fits-all"?


Not that any general is going to notice he's living just with 50$ a month .
Link?
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Old 30th September 2018, 01:03 PM   #306
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Originally Posted by Mycroft View Post
Link?
Tablas salariales quedaron arropadas por el aumento del sueldo

(minimum wage surpassed the upper salaries, so everybody is basically earning the same money)

We all earn the same. (in the private sector, blue collar workers, professionals, Ph.Ds and secretaries, they all started to get the same salary during September)

Salaries for public sector, approved.
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Old 11th October 2018, 12:14 PM   #307
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Maduro ordered oil production to be brought from 1.3 mbpd to 2.3 mbpd in 12 months. A few weeks later production has dropped to 1.197 mbpd (source: OPEC - September report). Inflation this year, projected to be 1,370,000% (prices almost doubled during September).

(Image source: peakoilbarrel.com)


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Old 13th October 2018, 08:00 AM   #308
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Originally Posted by aleCcowaN View Post
Maduro ordered oil production to be brought from 1.3 mbpd to 2.3 mbpd in 12 months. A few weeks later production has dropped to 1.197 mbpd (source: OPEC - September report). Inflation this year, projected to be 1,370,000% (prices almost doubled during September).

(Image source: peakoilbarrel.com)


http://i68.tinypic.com/mshegl.png
Oof.
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Old 14th October 2018, 12:58 PM   #309
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More hardship for the subjects of the fascist kleptocrat in the red disguise:

Venezuela’s Crisis Imperils Citgo, Its American ‘Cash Cow’

(source: the New York Times)

In a nutshell: PDVSA's subsidiary, a refinery on US soil which provides 20% of Venezuela's fuel needs, has been used as a collateral of 2 billion dollars in loans that are about to be defaulted.
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Old 14th October 2018, 04:58 PM   #310
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Originally Posted by aleCcowaN View Post
More hardship for the subjects of the fascist kleptocrat in the red disguise:

Venezuela’s Crisis Imperils Citgo, Its American ‘Cash Cow’

(source: the New York Times)

In a nutshell: PDVSA's subsidiary, a refinery on US soil which provides 20% of Venezuela's fuel needs, has been used as a collateral of 2 billion dollars in loans that are about to be defaulted.
Are refineries in need in the US? I know a few have been closed, but who will want this thing if they default?
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Old 15th October 2018, 03:57 AM   #311
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Originally Posted by kookbreaker View Post
Are refineries in need in the US? I know a few have been closed, but who will want this thing if they default?
I'm sure the creditors will be better off with shares in their hands in exchange of valueless bonds.

What's behind this is the miracle of these banana republics (Costa Pobre or Guatepeor, as we call them) having a bonanza of oil and through right-wing kleptocratic populisms, starting with Carlos Andrés Pérez, impeached for embezzlement, and ending with Maduro, the queen bee of the choros (slang for thieves, from gypsy Spanish), managed to develop their "social" policies --christian-democratic, indigenist/urban-shantyville-dweller fascism with extreme left entrysm (like Chavism), or plain military nazionalistic-- and forgot to even refine their oil in order to get more money. It's like sowing lots of wheat but purchasing the flour abroad: Venezuela exports crude and the business is done in Trinidad and Tobago, Aruba and the United States.

Even the dwindling Venezuelan oil production (now way below that of both Mexico and Brazil) depends on an impressive volume of naphtha imported from the USA: it happens that most of today's oil production in Venezuela comes from the Orinoco basin, and it's so heavy that in needs to be diluted before it is pumped to port. Trump has been asked by several American presidents not to block such exports: it would be a nightmare for the starving population for a few months and it'd throw Venezuela completely in Russian and Chinese arms for good.
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Old 15th October 2018, 08:11 AM   #312
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Not only does Venezuela have levels of poverty and despair that Western nations only see in Amazon distribution centres, but they also seem to have become a narco-state.


Quote:
Join CSIS Americas for a public discussion on the policy implications of Venezuela’s escalation into a hub of organized crime. The political, social, and security chaos in Venezuela has stimulated a two-decade-long systematic erosion of the country’s institutions – creating the perfect breeding ground for illicit activity. Even as the United States and the international community increase pressure on the Venezuelan regime, Venezuela continues to solidify itself as a major player in money laundering, illicit drug production and drug transit. In response to Venezuelan government’s continuous human right violations and involvement in narco-trafficking, among other illicit activities, the United States and other like-minded countries have sanctioned more than 70 high-level Venezuelan government officials and military members, including President Nicolas Maduro and Vice-President Delcy Rodriguez.
I don't think this is something that has been discussed here (that I've seen).
But Venezuela's elite is uniquely positioned to make the country a major cocaine hub.
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Old 15th October 2018, 11:03 AM   #313
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Originally Posted by Eddie Dane View Post
I don't think this is something that has been discussed here (that I've seen).
But Venezuela's elite is uniquely positioned to make the country a major cocaine hub.

The term kleptocracy by definition encompasses that.
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Old 15th October 2018, 09:08 PM   #314
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Originally Posted by kookbreaker View Post
Are refineries in need in the US? I know a few have been closed, but who will want this thing if they default?
Refineries are always a need in the U.S.

https://www.cnbc.com/2017/08/31/gaso...ery-shuts.html
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Old 19th October 2018, 11:40 AM   #315
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Socialist paradises used to be a lot better than this
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Old 19th October 2018, 12:22 PM   #316
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Originally Posted by applecorped View Post
Socialist paradises used to be a lot better than this
You call someplace paradise, kiss it goodbye.
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Old 19th October 2018, 01:19 PM   #317
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Originally Posted by carlitos
Originally Posted by applecorped View Post
Socialist paradises used to be a lot better than this
You call someplace paradise, kiss it goodbye.
Socialist paradises can't prosper because of (Latin American lefty version): the international synarchy (kind of a band formed by the Queen of England, the Rockefeller dude -the original one- and a lot of Jewish bankers), the vested interest of colonialists nations (mainly The -Augustan- Empire and The -Caesarian- Empire), the local oligarchy who plot with all of them, the sepoys, spahis and gurkas who work for them, their quisling chiefs, the church, the masons, the fascists, the nationalists, and the stray masses led to believe there is a future in nasty savage Capitalism, who wrongly believe it is OK to behave like a human being.
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Old 22nd October 2018, 11:47 AM   #318
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Originally Posted by aleCcowaN View Post
Socialist paradises can't prosper because of (Latin American lefty version): the international synarchy (kind of a band formed by the Queen of England, the Rockefeller dude -the original one- and a lot of Jewish bankers), the vested interest of colonialists nations (mainly The -Augustan- Empire and The -Caesarian- Empire), the local oligarchy who plot with all of them, the sepoys, spahis and gurkas who work for them, their quisling chiefs, the church, the masons, the fascists, the nationalists, and the stray masses led to believe there is a future in nasty savage Capitalism, who wrongly believe it is OK to behave like a human being.


Jewish Bankers... They're so much better than other bankers
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Old 22nd October 2018, 02:51 PM   #319
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Originally Posted by Eddie Dane View Post
Not only does Venezuela have levels of poverty and despair that Western nations only see in Amazon distribution centres, but they also seem to have become a narco-state.




I don't think this is something that has been discussed here (that I've seen).
But Venezuela's elite is uniquely positioned to make the country a major cocaine hub.
Not surprised. With their formal country becoming somewhat politically more stable, which is bad news for the Drug Cartels, they have to find somewhere to move to, and with Venzuela heading slowly but surely for chaos Venezuela seems to be the obvious choice.
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Old 22nd October 2018, 02:56 PM   #320
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Originally Posted by McHrozni View Post
Most of the governments in the region - Brazil especially - have been complicit in making of the Venezuelan regime.

Plus Venezuelans seem to be less prone to certain bouts of the mysterious mental illness that makes people crash vechiles into crowds, shoot up bars they used to frequent and fly huge passenger planes into buildings, making them less of a percieved threat than some other populations.

Lastly, what do you intend to do, exactly? Venezuela is like Somalia, the infrastructure is falling apart, most educated people have already fled, you have a large armed populace that imposes their will through force or threat of force and so on. You'd need a million men, minimum, to occupy and hold the country for a few years just to reestablish order. That's three times what was available for the war in Iraq in 2003, eight to ten times what the occupation forces were. Who's going to pay for it all? That's why the Iraq war was such a failure, repeating it in Venezuela seems utterly stupid.

McHrozni
And just what the hell is the US and it's allies supposed to do to solve the crisis in Venezuela? Giving the current regime more money is just throwing money down the rathole. Not much other countries can do except wait for the coming crash and then pick up the pieces.
Of course the US can do no right in the eyes of some. If we did attempt some kind of intervention in Vneezuela, we would no doubt be ac cused of Yankee Imperialism.
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