ISF Logo   IS Forum
Forum Index Register Members List Events Mark Forums Read Help

Go Back   International Skeptics Forum » General Topics » USA Politics
 


Welcome to the International Skeptics Forum, where we discuss skepticism, critical thinking, the paranormal and science in a friendly but lively way. You are currently viewing the forum as a guest, which means you are missing out on discussing matters that are of interest to you. Please consider registering so you can gain full use of the forum features and interact with other Members. Registration is simple, fast and free! Click here to register today.
Tags !MOD BOX WARNING! , donald trump , George Papadopoulos , Paul Manafort , Robert Mueller , Trump controversies , Trump-Russia connections

Closed Thread
Old 30th October 2017, 03:23 PM   #361
Mumbles
Philosopher
 
Mumbles's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 6,410
Originally Posted by Argumemnon View Post
What was the excuse before WW2?
Well, back then, they meant it.

Toupee Fiasco means to, as well. But many would rather talk what they say as "free speech", and just paper over the overtly violent incidents - or, would worse cases, would prefer to stereotypes ton the black person involved.

And given that Putin is, himself, a white nationalist who openly persecutes LGBT Russians, I do not trust his word for an instant. And since he's linked to Toupee Fiasco, who only cares about erasing Obama's achievements (this won't work, Fiasco will go down as one of the worst residents in US history).

Well...yes, I can easily see a clown like Spencer going from "peaceful ethnic cleansing" to "Het, they won't leave like we so kindly asked, let's do it by force." That's years away, but don't think that, for example ISIS, isn't enforcing the idea.

I don't agree with every antifa group, that should be obvious by nows. However, I object far snottily against the BS who thinks that hate-peddlers lie Spence are simply presenting ideas. It'd be far better to teach kids how to react, and how to argue against that sort of stereotype thinking.
Mumbles is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 30th October 2017, 03:23 PM   #362
Emily's Cat
Rarely prone to hissy-fits
 
Emily's Cat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Pacific Northwet
Posts: 10,090
Originally Posted by Oystein View Post
The question appeared loaded. I neither claimed, nor implied, nor insinuated, that anyone is charged for high treason. The question has no bearing on what I asked.
Then I don't understand what you asked, nor why.

Originally Posted by Oystein View Post
That would amount to admitting that Trump, personally, knowingly, willingly, maliciously, conspired with the enemy against America and against Democracy.

What is, in the minds of conservatives, the correct punishment for High Treason?
What was this supposed to imply?
__________________
I am me. I am just me. I'm a little like other cats... but mostly I am just me.
Emily's Cat is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 30th October 2017, 03:25 PM   #363
crescent
Master Poster
 
crescent's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 2,794
Originally Posted by Emily's Cat View Post
What's the appropriate term for a case where leaks are used to discredit and disparage people being investigate in addition to actual prosecution?
Don't know, don't care. Relevance?
crescent is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 30th October 2017, 03:25 PM   #364
Emily's Cat
Rarely prone to hissy-fits
 
Emily's Cat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Pacific Northwet
Posts: 10,090
Originally Posted by Oystein View Post
Another loaded question
Dammit, here I thought I was being marginally clever and very slightly funny...
__________________
I am me. I am just me. I'm a little like other cats... but mostly I am just me.
Emily's Cat is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 30th October 2017, 03:29 PM   #365
jimbob
Uncritical "thinker"
 
jimbob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: UK
Posts: 19,474
Originally Posted by phiwum View Post
I don't recall who suggested this, but someone in this forum once said that Mueller's investigation leaks like a sieve. Since nothing relevant has leaked, nothing could be there.

As it turns out, it turns out that they did not leak the guilty plea of Papa... this isn't a good argument. Mueller seems to be running a right team.
It's almost as though the leaks that occurred were strategic.
__________________
OECD healthcare spending
Expenditure on healthcare
http://www.oecd.org/els/health-systems/health-data.htm
link is 2015 data (2013 Data below):
UK 8.5% of GDP of which 83.3% is public expenditure - 7.1% of GDP is public spending
US 16.4% of GDP of which 48.2% is public expenditure - 7.9% of GDP is public spending
jimbob is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 30th October 2017, 03:31 PM   #366
Stacko
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 10,262
Originally Posted by jimbob View Post
It's almost as though the leaks that occurred were strategic.
Or from a different source that would have access to some of the documents pertaining to the case.
Stacko is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 30th October 2017, 03:43 PM   #367
logger
Banned
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 11,145
Originally Posted by Segnosaur View Post
First of all, you are assuming that Trump is actually smart/clever enough to engage in any sort of mocking. Given the fact that Trump has an intelligence level roughly the same as Forrest Gump, it would be correct to be skeptical of a claim that its just 'mockery'.

But lets give him the benefit of the doubt... lets say he really didn't want Russia/China to hack into Clinton's emails. Its still a joke/comment of a very questionable nature. (There are some things you don't joke about.)

Keep in mind that at the time, multiple Republican congress critters also criticized Trump fro his comments.
Starting this post the way you did just makes the rest look silly, good try though.
logger is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 30th October 2017, 03:47 PM   #368
logger
Banned
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 11,145
Originally Posted by phiwum View Post
You're right, no clear evidence of collusion at the highest level at this point, so far as you and I know. Not quite the same thing as no collusion, of course. We must wait and see.
There isnít any evidence at all. Which is why we have an investigation of collusion that nets a crime that has nothing to do with it. Keep hoping though.
logger is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 30th October 2017, 03:48 PM   #369
logger
Banned
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 11,145
Originally Posted by sunmaster14 View Post
Well, Hillary is certainly smart enough to use two layers of intermediaries (or three, depending upon how you count), but I doubt Trump is. Which is why I suspect Trump is cleaner than your average presidential candidate. If Mueller conducted the same investigation of Hillary's campaign, you would see quid pro quos with foreign countries all the hell over the place, although with just enough of a buffer that other people would be taking the fall.
The Clintons certainly have a lot of experience with this. Of course our liberal friends on here arenít thinking about that.
logger is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 30th October 2017, 03:49 PM   #370
Oystein
Penultimate Amazing
 
Oystein's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 16,288
Originally Posted by Childlike Empress View Post
You mean I have excellent sources, because by now what I told the people here more than five years ago about Syria, not least based on Sibel Edmonds' early reports from the sources she got through her whistleblower association, is now since a couple of days admitted from the horses mouth, and you have not even heard about it because your sources you even pay for don't want you to know.
"In Shocking, Viral Interview, Qatar Confesses Secrets Behind Syrian War

by Tyler Durden
Oct 29, 2017 6:53 PM
"



These secrets, to the extent they are true and not exaggerated and filtered, aren't that secret, really. You misunderestimate many, including me.
__________________
Thermodynamics hates conspiracy theorists. (Foster Zygote)
Oystein is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 30th October 2017, 03:49 PM   #371
Stacko
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 10,262
In a move that will confuse everyone:
Tonight, Carter Page will joint me live, on-set to react today's indictments and guilty plea.
Stacko is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 30th October 2017, 03:51 PM   #372
Childlike Empress
Ewige Blumenkraft
 
Childlike Empress's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Ivory Tower
Posts: 16,034
Originally Posted by Oystein View Post
misunderestimate

LOL, Karlchen, good one.
Childlike Empress is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 30th October 2017, 03:52 PM   #373
Oystein
Penultimate Amazing
 
Oystein's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 16,288
Originally Posted by Emily's Cat View Post
Then I don't understand what you asked, nor why.
Yes, looks like it.

Originally Posted by Emily's Cat View Post
What was this supposed to imply?
That Trump, personally, knowingly, willingly, maliciously, conspired with the enemy against America and against Democracy. (That should not have been difficult to get, for I wrote it verbally in the post you pretend not to understand)
__________________
Thermodynamics hates conspiracy theorists. (Foster Zygote)
Oystein is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 30th October 2017, 03:52 PM   #374
plague311
Great minds think...
 
plague311's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: North Dakota
Posts: 4,657
Originally Posted by Stacko View Post
As long as he remembers to pass it to the left hand side.
__________________
"All acts performed in the world begin in the imagination."--Barbara Grizzuti Harrison

ďThere are times when the mind is dealt such a blow it hides itself in insanity. While this may not seem beneficial, it is. There are times when reality is nothing but pain, and to escape that pain the mind must leave reality behind.Ē - Patrick Rothfuss
plague311 is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 30th October 2017, 03:52 PM   #375
logger
Banned
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 11,145
Originally Posted by Argumemnon View Post
What is that supposed to mean?

Again, are you seriously suggesting that... oh, that's right. You were gone so long I almost forgot that you think everyone who disagrees with you is a colossal far-wing leftist.

Or at least you pretend to think that. Well, if and when the whole Trump edifice collapses, I look forward to reading your hysterical excuses.
You really donít know what I mean do you? Iím not explaining it to you, because itís a simple statement and you should easily understand it.
logger is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 30th October 2017, 03:53 PM   #376
logger
Banned
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 11,145
Originally Posted by NoahFence View Post
At this level, you have to admit this isn't a hoax. We have three people intimately associated with Trump and his campaign. Two under indictment and one has already pled guilty.


Yes all three have nothing to do with collusion. You really donít understand that?
logger is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 30th October 2017, 03:53 PM   #377
CapelDodger
Penultimate Amazing
 
CapelDodger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Cardiff, South Wales
Posts: 23,861
Originally Posted by varwoche View Post
I will be surprised if we ever see clear evidence of collusion reaching Trump personally. Even an ignoramus knows to use minions to conduct dirty work. Also, collusion could easily be accomplished with just winks and nods.
I agree. I think collusion is a bit of a red herring : when no collusion is found it will be presented as showing no Russian influence on the election, which is, of course, another matter entirely.
__________________
It's a poor sort of memory that only works backward - Lewis Carroll (1832-1898)

God can make a cow out of a tree, but has He ever done so? Therefore show some reason why a thing is so, or cease to hold that it is so - William of Conches, c1150
CapelDodger is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 30th October 2017, 03:53 PM   #378
Oystein
Penultimate Amazing
 
Oystein's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 16,288
Originally Posted by Childlike Empress View Post
LOL, Karlchen, good one.
I adore GWB, dontcha know.
__________________
Thermodynamics hates conspiracy theorists. (Foster Zygote)
Oystein is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 30th October 2017, 03:54 PM   #379
logger
Banned
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 11,145
Originally Posted by Doubt View Post
Let me fix that for you:

"Yes I am Trolling, Boo

But itís still a hoax, your side doesnít have a thing and Mueller needs to resign and get ready to be interviewed. nothing that follows the trolling confession can be taken seriously and is divorced from reality."
I wouldnít expect you to see it any other way, in fact Iím delighted that you look at it that way.
logger is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 30th October 2017, 03:54 PM   #380
plague311
Great minds think...
 
plague311's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: North Dakota
Posts: 4,657
Originally Posted by TheL8Elvis View Post
Again, if he broke the law, he can suffer the consequences too.
I don't get why this is so hard to understand for people on the right. If anyone is guilty of a crime, no matter their political affiliation, then they should be prosecuted for said crime.
__________________
"All acts performed in the world begin in the imagination."--Barbara Grizzuti Harrison

ďThere are times when the mind is dealt such a blow it hides itself in insanity. While this may not seem beneficial, it is. There are times when reality is nothing but pain, and to escape that pain the mind must leave reality behind.Ē - Patrick Rothfuss
plague311 is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 30th October 2017, 03:55 PM   #381
Emily's Cat
Rarely prone to hissy-fits
 
Emily's Cat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Pacific Northwet
Posts: 10,090
Originally Posted by CapelDodger View Post
I agree. I think collusion is a bit of a red herring : when no collusion is found it will be presented as showing no Russian influence on the election, which is, of course, another matter entirely.
Yeah, I think this was a bad tactic. I personally think a lot more would have been gleaned by taking a softer, less sensationalist approach to this matter. Then the facts would carry more weight. As it stands, if they can't make "collusion" or something similar stick... it's going to end up looking like a failure in the eyes of most media-viewers.
__________________
I am me. I am just me. I'm a little like other cats... but mostly I am just me.
Emily's Cat is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 30th October 2017, 03:56 PM   #382
logger
Banned
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 11,145
Originally Posted by varwoche View Post
Mueller a leftist?!? How utterly surreal.
Stating the simple fact that there are leftist all through government pushing a hoax and somehow your first thought is I was discussing Mueller.
logger is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 30th October 2017, 03:58 PM   #383
Childlike Empress
Ewige Blumenkraft
 
Childlike Empress's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Ivory Tower
Posts: 16,034
Originally Posted by CapelDodger View Post
I agree. I think collusion is a bit of a red herring : when no collusion is found it will be presented as showing no Russian influence on the election, which is, of course, another matter entirely.

So where do you, with your senior member experience, think the beef is?
Childlike Empress is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 30th October 2017, 03:59 PM   #384
Emily's Cat
Rarely prone to hissy-fits
 
Emily's Cat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Pacific Northwet
Posts: 10,090
Originally Posted by plague311 View Post
I don't get why this is so hard to understand for people on the right. If anyone is guilty of a crime, no matter their political affiliation, then they should be prosecuted for said crime.
I think that a lot of people on the right, it's not that they don't get it... it's that they don't believe it of those on the left. I think they feel they've observed a willingness to overlook and forgive crimes on the left. I think many on the right believe that if someone on the left is guilty of a crime, the left will make excuses about why it was actually okay...
__________________
I am me. I am just me. I'm a little like other cats... but mostly I am just me.
Emily's Cat is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 30th October 2017, 04:03 PM   #385
Craig4
Penultimate Amazing
 
Craig4's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Alexandria, VA Home to the Deep State.
Posts: 17,455
Originally Posted by logger View Post
There isnít any evidence at all. Which is why we have an investigation of collusion that nets a crime that has nothing to do with it. Keep hoping though.
Did you miss the story about the campaign staffer who plead guilty to making false statements to the FBI about the campaign's collusion with Russia?
Craig4 is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 30th October 2017, 04:05 PM   #386
Belz...
Fiend God
 
Belz...'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: In the details
Posts: 76,577
Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
Oh dear, it would appear that I have an admirer.
'k

__________________
Master of the Shining Darkness

"My views are nonsense. So what?" - BobTheCoward


Belz... is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 30th October 2017, 04:05 PM   #387
CapelDodger
Penultimate Amazing
 
CapelDodger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Cardiff, South Wales
Posts: 23,861
Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
I don't think Trump is that smart. He knows how to pay people off, but not necessarily how to keep his hands clean. Anyone with a pathologic sense of self like Trump's will almost certainly be stupid and careless acting on the belief he is above it all.
I think Trump's more vulnerable on money-laundering, which he'd see as clever business which he'd naturally be terribly good at. While not being.
__________________
It's a poor sort of memory that only works backward - Lewis Carroll (1832-1898)

God can make a cow out of a tree, but has He ever done so? Therefore show some reason why a thing is so, or cease to hold that it is so - William of Conches, c1150
CapelDodger is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 30th October 2017, 04:06 PM   #388
Belz...
Fiend God
 
Belz...'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: In the details
Posts: 76,577
Originally Posted by Childlike Empress View Post
There's gangsters and organized crime everywhere at the top level of (not only) US government, including Mueller who has a lot of skeletons in his closet not least covering up for international networks post-9/11. It's anybodies guess where this tumbling abomination will turn next, but the fact that Trump is now closing in on one year after election, untouched by anything but a cacaphony of pre$$titute noise, shows that if there's mayor dirt on him, it can't be untangled without bringing the whole House of Cards down.
You know, I'd love to have a TARDIS-like machine but that also allowed me to go into alternate timelines and realities, because I'd check out the one where Hillary is president and Mueller is investigating her, and all else is the same. I'd bet some money that people like you would be assuring the members here that Mueller is some sort of justice paragon and avatar/incarnation of the law.

I guess I have my answer about how the Trump defenders would spin this. Actually, they're spinning in place.
__________________
Master of the Shining Darkness

"My views are nonsense. So what?" - BobTheCoward


Belz... is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 30th October 2017, 04:07 PM   #389
plague311
Great minds think...
 
plague311's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: North Dakota
Posts: 4,657
Originally Posted by Emily's Cat View Post
I think that a lot of people on the right, it's not that they don't get it... it's that they don't believe it of those on the left. I think they feel they've observed a willingness to overlook and forgive crimes on the left. I think many on the right believe that if someone on the left is guilty of a crime, the left will make excuses about why it was actually okay...
I've never read so much hypocrisy in one statement up to this point.

You mean, like this entire thread of righties touting ad nauseum that this is a witch hunt, and that there's nothing here? Or how about the discussion of Trump grabbing women (and admitted to walking in on underage girls at a Miss Teen USA event), where the majority of the right dismissed it as "locker room talk" among guys? Or how about the other thousand times that Trump, or his family, has been involved in paying off State Attorney's, or threatening people, or broken ethics, and the right has completely justified it?

Wow. Outstanding.
__________________
"All acts performed in the world begin in the imagination."--Barbara Grizzuti Harrison

ďThere are times when the mind is dealt such a blow it hides itself in insanity. While this may not seem beneficial, it is. There are times when reality is nothing but pain, and to escape that pain the mind must leave reality behind.Ē - Patrick Rothfuss
plague311 is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 30th October 2017, 04:08 PM   #390
Belz...
Fiend God
 
Belz...'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: In the details
Posts: 76,577
Originally Posted by Mumbles View Post
Well, back then, they meant it.

Toupee Fiasco means to, as well. But many would rather talk what they say as "free speech", and just paper over the overtly violent incidents - or, would worse cases, would prefer to stereotypes ton the black person involved.

And given that Putin is, himself, a white nationalist who openly persecutes LGBT Russians, I do not trust his word for an instant. And since he's linked to Toupee Fiasco, who only cares about erasing Obama's achievements (this won't work, Fiasco will go down as one of the worst residents in US history).
I love the typo. It actually makes him a worse person.
__________________
Master of the Shining Darkness

"My views are nonsense. So what?" - BobTheCoward


Belz... is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 30th October 2017, 04:10 PM   #391
Belz...
Fiend God
 
Belz...'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: In the details
Posts: 76,577
Originally Posted by logger View Post
You really donít know what I mean do you? Iím not explaining it to you, because itís a simple statement and you should easily understand it.
This is a type of behaviour that has always fascinated me. Say something, and then refuse to explain it only when people don't understand. The idiotic part is that, if said people did understand it, there'd be no need to explain it. In other words, there is no intention for the utterance to make sense, otherwise explaining would be the choice to make.

So my conclusion is that you don't know what you meant, either. You posted it because you thought I wouldn't call you on it, and there's actually no meaning behind it.
__________________
Master of the Shining Darkness

"My views are nonsense. So what?" - BobTheCoward


Belz... is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 30th October 2017, 04:10 PM   #392
Childlike Empress
Ewige Blumenkraft
 
Childlike Empress's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Ivory Tower
Posts: 16,034
Originally Posted by Emily's Cat View Post
I think that a lot of people on the right, it's not that they don't get it... it's that they don't believe it of those on the left. I think they feel they've observed a willingness to overlook and forgive crimes on the left. I think many on the right believe that if someone on the left is guilty of a crime, the left will make excuses about why it was actually okay...

Of course this is all ridiculous based on what the corporate media (on the top) broadcasts to the masses (on the bottom) who should understand that these "left" and "right" terms are completely meaningless in current year society, not least because the US is a post-industrial society. There is no working class anymore. "Left" and "Right" are defined, if by anything, by opinions on matters of social life, what is a family, is it ok to be gay, what shall we do about it. And the answer is of course to realize that this can be resolved by basic tolerance. If you tolerate my hobbies, I'll tolerate yours. The Guns and Dope Party imagined by Robert Anton Wilson (pbuh) a long time ago. And what we shouldn't tolerate is a "political'" class - that is enriching an oligarchy that pays them - investigating itself. Because the outcome is clear and only in their interest.
Childlike Empress is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 30th October 2017, 04:12 PM   #393
Belz...
Fiend God
 
Belz...'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: In the details
Posts: 76,577
Originally Posted by plague311 View Post
I've never read so much hypocrisy in one statement up to this point.

You mean, like this entire thread of righties touting ad nauseum that this is a witch hunt, and that there's nothing here? Or how about the discussion of Trump grabbing women (and admitted to walking in on underage girls at a Miss Teen USA event), where the majority of the right dismissed it as "locker room talk" among guys? Or how about the other thousand times that Trump, or his family, has been involved in paying off State Attorney's, or threatening people, or broken ethics, and the right has completely justified it?

Wow. Outstanding.
Notice how the support for the right is veiled as an attempt to understand the "other" side? I don't know if you noticed the pattern yet.
__________________
Master of the Shining Darkness

"My views are nonsense. So what?" - BobTheCoward


Belz... is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 30th October 2017, 04:15 PM   #394
Stacko
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 10,262
Originally Posted by Argumemnon View Post
You know, I'd love to have a TARDIS-like machine but that also allowed me to go into alternate timelines and realities, because I'd check out the one where Hillary is president and Mueller is investigating her, and all else is the same. I'd bet some money that people like you would be assuring the members here that Mueller is some sort of justice paragon and avatar/incarnation of the law.

I guess I have my answer about how the Trump defenders would spin this. Actually, they're spinning in place.
In what reality would Hillary fire the FBI director necessitating the appointment of a special counsel? Republican appointees run the DoJ right now. Hillary isnít being prosecuted because thereís no case. Its always been political theater designed to hurt her poll numbers. There'd just be endless house select committees knowingly investigating nothing.
Stacko is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 30th October 2017, 04:19 PM   #395
Jim_MDP
Philosopher
 
Jim_MDP's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: N.Cal/S.Or
Posts: 6,798
Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
Yes, $10 mill bail and home confinement for a white collar case. None dare call it extortion.
...

That's a bit of a non-sequitur, but misplaced I believe.

Our system of fees, daily taxes, fines and bail is horribly biased against the poor. Being out $500 or $1000 to a bondsman for a charge (assuming not a career crim) is quite the hardship.

For the wealthy white-collar accused... bail is likely not.
He may not have the cash, but depending on his real property for collateral he may not be out a penny (I don't expect he's going tor run). Hardly extortion.

Hell... I've put up staggering amounts of cash (for others) just to avoid the 10% bond fee. A year and change later... I got it all back (I guess it cost me the availability of that money for the period).

You should look at Scandinavian DUI fines, where they've flipped it around.
I think it's a percentage of wealth... a rich drunk can lose the value of a Ferrari, or more.

/derail
__________________
----------------------
Anything goes in the Goblin hut... anything.

"Suggesting spurious explanations isn't relevant to my work." -- WTC Dust.
"Both cannot be simultaneously true, and so one may conclude neither is true, and if neither is true, then Apollo is fraudulent." -- Patrick1000.

Last edited by Jim_MDP; 30th October 2017 at 04:41 PM.
Jim_MDP is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 30th October 2017, 04:20 PM   #396
Jim_MDP
Philosopher
 
Jim_MDP's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: N.Cal/S.Or
Posts: 6,798
Originally Posted by applecorped View Post
We have to be past Peak Trump now

What... are you high?

We're just getting the good stuff revved up.
__________________
----------------------
Anything goes in the Goblin hut... anything.

"Suggesting spurious explanations isn't relevant to my work." -- WTC Dust.
"Both cannot be simultaneously true, and so one may conclude neither is true, and if neither is true, then Apollo is fraudulent." -- Patrick1000.
Jim_MDP is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 30th October 2017, 04:25 PM   #397
phiwum
Penultimate Amazing
 
phiwum's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 10,901
Originally Posted by jimbob View Post
It's almost as though the leaks that occurred were strategic.
I don't know about that. Maybe.

But it seems that some things can be kept quiet in this investigation.
phiwum is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 30th October 2017, 04:27 PM   #398
phiwum
Penultimate Amazing
 
phiwum's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 10,901
Originally Posted by logger View Post
There isnít any evidence at all. Which is why we have an investigation of collusion that nets a crime that has nothing to do with it. Keep hoping though.
We might wait and see. Maybe there's no evidence of collusion. Maybe there is. I don't wager one way or the other at this point.
phiwum is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 30th October 2017, 04:30 PM   #399
phiwum
Penultimate Amazing
 
phiwum's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 10,901
Originally Posted by Emily's Cat View Post
I think that a lot of people on the right, it's not that they don't get it... it's that they don't believe it of those on the left. I think they feel they've observed a willingness to overlook and forgive crimes on the left. I think many on the right believe that if someone on the left is guilty of a crime, the left will make excuses about why it was actually okay...
Which crimes have been overlooked?
phiwum is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 30th October 2017, 04:38 PM   #400
Emily's Cat
Rarely prone to hissy-fits
 
Emily's Cat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Pacific Northwet
Posts: 10,090
Originally Posted by Craig4 View Post
Did you miss the story about the campaign staffer who plead guilty to making false statements to the FBI about the campaign's collusion with Russia?
I read the story about the campaign staffer who plead guilty to making a false statement to the FBI about him having met with Russians after he became part of the campaign, rather than before.
__________________
I am me. I am just me. I'm a little like other cats... but mostly I am just me.
Emily's Cat is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Closed Thread

International Skeptics Forum » General Topics » USA Politics

Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 10:52 AM.
Powered by vBulletin. Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.

This forum began as part of the James Randi Education Foundation (JREF). However, the forum now exists as
an independent entity with no affiliation with or endorsement by the JREF, including the section in reference to "JREF" topics.

Disclaimer: Messages posted in the Forum are solely the opinion of their authors.