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Old 20th June 2018, 07:33 AM   #81
abaddon
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Manned spaceflight is a distraction.
So Trump's space force will be able to go nowhere?
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Old 20th June 2018, 07:35 AM   #82
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Originally Posted by Craig4 View Post
I wouldn't worry about this. I'm sure the Joint Staff J5-5 office, future plans has this for action. In other words, Mattiis knows where to send things to die. It will spasm occasionally, like a patient with burns over 80% of their body and you'll think there is hope for recovery but no, the idea will die. There will be no sad goodbye, no funeral. One day the conference room will be booked for a planning meeting to discuss officer accession and career progression (nothing devolves into a useless circle jerk like a discussion of career progression) for the space force. And then, almost without notice the room will be booked for the next presidential transition team. The Deputy J5-5 will use a sharpie to cross out the Space Force meeting, leaving the words visible to the Trump administration lackeys who come to the transition meeting. And that is how the Space Force will die, a passive aggressive **** you from the deputy chief of Joint Staff Future Plans.

With Trump's attention span that would probably work.

Except for ... !!!

... those pesky reporters who will inevitably ask him about the status of his planned Space Forceô.
"And it would have worked, too, if it hadn't been for those pesky kids reporters."
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Old 20th June 2018, 07:58 AM   #83
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Originally Posted by TellyKNeasuss View Post
Fleets used to sail in 3 parts: a main body, a reconnaissance force, and a rear guard. A junior admiral would be assigned to command the rear guard, so as ranks became formalized the lowest grade of admiral came to be called a rear admiral.
Somehow I just KNEW someone was going to give me a serious answer!
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Old 20th June 2018, 08:04 AM   #84
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Originally Posted by abaddon View Post
So Trump's space force will be able to go nowhere?
The furthest they will have to go is to a Parade on Pennsylvania Avenue.
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Old 20th June 2018, 08:07 AM   #85
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Is this an unmanned space force? Are the US going to ask the Russians to launch if for them?

Unless there's a US based, man-rated rocket of which I'm unaware, currently the US lacks the ability to launch a person into space, let alone a space force.

(Edit - I see this has already been mentioned. It's such a total stopper that I consider it worth mentioning twice.)
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Old 20th June 2018, 08:09 AM   #86
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Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza View Post
The furthest they will have to go is to a Parade on Pennsylvania Avenue.
Presumably with an array of phallic over-compensateors launch vehicles on display to make The President feel more puissant.
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Old 20th June 2018, 08:10 AM   #87
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Originally Posted by 3point14 View Post
Is this an unmanned space force? Are the US going to ask the Russians to launch if for them?

Unless there's a US based, man-rated rocket of which I'm unaware, currently the US lacks the ability to launch a person into space, let alone a space force.
Yeah, the first step in creating a Space Force: influx of a gajillion dollars.

The infrastructure needed to do this is mindboggling.
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Old 20th June 2018, 08:13 AM   #88
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Originally Posted by pgwenthold View Post
Yeah, the first step in creating a Space Force: influx of a gajillion dollars.

The infrastructure needed to do this is mindboggling.

Maybe they can de-mothball the shuttle and finally make use of all those previously unused design features demanded by the US military?
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Old 20th June 2018, 08:15 AM   #89
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Originally Posted by 3point14 View Post
Is this an unmanned space force? Are the US going to ask the Russians to launch if for them?

Unless there's a US based, man-rated rocket of which I'm unaware, currently the US lacks the ability to launch a person into space, let alone a space force.

(Edit - I see this has already been mentioned. It's such a total stopper that I consider it worth mentioning twice.)

It reminds me of when President Bush I called for a Mars mission during a speech in 1989. There was a political cartoon that showed him doing a launch countdown while sitting on top of a wrecked space capsule that was rusting away in a junkyard, wearing a space helmet and carrying a sign that said "Mars or Bust."
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Old 20th June 2018, 11:25 AM   #90
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Originally Posted by abaddon View Post
So Trump's space force will be able to go nowhere?
Since it won't exist without an act of Congress, it won't even get off the ground.

But actual space militarization doesn't require manned spaceflight. The Air Force briefly considered manned orbital reconnaissance spaceplanes, but that was superseded by technological advancements and the development of recon satellites. Nowadays, they have things like the Orbital Test Vehicle, for military missions. It takes Trumpian levels of ignorance to imagine that human spaceflight is an important part of military space programs, now and in the future.
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Old 20th June 2018, 11:36 AM   #91
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Since it won't exist without an act of Congress, it won't even get off the ground.

But actual space militarization doesn't require manned spaceflight. The Air Force briefly considered manned orbital reconnaissance spaceplanes, but that was superseded by technological advancements and the development of recon satellites. Nowadays, they have things like the Orbital Test Vehicle, for military missions. It takes Trumpian levels of ignorance to imagine that human spaceflight is an important part of military space programs, now and in the future.

Exactly.

So does thinking that building a wall is going to make a significant dent in the illegal immigrant problem.

And yet, it is likely that Trump will get his GOP Congresscretins to pony up $20 billion or so to do just that.

If they manage to stay around long enough, that is.
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Old 20th June 2018, 12:27 PM   #92
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Wow. Trump is totally destroying America with all his empty rhetoric that doesn't actually change the fundamentals of how this country runs.
Empty rhetoric? Trump will be touting this as an example of how he and the Republican Party have been accomplishing so much. Considering that a sizable part of his voters actually seem to believe his lies, let alone apparently think the crazy nonsense he spouts actually makes sense, i wouldn't be surprised if padding his list of accomplishments like this would actually work.
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Old 20th June 2018, 12:42 PM   #93
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Originally Posted by Squeegee Beckenheim View Post
I just hope that Trump himself designs the uniforms. Can you imagine?

Actually, it'll probably be Ivanka, won't it?

I suggest something like this:

https://i.imgur.com/NmVghNw.jpg
MI without Powered Armor always sucked.......
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Old 20th June 2018, 12:45 PM   #94
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The worst thing about this stupid proposal is that it really hurts people like me who advocate greater funding for Space Exploration.Now we are saddles with explaiing why we don't support Donnie's dumb idea.
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Old 20th June 2018, 12:45 PM   #95
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Originally Posted by dudalb View Post
MI without Powered Armor always sucked.......
+1
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Old 20th June 2018, 12:48 PM   #96
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Originally Posted by LSSBB View Post
+1
I really disliked the film of "Starship Troopers".
I strongly disagree with a lot of Henlein's ideas in the novel, but he deserved to have them accurately stated, rather then the strawman ideas that the director gave us.
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Old 20th June 2018, 01:01 PM   #97
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Originally Posted by 3point14 View Post
Is this an unmanned space force? Are the US going to ask the Russians to launch if for them?

Unless there's a US based, man-rated rocket of which I'm unaware, currently the US lacks the ability to launch a person into space, let alone a space force.

(Edit - I see this has already been mentioned. It's such a total stopper that I consider it worth mentioning twice.)
Why are manned launches necessary? The Air Force does space missions all the time, but they haven't bothered with manned missions in almost fifty years.
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Old 20th June 2018, 01:57 PM   #98
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Why are manned launches necessary? The Air Force does space missions all the time, but they haven't bothered with manned missions in almost fifty years.

They're not. You know that, I know that. Does Trump know that? I would guess he's got BSG rattling around in his head.
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Old 20th June 2018, 03:31 PM   #99
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Originally Posted by quadraginta View Post
With Trump's attention span that would probably work.

Except for ... !!!

... those pesky reporters who will inevitably ask him about the status of his planned Space Forceô.
"And it would have worked, too, if it hadn't been for those pesky kids reporters."
I shouldn't worry about that. There will be PowerPoint slides galore depicting progress on the Space Force. They may even violate the Joint Staff Style Guide directing that no animations, dissolves or other special effects be used to make the presentations dynamic and exciting.
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Old 20th June 2018, 03:53 PM   #100
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Originally Posted by Sabrina View Post
"Nipple, nipple, tweak, tweak!"

(Sorry, I couldn't resist. )
Originally Posted by kookbreaker View Post
But do you have a high-gloss plywood Moon vehicle?
Thank you. Joel, Crow & Tom are pleased!

I was hoping somebody spotted the reference and would send an appropriate reply, bonus I got two! Just watched an episode last week in the Netflix collection, Commando Cody was one of the highlights of season one.

Last edited by paulhutch; 20th June 2018 at 03:55 PM.
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Old 20th June 2018, 03:55 PM   #101
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Originally Posted by 3point14 View Post
They're not. You know that, I know that. Does Trump know that? I would guess he's got BSG rattling around in his head.
I would guess he doesn't give a ****, because he knows it's empty rhetoric that has already accomplished its mission.
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Old 20th June 2018, 05:41 PM   #102
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
I would guess he doesn't give a ****, because he knows it's empty rhetoric that has already accomplished its mission.
He THINKS it has already accomplished its mission - Project Distract From Disasters. But the mission actually accomplished is to add yet another tick in the column of Donny's Really Stupid Ideas That He Thinks Distract But Would Not Distract A Flighty Five Year Old And We See Through This All The Time.
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Old 20th June 2018, 05:45 PM   #103
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Yup. You've been seeing through it for what? A couple years, now? At least. How's that working out for you?
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Old 20th June 2018, 05:52 PM   #104
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Yup. You've been seeing through it for what? A couple years, now? At least. How's that working out for you?
Quite well, actually. I don't live in the USA and am not a citizen, so don't have to suffer quite so much from his incompetence.

Mind you, here in Australia we have our own proto-Nazi immigration policies we have enacted that I am equally appalled by. Not a lot different from what Donny has reverted to today. Which should be equally condemned.

But that's WAY off topic for this. Ask us about our Cape York Space Centre!
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Old 21st June 2018, 05:28 AM   #105
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Originally Posted by paulhutch View Post
Thank you. Joel, Crow & Tom are pleased!

I was hoping somebody spotted the reference and would send an appropriate reply, bonus I got two! Just watched an episode last week in the Netflix collection, Commando Cody was one of the highlights of season one.
Dude, I'm like an MST3K superfan. I purchased VIP tickets to BOTH shows on the live tour in my area and have joined a group that rents a small theater to watch episodes at midnight once a month. Only reason I haven't seen all the episodes yet is lack of time. /offtopic side-discussion
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Old 21st June 2018, 05:35 AM   #106
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Originally Posted by dudalb View Post
The worst thing about this stupid proposal is that it really hurts people like me who advocate greater funding for Space Exploration.Now we are saddles with explaiing why we don't support Donnie's dumb idea.
You have NASA and its wonderful work. This is an absurd militarisation of space fantasy.
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Old 21st June 2018, 06:10 AM   #107
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The Air Force wouldn't give Trump the Remote Control for the X-37, so now he is going to take their space toy away and give it to a more compliant, totally incompetent lackey.
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Old 21st June 2018, 06:22 AM   #108
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Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza View Post
The Air Force wouldn't give Trump the Remote Control for the X-37, so now he is going to take their space toy away and give it to a more compliant, totally incompetent lackey.
There's criticizing Trump's policies, and there's criticizing Trump's rhetoric, and then there's this. Why does criticism of Trump always have to veer so sharply into bitter fantasies?
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Old 21st June 2018, 06:59 AM   #109
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
There's criticizing Trump's policies, and there's criticizing Trump's rhetoric, and then there's this. Why does criticism of Trump always have to veer so sharply into bitter fantasies?

It didn't seem particularly bitter to me. More like mildly humorous.

Also somewhat plausible, which, I suppose, is what makes it mildly humorous.
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Old 21st June 2018, 07:37 AM   #110
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Originally Posted by 3point14 View Post
Is this an unmanned space force? Are the US going to ask the Russians to launch if for them?

Unless there's a US based, man-rated rocket of which I'm unaware, currently the US lacks the ability to launch a person into space, let alone a space force.
Say a serious attempt were made, to establish a manned space force (whether a department of an existing branch, or a new branch of the military). Obviously the first step would be to redevelop indigenous manned space flight capability. NASA's working on this, but slowly. A budget infusion and acceleration of the program, would that really be a bad thing, for all you manned spaceflight aficionados?
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Old 21st June 2018, 07:39 AM   #111
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Originally Posted by pgwenthold View Post
Yeah, the first step in creating a Space Force: influx of a gajillion dollars.

The infrastructure needed to do this is mindboggling.
Most of the infrastructure is already in place and regularly used.
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Old 21st June 2018, 07:40 AM   #112
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Originally Posted by dudalb View Post
The worst thing about this stupid proposal is that it really hurts people like me who advocate greater funding for Space Exploration.Now we are saddles with explaiing why we don't support Donnie's dumb idea.
If that's the worst thing, it seems like it's probably not a big deal, then.
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Old 21st June 2018, 07:42 AM   #113
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
There's criticizing Trump's policies, and there's criticizing Trump's rhetoric, and then there's this. Why does criticism of Trump always have to veer so sharply into bitter fantasies?
bitter?
fantasy?
policy?`

There is no reasonable argument to be made for a Space Force: what the Military does in space is mostly buried in the Black Budget, and making a separate branch will create more bureaucracy and let our enemies know what we are up to.

Trump wants Star Wars, just like Reagan, purely for publicity, because neither one understood anything about objects in orbit.
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Old 21st June 2018, 08:02 AM   #114
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I make no apologies if this has already been posted. It needs multiple postings.

YouTube Video This video is not hosted by the ISF. The ISF can not be held responsible for the suitability or legality of this material. By clicking the link below you agree to view content from an external website.
I AGREE
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Old 21st June 2018, 08:07 AM   #115
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Say a serious attempt were made, to establish a manned space force (whether a department of an existing branch, or a new branch of the military). Obviously the first step would be to redevelop indigenous manned space flight capability. NASA's working on this, but slowly. A budget infusion and acceleration of the program, would that really be a bad thing, for all you manned spaceflight aficionados?
Depends what their aims are.
If it's all LEO stuff then possibly not a Good Thing, as NASAs current work is on multi purpose vehicles with the aim of heading Out There, rather than just orbit.
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Old 21st June 2018, 08:07 AM   #116
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Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza View Post
The Air Force wouldn't give Trump the Remote Control for the X-37, so now he is going to take their space toy away and give it to a more compliant, totally incompetent lackey.

"Mr President, you've used all the fuel pulling 360's in LEO, there's none let to deorbit"
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Old 21st June 2018, 08:11 AM   #117
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I think the biggest issue with this whole cockamamie idea is that there doesn't seem to be any sort of logical reason to create a Space Force to begin with. People have already pointed out the fact that space itself is neutral territory (unless Trump plans to pull out of THAT treaty too), so can someone please explain WHY we would even need a military branch for space? We already have NASA for space exploration, so that can't be it, we're decades (probably) away from any real attempt at colonizing other planets (assuming we can even build the tech to reach the closest one that could possibly BE colonized), so what is the purpose of this "Space Force"?

Let me guess; Trump's desperate for any action that will make his base continue to coo and slaver over him while utterly ignoring the ineffectual outcome of his actions. I swear to FSM, every time I hear about the next ridiculous thing this idiot comes out with I just want to yell at the TV, "Trumpy, you can do stupid things!" I'm just not willing to taint my memories of a great TV show by doing so.
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Old 21st June 2018, 08:16 AM   #118
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Say a serious attempt were made, to establish a manned space force (whether a department of an existing branch, or a new branch of the military). Obviously the first step would be to redevelop indigenous manned space flight capability. NASA's working on this, but slowly. A budget infusion and acceleration of the program, would that really be a bad thing, for all you manned spaceflight aficionados?

It'd be alright, but the differences in requirements between civilian ad military use make it a bit tricky. Look at all the changes the USAF insisted happen to the shuttle which were never required.

It would no doubt be a boon to civilian spaceflight but not as much as one might think, I suspect.
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Old 21st June 2018, 08:49 AM   #119
TheSupermeerkat
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Originally Posted by 3point14 View Post
Is this an unmanned space force? Are the US going to ask the Russians to launch if for them?

Unless there's a US based, man-rated rocket of which I'm unaware, currently the US lacks the ability to launch a person into space, let alone a space force.

(Edit - I see this has already been mentioned. It's such a total stopper that I consider it worth mentioning twice.)


SpaceX and Boeing are, or should be, launching manned capsules later this year.
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Old 21st June 2018, 09:13 AM   #120
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Originally Posted by TheSupermeerkat View Post
SpaceX and Boeing are, or should be, launching manned capsules later this year.

Good news.

At least Trump's Space Cadets will be able to rent flight time from American companies.

(Although Trump will probably balk at his Russian buddies losing the income.)
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