Forum Index Register Members List Events Mark Forums Read Help

 International Skeptics Forum Ultimate math trick question?

 Welcome to the International Skeptics Forum, where we discuss skepticism, critical thinking, the paranormal and science in a friendly but lively way. You are currently viewing the forum as a guest, which means you are missing out on discussing matters that are of interest to you. Please consider registering so you can gain full use of the forum features and interact with other Members. Registration is simple, fast and free! Click here to register today.
 Tags math puzzles

 6th July 2017, 07:27 PM #81 DevilsAdvocate Illuminator     Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 4,773 Wait, I need to recheck that second set. __________________ Heaven forbid someone reads these words and claims to be adversely affected by them, thus ensuring a barrage of lawsuits filed under the guise of protecting the unknowing victims who were stupid enough to read this and believe it! - Kevin Trudeau
 6th July 2017, 07:29 PM #82 Jim_MDP Philosopher     Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: N.Cal/S.Or Posts: 6,209 Originally Posted by Red Baron Farms a person who is "4" is actually between "4" and "4 years+364 days" due to always rounding down. So the sister will be between "2" and "2 years 182 days" younger, being half your age. wait til sis becomes 12, then you are between 14 and 14 years +182 days. always rounding down means you are 14 either way. This is your minimum age because 12 years 0 days is your sister's minimum age. But sis also has 364 days more before her next birthday. So depending when asked she could be up to 12 years 364 days, and the maximum you could be is 2 years 182 days older. 12 years 364 days + 2 years 182 days = 14 years 546 days = 15 years 181 days. Always rounding down means 15 years old is your maximum age. QED "You really are just a simple creature, aren't you?" __________________ ---------------------- Anything goes in the Goblin hut... anything. "Suggesting spurious explanations isn't relevant to my work." -- WTC Dust. "Both cannot be simultaneously true, and so one may conclude neither is true, and if neither is true, then Apollo is fraudulent." -- Patrick1000.
 6th July 2017, 07:31 PM #83 Red Baron Farms Illuminator     Join Date: Apr 2013 Location: Oklahoma Posts: 4,088 Originally Posted by William Parcher OMG it was a turd. We already knew that answer. It's not cool or educational. If you all knew it, why didn't anyone except kid eager answer it? __________________ Scott "Permaculture is a philosophy of working﻿ with, rather than against nature; of protracted & thoughtful observation rather than protracted & thoughtless labour; & of looking at plants & animals in all their functions, rather than treating any area as a single-product system." Bill Mollison Biome Carbon Cycle Management
 6th July 2017, 07:35 PM #84 Modified Philosopher     Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 6,401 Originally Posted by Red Baron Farms a person who is "4" is actually between "4" and "4 years+364 days" due to always rounding down. So the sister will be between "2" and "2 years 182 days" younger, being half your age. wait til sis becomes 12, then you are between 14 and 14 years +182 days. always rounding down means you are 14 either way. This is your minimum age because 12 years 0 days is your sister's minimum age. But sis also has 364 days more before her next birthday. So depending when asked she could be up to 12 years 364 days, and the maximum you could be is 2 years 182 days older. 12 years 364 days + 2 years 182 days = 14 years 546 days = 15 years 181 days. Always rounding down means 15 years old is your maximum age. QED You are mixing the colloquial meaning of age in years with the exact definition of "half". This is unreasonable. When someone says "half my age", they usually mean that persons rounded age is half of their rounded age.
 6th July 2017, 07:37 PM #85 William Parcher Show me the monkey!     Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 19,711 Originally Posted by Red Baron Farms If you all knew it, why didn't anyone except kid eager answer it? The person asking the question has something to say... "I didn't ask you for a range of years. I asked you how old I am." __________________ Bigfoot believers and Bigfoot skeptics are both plumb crazy. Each spends more than one minute per year thinking about Bigfoot.
 6th July 2017, 07:39 PM #86 William Parcher Show me the monkey!     Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 19,711 An answer of "somewhere between 5 and 95" would be absolutely correct. __________________ Bigfoot believers and Bigfoot skeptics are both plumb crazy. Each spends more than one minute per year thinking about Bigfoot.
 6th July 2017, 07:39 PM #87 Metullus Forum ¾-Wit Pro Tem     Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 5,001 Oh, for Christ's sake... __________________ I have met Tim at TAM. He is of sufficient height to piss on your leg. - Doubt 10/7/2005 - I'll miss Tim. Aristotle taught that the brain exists merely to cool the blood and is not involved in the process of thinking. This is true only of certain persons. - Will Cuppy
 6th July 2017, 07:41 PM #88 Jim_MDP Philosopher     Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: N.Cal/S.Or Posts: 6,209 Kobiashi Maru. I'm not getting the million , am I ? __________________ ---------------------- Anything goes in the Goblin hut... anything. "Suggesting spurious explanations isn't relevant to my work." -- WTC Dust. "Both cannot be simultaneously true, and so one may conclude neither is true, and if neither is true, then Apollo is fraudulent." -- Patrick1000.
 6th July 2017, 07:48 PM #89 Red Baron Farms Illuminator     Join Date: Apr 2013 Location: Oklahoma Posts: 4,088 Originally Posted by Jim_MDP Kobiashi Maru. I'm not getting the million , am I ? Kid Eager won sorry guys. On this day he was the smartest. Maybe next time they'll do the Monte Hall puzzle and you can win a million then. __________________ Scott "Permaculture is a philosophy of working﻿ with, rather than against nature; of protracted & thoughtful observation rather than protracted & thoughtless labour; & of looking at plants & animals in all their functions, rather than treating any area as a single-product system." Bill Mollison Biome Carbon Cycle Management
 6th July 2017, 07:50 PM #90 DevilsAdvocate Illuminator     Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 4,773 I was right. The numbers I posted are correct. As I said, it depends on how you interpret "half my age". You were born 1/1/1980. Your sister was born 1/2/1981. On 1/1/1984 you just turned 4. Your sister was 2 years old. She would turn 3 the next day. You were 4 and she was 2, so she was half your age in "years old". On 1/2/1993 she turned 12. You were 13. __________________ Heaven forbid someone reads these words and claims to be adversely affected by them, thus ensuring a barrage of lawsuits filed under the guise of protecting the unknowing victims who were stupid enough to read this and believe it! - Kevin Trudeau Last edited by DevilsAdvocate; 6th July 2017 at 08:03 PM. Reason: Stoopit phone
 6th July 2017, 07:53 PM #91 William Parcher Show me the monkey!     Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 19,711 Originally Posted by William Parcher Well in typical communication we say we are "4 years old" for 364 days. For high precision we would need to know the birthdays of both people. I think. This was a winning answer. __________________ Bigfoot believers and Bigfoot skeptics are both plumb crazy. Each spends more than one minute per year thinking about Bigfoot.
 6th July 2017, 08:05 PM #92 Red Baron Farms Illuminator     Join Date: Apr 2013 Location: Oklahoma Posts: 4,088 Originally Posted by William Parcher This was a winning answer. It was so close to answering I was screaming at my monitor, "He understands how to set up the problem, why doesn't he complete it!" You had it! all you had to do was then start the math and show the results! But then you didn't produce an answer! __________________ Scott "Permaculture is a philosophy of working﻿ with, rather than against nature; of protracted & thoughtful observation rather than protracted & thoughtless labour; & of looking at plants & animals in all their functions, rather than treating any area as a single-product system." Bill Mollison Biome Carbon Cycle Management
 6th July 2017, 08:13 PM #93 The Great Zaganza Illuminator     Join Date: Aug 2016 Posts: 3,729 Because it's not the answer, given the data. __________________ "When someone asks you if you're a god, you say "YES"!"
 6th July 2017, 08:15 PM #94 DevilsAdvocate Illuminator     Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 4,773 I just figured out why my second set of numbers has a max of 16 when that doesn't make sense. I calculated number of days old/365, but I was including leap days in the dates. It should be a max age of just under 16 (one day I think). __________________ Heaven forbid someone reads these words and claims to be adversely affected by them, thus ensuring a barrage of lawsuits filed under the guise of protecting the unknowing victims who were stupid enough to read this and believe it! - Kevin Trudeau
 6th July 2017, 08:22 PM #95 William Parcher Show me the monkey!     Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 19,711 Originally Posted by Red Baron Farms It was so close to answering I was screaming at my monitor, "He understands how to set up the problem, why doesn't he complete it!" You had it! all you had to do was then start the math and show the results! But then you didn't produce an answer! You intentionally misled me by saying that my answer of 14 was correct. Since you do not know their age you shouldn't have said correct. But if you had been honest you would have given away the whole game. You would have said "that might be the correct answer" if you were truly running the game as forthright. We also don't know if the person would actually accept a multi-answer. Tell me my age. You are 14 or 15. Ok, which one? __________________ Bigfoot believers and Bigfoot skeptics are both plumb crazy. Each spends more than one minute per year thinking about Bigfoot.
 6th July 2017, 08:24 PM #96 ynot Philosopher     Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 7,428 Originally Posted by William Parcher This was a winning answer. There were many possible "correct" answers. RBF's particular answer is only "correct" because RBF says it is. It's a "What number am I thinking of?" thing. __________________ Rumours of a god’s existence have been greatly exaggerated.
 6th July 2017, 08:33 PM #97 fromdownunder Philosopher   Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 5,780 That's it? That's the Ultimate Math Trick Question? Somehow I get the feeling that Ultimate means something different to most of us. Norm __________________ Against stupidity, the Gods themselves contend in Vain
 6th July 2017, 08:46 PM #99 Skeptical Greg Agave Wine Connoisseur     Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Just past ' Resume Speed ' . Posts: 14,965 ^^^^ __________________ " What if the Hokey Pokey is what it's all about? " Prove your computer is not a wimp ! Join Team 13232 !
 6th July 2017, 08:49 PM #100 Roboramma Penultimate Amazing     Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Shanghai Posts: 10,321 Originally Posted by DevilsAdvocate I was right. The numbers I posted are correct. As I said, it depends on how you interpret "half my age". You were born 1/1/1980. Your sister was born 1/2/1981. On 1/1/1984 you just turned 4. Your sister was 2 years old. She would turn 3 the next day. You were 4 and she was 2, so she was half your age in "years old". On 1/2/1993 she turned 12. You were 13. This. First of all, the correct answer is 14. But if you are going to play games then the above is correct and RBF is simply wrong. __________________ "... when people thought the Earth was flat, they were wrong. When people thought the Earth was spherical they were wrong. But if you think that thinking the Earth is spherical is just as wrong as thinking the Earth is flat, then your view is wronger than both of them put together." Isaac Asimov
 6th July 2017, 08:53 PM #101 DevilsAdvocate Illuminator     Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 4,773 Hold up. You were born midnight 1/1/1980. At midnight 1/1/1984 you turn 4. That's 1461 days old. She's half as much at 730.5 days. So she was born noon 12/31/1981. At noon 12/31/1993, she turns 12. You are still 13 until the next day-12 hours away. On 12/31/1993 she is 12 and you are 13 __________________ Heaven forbid someone reads these words and claims to be adversely affected by them, thus ensuring a barrage of lawsuits filed under the guise of protecting the unknowing victims who were stupid enough to read this and believe it! - Kevin Trudeau
 6th July 2017, 08:55 PM #102 Loss Leader Do you want to date my Avatar?Moderator     Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Florida Posts: 24,995 Originally Posted by Loss Leader Oh, that's stupid. That is just ... so stupid. To expand on the stupidity ... Why are you only using the Western colloquial definition of "four years old"? There are plenty of societies that count a person's age from the point of conception or that just declare that all people to have been born on January 1st. Even in the West, we do that. If a baby is born on December 31, the parents get to write him off as a dependent for the whole year. So the IRS considers all children to be born on the previous January 1. it also considers all children to turn 18 on the next January 1 after their birthday. Also, the Gregorian calendar isn't the only one in use in the world. In the Chinese calendar an ordinary year has 353, 354, or 355 days, a leap year has 383, 384, or 385 days. That's about the same for the Hebrew calendar. What does that do to your math? It borks it completely is what it does. You choose some unstated premises to accept (like the western calendar and the western way of marking birthdays) while choosing some unstated premises to reject (like 4 meaning 4). You provide no justification for doing so, but insist that you have the "right" answer. You don't. Your answer is, as said, stupid. __________________ I have the honor to be Your Obdt. St L. Leader
 6th July 2017, 09:25 PM #103 Modified Philosopher     Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 6,401 Originally Posted by Loss Leader Even in the West, we do that. If a baby is born on December 31, the parents get to write him off as a dependent for the whole year. I wonder how many medically induced births occur to cash in on those tax savings.
 6th July 2017, 09:36 PM #104 Loss Leader Do you want to date my Avatar?Moderator     Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Florida Posts: 24,995 Originally Posted by Modified I wonder how many medically induced births occur to cash in on those tax savings. At least some Eastern couples have scheduled c-sections for days they consider "lucky" like 8 or 3. __________________ I have the honor to be Your Obdt. St L. Leader
 6th July 2017, 09:41 PM #105 DevilsAdvocate Illuminator     Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 4,773 Sheesh. Tough crowd. The answer of 14 is correct in a general sense. Considering that "years old" generally means an age spanning a year, that creates an interesting math problem. The answer of 14-15 is basically correct. It doesn't account for leap years, which is important when considering how many "years old" someone is. I should have put my answer in years and days instead of a decimal percent of years. The correct answer is 13 years 364 days to 15 years 182 days. For the alternative interpretation, 13 years 1 day to 15 years 364 days. __________________ Heaven forbid someone reads these words and claims to be adversely affected by them, thus ensuring a barrage of lawsuits filed under the guise of protecting the unknowing victims who were stupid enough to read this and believe it! - Kevin Trudeau
 6th July 2017, 09:42 PM #106 theprestige Penultimate Amazing   Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 26,130 Originally Posted by Red Baron Farms a person who is "4" is actually between "4" and "4 years+364 days" due to always rounding down. So the sister will be between "2" and "2 years 182 days" younger, being half your age. wait til sis becomes 12, then you are between 14 and 14 years +182 days. always rounding down means you are 14 either way. This is your minimum age because 12 years 0 days is your sister's minimum age. But sis also has 364 days more before her next birthday. So depending when asked she could be up to 12 years 364 days, and the maximum you could be is 2 years 182 days older. 12 years 364 days + 2 years 182 days = 14 years 546 days = 15 years 181 days. Always rounding down means 15 years old is your maximum age. QED Well that pretty much poisons the well for every other claim you make. This signature is intended to irradiate people.
 6th July 2017, 09:43 PM #107 Brainster Penultimate Amazing     Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 14,987 As best as I can tell, the correct answer lies somewhere between 13 years and 1 day and 15 years and 363 days (ignoring leap days). Quote: When I was 4 years old, my sister was half my age. I could have been anywhere between 4 years old precisely (my birthday) and 4 years and 364 days, while my sister could also have been anywhere from 2 years old precisely to 2 years and 364 days. Thus, I am anywhere from 1 year and 1 day to 2 years and 364 days older than she. Quote: Now my sister is 12 years old. How old am I? Again, my sister is anywhere from 12 years old precisely to 12 years and 364 days. So the bottom end of the range for my age is 13 years and 1 day, and the top end is 15 years and 363 days. __________________ My new blog: Recent Reads. 1960s Comic Book Nostalgia Visit the Screw Loose Change blog.
 6th July 2017, 09:53 PM #108 DevilsAdvocate Illuminator     Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 4,773 That is correct for the "alternate" interpretation, but the max can be 363 or 364 when leap year is considered. __________________ Heaven forbid someone reads these words and claims to be adversely affected by them, thus ensuring a barrage of lawsuits filed under the guise of protecting the unknowing victims who were stupid enough to read this and believe it! - Kevin Trudeau
 6th July 2017, 09:58 PM #109 Aepervius Non credunt, semper verificare   Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Sigil, the city of doors Posts: 14,581 There is only one problem with your gotcha. But the udnerlying assumption of those math question , is always that the math falls on integer values of year. That is why nobody go for the assumption that it was 4 year and 364 days, because they think the puzzler does not go for a cheap gotcha, going against the basic assumptions. In fact, nobody I know would say the boy would be 4 year old at 4+364. You would say he is ABOUT 5. You would never say he is 4 in normal conversation. That is why it is a cheap gotcha. Go ahead ask a person which is a few day or even week before anybirthday, how old they are. Most will answer "about" year +1 , with their birthday coming soon. So yeah the answer get 3 thumb down, and one ruined birthday cake.
 6th July 2017, 09:59 PM #110 Red Baron Farms Illuminator     Join Date: Apr 2013 Location: Oklahoma Posts: 4,088 Originally Posted by DevilsAdvocate Hold up. You were born midnight 1/1/1980. At midnight 1/1/1984 you turn 4. That's 1461 days old. She's half as much at 730.5 days. So she was born noon 12/31/1981. At noon 12/31/1993, she turns 12. You are still 13 until the next day-12 hours away. On 12/31/1993 she is 12 and you are 13 incorrect. Nice try though. You sent the extra 1/2 day the wrong direction.At 12 she is 365 days x 12 = 4320 days (+3 leap days) you will be 4320days +730.5days.(plus at least 3 and maybe 4 leap days) = squarely in the 14 th year by 1/2 a day sooner or more. You rounded that 1/2 day the wrong way. It only works to make him 13 if it is a leap day ONLY. And we already stated we wouldn't use such. Originally Posted by DevilsAdvocate Wait, I need to recheck that second set. check it again. __________________ Scott "Permaculture is a philosophy of working﻿ with, rather than against nature; of protracted & thoughtful observation rather than protracted & thoughtless labour; & of looking at plants & animals in all their functions, rather than treating any area as a single-product system." Bill Mollison Biome Carbon Cycle Management Last edited by Red Baron Farms; 6th July 2017 at 10:03 PM.
 6th July 2017, 10:06 PM #111 jadebox Graduate Poster     Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: USA Posts: 1,354 Okay ...it is now clear that the correct answer is 14.
6th July 2017, 10:09 PM   #112
theprestige
Penultimate Amazing

Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 26,130
Originally Posted by Red Baron Farms
incorrect. Nice try though. You sent the extra 1/2 day the wrong direction.At 12 she is 365 days x 12 = 4320 days (+3 leap days)
you will be 4320days +730.5days. = squarely in the 14 th year by 1/2 a day. You rounded that 1/2 day the wrong way. It only works to make him 13 if it is a leap day ONLY. And we already stated we wouldn't use such.
Jesus Christ. Are you still defending this turd? Your problem is stated in years. It's dishonest to change the units to days when evaluating answers.

You haven't discovered the "ultimate" anything.

You've just transformed a straightforward age calculation into an exercise in gratuitous dickery.

 Edited by zooterkin: Edited for rule 12 and rule 0.

Last edited by zooterkin; 9th July 2017 at 11:00 AM.

 6th July 2017, 10:30 PM #113 RussDill Philosopher   Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Charleston Posts: 5,426 Originally Posted by Red Baron Farms a person who is "4" is actually between "4" and "4 years+364 days" due to always rounding down. So the sister will be between "2" and "2 years 182 days" younger, being half your age. Since the definition of half your age is not stated in the problem, you cannot arbitrarily make one up and then claim to have the right answer because no one else guesses your arbitrary interpretation. A equally valid definition is that you are aged 4 years and your sister is aged 2 years, ignoring how long it is to your respective birthdays. Your definition clearly falls flat if you compare it to how people in the real world consider one person's age to be half of another person's age. Let's not forget the rule that a court will construe ambiguous contract terms against the drafter of the agreement. __________________ The woods are lovely, dark and deep but i have promises to keep and lines to code before I sleep And lines to code before I sleep
 6th July 2017, 10:31 PM #114 DevilsAdvocate Illuminator     Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 4,773 You would be in the 14th year (14.00821...) but you would not have reached the date of your 14th birthday, so you would still be 13 "years old" even though you have completed the 14 the trip around the sun. Because you were born on a leap year, you lived an extra calendar day that your sister did not. When we halve your age, that puts her born an extra half day ahead. So she hits age 12 a half day sooner. Of course you are exactly the same number of days old when she turns 12 no matter when you were born. But that leap year means you have to wait another day for the calendar date of your birth date. __________________ Heaven forbid someone reads these words and claims to be adversely affected by them, thus ensuring a barrage of lawsuits filed under the guise of protecting the unknowing victims who were stupid enough to read this and believe it! - Kevin Trudeau
 6th July 2017, 10:33 PM #115 ynot Philosopher     Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 7,428 “When I was 4 years old” – Could mean on my 4th birthday, sometime between my 4th and 5th birthday, or I had been alive in 4 calendar years. "my sister was half my age" – Could mean half my then age or half my current age. "Now my sister is 12 years old" - Could mean on my sister’s 12th birthday, sometime between my sister’s 12th and 13th birthday, or my sister has been alive in 12 calendar years. "How old am I?" - Calculate any number from the permutations above and claim it’s the “correct” answer, and that 1,755 others provided wrong and/or incomplete answers! This thread is in the wrong section of the forum. __________________ Rumours of a god’s existence have been greatly exaggerated. Last edited by ynot; 6th July 2017 at 10:35 PM.
 7th July 2017, 02:35 AM #117 McHrozni Penultimate Amazing   Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 10,485 Originally Posted by Red Baron Farms Was surfing and came across this problem: When I was 4 years old, my sister was half my age. Now my sister is 12 years old. How old am I? Then I got to noticing that there was a huge thread of wrong and/or incomplete answers! 1,755 answers and not a single one as far as I could find got it 100% right. Only a very few even got close. So I thought that those of you here who like math puzzles might want to try your hand at it. Will award the complementary 3 thumbs up to the party getting it completely right, 2 thumbs for mostly right close but no cigar, 1 for correct but not complete and for using black holes and/or speed of light cheats etc et al. Since you went as far as to break down the meaning of "X years old", you really should explain which, if any, time dilatation anomalies were present. It is entirely possible for you to be 4 years old still, any answer that doesn't encompass that is also incomplete, including your 'ultimate' answer. McHrozni __________________ لا إله إلا رجل والعلوم والتكنولوجيا وأنبيائه
 7th July 2017, 02:40 AM #118 Red Baron Farms Illuminator     Join Date: Apr 2013 Location: Oklahoma Posts: 4,088 Originally Posted by McHrozni Since you went as far as to break down the meaning of "X years old", you really should explain which, if any, time dilatation anomalies were present. It is entirely possible for you to be 4 years old still, any answer that doesn't encompass that is also incomplete, including your 'ultimate' answer. McHrozni I did "Will award the complementary 3 thumbs up to the party getting it completely right, 2 thumbs for mostly right close but no cigar, 1 for correct but not complete and for using black holes and/or speed of light cheats etc et al." post #1 __________________ Scott "Permaculture is a philosophy of working﻿ with, rather than against nature; of protracted & thoughtful observation rather than protracted & thoughtless labour; & of looking at plants & animals in all their functions, rather than treating any area as a single-product system." Bill Mollison Biome Carbon Cycle Management Last edited by Red Baron Farms; 7th July 2017 at 02:46 AM. Reason: add emos
 7th July 2017, 02:43 AM #119 McHrozni Penultimate Amazing   Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 10,485 Originally Posted by Red Baron Farms I did "Will award the complementary 3 thumbs up to the party getting it completely right, 2 thumbs for mostly right close but no cigar, 1 for correct but not complete and for using black holes and/or speed of light cheats etc et al." post #1 I know, I cited the post. Your supposedly "complete" answer did not include time dilatation due to effects of speed or gravity. wait til sis becomes 12, then you are between 14 and 14 years +182 days. always rounding down means you are 14 either way. This is your minimum age because 12 years 0 days is your sister's minimum age. http://www.internationalskeptics.com...6&postcount=77 If we include wormholes there is no minimum or maximum age you could be. This answer is at least as reasonable as your answer to the question. At a minimum you need to add there were no time dilatation effects greater for either of you during this time. McHrozni __________________ لا إله إلا رجل والعلوم والتكنولوجيا وأنبيائه Last edited by McHrozni; 7th July 2017 at 02:46 AM.
 7th July 2017, 02:44 AM #120 3point14 Pi     Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 14,456 Well, that's five minutes of my life I won't get back. __________________ Up the River!

International Skeptics Forum

 Bookmarks Digg del.icio.us StumbleUpon Google Reddit