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Old 10th July 2018, 11:29 AM   #2961
d4m10n
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Originally Posted by Myriad View Post
Their forum’s purpose was to reassure the people of the right genders, sexual orientations, and racial characteristics that yes, indeed, they were widely hated by everyone else.
I'd say that the forum's primary purpose was to create a safe space for atheists who feel marginalized in some way or another. Not sure if we are really disagreeing here, though, in terms of how A+ played out in practice.
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Old 3rd August 2018, 07:36 AM   #2962
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Originally Posted by d4m10n View Post
As was Richard Carrier.

As was Jamie Kilstein.

Not to mention Hugo Schwyzer.
I just saw on PZ Myers' Freethoughts blog 'Pharyngula' that Arizona State University has removed Lawrence Krauss as leader of the Origins Project, a program he began to “explore humankind’s most fundamental questions about our origins.” So another one to add to the above list.

Last edited by GDon; 3rd August 2018 at 07:37 AM.
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Old 3rd August 2018, 07:38 AM   #2963
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Originally Posted by Stout View Post
Looks like Silverman was a proud feminist.

Originally Posted by d4m10n View Post
As was Richard Carrier.

As was Jamie Kilstein.

Not to mention Hugo Schwyzer.

Originally Posted by GDon View Post
I just saw on PZ Myers' Freethoughts blog 'Pharyngula' that Arizona State University has removed Lawrence Krauss as leader of the Origins Project, a program he began to “explore humankind’s most fundamental questions about our origins.” So another one to add to the above list.
Krauss was a proud feminist?
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Old 4th August 2018, 12:39 AM   #2964
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Originally Posted by d4m10n View Post
Krauss was a proud feminist?
Well, perhaps I am unfairly putting words into his mouth. Maybe he falls under the standard "the more a person claims to help women, the more inevitable it seems that claims of sexual harassment will be made against him."

This is from Krauss's letter where he defends against the sexual harassment charges made against him:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1IgA...ryTNJbJ_5/view
Second, BuzzFeed claimed that my statements suggesting the skeptical movement is becoming more diverse, and that it is a good time to be a woman in science, somehow reflected a reality colored by misogynistic and sexist glasses. Yet, anyone who attends skeptics conferences will have noticed that the programs and speakers have become far more diverse, a development I have vocally supported. And throughout my career I have watched and participated in efforts to increase diversity in the community of physicists. When I was chair of physics, we not only hired the first two women faculty in the physics department, we also matriculated what was probably the first all-female entering graduate physics class. In fact, it is a good time to be a woman in science, and I have pointed this out frequently when I lecture precisely because I believe this helps encourage young women who hear it to consider a career in science.
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Old 4th August 2018, 11:55 AM   #2965
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ASU has completed the investigation that it reopened in February. https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article...east-asu-finds
Quote:
In a letter sent Jul. 31, Arizona State provost Mark Searle told Thomson that “the preponderance of the evidence” now suggested that Krauss had breached the university’s policy on sexual harassment, and that he “did grab the right breast of the woman in the photograph.”
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Old 9th August 2018, 01:45 PM   #2966
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Just finished slogging through this epic post from Richard Carrier about the demise of Atheism Plus: https://www.richardcarrier.info/archives/14153

Not getting the sense that he really remembers what he originally wrote about it.
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Old 10th August 2018, 12:55 AM   #2967
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Originally Posted by d4m10n View Post
Just finished slogging through this epic post from Richard Carrier about the demise of Atheism Plus: https://www.richardcarrier.info/archives/14153

Not getting the sense that he really remembers what he originally wrote about it.
Any chance you could sum up?
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Old 10th August 2018, 04:27 AM   #2968
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Originally Posted by Squeegee Beckenheim View Post
Any chance you could sum up?
Bascially, Carrier did nothing wrong and everyone else is to blame. It was in no way ill-advised to call for a strict disivion between in-group members in good standing and subhuman CHUDs.

Originally Posted by Richard Carrier
The point of Atheism+ is to create an in-group/out-group shibboleth that forces people to declare which they are: someone who embraces reasonableness, compassion, and integrity as values, or someone who rejects them; someone who opposes racism, sexism, injustice, and cruelty, or someone who is okay with racism, sexism, injustice, and cruelty.
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Old 10th August 2018, 10:57 AM   #2969
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Originally Posted by d4m10n View Post
Bascially, Carrier did nothing wrong and everyone else is to blame. It was in no way ill-advised to call for a strict disivion between in-group members in good standing and subhuman CHUDs.

Slightly more specifically, when Carrier spoke of excluding undesirables from the new atheist movement, he really did only mean the worst of the worst, such as overt racists and misogynists. Others failed to understand this at first, which somehow forced the rest of the "movement" to start behaving badly.
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Old 10th August 2018, 11:02 AM   #2970
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Irony: Carrier proposes excluding overt bigots, and everybody decides the only way to do this is through overt bigotry.
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Old 10th August 2018, 11:20 AM   #2971
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Originally Posted by Myriad View Post
Slightly more specifically, when Carrier spoke of excluding undesirables from the new atheist movement, he really did only mean the worst of the worst, such as overt racists and misogynists. Others failed to understand this at first, which somehow forced the rest of the "movement" to start behaving badly.
We failed to understand this at first because the crucial parenthetical (with the two offsite links) wasn't actually present in the original post.
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Old 16th August 2018, 07:41 AM   #2972
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To be honest the addition of those links does change the meaning of his words by a lot. At the time the impression was that the "CHORFS" were anyone not marching in line with FTB.
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Old 16th August 2018, 08:40 AM   #2973
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*CHUDS
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