[Merged] The Qur'an corrects the mistakes of the false Injil/Torah - Page 71

Blue Mountain · 25th June 2023, 03:52 PM

Originally Posted by Reformed Offlian

No, that is not more accurate. The quote from Helder Camara is:

"Quando dou comida aos pobres, chamam-me de santo. Quando pergunto por que eles são pobres, chamam-me de comunista."

The highlighted portion translates as: "When I ask why they are poor..."

Helder Camara wasn't just calling attention to humanitarian problems; he was calling out structural inequalities that created underclasses in the first place.

Thanks for that. It appears at one point someone translated the quote into English and altered it, and the altered version has become the accepted one.

Reformed Offlian · 25th June 2023, 06:02 PM

Originally Posted by Blue Mountain

Thanks for that. It appears at one point someone translated the quote into English and altered it, and the altered version has become the accepted one.

Yup. It's the one I heard Leonard Nimoy say in my computer while playing Civ IV.

Filippo Lippi · 25th June 2023, 11:42 PM

Originally Posted by Little 10 Toes

Emre_1974tr, why did Allah allow earthquakes to happen to Türkiye?

The Quran (at 31:10) says that "And He placed on the earth weights and supports so that it would not shake you and make you stagger...".

Shhhh.... Emre is doing everything, EVERYTHING, he can to save us from the eternal hellfire

Scorpion · 26th June 2023, 08:54 AM

Originally Posted by Emre_1974tr

There is no limit to the amount of wealth in Islam, as long as it is acquired through lawful means. If there were a limit, there would be a limit of wealth equivalent to a certain weight/amount of gold or diamonds, but there is absolutely no such restriction in the verses.

Not to mention sharing the spoils of war. The Quran has an an entire chapter (Surah 8) devoted to dividing the spoils of war.
It starts by saying in verse one that all spoils belong to Allah and the messenger. But later in the surah at verse forty one Muhammad realizes that nobody will fight his battles for nothing, so he reduces his take to one fifth of the spoils.

This is clear evidence of Muhammad's bandit mind working, and shows he deiced to share the spoils of war as an afterthought.

arthwollipot · 26th June 2023, 06:59 PM

There are passages in the Bible about spoils of war too, just sayin'.

catsmate · 29th June 2023, 10:36 AM

Originally Posted by Scorpion

Not to mention sharing the spoils of war. The Quran has an an entire chapter (Surah 8) devoted to dividing the spoils of war.
It starts by saying in verse one that all spoils belong to Allah and the messenger. But later in the surah at verse forty one Muhammad realizes that nobody will fight his battles for nothing, so he reduces his take to one fifth of the spoils.

This is clear evidence of Muhammad's bandit mind working, and shows he deiced to share the spoils of war as an afterthought.

They took their flocks and their herds and their donkeys, and that which was in the city and that which was in the field;

the Lord had given the people favor in the sight of the Egyptians, so that they let them have their request. Thus they plundered the Egyptians.

The sons of Israel captured the women of Midian and their little ones; and all their cattle and all their flocks and all their goods they plundered.

Only the women and the children and the animals and all that is in the city, all its spoil, you shall take as booty for yourself

Filippo Lippi · 29th June 2023, 10:49 PM

"Emre looked upon his thread at the top of R+P and saw that it was good, for he would not have to pull up some BS post from his nethers"

Foster Zygote · 30th June 2023, 08:25 AM

Originally Posted by arthwollipot

There are passages in the Bible about spoils of war too, just sayin'.

It's quite specific about killing everyone except for the virgin girls.

catsmate · 1st July 2023, 07:23 AM

Originally Posted by Foster Zygote

It's quite specific about killing everyone except for the virgin girls.

No, the Israelites were more economical, they enslaved all the surviving women and children.

MarkCorrigan · 6th July 2023, 03:18 PM

Originally Posted by Reformed Offlian

No, that is not more accurate. The quote from Helder Camara is:

"Quando dou comida aos pobres, chamam-me de santo. Quando pergunto por que eles são pobres, chamam-me de comunista."[/hilite]

The highlighted portion translates as: "When I ask why they are poor..."

Helder Camara wasn't just calling attention to humanitarian problems; he was calling out structural inequalities that created underclasses in the first place.

Thank you for this post, I've adjusted my sig to match.

Emre_1974tr · 25th July 2023, 04:32 PM

Self-defense and retaliation mentioned in Ma'idah 33

https://free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9612339.0

Emre_1974tr · 25th July 2023, 04:34 PM

Self-defense and retaliation mentioned in Ma'idah 33

https://free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9612339.0

Norman Alexander · 25th July 2023, 05:07 PM

Originally Posted by Emre_1974tr

Self-defense and retaliation mentioned in Ma'idah 33

https://free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9612339.0

Welcome back!

Any chance you can answer the question I asked months ago? If I was to visit Zeytinli, what interesting things could I see there? While you visit, perhaps you can tell me?

Gord_in_Toronto · 27th July 2023, 09:12 AM

Originally Posted by Emre_1974tr

Self-defense and retaliation mentioned in Ma'idah 33

https://free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9612339.0

Jesus said. “Do not judge others, and you will not be judged. Do not condemn others, or it will all come back against you. Forgive others, and you will be forgiven. (Luke 6:37)

JayUtah · 27th July 2023, 09:39 AM

I suppose Emre's argument is that Islam improves over all that namby-pamby turning the other cheek.

Gord_in_Toronto · 27th July 2023, 10:38 AM

Originally Posted by JayUtah

I suppose Emre's argument is that Islam improves over all that namby-pamby turning the other cheek.

But isn't a religion of PEACE?

Emre_1974tr · 15th September 2023, 07:26 PM

Holy Quran 3:59 The example of Jesus with God is similar to that of Adam; He created him from dust, then He said to him "Be" and he was.

Adam and his wife, as well as the other humans first created in paradise, were created directly, just like Jesus. They have no father and mother.

And the verses explains that the creation in the hereafter is also a creation without ancestors, and that people will be created directly.

Also, as I have shown in my article, some special people, such as martyrs and prophets, have already been created in Paradise/the Floor of God and have already started their eternal life:

https://free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9611687.0

So Jesus and the other prophets are now living in the Hereafter Universe in the flesh.

In short, the situation of Adam and his wife, the situation of the other people created in paradise, and the situation of all the people created in the Hereafter Universe is like the situation of Jesus. They were created directly without ancestors and continue to be created. In other words, sexuality is not mediated in their creation.

And this ancestorless creation gives them no divinity. God creates as he wills. The creation of Jesus is just like any other example of creation without ancestors, there is no divinity in it.

Thus the Holy Qur'an once again corrects the false Bible on the market.

JayUtah · 15th September 2023, 08:19 PM

Originally Posted by Emre_1974tr

Thus the Holy Qur'an once again corrects the false Bible on the market.

"My superstition is better than someone else's."

Scorpion · 15th September 2023, 09:12 PM

Originally Posted by Emre_1974tr

Holy Quran 3:59 The example of Jesus with God is similar to that of Adam; He created him from dust, then He said to him "Be" and he was.

Adam and his wife, as well as the other humans first created in paradise, were created directly, just like Jesus. They have no father and mother.

And the verses explains that the creation in the hereafter is also a creation without ancestors, and that people will be created directly.

Also, as I have shown in my article, some special people, such as martyrs and prophets, have already been created in Paradise/the Floor of God and have already started their eternal life:

https://free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9611687.0

So Jesus and the other prophets are now living in the Hereafter Universe in the flesh.

In short, the situation of Adam and his wife, the situation of the other people created in paradise, and the situation of all the people created in the Hereafter Universe is like the situation of Jesus. They were created directly without ancestors and continue to be created. In other words, sexuality is not mediated in their creation.

And this ancestorless creation gives them no divinity. God creates as he wills. The creation of Jesus is just like any other example of creation without ancestors, there is no divinity in it.

Thus the Holy Qur'an once again corrects the false Bible on the market.

The unholy Quran cannot even make up its mind what Adam was created from. It says at verse 3.59 he was made from dust, but at verse 15.26 it says he was created from potters clay, or black mud. Again at verse 37.11 it says he was created from clay.

Greek mythology says long before the Quran that man was created from mud.
Egyptian mythology says Khnum created human embryos from clay.

Sumerian myths say a Goddess created men from clay.

So it is clear the idea of man being created from clay precedes the Quran by centuries.

Since it should be blindingly obvious to a brain dead donkey that man (or Adam) was not created from dust or clay, these stories are just myths.

Not to mention that the story of Adam and Eve is also nothing but a bible myth that was stolen by Muhammad and shoved into the Quran.

Norman Alexander · 15th September 2023, 09:31 PM

Originally Posted by Emre_1974tr

Holy Quran 3:59 The example of Jesus with God is similar to that of Adam;

[snipped for brevity]

Thus the Holy Qur'an once again corrects the false Bible on the market.

Again, welcome back!

Any chance you can answer the question I asked months ago? If I was to visit Zeytinli, what interesting things could I see there? While you visit, perhaps you can tell me?

I am also now asking about Bursa. It looks lovely. Can you recommend any sights there?

Blue Mountain · 15th September 2023, 10:30 PM

Originally Posted by Norman Alexander

Again, welcome back!

Any chance you can answer the question I asked months ago? If I was to visit Zeytinli, what interesting things could I see there? While you visit, perhaps you can tell me?

I am also now asking about Bursa. It looks lovely. Can you recommend any sights there?

Hmmm; this is post #2821 in the thread. I'm not sure how far back I'd have to go to find Emre_1974tr actually answering a question.

Norman Alexander · 15th September 2023, 11:49 PM

Originally Posted by Blue Mountain

Hmmm; this is post #2821 in the thread. I'm not sure how far back I'd have to go to find Emre_1974tr actually answering a question.

Oh, I know. But I live in hope his Muslim religion of peace will allow him to respond nicely. It's not like I'm asking him to renounce anything.

Gulliver Foyle · 16th September 2023, 02:04 AM

Originally Posted by Emre_1974tr

Holy Quran 3:59 The example of Jesus with God is similar to that of Adam; He created him from dust, then He said to him "Be" and he was.

Adam and his wife, as well as the other humans first created in paradise, were created directly, just like Jesus. They have no father and mother.

And the verses explains that the creation in the hereafter is also a creation without ancestors, and that people will be created directly.

Also, as I have shown in my article, some special people, such as martyrs and prophets, have already been created in Paradise/the Floor of God and have already started their eternal life:

https://free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9611687.0

So Jesus and the other prophets are now living in the Hereafter Universe in the flesh.

In short, the situation of Adam and his wife, the situation of the other people created in paradise, and the situation of all the people created in the Hereafter Universe is like the situation of Jesus. They were created directly without ancestors and continue to be created. In other words, sexuality is not mediated in their creation.

And this ancestorless creation gives them no divinity. God creates as he wills. The creation of Jesus is just like any other example of creation without ancestors, there is no divinity in it.

Thus the Holy Qur'an once again corrects the false Bible on the market.

You do understand that every single thing in your post is factually wrong, don't you? Humans are descended from earlier species of apes.

Myriad · 16th September 2023, 06:38 AM

The Quran or the Bible might have something to say about who created the miserable deserts southeast of the Mediterranean and their unhappy scrawny people animated from dust or mud, but the glorious temperate forests of northeastern North America and their hardy happy native inhabitants were undeniably created by Teharonhiakwako, the good twin of the Do-yo-da-no, from the body of his mother the Sky Woman. Ask Muskrat or Crow; they were there!

steenkh · 17th September 2023, 12:18 AM

Originally Posted by Myriad

The Quran or the Bible might have something to say about who created the miserable deserts southeast of the Mediterranean and their unhappy scrawny people animated from dust or mud, but the glorious temperate forests of northeastern North America and their hardy happy native inhabitants were undeniably created by Teharonhiakwako, the good twin of the Do-yo-da-no, from the body of his mother the Sky Woman. Ask Muskrat or Crow; they were there!

So … some people were created by gods, and perhaps other people descended from hominids through evolution? Then there is room for everybody’s beliefs - provided they do not rule each other out.

Myriad · 17th September 2023, 08:18 AM

Originally Posted by steenkh

So … some people were created by gods, and perhaps other people descended from hominids through evolution? Then there is room for everybody’s beliefs - provided they do not rule each other out.

Replace "beliefs" with "narratives" or "mental models" (belief doesn't matter; that's one of the great occult secrets of life; you're welcome) and then it's no big deal if they do rule each other out.

Oops! Forgot for a moment which forum I'm at. Of course believing in stuff is real super important and it's even more important to believe in and only in what can be confirmed empirically.

Religion used to be local. And it largely still is today too, which is why there's a million different Christianities and a million different Buddhisms. "How shall we sing the LORD'S song in a strange land?" - Psalms 137:4 (KJV). The idea that any religion could or should be global is one of the worst human ideas ever. Thus I can say unto both Emre and Scorpion: if you don't live in the same place, you don't and can't know each other's gods, and if you don't live where I do, you don't know the gods I do.

Emre_1974tr · 17th September 2023, 12:38 PM

Originally Posted by Myriad

Replace "beliefs" with "narratives" or "mental models" (.

Knowledge is faith too. Knowledge is the strongest form of faith. We call strong belief based on evidence knowledge.The existence of God is a belief based on absolute proof. In other words, it is knowledge.

sackett · 17th September 2023, 12:49 PM

Originally Posted by Emre_1974tr

Knowledge is faith too. Knowledge is the strongest form of faith. We call strong belief based on evidence knowledge.The existence of God is a belief based on absolute proof. In other words, it is knowledge.

You poor creature.

Norman Alexander · 17th September 2023, 02:01 PM

Originally Posted by Emre_1974tr

Knowledge is faith too. Knowledge is the strongest form of faith. We call strong belief based on evidence knowledge.The existence of God is a belief based on ~~absolute proof~~ dogma. In other words, it is ~~knowledge~~ wishful thinking and misguided imagination.

Fixed for you.

Also, still waiting for your response and Zeytinli and Bursa.

JayUtah · 17th September 2023, 02:01 PM

Originally Posted by Emre_1974tr

The existence of God is a belief based on absolute proof.

Zeus will be so happy.

Myriad · 17th September 2023, 04:17 PM

Originally Posted by Emre_1974tr

Knowledge is faith too. Knowledge is the strongest form of faith. We call strong belief based on evidence knowledge.The existence of God is a belief based on absolute proof. In other words, it is knowledge.

"The existence of God is a belief..." Right. That's all it is, and it ain't much.

We have no knowledge of existence except the narratives we adopt to explain our state of experience. Existence of a thing only means there's a narrative that includes that thing. Do choices exist? Yes in one mental model (of autonomous free will), no in another (of deterministic neural computation). Does proof exist? Yes in one model of cognition (logic), no in another (empiricism). God's existence means nothing except that people think about stories about God. That's no great distinction. People think about stories about talking animals, justice, space princesses, quantum fields, and infallible detectives too, as well as scads of other, often more relevant and useful, gods.

catsmate · 18th September 2023, 01:52 AM

Originally Posted by Emre_1974tr

Knowledge is faith too. Knowledge is the strongest form of faith. We call strong belief based on evidence knowledge.The existence of God is a belief based on absolute proof. In other words, it is knowledge.

Rubbish.

steenkh · 18th September 2023, 04:05 AM

Originally Posted by Emre_1974tr

The existence of God is a belief based on absolute proof. In other words, it is knowledge.

A pity that nobody has been able to produce such a proof.

25th June 2023, 03:52 PM	#2801
Blue Mountain Resident Skeptical Hobbit Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Waging war on woo-woo in Winnipeg Posts: 7,489	Originally Posted by Reformed Offlian No, that is not more accurate. The quote from Helder Camara is: "Quando dou comida aos pobres, chamam-me de santo. Quando pergunto por que eles são pobres, chamam-me de comunista." The highlighted portion translates as: "When I ask why they are poor..." Helder Camara wasn't just calling attention to humanitarian problems; he was calling out structural inequalities that created underclasses in the first place. Thanks for that. It appears at one point someone translated the quote into English and altered it, and the altered version has become the accepted one.
	__________________ The social illusion reigns to-day upon all the heaped-up ruins of the past, and to it belongs the future. The masses have never thirsted after truth. They turn aside from evidence that is not to their taste, preferring to deify error, if error seduce them. Gustav Le Bon, The Crowd, 1895 (from the French)

25th June 2023, 11:42 PM	#2803
Filippo Lippi Illuminator Join Date: Nov 2002 Posts: 4,463	Originally Posted by Little 10 Toes Emre_1974tr, why did Allah allow earthquakes to happen to Türkiye? The Quran (at 31:10) says that "And He placed on the earth weights and supports so that it would not shake you and make you stagger...". Shhhh.... Emre is doing everything, EVERYTHING, he can to save us from the eternal hellfire
	__________________ You can't defeat fascism through debate because it's not simply an idea, proposal or theory. It's a fundamentally flawed way of looking at the world. It's a distorting prism, emotionally charged and completely logic-proof. You may as well challenge rabies to a game of Boggle. @ViolettaCrisis

26th June 2023, 08:54 AM	#2804
Scorpion Illuminator Join Date: Feb 2013 Posts: 3,408	Originally Posted by Emre_1974tr There is no limit to the amount of wealth in Islam, as long as it is acquired through lawful means. If there were a limit, there would be a limit of wealth equivalent to a certain weight/amount of gold or diamonds, but there is absolutely no such restriction in the verses. Not to mention sharing the spoils of war. The Quran has an an entire chapter (Surah 8) devoted to dividing the spoils of war. It starts by saying in verse one that all spoils belong to Allah and the messenger. But later in the surah at verse forty one Muhammad realizes that nobody will fight his battles for nothing, so he reduces his take to one fifth of the spoils. This is clear evidence of Muhammad's bandit mind working, and shows he deiced to share the spoils of war as an afterthought.
Scorpion Illuminator Join Date: Feb 2013 Posts: 3,408	__________________ You see many stars in the sky at night, but not when the sun rises. Can you therefore say there are no stars in the heavens during the day? O man because you cannot find God in the days of your ignorance, say not that there is no God. Sri Ramakrishna Even in the valley of the shadow of death two and two do not make six. Leo Tolstoy Last edited by Scorpion; 26th June 2023 at 08:58 AM.

26th June 2023, 06:59 PM	#2805
arthwollipot Observer of Phenomena Pronouns: he/him Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Ngunnawal Country Posts: 84,444	There are passages in the Bible about spoils of war too, just sayin'.
	__________________ A million people can call the mountains a fiction Yet it need not trouble you as you stand atop them https://xkcd.com/154/

29th June 2023, 10:36 AM	#2806
catsmate No longer the 1 Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 29,319	Originally Posted by Scorpion Not to mention sharing the spoils of war. The Quran has an an entire chapter (Surah 8) devoted to dividing the spoils of war. It starts by saying in verse one that all spoils belong to Allah and the messenger. But later in the surah at verse forty one Muhammad realizes that nobody will fight his battles for nothing, so he reduces his take to one fifth of the spoils. This is clear evidence of Muhammad's bandit mind working, and shows he deiced to share the spoils of war as an afterthought. They took their flocks and their herds and their donkeys, and that which was in the city and that which was in the field; the Lord had given the people favor in the sight of the Egyptians, so that they let them have their request. Thus they plundered the Egyptians. The sons of Israel captured the women of Midian and their little ones; and all their cattle and all their flocks and all their goods they plundered. Only the women and the children and the animals and all that is in the city, all its spoil, you shall take as booty for yourself
	__________________ As human right is always something given, it always in reality reduces to the right which men give, "concede," to each other. If the right to existence is conceded to new-born children, then they have the right; if it is not conceded to them, as was the case among the Spartans and ancient Romans, then they do not have it. For only society can give or concede it to them; they themselves cannot take it, or give it to themselves.

25th June 2023, 06:02 PM	#2802
Reformed Offlian Graduate Poster Join Date: Apr 2020 Location: USA Posts: 1,203	Originally Posted by Blue Mountain Thanks for that. It appears at one point someone translated the quote into English and altered it, and the altered version has become the accepted one. Yup. It's the one I heard Leonard Nimoy say in my computer while playing Civ IV.

29th June 2023, 10:49 PM	#2807
Filippo Lippi Illuminator Join Date: Nov 2002 Posts: 4,463	"Emre looked upon his thread at the top of R+P and saw that it was good, for he would not have to pull up some BS post from his nethers"
	__________________ You can't defeat fascism through debate because it's not simply an idea, proposal or theory. It's a fundamentally flawed way of looking at the world. It's a distorting prism, emotionally charged and completely logic-proof. You may as well challenge rabies to a game of Boggle. @ViolettaCrisis

30th June 2023, 08:25 AM	#2808
Foster Zygote Dental Floss Tycoon Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 21,042	Originally Posted by arthwollipot There are passages in the Bible about spoils of war too, just sayin'. It's quite specific about killing everyone except for the virgin girls.
	__________________ Counterbalance in the little town of Ridgeview, Ohio. Two people permanently enslaved by the tyranny of fear and superstitution, facing the future with a kind of helpless dread. Two others facing the future with confidence - having escaped one of the darker places of the Twilight Zone.

1st July 2023, 07:23 AM	#2809
catsmate No longer the 1 Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 29,319	Originally Posted by Foster Zygote It's quite specific about killing everyone except for the virgin girls. No, the Israelites were more economical, they enslaved all the surviving women and children.
	__________________ As human right is always something given, it always in reality reduces to the right which men give, "concede," to each other. If the right to existence is conceded to new-born children, then they have the right; if it is not conceded to them, as was the case among the Spartans and ancient Romans, then they do not have it. For only society can give or concede it to them; they themselves cannot take it, or give it to themselves.

6th July 2023, 03:18 PM	#2810
MarkCorrigan ¡No pasarán! Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Слава Україні Posts: 12,394	Originally Posted by Reformed Offlian No, that is not more accurate. The quote from Helder Camara is: "Quando dou comida aos pobres, chamam-me de santo. Quando pergunto por que eles são pobres, chamam-me de comunista."[/hilite] The highlighted portion translates as: "When I ask why they are poor..." Helder Camara wasn't just calling attention to humanitarian problems; he was calling out structural inequalities that created underclasses in the first place. Thank you for this post, I've adjusted my sig to match.
	__________________ Naturalism adjusts it's principles to fit with the observed data. It's a god of the facts world view. -joobz When I give food to the poor, they call me a Saint. When I ask why they are poor, they call me a Communist. - Hélder Câmara

25th July 2023, 04:32 PM	#2811
Emre_1974tr Graduate Poster Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Turkey Posts: 1,204	Self-defense and retaliation mentioned in Ma'idah 33 https://free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9612339.0

25th July 2023, 04:34 PM	#2812
Emre_1974tr Graduate Poster Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Turkey Posts: 1,204	Self-defense and retaliation mentioned in Ma'idah 33 https://free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9612339.0

25th July 2023, 05:07 PM	#2813
Norman Alexander Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Nov 2014 Location: Dharug & Gundungurra Posts: 15,717	Originally Posted by Emre_1974tr Self-defense and retaliation mentioned in Ma'idah 33 https://free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9612339.0 Welcome back! Any chance you can answer the question I asked months ago? If I was to visit Zeytinli, what interesting things could I see there? While you visit, perhaps you can tell me?
	__________________ _{...our governments are just trying to protect us from terror. In the same way that someone banging a hornets’ nest with a stick is trying to protect us from hornets. Frankie Boyle, Guardian, July 2015}

27th July 2023, 09:12 AM	#2814
Gord_in_Toronto Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 24,049	Originally Posted by Emre_1974tr Self-defense and retaliation mentioned in Ma'idah 33 https://free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9612339.0 Jesus said. “Do not judge others, and you will not be judged. Do not condemn others, or it will all come back against you. Forgive others, and you will be forgiven. (Luke 6:37)
	__________________ "Reality is what's left when you cease to believe." Philip K. Dick

27th July 2023, 09:39 AM	#2815
JayUtah Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: The great American West Posts: 23,279	I suppose Emre's argument is that Islam improves over all that namby-pamby turning the other cheek.

27th July 2023, 10:38 AM	#2816
Gord_in_Toronto Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 24,049	Originally Posted by JayUtah I suppose Emre's argument is that Islam improves over all that namby-pamby turning the other cheek. But isn't a religion of PEACE?
	__________________ "Reality is what's left when you cease to believe." Philip K. Dick

15th September 2023, 07:26 PM	#2817
Emre_1974tr Graduate Poster Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Turkey Posts: 1,204	Holy Quran 3:59 The example of Jesus with God is similar to that of Adam; He created him from dust, then He said to him "Be" and he was. Adam and his wife, as well as the other humans first created in paradise, were created directly, just like Jesus. They have no father and mother. And the verses explains that the creation in the hereafter is also a creation without ancestors, and that people will be created directly. Also, as I have shown in my article, some special people, such as martyrs and prophets, have already been created in Paradise/the Floor of God and have already started their eternal life: https://free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9611687.0 So Jesus and the other prophets are now living in the Hereafter Universe in the flesh. In short, the situation of Adam and his wife, the situation of the other people created in paradise, and the situation of all the people created in the Hereafter Universe is like the situation of Jesus. They were created directly without ancestors and continue to be created. In other words, sexuality is not mediated in their creation. And this ancestorless creation gives them no divinity. God creates as he wills. The creation of Jesus is just like any other example of creation without ancestors, there is no divinity in it. Thus the Holy Qur'an once again corrects the false Bible on the market.

15th September 2023, 08:19 PM	#2818
JayUtah Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: The great American West Posts: 23,279	Originally Posted by Emre_1974tr Thus the Holy Qur'an once again corrects the false Bible on the market. "My superstition is better than someone else's."

15th September 2023, 09:12 PM	#2819
Scorpion Illuminator Join Date: Feb 2013 Posts: 3,408	Originally Posted by Emre_1974tr Holy Quran 3:59 The example of Jesus with God is similar to that of Adam; He created him from dust, then He said to him "Be" and he was. Adam and his wife, as well as the other humans first created in paradise, were created directly, just like Jesus. They have no father and mother. And the verses explains that the creation in the hereafter is also a creation without ancestors, and that people will be created directly. Also, as I have shown in my article, some special people, such as martyrs and prophets, have already been created in Paradise/the Floor of God and have already started their eternal life: https://free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9611687.0 So Jesus and the other prophets are now living in the Hereafter Universe in the flesh. In short, the situation of Adam and his wife, the situation of the other people created in paradise, and the situation of all the people created in the Hereafter Universe is like the situation of Jesus. They were created directly without ancestors and continue to be created. In other words, sexuality is not mediated in their creation. And this ancestorless creation gives them no divinity. God creates as he wills. The creation of Jesus is just like any other example of creation without ancestors, there is no divinity in it. Thus the Holy Qur'an once again corrects the false Bible on the market. The unholy Quran cannot even make up its mind what Adam was created from. It says at verse 3.59 he was made from dust, but at verse 15.26 it says he was created from potters clay, or black mud. Again at verse 37.11 it says he was created from clay. Greek mythology says long before the Quran that man was created from mud. Egyptian mythology says Khnum created human embryos from clay. Sumerian myths say a Goddess created men from clay. So it is clear the idea of man being created from clay precedes the Quran by centuries. Since it should be blindingly obvious to a brain dead donkey that man (or Adam) was not created from dust or clay, these stories are just myths. Not to mention that the story of Adam and Eve is also nothing but a bible myth that was stolen by Muhammad and shoved into the Quran.
Scorpion Illuminator Join Date: Feb 2013 Posts: 3,408	__________________ You see many stars in the sky at night, but not when the sun rises. Can you therefore say there are no stars in the heavens during the day? O man because you cannot find God in the days of your ignorance, say not that there is no God. Sri Ramakrishna Even in the valley of the shadow of death two and two do not make six. Leo Tolstoy Last edited by Scorpion; 15th September 2023 at 09:16 PM.

15th September 2023, 09:31 PM	#2820
Norman Alexander Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Nov 2014 Location: Dharug & Gundungurra Posts: 15,717	Originally Posted by Emre_1974tr Holy Quran 3:59 The example of Jesus with God is similar to that of Adam; [snipped for brevity] Thus the Holy Qur'an once again corrects the false Bible on the market. Again, welcome back! Any chance you can answer the question I asked months ago? If I was to visit Zeytinli, what interesting things could I see there? While you visit, perhaps you can tell me? I am also now asking about Bursa. It looks lovely. Can you recommend any sights there?
	__________________ _{...our governments are just trying to protect us from terror. In the same way that someone banging a hornets’ nest with a stick is trying to protect us from hornets. Frankie Boyle, Guardian, July 2015}

15th September 2023, 10:30 PM	#2821
Blue Mountain Resident Skeptical Hobbit Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Waging war on woo-woo in Winnipeg Posts: 7,489	Originally Posted by Norman Alexander Again, welcome back! Any chance you can answer the question I asked months ago? If I was to visit Zeytinli, what interesting things could I see there? While you visit, perhaps you can tell me? I am also now asking about Bursa. It looks lovely. Can you recommend any sights there? Hmmm; this is post #2821 in the thread. I'm not sure how far back I'd have to go to find Emre_1974tr actually answering a question.
	__________________ The social illusion reigns to-day upon all the heaped-up ruins of the past, and to it belongs the future. The masses have never thirsted after truth. They turn aside from evidence that is not to their taste, preferring to deify error, if error seduce them. Gustav Le Bon, The Crowd, 1895 (from the French)

15th September 2023, 11:49 PM	#2822
Norman Alexander Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Nov 2014 Location: Dharug & Gundungurra Posts: 15,717	Originally Posted by Blue Mountain Hmmm; this is post #2821 in the thread. I'm not sure how far back I'd have to go to find Emre_1974tr actually answering a question. Oh, I know. But I live in hope his Muslim religion of peace will allow him to respond nicely. It's not like I'm asking him to renounce anything.
	__________________ _{...our governments are just trying to protect us from terror. In the same way that someone banging a hornets’ nest with a stick is trying to protect us from hornets. Frankie Boyle, Guardian, July 2015}

16th September 2023, 02:04 AM	#2823
Gulliver Foyle Master Poster Join Date: Dec 2014 Location: Cork baaaiii Posts: 2,397	Originally Posted by Emre_1974tr Holy Quran 3:59 The example of Jesus with God is similar to that of Adam; He created him from dust, then He said to him "Be" and he was. Adam and his wife, as well as the other humans first created in paradise, were created directly, just like Jesus. They have no father and mother. And the verses explains that the creation in the hereafter is also a creation without ancestors, and that people will be created directly. Also, as I have shown in my article, some special people, such as martyrs and prophets, have already been created in Paradise/the Floor of God and have already started their eternal life: https://free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9611687.0 So Jesus and the other prophets are now living in the Hereafter Universe in the flesh. In short, the situation of Adam and his wife, the situation of the other people created in paradise, and the situation of all the people created in the Hereafter Universe is like the situation of Jesus. They were created directly without ancestors and continue to be created. In other words, sexuality is not mediated in their creation. And this ancestorless creation gives them no divinity. God creates as he wills. The creation of Jesus is just like any other example of creation without ancestors, there is no divinity in it. Thus the Holy Qur'an once again corrects the false Bible on the market. You do understand that every single thing in your post is factually wrong, don't you? Humans are descended from earlier species of apes.
	__________________ Ceterum autem censeo Factio Republicanus esse delendam

16th September 2023, 06:38 AM	#2824
Myriad The Clarity Is Devastating Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Betwixt Posts: 20,552	The Quran or the Bible might have something to say about who created the miserable deserts southeast of the Mediterranean and their unhappy scrawny people animated from dust or mud, but the glorious temperate forests of northeastern North America and their hardy happy native inhabitants were undeniably created by Teharonhiakwako, the good twin of the Do-yo-da-no, from the body of his mother the Sky Woman. Ask Muskrat or Crow; they were there!
	__________________ "*Except Myriad. Even Cthulhu would give him a pat on the head and an ice cream and send him to the movies while he ended the rest of the world." - Foster Zygote

17th September 2023, 12:18 AM	#2825
steenkh Philosopher Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Denmark Posts: 7,012	Originally Posted by Myriad The Quran or the Bible might have something to say about who created the miserable deserts southeast of the Mediterranean and their unhappy scrawny people animated from dust or mud, but the glorious temperate forests of northeastern North America and their hardy happy native inhabitants were undeniably created by Teharonhiakwako, the good twin of the Do-yo-da-no, from the body of his mother the Sky Woman. Ask Muskrat or Crow; they were there! So … some people were created by gods, and perhaps other people descended from hominids through evolution? Then there is room for everybody’s beliefs - provided they do not rule each other out.
	__________________ Steen -- Jack of all trades - master of none!

17th September 2023, 08:18 AM	#2826
Myriad The Clarity Is Devastating Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Betwixt Posts: 20,552	Originally Posted by steenkh So … some people were created by gods, and perhaps other people descended from hominids through evolution? Then there is room for everybody’s beliefs - provided they do not rule each other out. Replace "beliefs" with "narratives" or "mental models" (belief doesn't matter; that's one of the great occult secrets of life; you're welcome) and then it's no big deal if they do rule each other out. Oops! Forgot for a moment which forum I'm at. Of course believing in stuff is real super important and it's even more important to believe in and only in what can be confirmed empirically. Religion used to be local. And it largely still is today too, which is why there's a million different Christianities and a million different Buddhisms. "How shall we sing the LORD'S song in a strange land?" - Psalms 137:4 (KJV). The idea that any religion could or should be global is one of the worst human ideas ever. Thus I can say unto both Emre and Scorpion: if you don't live in the same place, you don't and can't know each other's gods, and if you don't live where I do, you don't know the gods I do.
	__________________ "*Except Myriad. Even Cthulhu would give him a pat on the head and an ice cream and send him to the movies while he ended the rest of the world." - Foster Zygote

17th September 2023, 12:38 PM	#2827
Emre_1974tr Graduate Poster Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Turkey Posts: 1,204	Originally Posted by Myriad Replace "beliefs" with "narratives" or "mental models" (. Knowledge is faith too. Knowledge is the strongest form of faith. We call strong belief based on evidence knowledge.The existence of God is a belief based on absolute proof. In other words, it is knowledge.

17th September 2023, 12:49 PM	#2828
sackett Philosopher Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Detroit Posts: 8,569	Originally Posted by Emre_1974tr Knowledge is faith too. Knowledge is the strongest form of faith. We call strong belief based on evidence knowledge.The existence of God is a belief based on absolute proof. In other words, it is knowledge. You poor creature.
	__________________ If you would learn a man's character, give him authority. If you would ruin a man's character, let him seize power.

17th September 2023, 02:01 PM	#2829
Norman Alexander Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Nov 2014 Location: Dharug & Gundungurra Posts: 15,717	Originally Posted by Emre_1974tr Knowledge is faith too. Knowledge is the strongest form of faith. We call strong belief based on evidence knowledge.The existence of God is a belief based on ~~absolute proof~~ dogma. In other words, it is ~~knowledge~~ wishful thinking and misguided imagination. Fixed for you. Also, still waiting for your response and Zeytinli and Bursa.
	__________________ _{...our governments are just trying to protect us from terror. In the same way that someone banging a hornets’ nest with a stick is trying to protect us from hornets. Frankie Boyle, Guardian, July 2015}

17th September 2023, 02:01 PM	#2830
JayUtah Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: The great American West Posts: 23,279	Originally Posted by Emre_1974tr The existence of God is a belief based on absolute proof. Zeus will be so happy.

17th September 2023, 04:17 PM	#2831
Myriad The Clarity Is Devastating Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Betwixt Posts: 20,552	Originally Posted by Emre_1974tr Knowledge is faith too. Knowledge is the strongest form of faith. We call strong belief based on evidence knowledge.The existence of God is a belief based on absolute proof. In other words, it is knowledge. "The existence of God is a belief..." Right. That's all it is, and it ain't much. We have no knowledge of existence except the narratives we adopt to explain our state of experience. Existence of a thing only means there's a narrative that includes that thing. Do choices exist? Yes in one mental model (of autonomous free will), no in another (of deterministic neural computation). Does proof exist? Yes in one model of cognition (logic), no in another (empiricism). God's existence means nothing except that people think about stories about God. That's no great distinction. People think about stories about talking animals, justice, space princesses, quantum fields, and infallible detectives too, as well as scads of other, often more relevant and useful, gods.
	__________________ "*Except Myriad. Even Cthulhu would give him a pat on the head and an ice cream and send him to the movies while he ended the rest of the world." - Foster Zygote

18th September 2023, 01:52 AM	#2832
catsmate No longer the 1 Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 29,319	Originally Posted by Emre_1974tr Knowledge is faith too. Knowledge is the strongest form of faith. We call strong belief based on evidence knowledge.The existence of God is a belief based on absolute proof. In other words, it is knowledge. Rubbish.
	__________________ As human right is always something given, it always in reality reduces to the right which men give, "concede," to each other. If the right to existence is conceded to new-born children, then they have the right; if it is not conceded to them, as was the case among the Spartans and ancient Romans, then they do not have it. For only society can give or concede it to them; they themselves cannot take it, or give it to themselves.

18th September 2023, 04:05 AM	#2833
steenkh Philosopher Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Denmark Posts: 7,012	Originally Posted by Emre_1974tr The existence of God is a belief based on absolute proof. In other words, it is knowledge. A pity that nobody has been able to produce such a proof.
	__________________ Steen -- Jack of all trades - master of none!