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Tags donald trump , Jeff Sessions , lying charges , Russia conspiracies , Trump administration , Trump controversies , Trump-Russia connections , US-Russia relations

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Old 3rd March 2017, 05:32 PM   #281
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Originally Posted by Fudbucker View Post
Have the Russians infiltrated both political parties?
Has your side gone off the deep end? Now talking to any Russian, is Russians infiltrating us. If this is all the Dems have, Trump really is going to steam roll them.

No freaking out about a presidential candidates former president husband meeting with the AG investigating her?
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Old 3rd March 2017, 05:33 PM   #282
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Originally Posted by The_Animus View Post
Regarding this, seems like he either lied previously and committed perjury, or committed campaign finance fraud.
Given McCaskill and Pelosi's misstatements (I'm being generous with that term) it's apparently pretty easy for a politician to forget meeting with the Russians. They seem to have the power to cloud politicians' minds.
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Old 3rd March 2017, 05:34 PM   #283
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Originally Posted by trustbutverify View Post
Do you have a link where democrats have lied about contacts with Russian government officials?
I don't know if they've lied, but they certainly got their stories wrong:
http://www.politico.com/story/2017/0...meeting-235653
http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-me...ussian-ambass/
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Old 3rd March 2017, 05:37 PM   #284
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Originally Posted by logger View Post
Has your side gone off the deep end? Now talking to any Russian, is Russians infiltrating us. If this is all the Dems have, Trump really is going to steam roll them.

No freaking out about a presidential candidates former president husband meeting with the AG investigating her?
Except when you factor in Trump's inexplicable praise of Putin (So Putin's killed people? America's not so innocent!), and Russia's obvious attempt to discredit Clinton to benefit Trump, and Trump's constant citing of Wikileaks, the story sounds a bit more ominous.
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Old 3rd March 2017, 05:53 PM   #285
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Originally Posted by A'isha View Post
Yes, but sunmaster14 is apparently arguing that Flynn had contact with the Russians during the transition, and Pence's statement based on what Flynn told him referred strictly and specifically to the campaign, therefore neither Flynn nor Pence lied about anything.
Trump has never stopped being in campaign mode. It is disorienting.
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Old 3rd March 2017, 05:54 PM   #286
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Originally Posted by Fudbucker View Post
Except when you factor in Trump's inexplicable praise of Putin (So Putin's killed people? America's not so innocent!), and Russia's obvious attempt to discredit Clinton to benefit Trump, and Trump's constant citing of Wikileaks, the story sounds a bit more ominous.
So what are we to make of it? Should we consider the obvious? That Putin couldn't stand Clinton and Obama? That Trump is clearly trying a reset button.

Or she we jump to the conclusion Russia is taking us over? Even though leaking hacked emails couldn't possibly do that, it only shows what a morons Clinton, podesta and the DNC were for letting themselves be hacked?

You simply have to admit Fud, this is truly one big giant nothing Berger.
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Old 3rd March 2017, 05:56 PM   #287
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Originally Posted by Minoosh View Post
Trump has never stopped being in campaign mode. It is disorienting.
It's because campaigning is a lot more fun then actually Governing......

Anyway, it is amazing how Trump lost all the cred he got from the still undecided from his Tuesday Night speech so quickly.
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Old 3rd March 2017, 06:05 PM   #288
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Originally Posted by dudalb View Post
It's because campaigning is a lot more fun then actually Governing......

Anyway, it is amazing how Trump lost all the cred he got from the still undecided from his Tuesday Night speech so quickly.
That is all in your head.
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Old 3rd March 2017, 06:11 PM   #289
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Originally Posted by logger View Post
So what are we to make of it? Should we consider the obvious? That Putin couldn't stand Clinton and Obama? That Trump is clearly trying a reset button.

Or she we jump to the conclusion Russia is taking us over? Even though leaking hacked emails couldn't possibly do that, it only shows what a morons Clinton, podesta and the DNC were for letting themselves be hacked?

You simply have to admit Fud, this is truly one big giant nothing Berger.
We can work with Russia, they're dealing with some of the same problems we are, and Ukraine is not a strategic concern of ours.

I'm waiting to see if there's any "there" there, as far as Trump and the Russians. As Krauthammer said the other day, it's a cover-up in search of a crime.
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Old 3rd March 2017, 06:18 PM   #290
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Originally Posted by logger View Post
So what are we to make of it?
Whatever serves the combined agendas of Putin, Trump and Assange?
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Old 3rd March 2017, 06:18 PM   #291
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Originally Posted by logger View Post
It also talked about Dems meeting him also, right before your very eyes, oh my!
The issue isn't that they met with him, the issue is they claimed that they didn't, or didn't speak with him about things that it was then proven that they did.

Had Sessions said "It would depend on why they were meeting with the Russians. Many have called me a surrogate because of my speaking for The President during his campaign, but as part of my job as a Senator I had contact with the Russian Ambassador several times, it had nothing to do with the Campaign though, so likewise I'd take that into consideration for others" This would be beyond a non-story now.

The continuing issue is that they said they didn't meet with the Russians, that there was no contact, but time and again this is showing up to be false, and that looks like a cover up.
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Old 3rd March 2017, 06:22 PM   #292
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Why is Carter Page being allowed to make TV appearances. Between his appearance on All In With Chris Hayes and trying to finesse the Russian meaning of the word "meetings" on Anderson Cooper 360 tonight, it's bizarre and screams weak link.
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Old 3rd March 2017, 06:23 PM   #293
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Originally Posted by Fudbucker View Post
I'm waiting to see if there's any "there" there, as far as Trump and the Russians. As Krauthammer said the other day, it's a cover-up in search of a crime.
There's no smoking gun yet, but those shell casings all over the floor are interesting.
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Old 3rd March 2017, 06:29 PM   #294
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Originally Posted by trustbutverify View Post
There's no smoking gun yet, but those shell casings all over the floor are interesting.
Trump's razor (the stupidest explanation is the best) offers a compelling narrative.

Quote:
The final reason this theory makes sense to me is that Trump's world is pervasively disorganized and corrupt. That's less fertile ground for conspiracies than influence operations, which is easy to reconcile with what I've set forth above. It also gives some explanation or some logic to the fact that Trump's Russia-infused coterie includes a lot of people who just seem like idiots. Why did Carter Page go on Chris Hayes' show last night? Why is he on TV at all? That simply makes no sense. Why did Michael Cohen take a meeting with a shady pro-Russian Ukrainian parliamentarian - with Felix Sater in tow! - right as the Russia story was engulfing his boss's presidency? Seriously, why?
What appears to be a gaggle of idiots in over their heads might just be a gaggle of idiots in over their heads.
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Old 3rd March 2017, 06:53 PM   #295
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Originally Posted by Stacko View Post
Trump's razor (the stupidest explanation is the best) offers a compelling narrative.



What appears to be a gaggle of idiots in over their heads might just be a gaggle of idiots in over their heads.
I don't believe stupidity precludes corruption.
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Old 3rd March 2017, 06:57 PM   #296
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Originally Posted by Stacko View Post
Trump's razor (the stupidest explanation is the best) offers a compelling narrative.



What appears to be a gaggle of idiots in over their heads might just be a gaggle of idiots in over their heads.
Also, they might just be legitimately pro Russian because they like Russia.
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Old 3rd March 2017, 07:00 PM   #297
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Originally Posted by trustbutverify View Post
I don't believe stupidity precludes corruption.
But the article wants warrants, subpoenas, and depositions. To get that you need to to a judge and convince them you have probable cause to find evidence there.
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Old 3rd March 2017, 07:02 PM   #298
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Originally Posted by BobTheCoward View Post
But the article wants warrants, subpoenas, and depositions. To get that you need to to a judge and convince them you have probable cause to find evidence there.
Who is "you" in your scenario?
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Old 3rd March 2017, 07:08 PM   #299
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Originally Posted by BobTheCoward View Post
Also, they might just be legitimately pro Russian because they like Russia.
Crushing on a regime that assassinates it's critics is Team Trump's right. Using that crush in, at the very least, unethical and (possibly) illegal ways isn't. That's what an aggressive, independent investigation is for. And I believe it's called for. Obviously, you might disagree.
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Old 3rd March 2017, 07:15 PM   #300
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Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
Who is "you" in your scenario?
People who agree with the cited "trumps razor" article.
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Old 3rd March 2017, 07:16 PM   #301
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Originally Posted by trustbutverify View Post
Crushing on a regime that assassinates it's critics is Team Trump's right. Using that crush in, at the very least, unethical and (possibly) illegal ways isn't. That's what an aggressive, independent investigation is for. And I believe it's called for. Obviously, you might disagree.
Depends on what you mean by investigation and what authority ND standards they follow.
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Old 3rd March 2017, 07:20 PM   #302
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Originally Posted by BobTheCoward View Post
People who agree with the cited "trumps razor" article.
So anyone can ask the court for a subpoena?

You need to follow your own dots and reread others' comments about the difference between enough evidence to investigate not being the same as enough evidence to convict.

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Old 3rd March 2017, 07:22 PM   #303
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Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
So anyone can ask the court for a subpoena?
No. I'm mansplaining.
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Old 3rd March 2017, 07:25 PM   #304
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Originally Posted by The_Animus View Post
Regarding this, seems like he either lied previously and committed perjury, or committed campaign finance fraud.
Nobody really cares about the latter IMO. Talk about "co-mingling funds" makes eyes glaze over. He was campaigning in a sense; why would he have to attend as a member of Armed Services?
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Old 3rd March 2017, 07:25 PM   #305
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Originally Posted by BobTheCoward View Post
No. I'm mansplaining.
That explains the lack of a coherent POV.
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Old 3rd March 2017, 07:27 PM   #306
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Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
That explains the lack of a coherent POV.
Read it as being purposely dismissive.
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Old 3rd March 2017, 07:28 PM   #307
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Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
So anyone can ask the court for a subpoena?

You need to follow your own dots and reread others' comments about the difference between enough evidence to investigate not being the same as enough evidence to convict.
And I'm saying there isn't enough to "investigate" if we mean warrants, wiretaps, requests to the NSA, etc.
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Old 3rd March 2017, 07:32 PM   #308
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Originally Posted by PhantomWolf View Post
Had Sessions said "It would depend on why they were meeting with the Russians. Many have called me a surrogate because of my speaking for The President during his campaign, but as part of my job as a Senator I had contact with the Russian Ambassador several times, it had nothing to do with the Campaign though, so likewise I'd take that into consideration for others" This would be beyond a non-story now.
Yes, it's as if he wasn't listening carefully. It does not bode well when D. Trump thinks he could have been more "accurate."

We need some sex to spice this up - if Putin and Sessions hired the same rent boy within a 24-hour period, who confessed to the tabloids, prompting Sessions to deny any impropriety, as Putin stood by with a smug little grin on his face - yeah, that would be about right.
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Old 3rd March 2017, 07:34 PM   #309
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Originally Posted by BobTheCoward View Post
And I'm saying there isn't enough to "investigate" if we mean warrants, wiretaps, requests to the NSA, etc.
We disagree. I think there's enough for all those investigative tools.
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Old 3rd March 2017, 07:36 PM   #310
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Originally Posted by Minoosh View Post
Yes, it's as if he wasn't listening carefully. It does not bode well when D. Trump thinks he could have been more "accurate."

We need some sex to spice this up - if Putin and Sessions hired the same rent boy within a 24-hour period, who confessed to the tabloids, prompting Sessions to deny any impropriety, as Putin stood by with a smug little grin on his face - yeah, that would be about right.
Have you heard something?
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Old 3rd March 2017, 07:36 PM   #311
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Originally Posted by BobTheCoward View Post
And I'm saying there isn't enough to "investigate" if we mean warrants, wiretaps, requests to the NSA, etc.
You have blinders on. That's all right, keep digging those heels in, it's not like anyone's confirmation denial bias is going to stop that snowball rolling down hill.
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Old 3rd March 2017, 07:37 PM   #312
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Originally Posted by trustbutverify View Post
We disagree. I think there's enough for all those investigative tools.
Of course there is, the evidence has passed the critical mass.
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Old 3rd March 2017, 07:43 PM   #313
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Originally Posted by trustbutverify View Post
We disagree. I think there's enough for all those investigative tools.
Argue it for any one of them of your choice.
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Old 3rd March 2017, 07:48 PM   #314
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Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
Of course there is, the evidence has passed the critical mass.
That's how I see it, anyway.
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Old 3rd March 2017, 08:19 PM   #315
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Didn't read this thread, but I think calls for Sessions to resign are ridiculous. Yes, he should recuse himself, but his answers during the confirmation hearing were understandable.
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Old 3rd March 2017, 08:37 PM   #316
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Originally Posted by Cain View Post
Didn't read this thread, but I think calls for Sessions to resign are ridiculous. Yes, he should recuse himself, but his answers during the confirmation hearing were understandable.
Uhhh, kind-a-sorta but, no, not really.

Lots of details coming out in the the last 24 hours make Sessions' excuses less than credible.

For example, one of the meetings was at the GOP Convention, not at some place unrelated to the campaign. In addition, the timing when Russian hacking was dominating the news makes it unlikely Sessions said nothing about it with the ambassador.
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Old 3rd March 2017, 08:42 PM   #317
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Originally Posted by Cain View Post
Didn't read this thread, but I think calls for Sessions to resign are ridiculous. Yes, he should recuse himself, but his answers during the confirmation hearing were understandable.
Premature maybe, but not ridiculous. He was, minimally, deceptive in his answers, and the timing of these meetings is interesting. How many times before this campaign has Sessions had 1-1 meetings with high placed Kremlin officials?
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Old 3rd March 2017, 08:44 PM   #318
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Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
Uhhh, kind-a-sorta but, no, not really.

Lots of details coming out in the the last 24 hours make Sessions' excuses less than credible.

For example, one of the meetings was at the GOP Convention, not at some place unrelated to the campaign. In addition, the timing when Russian hacking was dominating the news makes it unlikely Sessions said nothing about it with the ambassador.
Really? It seems just as reasonable it wouldn't be mentioned by sessions to not provoke an altercation at a big party.
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Old 3rd March 2017, 08:46 PM   #319
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Originally Posted by BobTheCoward View Post
Really? It seems just as reasonable it wouldn't be mentioned by sessions to not provoke an altercation at a big party.
No, that rationalization has no connection whatsoever to what Sessions said about his meetings.

Why are you making excuses up even Sessions did not use?
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Old 3rd March 2017, 08:52 PM   #320
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Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
No, that rationalization has no connection whatsoever to what Sessions said about his meetings.

Why are you making excuses up even Sessions did not use?
The sessions spokesperson called the discussion "short and informal". Your post is speculative on the subject matter, and why it was brought up. There are equally speculative reasons on why it wasn't.
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