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Tags 2020 elections , democratic party , presidential candidates

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Old 26th March 2020, 04:33 PM   #481
theprestige
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Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
He'd have no trouble debunking today's press conference that was nothing but lies.
Given that he teased this seven days ago, with a planned start five days ago, I'd say he must be having a lot of trouble.

What's your estimate?

- He's decided not to do it after all.
- He keeps taping segments, but none of them are working
- Nobody on his staff can figure out how to overcome the technical challenges of recording a video clip and uploading it to the internet*

---
*Something every tide-pod-eating, corona-toilet-licking, car-crashing halfwit seems to have figured out. I mean, even Arnold Schwarzenegger has figured it out.
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Old 26th March 2020, 04:55 PM   #482
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
The actual criticism is that he's not paying his campaign workers. That's not a strange criticism at all.
The issue isn't that he isn't paying his workers, that's what Trump does, it is that the recruiters allegedly promised workers that they would be hired through to November regardless of if Bloomberg was the Candidate or not. They haven't been, the Campaign was closed down, the workers let go, and the remaining funds passed over to the DNC. According to the Campaign part of the deal was for the DNC to take as many of the campaign's workers as they could, but whether that is happening or not....
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Old 26th March 2020, 04:57 PM   #483
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Charitable donations are tax deductible. It's not giving money away if you're getting paid to do it.
Talk about "damned if you do, damned if you don't."
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Old 26th March 2020, 05:06 PM   #484
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Originally Posted by Delphic Oracle View Post
miss half the early primary dates
You mean "be excluded from participating in", right?

Quote:
Then you can donate millions.
It's his Campaign that donated the money.

I'm going to just point this out, the DNC was just given an $18 million dollar war chest to fight Trump, and all you can do is bitch about it. Sheesh!
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Old 26th March 2020, 07:37 PM   #485
Delphic Oracle
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Originally Posted by PhantomWolf View Post
You mean "be excluded from participating in", right?
No, I mean he missed filing dates to appear on the ballot.

Perhaps you thought I meant debates.

In which case he failed to meet the qualifications many other candidates did.

Quote:
It's his Campaign that donated the money.
How many contributors were there to his campaign?

Quote:
I'm going to just point this out, the DNC was just given an $18 million dollar war chest to fight Trump, and all you can do is bitch about it. Sheesh!
No.

My concern about what potential influence Bloomberg finding a way around FEC contribution limits just bought him doesn't mean we can't spend or use it.

Unless we're being intentionally naive out of convenience in a "I don't see any influence peddling in my party, only the evil other side does!" kind of way.

Last edited by Delphic Oracle; 26th March 2020 at 07:38 PM.
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Old 26th March 2020, 09:46 PM   #486
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Originally Posted by applecorped View Post
Is incentivizing charitable donations cheaper than raising taxes?
Good question. What do you think?
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Old 27th March 2020, 07:38 AM   #487
theprestige
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Originally Posted by PhantomWolf View Post
Talk about "damned if you do, damned if you don't."
Enh. Nobody's condemning him for his charitable donations. But they *are* tax deductible, which kind of undermines their value as altruistic gestures.

Not that it's a big deal. This all stems from the "you don't get rich by giving away money" wisecrack I made. It amuses me to attempt a serious look at a silly thing, so I'm happy to play along with your rebuttal. But I do wonder, why is there a serious rebuttal in the first place?
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Old 27th March 2020, 07:41 AM   #488
theprestige
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Originally Posted by applecorped View Post
Is incentivizing charitable donations cheaper than raising taxes?
Originally Posted by SezMe View Post
Good question. What do you think?
Not really the thread for it.

But I'll tell you what: If either of you (or Dr Keith, or anyone else) starts a thread on the subject, I'll happily tell you there what I think, and make at least one pass at arguing about it with all comers.
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Old 27th March 2020, 04:37 PM   #489
Aridas
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Hmm. This looks relevant. YouGov poll: Who Americans want Joe Biden to choose as his Vice President

Warren 27%
Harris 18%
Not sure 14%
Sanders 13%
Klobuchar 10%
Abrams 9%
Someone else 9%
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Old 27th March 2020, 07:32 PM   #490
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Given that he teased this seven days ago, with a planned start five days ago, I'd say he must be having a lot of trouble.

What's your estimate?

- He's decided not to do it after all.
- He keeps taping segments, but none of them are working
- Nobody on his staff can figure out how to overcome the technical challenges of recording a video clip and uploading it to the internet*

---
*Something every tide-pod-eating, corona-toilet-licking, car-crashing halfwit seems to have figured out. I mean, even Arnold Schwarzenegger has figured it out.
I don't know what's wrong. It's worrisome but not because I'm worried about the political issues. We are months from the election.

But with the COVID spreading like wildfire, I hope he isn't sick.
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Old Yesterday, 03:17 PM   #491
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Well, at least we have an idea what percentage of Sanders Supporters are brain damaged morons...

From; https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/...ll/2936124001/
If former Vice President Joe BIden secures the Democratic presidential nomination, 15% of Sen. Bernie Sanders' supporters will vote for President Donald Trump's re-election, according to an ABC News/Washington Post poll.

Yup... after seeing what Trump has done for the past 3 years... his racism, his tax cuts for millionaires, and his screw-ups over Covid-19 that will probably result in hundreds of unnecessary deaths, there is still a significant number of BernieBros who would rather pick Stubby McBonespurs instead of a Democrat who does not offer all of Sander's policies, but is sure the heck closer politically than Trump.

(The article does point out that in a similar poll in 2016, the number of Sanders to Trump voters ended up being smaller on election day than the poll selected. But seriously, the number should be 0.)

And please... any BernieBros who will jump in with a "But, but... Clinton supporters".... keep your "what-aboutisms" in your pants.
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Old Yesterday, 03:58 PM   #492
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Originally Posted by Segnosaur View Post
Well, at least we have an idea what percentage of Sanders Supporters are brain damaged morons...

From; https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/...ll/2936124001/
If former Vice President Joe BIden secures the Democratic presidential nomination, 15% of Sen. Bernie Sanders' supporters will vote for President Donald Trump's re-election, according to an ABC News/Washington Post poll.

Yup... after seeing what Trump has done for the past 3 years... his racism, his tax cuts for millionaires, and his screw-ups over Covid-19 that will probably result in hundreds of unnecessary deaths, there is still a significant number of BernieBros who would rather pick Stubby McBonespurs instead of a Democrat who does not offer all of Sander's policies, but is sure the heck closer politically than Trump.

(The article does point out that in a similar poll in 2016, the number of Sanders to Trump voters ended up being smaller on election day than the poll selected. But seriously, the number should be 0.)

And please... any BernieBros who will jump in with a "But, but... Clinton supporters".... keep your "what-aboutisms" in your pants.
Telling voters they are wrong, or "brain damaged morons", is not a successful strategy.

In any event, around this time in 2008 28% of Clinton voters said they would vote for McCain over Obama. Numbers in this range are very common in primaries. It doesn't reveal anything about Sanders voters. You may think them stupid, but across all voters there are many who don't think the "rational" way you do. Hell, even if they are idiots, I see no evidence it is more proportionally idiotic than any other campaign. Notably, the poll didn't ask about the Biden voters who wouldn't vote for Sanders. I expect they would be higher, but it would be because they are rational somehow, and not brain-dead bros .
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Old Yesterday, 08:35 PM   #493
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Originally Posted by Tsukasa Buddha View Post
Telling voters they are wrong, or "brain damaged morons", is not a successful strategy.
Especially not when it involves treating the ability to draw crossover voters as a bad thing and the lack of such an ability as a good thing.
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Old Today, 04:19 AM   #494
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Originally Posted by Delvo View Post
Especially not when it involves treating the ability to draw crossover voters as a bad thing and the lack of such an ability as a good thing.
Seriously. Bernie's campaign was appealing to people who were not reliable Democratic party voters. Some were probably Trump supporters in 2016. The primary isn't just held among party loyalists. The fact that Bernie could appeal to people who might support Trump was an asset. Seems that Bernie is more appealing than Joe to people who aren't "Vote Blue No Matter Who" party loyalists.

A Biden campaign is a repudiation of the Bernie strategy, so let's not pretend to be shocked that Bernie's unique coalition is not 100% transferable to Biden.
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Old Today, 08:23 AM   #495
theprestige
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Originally Posted by Segnosaur View Post
Well, at least we have an idea what percentage of Sanders Supporters are brain damaged morons...
"Why did you hit him?"

"Well, I really needed his help."

"Then why did you hit him?"

"He hit me first."

"But you really need his help, right?"

"Yeah, but he hit me!"

"Is that really the most important thing right now?"

"... Yes."

Maybe calling Bernie Bros morons isn't the strongest play.

Last edited by theprestige; Today at 08:25 AM.
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Old Today, 08:27 AM   #496
theprestige
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Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
I don't know what's wrong. It's worrisome but not because I'm worried about the political issues. We are months from the election.

But with the COVID spreading like wildfire, I hope he isn't sick.
In any case, he did finally have a virtual town hall or some such on the subject. Pretty quickly, too. And again I'm surprised it isn't getting more discussion. I haven't watched it myself, but I'd expect people invested in Biden's campaign (and Bernie's) to be talking more about this event.
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Old Today, 10:27 AM   #497
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Originally Posted by Tsukasa Buddha View Post
Telling voters they are wrong, or "brain damaged morons", is not a successful strategy.

In any event, around this time in 2008 28% of Clinton voters said they would vote for McCain over Obama. Numbers in this range are very common in primaries. It doesn't reveal anything about Sanders voters. You may think them stupid, but across all voters there are many who don't think the "rational" way you do. Hell, even if they are idiots, I see no evidence it is more proportionally idiotic than any other campaign. Notably, the poll didn't ask about the Biden voters who wouldn't vote for Sanders. I expect they would be higher, but it would be because they are rational somehow, and not brain-dead bros .
Another thing to keep in mind is those are single sample surveys. I saw one on 538 with results that 8% of Biden supporters wouldn't vote for Sanders and 3% of Sanders supporters wouldn't vote for Biden, though it did say the survey was skewed by not having enough younger respondents.

With the recent sexual assault allegation and the report that people have very low enthusiasm for Biden I don't understand why anyone is still carrying a torch for him.
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Old Today, 10:55 AM   #498
Aridas
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Originally Posted by The_Animus View Post
With the recent sexual assault allegation
Which one? I think that I've seen a couple - none of which were credible. I could very easily have missed one, though.

Originally Posted by The_Animus View Post
and the report that people have very low enthusiasm for Biden I don't understand why anyone is still carrying a torch for him.
To poke back to a little earlier in the thread, Biden is the risk-mitigation candidate. In this time where fear and desire to get rid of the current President is playing a much stronger role than usual, that matters more than usual. Going further, that Biden has pointedly shown respect to African Americans in their eyes has also tipped things towards him, as well as their all too common lack of faith in white people as a group to elect a person like Bernie, even if they'd prefer his policies.
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Old Today, 11:01 AM   #499
theprestige
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Originally Posted by The_Animus View Post
Another thing to keep in mind is those are single sample surveys. I saw one on 538 with results that 8% of Biden supporters wouldn't vote for Sanders and 3% of Sanders supporters wouldn't vote for Biden, though it did say the survey was skewed by not having enough younger respondents.
Well, it seems the younger voters aren't actually voters in the first place, so maybe the survey isn't that skewed.
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Old Today, 11:08 AM   #500
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Originally Posted by The_Animus View Post
With the recent sexual assault allegation and the report that people have very low enthusiasm for Biden I don't understand why anyone is still carrying a torch for him.
Because ELECTABLE!!!!!!!!
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Old Today, 11:13 AM   #501
theprestige
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Originally Posted by Delvo View Post
Because ELECTABLE!!!!!!!!
I'm beginning to think that "electability" is a factor because nobody wants to risk having an actual platform that people can look at and vote up or down on.

The ideal is for candidates to say, "this is my plan, if you like it, vote for me. If you don't, don't."

The reality is that candidates don't want to give voters such a clear choice. If you can manage to pull it off, it's much better to get elected on a platform of "I look pretty good and sound pretty good and I'm probably trustworthy enough that things will work out pretty well if you elect me."
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