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Old 23rd July 2018, 09:56 PM   #161
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Originally Posted by TheGoldcountry View Post
Interesting what the death of another human being, justified by a ridiculous law, does to people.

It's insanity.
The law is not ridiculous, and it does not justify this killing.
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Old 23rd July 2018, 10:18 PM   #162
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
The law is not ridiculous.

Any law that increases homicide rates by 30% is ridiculous on its face.
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Old 23rd July 2018, 11:22 PM   #163
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Originally Posted by This is The End View Post
Any law that increases homicide rates by 30% is ridiculous on its face.
You mean justified homicide? Think about how great it is to legally kill people? It's just a bonus that they're black. You can be a tough-talking wannabe police officer patrolling your neighborhood and BAM: you get to kill Trayvon. You can be an ******* parking lot cop who makes bitchy comments for unauthorized use of the handicap spot and BAM: gun down a father of tre. #Empowering #Don'tTreadOnMe #HookerTookMy$$$NowSheDeadBitch(YouThaBitchNoComma sInHashTags)
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Old 23rd July 2018, 11:26 PM   #164
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https://www.yahoo.com/gma/victims-gi...opstories.html


Quote:
“By this time a witness pulls up and everybody hears us going back and forth with one another. ... A witness goes in the store and he let the owner know that there was somebody out there messing with a woman in a car,” she said. “My man hears what’s going on, sees the guy yelling at me and I’m sitting in the car. My man is defending me and his children, so he pushes him down.


“The guy is on the ground and he pulls the gun out. ... My dude steps back 'cause my dude is fearing for his life -- all of us were,” she added.

Drejka is ***** IMO.
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Old 23rd July 2018, 11:32 PM   #165
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Originally Posted by Cain View Post
You mean justified homicide?

Well, I know it's you and all, but I should elaborate.

The knowledge that your state has the law is shown to cause "people to engage in potentially violent situations that they would’ve previously avoided".

When is pretty ****** obvious really.

http://time.com/4569145/florida-stan...ncrease-study/

Quote:
Since the controversial law was implemented in 2005, Florida’s overall monthly homicide rate has increased 24.4% and the homicide by firearm rate is up 31.6%, according to the study, which was published in the Journal of the American Medical Association.
Quote:
The research backs up a similar study from 2013
Quote:
“This doesn’t rule out the possibility that there might have been something else that happened the we don’t know about,” Humphreys says. “But the magnitude of the effect led us to believe that the only thing that could plausibly lead to that effect is ‘Stand Your Ground.’

In other words, the only people claiming "huge coincidence" to that are racist & white.
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Old 24th July 2018, 01:11 AM   #166
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Originally Posted by Wolrab View Post
I watched the video. There is no audio. What I see is a man checking out a vehicle. He approaches the driver's side and then backs off a step or two and appears to be pointing out other parking spaces. He does not appear to be gesticulating too wildly. When the boyfriend comes out, the old guy is distracted by the vehicle door opening and does not see or react the the boyfriend coming at him. The boyfriend violently shoves the guy to the ground. We can't see if his head strikes the ground as it is blocked by the boyfriend's body. The guy on the ground goes for his weapon and shoots the boyfriend within 4 seconds of hitting the ground. We don't know what the boyfriend was saying before the guy shoots.

Speculation does not help.
By all accounts, he was loud enough to be noticed by everyone around him, and aggressive enough for the woman he was likely yelling at to get out of the car. If they wanted to charge him with a crime like "disturbing the peace", "menacing", or whatever, they would do so, which would mean he was committing a crime during the shooting. Boom, done, murder/manslaughter charge justified. I've seen plenty of people charged for far thinner reasons, this guy at least unquestionably shot and killed someone.

Last edited by Mumbles; 24th July 2018 at 01:13 AM.
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Old 24th July 2018, 03:01 AM   #167
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Originally Posted by Mumbles View Post
By all accounts, he was loud enough to be noticed by everyone around him, and aggressive enough for the woman he was likely yelling at to get out of the car. If they wanted to charge him with a crime like "disturbing the peace", "menacing", or whatever, they would do so, which would mean he was committing a crime during the shooting. Boom, done, murder/manslaughter charge justified. I've seen plenty of people charged for far thinner reasons, this guy at least unquestionably shot and killed someone.
He is a free speech hero for the right wing like Jeremy Joseph Christian standing up for their first amendment rights to harass the lesser races.
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Old 24th July 2018, 04:14 AM   #168
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
Park your jalopy in a handicap spot.
Someone tells you to move it.
Getting in screaming argument.
Hulking boyfriend blindsides guy twice his age.
Hulking boyfriend removed from gene pool.

Yeah, not too upset about this one.

(Ain’t that just like a guy who would park in a handicapped spot, he brought a shove to a gun fight)
Cain? Is that you?
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Old 24th July 2018, 05:14 AM   #169
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
Seems, like the deceased’s mistake was “parking” an armed man on his ass because his baby momma was too *********** lazy to park like a human being.
Cool dog whistle, bro.
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Old 24th July 2018, 05:27 AM   #170
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Does anyone think this guy would be out playing parking police if he wasn't armed? It takes a special kind of courage to be confrontational knowing that you have a gun hidden in your belt.

Legal or not, shooter is human garbage.
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Old 24th July 2018, 07:09 AM   #171
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Here is the next stand your ground self defense shooting.

https://people.com/crime/dad-fatally...-racial-slurs/

Who wouldn't be afraid for the life after someone leaves a bar to confront them after they got thrown out of the bar. Totally legit legal shooting.
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Old 24th July 2018, 07:33 AM   #172
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Originally Posted by ponderingturtle View Post
Here is the next stand your ground self defense shooting.

https://people.com/crime/dad-fatally...-racial-slurs/

Who wouldn't be afraid for the life after someone leaves a bar to confront them after they got thrown out of the bar. Totally legit legal shooting.
Seriously, your posts are getting to be about as non-nonsensical as Logger's were. The guy is under arrest for suspected homicide, how do you warp that in your brain to become a SYG case and legit shooting?
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Old 24th July 2018, 07:40 AM   #173
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Originally Posted by SuburbanTurkey View Post
Does anyone think this guy would be out playing parking police if he wasn't armed? It takes a special kind of courage to be confrontational knowing that you have a gun hidden in your belt.

Legal or not, shooter is human garbage.
Given that the store owner said this isn't the first time he's been seeing confronting people, there is little doubt in my mind he went looking for a reason to shoot someone.
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Old 24th July 2018, 07:41 AM   #174
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Originally Posted by This is The End View Post
Several people in this thread seem to be forgetting that even if the "shove" was 100% wrong (legally, morally, financially, whatever) the shooting can very well still be determined to be unjustified. Even in Florida.
if?

Of course it was 100% wrong.

"If" the Lothario wanted to protect his Lady Fair who was squatting in the handicapped parking lot, he could have interposed his bulk between the victim and the car, rather than blindsiding the victim.
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Old 24th July 2018, 07:41 AM   #175
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Originally Posted by Mumbles View Post
If they wanted to charge him with a crime like "disturbing the peace", "menacing", or whatever, they would do so, which would mean he was committing a crime during the shooting. Boom, done, murder/manslaughter charge justified.
No. A death which occurs during the commission of felony can be charged as murder to the person committing that felony (hence the term "felony murder"), but misdemeanors don't qualify for that treatment. I'm sure you can imagine the abuses such a law could produce.
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Old 24th July 2018, 07:43 AM   #176
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
if?

Of course it was 100% wrong.

"If" the Lothario wanted to protect his Lady Fair who was squatting in the handicapped parking lot, he could have interposed his bulk between the victim and the car, rather than blindsiding the victim.
It was 100% wrong UNLESS he was threatening the guys girlfriend with physical violence. Not sure we'll ever have definitive proof one way or the other on that.
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Old 24th July 2018, 07:46 AM   #177
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Originally Posted by lobosrul5 View Post
It was 100% wrong UNLESS he was threatening the guys girlfriend with physical violence. Not sure we'll ever have definitive proof one way or the other on that.
I am pretty sure we will, because the shover did not stop to assess the situation, he went from the door into the violent act without stopping
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Old 24th July 2018, 07:52 AM   #178
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“My man hears what’s going on, sees the guy yelling at me and I’m sitting in the car. My man is defending me and his children, so he pushes him down."

Thanks, he will be releasing the shovee toot sweet with our apologies for detaining him.

By the way, here is a 150 ticket for squatting in the handicapped spot. See that it does not happen again.
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Old 24th July 2018, 08:31 AM   #179
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
Disagree. The deceased blindsided him and wrecked him. That would be 15 yards and an ejection for targeting. The guy who got blindsided seemed totally dazed.
I agree.

The proper punishment should be 15 yards and ejection from the parking lot.

I don't understand the rest of the thread.
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Old 24th July 2018, 09:15 AM   #180
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Instead of shoving him he should've punched him in the face & then grabbed their son & left.
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Old 24th July 2018, 09:25 AM   #181
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Originally Posted by PhantomWolf View Post
Seriously, your posts are getting to be about as non-nonsensical as Logger's were. The guy is under arrest for suspected homicide, how do you warp that in your brain to become a SYG case and legit shooting?
The guy pursued him. That is plenty of reason to fear for your life.
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Old 24th July 2018, 10:06 AM   #182
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ITT: people having no idea what being in imminent danger of death or serious bodily injury means. Not even a single strong shove that knocks you on your keister is deadly serious, nor is thinking it might theoretically resume and escalate.

Seriously, is a kid shoving another down in a schoolyard attempted freaking murder? A shove is just not life or death.
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Old 24th July 2018, 10:11 AM   #183
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
ITT: people having no idea what being in imminent danger of death or serious bodily injury means. Not even a single strong shove that knocks you on your keister is deadly serious, nor is thinking it might theoretically resume and escalate.

Seriously, is a kid shoving another down in a schoolyard attempted freaking murder? A shove is just not life or death.
Excellent point.
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Old 24th July 2018, 10:29 AM   #184
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Originally Posted by lobosrul5 View Post
Given that the store owner said this isn't the first time he's been seeing confronting people, there is little doubt in my mind he went looking for a reason to shoot someone.
The other examples given also, iirc, related to people parking in the disabled space. I'd be interested to know if he has a close relation that has a disabled parking badge.
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Old 24th July 2018, 10:43 AM   #185
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Originally Posted by This is The End View Post
That should read "Mumbles is correct". I was reading the wrong word when trying to type the "correct" one.
You're starting to sound more like Donald Trump every day.
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Old 24th July 2018, 10:54 AM   #186
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
ITT: people having no idea what being in imminent danger of death or serious bodily injury means. Not even a single strong shove that knocks you on your keister is deadly serious, nor is thinking it might theoretically resume and escalate.

Seriously, is a kid shoving another down in a schoolyard attempted freaking murder? A shove is just not life or death.
You are completely wrong.

http://thechart.blogs.cnn.com/2009/0...omment-page-3/
https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/...w/48119664.cms
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/ar...layground.html
https://www.universalhub.com/crime/2...-elderly-woman
http://www.wmur.com/article/man-suff...-fight/5188675
https://www.nbclosangeles.com/news/l...262650951.html

i could go on and on
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Old 24th July 2018, 11:20 AM   #187
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
Yes, people have died from a single sucker punch or push. They are generally considered freak occurrences. Show me a medical report saying this guy had a serious head injury or brain bleed and I'll entertain that getting shoved is ground for reasonable fear of death. By the time the man had the pistol out and ready, he was no longer in danger. His attacker had stepped back and was making no further attempt to attack him. Maybe he was in some reasonable danger prior, but by the time he pulled the trigger, he was not. Looks like murder to me.


I have a feeling a jury of his peers wouldn't consider his actions reasonable. If there is any justice in the world, charges will be forthcoming from the DA, the sheriff's absurd interpretation be damned.
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Old 24th July 2018, 11:20 AM   #188
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
If I could've carried a gun on my person between about 6th and 10th grade and shot every kid who shoved me or worse.... man I'd have quite the kill count.
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Old 24th July 2018, 11:24 AM   #189
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Originally Posted by SuburbanTurkey View Post
Yes, people have died from a single sucker punch or push. They are generally considered freak occurrences. Show me a medical report saying this guy had a serious head injury or brain bleed and I'll entertain that getting shoved is ground for reasonable fear of death.
I think the criterion is "reasonable fear of death or serious bodily injury", with both reasonable and serious seeming to be the wiggle words.

But still, I don't see how he could have feared either, since after he pulled the gun the guy was clearly no longer being a threat if not outright retreating.
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Old 24th July 2018, 11:28 AM   #190
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15 year old girl got shoved in Cambridge Massachusetts yesterday she fell and hit her head on the sidewalk and she died.

They haven't said yet who pushed her but I wonder if that person will be charged with murder.
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Old 24th July 2018, 11:28 AM   #191
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Originally Posted by lobosrul5 View Post
If I could've carried a gun on my person between about 6th and 10th grade and shot every kid who shoved me or worse.... man I'd have quite the kill count.
neither one of these characters was in in 6th to 10th grade.

What a terrible comparison, but if that is the best y'all can do, I say go for it.

Striking one's head on the pavement is a serious often fatal injury
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Old 24th July 2018, 11:32 AM   #192
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
In addition to the other criticisms of this profound argument, did you know you can also break your ankle stepping off a curb if you land just the right way? That doesn't make stepping off a curb a freaking extreme risk.
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Old 24th July 2018, 11:34 AM   #193
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
neither one of these characters was in in 6th to 10th grade.

What a terrible comparison, but if that is the best y'all can do, I say go for it.

Striking one's head on the pavement is a serious often fatal injury
And if he was seen to strike his head, this argument might have relevance.
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Old 24th July 2018, 11:34 AM   #194
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Originally Posted by sir drinks-a-lot View Post
I think the criterion is "reasonable fear of death or serious bodily injury", with both reasonable and serious seeming to be the wiggle words.

But still, I don't see how he could have feared either, since after he pulled the gun the guy was clearly no longer being a threat if not outright retreating.
But this is Florida! how are you supposed to find reasonable people?
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Old 24th July 2018, 11:36 AM   #195
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
neither one of these characters was in in 6th to 10th grade.

What a terrible comparison, but if that is the best y'all can do, I say go for it.

Striking one's head on the pavement is a serious often fatal injury
You're saying being shoved can result in serious injury. True. So why can't everyone use deadly force after being shoved? If after drawing, the guy started charging him again then he'd be 100% justified. But, he didn't, at the moment he shot, there was no reasonable fear of serious bodily injury. Deadly force can't be justified after the fact. And under Florida statute assault and battery is a misdemeanor. So he can't claim that a felony had been committed. There is no way a shove constitutes felony battery under Florida law as per here: https://www.flsenate.gov/Laws/Statut...Chapter784/All

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Old 24th July 2018, 11:38 AM   #196
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Originally Posted by TheGoldcountry View Post
I've been blindsided by punches and shoves. Never even entered my mind that lethal force was warranted in response.
As an adult? I can assure you that it is a very serious crime. In Florida, McGlockton's actions constitute simple battery, which would make him eligible for up to a year in prison and a fine of not more than $1000. That is, unless McGlockton had been previously convicted of battery, in which case the law allows for him to be charged with felony battery, which would open up the possibility for him to serve up to five years in prison plus a fine of up to $5000.
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Old 24th July 2018, 11:39 AM   #197
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Originally Posted by lobosrul5 View Post
You're saying being shoved can result in serious injury. True. So why can't everyone use deadly force after being shoved? If after drawing, the guy started charging him again then he'd be 100% justified. But, he didn't. Deadly force can't be justified after the fact. And under Florida statute assault and battery is a misdemeanor. So he can't claim that a felony had been committed. There is no way a shove constitutes felony battery under Florida law as per here: https://www.flsenate.gov/Laws/Statut...Chapter784/All
Query: if someone with the flu sneezes on me, that would be attempted murder as well, right? I mean, it could end up killing me.
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Old 24th July 2018, 11:40 AM   #198
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Originally Posted by lobosrul5 View Post
You're saying being shoved can result in serious injury. True. So why can't everyone use deadly force after being shoved? If after drawing, the guy started charging him again then he'd be 100% justified. But, he didn't, at the moment he shot, there was no reasonable fear of serious bodily injury. Deadly force can't be justified after the fact. And under Florida statute assault and battery is a misdemeanor. So he can't claim that a felony had been committed. There is no way a shove constitutes felony battery under Florida law as per here: https://www.flsenate.gov/Laws/Statut...Chapter784/All
Yes, he could have been dying of a fatal brain bleed and not been justified. Once the attack stops, so does the justification. The guy backed off the attack with adequate time prior to the trigger being pulled.
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Old 24th July 2018, 11:41 AM   #199
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Originally Posted by Brainster View Post
As an adult? I can assure you that it is a very serious crime. In Florida, McGlockton's actions constitute simple battery, which would make him eligible for up to a year in prison and a fine of not more than $1000. That is, unless McGlockton had been previously convicted of battery, in which case the law allows for him to be charged with felony battery, which would open up the possibility for him to serve up to five years in prison plus a fine of up to $5000.
Battery is a serious crime, though I don't think a shove warrants the maximum sentence which is likely reserved for more blood-and-guts offenders. Still not attempted murder, though
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Old 24th July 2018, 02:15 PM   #200
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
No. A death which occurs during the commission of felony can be charged as murder to the person committing that felony (hence the term "felony murder"), but misdemeanors don't qualify for that treatment. I'm sure you can imagine the abuses such a law could produce.
Actually even then it is only a very specific list of felony's, such as kidnapping, rape, and robbery.
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