Continuation General UK politics [2]

[Mojo]

Originally Posted by Captain_Swoop

They don't mind rent as long as it is going to a private landlord.
It's public and social renting they don't like.

No, I’m sure they’re going to introduce the right to buy to tenants of private landlords any time now.

[The Don]

Originally Posted by Mojo

No, I’m sure they’re going to introduce the right to buy to tenants of private landlords any time now.

I very much doubt that unless it only applies to individual private landlords and not rental companies.

The real kick in the knackers would be if they could force a sale at a discount from the current market price AND the landlord would still have to pay any capital gains. For example:

We bought our flat in Bristol in 1993 for £80k, the current market value is around £400k. If we were forced to sell to our tenants for, say, £300k we'd still have a capital gain of £220k on which £88k of capital gains tax would be due.

We'd lose about 25% of our retirement income and £100k of unrealised gains, the government would get £88k of cash and the tenants have £100k of extra wealth.

It's a horrible idea

[Mojo]

Here, have a freshly calibrated irony meter:

[Mojo]

Originally Posted by The Don

It's a horrible idea

So is the forced sell-off of social housing. Hasn’t stopped them.

[The Don]

Originally Posted by Mojo

So is the forced sell-off of social housing. Hasn’t stopped them.

I'm hard pressed to think of a touted government policy in the last few years that wasn't

My only comfort is that Boris Johnson and his cronies announce all kinds of schemes to get headlines but their follow-through rate is low. That said, it hasn't stopped them shipping asylum seekers to a country notorious for human rights abuses.

[Mojo]

Anyway, why would it be any less of a benefit to the tenants than the sale of council/housing association housing?

[Captain_Swoop]

Government minister Heather Wheeler has apologised after describing Birmingham and Blackpool as "godawful" places.

Quote:

The Conservative MP for South Derbyshire made the remark at a conference in London as she launched the government's new digital strategy.

Mrs Wheeler, a parliamentary secretary in the Cabinet Office, said she made an "inappropriate remark that does not reflect my actual view".

Mrs Wheeler, also an assistant government whip, is reported to have said: "I was just at a conference in Blackpool or Birmingham or somewhere godawful."

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-61767856

[jimbob]

Originally Posted by Captain_Swoop

Government minister Heather Wheeler has apologised after describing Birmingham and Blackpool as "godawful" places.

Quote:

The Conservative MP for South Derbyshire made the remark at a conference in London as she launched the government's new digital strategy.

Mrs Wheeler, a parliamentary secretary in the Cabinet Office, said she made an "inappropriate remark that does not reflect my actual view".

Mrs Wheeler, also an assistant government whip, is reported to have said: "I was just at a conference in Blackpool or Birmingham or somewhere godawful."

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-61767856

I'm sure that will go down well in the Red Wall.

[GlennB]

Meanwhile, the government's 'Food strategy' is quite a laugh:

"Among its few policy proposals are the suggestion there could be more fish farming, which is environmentally controversial, and an increase in the use of “responsibly sourced wild venison”

You couldn't make it up.

eta: It dawns on me .... they'll issue loads of hunting licences so that chinless, betweeded Bullingdon types can roam the countryside blasting away at deer? A return to deer hunting with dogs? Is Rees-Mogg behind this proposal?

[P.J. Denyer]

Originally Posted by SteveAitch

Not for him and his friends...

Or any MP, they'll still be getting their payrises just as they did through Austerity

[The Don]

Originally Posted by GlennB

Meanwhile, the government's 'Food strategy' is quite a laugh:

"Among its few policy proposals are the suggestion there could be more fish farming, which is environmentally controversial, and an increase in the use of “responsibly sourced wild venison”

You couldn't make it up.

Let them eat hake ?

[Vixen]

Originally Posted by The Don

I very much doubt that unless it only applies to individual private landlords and not rental companies.

The real kick in the knackers would be if they could force a sale at a discount from the current market price AND the landlord would still have to pay any capital gains. For example:

We bought our flat in Bristol in 1993 for £80k, the current market value is around £400k. If we were forced to sell to our tenants for, say, £300k we'd still have a capital gain of £220k on which £88k of capital gains tax would be due.

We'd lose about 25% of our retirement income and £100k of unrealised gains, the government would get £88k of cash and the tenants have £100k of extra wealth.

It's a horrible idea

I know it is only headline grabbing rather than any thought-out policy but I don't think it works like that. When Cameron tried to introduce a similar scheme (in fact, copy cat) he was unable to force the Housing Associations (privately owned or charities) into selling without the government themselves taking on the HA debts. As this would have increased the Public Debt, with tax payers having to meet the shortfall from the discounts, it was a non-starter. So what I can glean is that for the government to be able to force you to sell to your tenant at a discount price, based on years residence or amount of rent paid, they have to buy it from you at current market value. Nobody can be forced to sell at a discount (except perhaps under rarely enforced Compulsory Purchase Order, for which there has to be a legal reason, such as slum clearance, or making way for H2 railway or even fracking expeditions) but even then you'd expect market value in compensation. In insolvency practice we used to get a lot of stressed, angry complaints from bankrupts accusing us of selling their property below market value but the truth is that the value of a property is only worth what someone is prepared to pay for it on the open free market. Likewise, HMRC also uses fair market value at arm's length (so selling to a relative cheaply to avoid Capital Gains Tax doesn't work) so IMV based on these precedents, there is no way you could be forced to sell your Bristol property for less than the market value at arm's length.

[Captain_Swoop]

Prince Charles is quite right, dumping asylum seekers in Rwanda is “appalling”

[Captain_Swoop]

Michael Rosen tweeted

@MichaelRosenYes
Some of us know very well what it's like when a government says that some people are 'illegal' and deports them to another country.
1944: Martin Rosen (Rozen) 'legally' arrested in France, 'legally' deported to a camp in another country. Never seen or heard of again.

[junkshop]

Originally Posted by Captain_Swoop

Michael Rosen tweeted

@MichaelRosenYes
Some of us know very well what it's like when a government says that some people are 'illegal' and deports them to another country.
1944: Martin Rosen (Rozen) 'legally' arrested in France, 'legally' deported to a camp in another country. Never seen or heard of again.

Quite. No further comment needed (amplification may be helpful, however).

[Captain_Swoop]

The government is preparing to repeal a legal ban that prevents agency staff filling in for striking workers.

Transport Secretary Grant Shapps told the Sunday Telegraph a potential change in legislation could allow companies to hire temporary workers to prevent disruption.

Quote:

"further measures certainly would come in during this particular dispute, if it can't be resolved".
"We will be looking at the full suite of modernisation that's required,"
"The country must not continue to be held to ransom."
The transport secretary said any change could involve secondary legislation, which can be signed off by ministers "very fast".

In the Sun on Sunday, Shapps warned rail workers who plan to strike that they will not be able to work overtime on subsequent days to top-up pay they will lose as a result of taking part in the action because rail companies may decide to run restricted timetables after the strike days.

He wrote

Quote:

"Rail managers and ministers are determined to ensure strikers cannot milk the system to maintain their income while inflicting misery on the public."

[jimbob]

Meanwhile, it's reported that Johnson wanted Tory MPs to photograph their secret ballots to prove their support, but the rules prevented phones for that reason.

Also that the Whips are trying to find the 17 who said they would support Johnson but voted against.

[Vixen]

It seems the government made a misrepresentation* when it sent letters to the first deportees selected to go to Rwanda in that it claimed their safety and welfare was guaranteed by the UNHCR (UN human refugee council). On the contrary the UNHRC condemns the plan. So I expect at the Appeal Court tomorrow this will be the key legal point.

Quote:

In a late submission of evidence, the UNHCR claimed the home secretary misled refugees over the organisation’s support for the plan. The agency has also said the scheme failed to meet the required standards of “legality and appropriateness” for transferring asylum seekers from one country to another.

It emerged on Friday that the government has cancelled the removal directions for three people who had asked the high court to prevent their deportation. In the hearing, it emerged two more people will also have them cancelled.

Letters sent by the Home Office to those seeking asylum assured them the UNHCR was “closely involved” in the scheme to send people to the east African country, the high court was told. But a letter from the UNHCR to the Home Office minister Tom Pursglove questioned this claim.

“We are also concerned by statements made in the letters indicating that UNHCR has not expressed substantial concerns with regard to the shortcomings in the capacity of the Rwandan asylum system,” the agency wrote.

GUARDIAN

In the interim, Prince Charles has roundly been told to shut up or else. Presumably, cuddly Boris will be bringing a Bill to abolish the monarchy and thus instal himself as General de Pfeffel Johnson, complete with uniform and a row of medals, as dictator of Great Britain, head of state.

The problem with populism is that whilst the racists are loving it, they don't realise they are next in line for oppression. Home Secretary Priti Patel (who was sacked by May for being a traitor to the UK by holding secret negotiations with a hostile foreign power as a UK cabinet minister, under the guise of being on holiday) claims it is to deter the people smugglers who get the asylum seekers across the channel. A moment's thought should tell people that it doesn't stop the criminals at all because many crossings are not even spotted. In addition, the cost of sending small handfuls of unwanted arrivals 'to be processed' in deepest Africa - a journey of 4,000 miles, which requires a host of police and security escorts who then need to fly back - will be phenomenal, without really solving the 'problem of asylum seekers', not to mention going back on the UK COP26 pledge to protect the environment by cutting down on CO2 pollution, of which aircrafts are some of the worst emitters. ISTM to be a straightforward delight in immigrant hatred to play to the racists, who can't really be blamed as they have been inculcated from birth into believing that the UK is being swamped by aliens of all kinds.

*A polite euphemism.

[Vixen]

Originally Posted by Captain_Swoop

The government is preparing to repeal a legal ban that prevents agency staff filling in for striking workers.

Transport Secretary Grant Shapps told the Sunday Telegraph a potential change in legislation could allow companies to hire temporary workers to prevent disruption.



In the Sun on Sunday, Shapps warned rail workers who plan to strike that they will not be able to work overtime on subsequent days to top-up pay they will lose as a result of taking part in the action because rail companies may decide to run restricted timetables after the strike days.

He wrote

Shakespeare foresaw this when he wrote, 'This is the summer of our discontent' (well almost).

[P.J. Denyer]

Originally Posted by jimbob

Meanwhile, it's reported that Johnson wanted Tory MPs to photograph their secret ballots to prove their support, but the rules prevented phones for that reason.

Also that the Whips are trying to find the 17 who said they would support Johnson but voted against.

It's becoming quite North Korean, I keep expecting Andrew "Tory Boy" Pierce to turn up on TV wearing a sky blue silk kimono.

[jimbob]

https://twitter.com/Otto_English/sta...87009608237058

Quote:

Otto English
@Otto_English
Normal
12%
So under Paragraph 16 of the Rwanda Deal - the UK has to take "Rwanda's most vulnerable refugees" and resettle them.... in the UK.

Two questions - how are we trust Rwanda with the refugees we are sending their way?

And do Nigel and Mr 59535789 on twitter know?

[Captain_Swoop]

UK Prime Minister Boris Johnson is "fully engaged" in trying to help two Britons handed the death penalty for fighting Russian forces.

Let's hope he does a batter job than the one he did in Iran.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/world-europe-61764008

[sphenisc]

Originally Posted by jimbob

https://twitter.com/Otto_English/sta...87009608237058
Normal
12%
So under Paragraph 16 of the Rwanda Deal - the UK has to take "Rwanda's most vulnerable refugees" and resettle them.... in the UK.

Two questions - how are we trust Rwanda with the refugees we are sending their way?

No need to trust them. In an endeavour to cut admin and bureaucracy, on arrival, the Rwandan Government will accept payment for receiving the refugees, designate them as the most vulnerable and immediately have them flown back to the UK. Then the whole process will be repeated.
After several rounds of this, the refugees will be treated as "temporarily resident" on the plane, and through the new government scheme be given the right-to-buy the plane, which they'll then do using their accumulated air-miles. They can then rent out the plane to the government for the next batch of refugees. Everyone's a winner!

[jimbob]

Originally Posted by sphenisc

No need to trust them. In an endeavour to cut admin and bureaucracy, on arrival, the Rwandan Government will accept payment for receiving the refugees, designate them as the most vulnerable and immediately have them flown back to the UK. Then the whole process will be repeated.
After several rounds of this, the refugees will be treated as "temporarily resident" on the plane, and through the new government scheme be given the right-to-buy the plane, which they'll then do using their accumulated air-miles. They can then rent out the plane to the government for the next batch of refugees. Everyone's a winner!

I'm 60% sure that this isn't the government's aim.

[Captain_Swoop]

Parliament's standards commissioner is investigating whether Labour leader Sir Keir Starmer broke the rules by being late in registering earnings and gifts.

MPs must declare within 28 days any interest which might be reasonably considered to influence their actions.

Sir Keir appears to have missed this deadline on several occasions, including over Arsenal FC tickets and a payment made for writing a book.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-61781601

[Darat]

Originally Posted by Captain_Swoop

Parliament's standards commissioner is investigating whether Labour leader Sir Keir Starmer broke the rules by being late in registering earnings and gifts.

MPs must declare within 28 days any interest which might be reasonably considered to influence their actions.

Sir Keir appears to have missed this deadline on several occasions, including over Arsenal FC tickets and a payment made for writing a book.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-61781601

Knew he was just as bad as X!

[Captain_Swoop]

UK’s biggest GP chain replacing doctors with less qualified staff

Quote:

The UK's biggest chain of GP practices lets less qualified staff see patients without adequate supervision, an undercover BBC Panorama investigation has found.

Operose Health is putting patients at risk by prioritising profit, says a senior GP.

The company, with almost 600,000 NHS patients, is owned by US healthcare giant Centene Corporation.

Operose says it's not short-staffed and operates in patients' best interests.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-61759643

This is the future of the NHS the Tories are working towards.

[Captain_Swoop]

You can get a high speed train from Paris to Bordeaux in 2 hours for 16 euro. It’s 584 km. London to Edinburgh is more or less the same distance and is ten times as expensive.

[KDLarsen]

Not sure if it should go here or in the Brexit thread*, but now that the ECHR has stopped at least one asylum seeker being placed on the flight to Rwanda, and with the possibility that the rest may yet obtain the same relief, I wonder if Johnson will just ignore it.

Just today he aired the idea of pulling out of the ECHR, in order to ensure the rendition flights can go ahead.

* Yes, I know, ECHR is nothing to do with the EU, but trying telling that to the Daily Mail readers...

[Captain_Swoop]

£500,000 to deport 8 people plus the estimated £30,000 per head cost of processing them in Rwanda.
Return flight has 68 'vulnerable' refugees from Rwanda coming to the UK.

What a triumph.

[Captain_Swoop]

European Court of Human Rights in Strasbourg grants rule 39 request to stop the flight to Rwanda from leaving. Basis: real risk of inhuman and degrading treatment (Art. 3 ECHR)
it has blocked the removal of one of seven passengers saying he could come to serious harm.
An out-of-hours judge is examining the remaining half dozen cases and there are fears in the Home Office the flight may not depart.

[Captain_Swoop]

Boris suggests the UK could pull out of the European Convention on Human Rights to force through Rwanda deportations

"Will it be necessary to change some laws to help us as we go along? It may very well be"

https://twitter.com/ITVNewsPolitics/...11158132002819

[Lothian]

Originally Posted by Captain_Swoop

.
Return flight has 68 'vulnerable' refugees from Rwanda coming to the UK.
.

Is that a joke or do you have a source for that number?

[Captain_Swoop]

Just to point out, the only countries ever to leave the European Convention on Human Rights are Greece for a while after a military coup, and Russia, after invading Ukraine.

If Boris pulls the uk out, where does that leave the Good Friday Agreement?

[Vixen]

Bloody lefty lawyers, poring over the statutes and looking at the letter of the law. Bah! Be like Braverman and just ****'em all! Save Big Dog. Scrap the law if it's writ wrong. **** the Withdrawal Agreement, **** the EU, **** the ECHR. Just tell'em we'll make a 'few trivial amendments' and ****'em. **** the FPN's [that's quite enough ~ Ed]

[jimbob]

Originally Posted by Lothian

Is that a joke or do you have a source for that number?

I've seen several people Tweet that number

[jimbob]

According to news sites, the last asylum seeker has got an injunction against deportation.

Is the UK still going to receive Rwandan refugees?

[Captain_Swoop]

Home Office source believes it's now down to none on the flight but they do not expect it to take off.

There you go gammons are you all happy now? £100 million to Rwanda, £500k for an empty plane and 68 immigrants that Rwanda didn't want.

Edit to add.

Flight now confirmed cancelled.

[The Don]

Originally Posted by Captain_Swoop

Home Office source believes it's now down to none on the flight but they do not expect it to take off.

There you go gammons are you all happy now? £100 million to Rwanda, £500k for an empty plane and 68 immigrants that Rwanda didn't want.

Edit to add.

Flight now confirmed cancelled.

A typical UK Tory government scheme, based on a dogmatic need to please their xenophobic base, a colossal waste of money and illegal.

Their response is a typical UK Tory government one. Instead of reconsidering their policy, they're going to make us into an international pariah by withdrawing from international agreements, in this case the ECHR.

[Mojo]

Originally Posted by KDLarsen

Yes, I know, ECHR is nothing to do with the EU, but trying telling that to the Daily Mail readers...

Well, apart from being signed up to the ECHR being effectively a condition of EU membership.