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Tags donald trump , Trump administration , Trump controversies

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Old 22nd January 2018, 06:37 AM   #241
Squeegee Beckenheim
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Administration releases a report saying 73% of all terrorists are foreign-born, claiming to be based on DHS data; DHS data analysists say no such data exists within the DHS
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Old 22nd January 2018, 06:43 AM   #242
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Originally Posted by The Don View Post
Only because he had no idea what a "clean bill" was.....
He described it pretty clearly, being just about DACA. He did say he would sign a bill like that. Now sure he needed the staff there to explain to him what his own position was but still.
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Old 22nd January 2018, 06:44 AM   #243
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Originally Posted by Squeegee Beckenheim View Post
So where are all these foreign born white supremacists coming from?
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Old 22nd January 2018, 06:51 AM   #244
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Originally Posted by Squeegee Beckenheim View Post
Literal fake news, huh?

This should be known as The Psychological Projection Administration.
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Old 22nd January 2018, 06:54 AM   #245
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Originally Posted by Upchurch View Post
Literal fake news, huh?

This should be known as The Psychological Projection Administration.
How can you call the official proclamations of the ministry of propaganda fake?

It is just an alternative fact.
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Old 22nd January 2018, 07:11 AM   #246
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Originally Posted by ponderingturtle View Post
So where are all these foreign born white supremacists coming from?
The 73% claim is limited to "international terrorism", so the report's authors aren't so much lying about that detail as they are deliberately limiting their analysis to the type of terrorism that supports their preferred flavor of fear-mongering. It would be like if I only looked at "international" gang activity and found that it involved a bunch of Mexicans and Salvadorans. The POTUS, on the other hand, just left out that whole "international" detail when gushing about the results making his tweet a lie.
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Old 22nd January 2018, 07:15 AM   #247
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Originally Posted by Civet View Post
The 73% claim is limited to "international terrorism", so the report's authors aren't so much lying about that detail as they are deliberately limiting their analysis to the type of terrorism that supports their preferred flavor of fear-mongering. It would be like if I only looked at "international" gang activity and found that it involved a bunch of Mexicans and Salvadorans. The POTUS, on the other hand, just left out that whole "international" detail when gushing about the results making his tweet a lie.
Yes, international is the key detail. It is a lie by omission and purposeful misinformation.
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Old 22nd January 2018, 07:17 AM   #248
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Even more shocking, the NIH has data suggesting that an overwhelming percentage of people undergoing abortion procedures are women!
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Old 22nd January 2018, 07:22 AM   #249
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The fact that it's talking about "international" terrorism is certainly one aspect of the administration's claims that don't stand up to scrutiny. I'd say, though, that it's commonplace for governments to release data in ways that push their own agendas - from omitting key points, to keep commissioning reports until one says what they want it to say.

It seems to me, though, that it's worse to claim that the data is based on DHS analysis, when the DHS did not perform the analysis and does not collect or analyse the kind of data that is being claimed of them. From the article:

Quote:
Career professional analysts at DHS communicated to the Justice Department that the data sought for the report simply did not exist within their department. DHS, multiple sources said, does not track or correlate international terrorism data by citizenship or country of origin, and have warned the Trump administration that doing so risks a misleading portrait of both terrorism and immigration.
It's claimed to be a DHS analysis, done by DHS analysts, using DHS data, yet the DHS wasn't consulted at all. They had nothing to do with it whatsoever.

Forget lies of omission, that's straight-up lying.
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Last edited by Squeegee Beckenheim; 22nd January 2018 at 07:23 AM.
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Old 22nd January 2018, 07:23 AM   #250
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Originally Posted by ponderingturtle View Post
He meant to say Torn. I will give him that. I think the thing is focusing on the lie not the slight misspeak. Everyone does that now and then.
I read that and thought "Who is this 'Tom' character?"
Damn Arial Font...

Originally Posted by Armitage72 View Post
I just realized... we're dealing with a twisted real life version of Chance the Gardener/Chauncey Gardiner, with arrogance replacing Chance's easy-going innocence. There's even the obsessive TV watching.
I made that connection several months ago -- glad to see it's seconded.
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Old 22nd January 2018, 07:30 AM   #251
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Originally Posted by Squeegee Beckenheim View Post
The fact that it's talking about "international" terrorism is certainly one aspect of the administration's claims that don't stand up to scrutiny. I'd say, though, that it's commonplace for governments to release data in ways that push their own agendas - from omitting key points, to keep commissioning reports until one says what they want it to say.

It seems to me, though, that it's worse to claim that the data is based on DHS analysis, when the DHS did not perform the analysis and does not collect or analyse the kind of data that is being claimed of them. From the article:



It's claimed to be a DHS analysis, done by DHS analysts, using DHS data, yet the DHS wasn't consulted at all. They had nothing to do with it whatsoever.

Forget lies of omission, that's straight-up lying.
Well it just shows their incompetence. A proper scaremonger - Alex Jones, for example - would have claimed that the Deep State within DHS was refusing to track the national origins of international terrorists in order to promote their globalist agenda so Sessions had to have his own people do the analysis. Golden opportunity just squandered.
As an aside, I'm absolutely baffled that DHS doesn't analyze pretty much every possible trend involving terrorists. I don't favor using such data to promote xenophobia or anything but if a bunch of terrorists had anything in common I'd expect it to be examined.
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Old 22nd January 2018, 07:57 AM   #252
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Originally Posted by Civet View Post
As an aside, I'm absolutely baffled that DHS doesn't analyze pretty much every possible trend involving terrorists. I don't favor using such data to promote xenophobia or anything but if a bunch of terrorists had anything in common I'd expect it to be examined.
I wouldn't dream of trying to claim any insight into why they don't - they're in possession of much more data than I am, and have tired and tested far more methodologies than my zero - but I can see a danger in finding correlations and assigning them meaning. Correlation does not imply causation, and with something as important as this it could be very dangerous to assume that it does.
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Old 22nd January 2018, 08:05 AM   #253
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Originally Posted by Fast Eddie B View Post
A female senator who was a combat veteran took Trump to task, calling him “Cadet Bonespurs” and pointing out his five deferments put him in a weak position to lecture her about the military.
She's kinda wrong, though. It's not his deferments that make him a weak military lecturer. Just as it's not her veterancy that makes her a strong military lecturer.
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Old 22nd January 2018, 08:16 AM   #254
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
She's kinda wrong, though. It's not his deferments that make him a weak military lecturer.
Is it his complete lack of leadership skills, lack of relevant knowledge on the topic, or his inability to put together a coherent thought?
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Old 22nd January 2018, 08:40 AM   #255
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Originally Posted by Squeegee Beckenheim View Post

It's claimed to be a DHS analysis, done by DHS analysts, using DHS data, yet the DHS wasn't consulted at all. They had nothing to do with it whatsoever.

Forget lies of omission, that's straight-up lying.
But this is the way things are done in Washington. Bills are written up by "think tanks" and shopped around to congress people until they can find someone to sign on and sponsor it.

This is the same thing. It was written by an advocacy group and Trump just put a DHS endorsement on it.
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Old 22nd January 2018, 08:44 AM   #256
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
She's kinda wrong, though. It's not his deferments that make him a weak military lecturer. Just as it's not her veterancy that makes her a strong military lecturer.
Do you understand that she's a former Lt. Colonel who lost both her legs in combat in Iraq? That is a helluva qualification to discuss military affairs.
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Old 22nd January 2018, 08:55 AM   #257
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There's this:
Quote:
This recorded message was set up on the White House comment phone line, which accepts calls from members of the public.

Callers to the White House comment line at the weekend were informed that Democrats were to blame [for the government shutdown]. The recorded message says calls cannot be answered because Democrats are holding government funding "hostage".

"Unfortunately, we cannot answer your call today because Congressional Democrats are holding government funding - including funding for our troops and other national security priorities - hostage to an unrelated immigration debate," the recording says.

"Due to this obstruction, the government is shut down."
and this:
Quote:
The 30-second ad opens with images of a recent courtroom outburst by Luis Bracamontes, a twice-deported undocumented immigrant accused of killing two California deputies in 2014. It then cuts between footage of President Donald Trump, people who are purported to be undocumented immigrants, and Democratic lawmakers. The ad implies that Democrats are to blame for any bad actors: “Now Democrats who stand in our way will be complicit in every murder committed by illegal immigrants,” the ad’s narrator says during the second half of the video.
Madness.
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Old 22nd January 2018, 09:01 AM   #258
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Originally Posted by alfaniner View Post
Madness.
They are just bringing back the classics.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...=.45e21e35c479
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Old 22nd January 2018, 09:06 AM   #259
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The Bracamontes ad is essentially the professional version of the type of messaging I see from the fellows on the The_Donald subreddit daily. It's almost exactly like those are types of folks setting the direction for the Republican party these days.
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Old 22nd January 2018, 09:14 AM   #260
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I saw a comment on an article a day or two ago where someone opined that, even though Trump didn't use the word "*********" to describe African countries, it was a genius move for him to have done so because Liberals have now objected to that description of those countries, so they can now not have any objection to people being deported there. I've not seen such weird thinking since, well, since logger last posted.
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Old 22nd January 2018, 09:14 AM   #261
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Originally Posted by Squeegee Beckenheim View Post
The fact that it's talking about "international" terrorism is certainly one aspect of the administration's claims that don't stand up to scrutiny. I'd say, though, that it's commonplace for governments to release data in ways that push their own agendas - from omitting key points, to keep commissioning reports until one says what they want it to say.

It seems to me, though, that it's worse to claim that the data is based on DHS analysis, when the DHS did not perform the analysis and does not collect or analyse the kind of data that is being claimed of them. From the article:



It's claimed to be a DHS analysis, done by DHS analysts, using DHS data, yet the DHS wasn't consulted at all. They had nothing to do with it whatsoever.

Forget lies of omission, that's straight-up lying.
Hell, it's Jefferson The Traitor Elf Sessions. Does anyone expect anything else from him? How's that illusory crackdown on marijuana coming, Jeff?

Hey, maybe Donnie Johnny got the cracker-jack team who finished with their non-findings on the non-results of the non-existent massive number of illegal voters and they came up with the numbers for him? The best people.
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Old 22nd January 2018, 09:36 AM   #262
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Originally Posted by Upchurch View Post
Is it his complete lack of leadership skills, lack of relevant knowledge on the topic, or his inability to put together a coherent thought?
How can you say that?

Trump had sex with women in the 70s. Avoiding STDs in that era was exactly like fighting a war in Vietnam!
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Old 22nd January 2018, 09:49 AM   #263
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Originally Posted by Segnosaur View Post
How can you say that?

Trump had sex with women in the 70s. Avoiding STDs in that era was exactly like fighting a war in Vietnam!
No, he couldn't be guilty of that because he had boner spurs.
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Old 22nd January 2018, 09:49 AM   #264
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Originally Posted by Bob001 View Post
Do you understand that she's a former Lt. Colonel who lost both her legs in combat in Iraq? That is a helluva qualification to discuss military affairs.
She's a female, liberal democrat. Thus, unqualified.
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Old 22nd January 2018, 09:53 AM   #265
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Originally Posted by Bob001 View Post
Do you understand that she's a former Lt. Colonel who lost both her legs in combat in Iraq? That is a helluva qualification to discuss military affairs.
Getting injured in combat is not a qualification to discuss military affairs. Combat injuries do not impart knowledge of recruitment and retention, training and doctrine, procurement and supply, etc. They don't make anyone an expert, or even minimally competent, in matters of strategic priority, force strength and composition, or national security posture. By themselves, they don't even give much insight into the administration of veteran's affairs.

As for rank being a qualification? She might have been a Lieutenant Colonel, but Donald Trump is Commander in Chief.
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Old 22nd January 2018, 09:55 AM   #266
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Getting injured in combat is not a qualification to discuss military affairs. Combat injuries do not impart knowledge of recruitment and retention, training and doctrine, procurement and supply, etc. They don't make anyone an expert, or even minimally competent, in matters of strategic priority, force strength and composition, or national security posture. By themselves, they don't even give much insight into the administration of veteran's affairs.

As for rank being a qualification? She might have been a Lieutenant Colonel, but Donald Trump is Commander in Chief.
And no one likes pilots who get shot down, they are as bad as ones who get captured.
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Old 22nd January 2018, 09:56 AM   #267
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Getting injured in combat is not a qualification to discuss military affairs. Combat injuries do not impart knowledge of recruitment and retention, training and doctrine, procurement and supply, etc. They don't make anyone an expert, or even minimally competent, in matters of strategic priority, force strength and composition, or national security posture. By themselves, they don't even give much insight into the administration of veteran's affairs.

As for rank being a qualification? She might have been a Lieutenant Colonel, but Donald Trump is Commander in Chief.
What training in matters of Military affairs as he had? Where did he serve?
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Old 22nd January 2018, 09:58 AM   #268
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Originally Posted by Shalamar View Post
She's a female, liberal democrat. Thus, unqualified.
Nothing about being female or liberal or a democrat disqualifies her as a military lecturer. Not even the combination of all three disqualifies her. As far as I know, nothing disqualifies her. Try again.
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Old 22nd January 2018, 10:09 AM   #269
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post

As for rank being a qualification? She might have been a Lieutenant Colonel, but Donald Trump is Commander in Chief.
he got elected, she got promoted.
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Old 22nd January 2018, 10:28 AM   #270
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I don't think theprestige is saying that Duckworth is in any way unqualified, or that Trump is in any way qualified. He was criticising the premise of one, specific argument.
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Old 22nd January 2018, 10:28 AM   #271
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Getting injured in combat is not a qualification to discuss military affairs. Combat injuries do not impart knowledge of recruitment and retention, training and doctrine, procurement and supply, etc. They don't make anyone an expert, or even minimally competent, in matters of strategic priority, force strength and composition, or national security posture. By themselves, they don't even give much insight into the administration of veteran's affairs.

As for rank being a qualification? She might have been a Lieutenant Colonel, but Donald Trump is Commander in Chief.
I wonder if congresspersons have access to that knowledge though. Maybe she should run.

oh wait.
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Old 22nd January 2018, 10:31 AM   #272
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Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza View Post
he got elected, she got promoted.
There's been a bit of news recently about naval officers who got promoted to high rank, who have now been made to resign, and face criminal charges, due to their actions as military officers. Promotion alone does not always signify qualification or fitness for duty.
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Old 22nd January 2018, 10:32 AM   #273
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Getting injured in combat is not a qualification to discuss military affairs. Combat injuries do not impart knowledge of recruitment and retention, training and doctrine, procurement and supply, etc. They don't make anyone an expert, or even minimally competent, in matters of strategic priority, force strength and composition, or national security posture. By themselves, they don't even give much insight into the administration of veteran's affairs.

As for rank being a qualification? She might have been a Lieutenant Colonel, but Donald Trump is Commander in Chief.
Well, if getting elected is a sufficient qualification, then that's all she has to do, isn't it.
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Old 22nd January 2018, 10:33 AM   #274
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Originally Posted by NoahFence View Post
I wonder if congresspersons have access to that knowledge though.
I'm sure they do. Feel free to make an argument for her qualifications based on that knowledge. If you can show that she has that knowledge, whether from her access as a congressperson or from some other source, I won't even disagree with you.

The argument we're currently examining is that getting injured in combat supposedly provides special insight into military affairs in general.
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Old 22nd January 2018, 10:39 AM   #275
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Originally Posted by WilliamSeger View Post
Well, if getting elected is a sufficient qualification, then that's all she has to do, isn't it.
If that's the qualification, then she and Trump are equally qualified. But her claim is that Trump is less qualified than her.
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Old 22nd January 2018, 10:41 AM   #276
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Originally Posted by Squeegee Beckenheim View Post
I don't think theprestige is saying that Duckworth is in any way unqualified, or that Trump is in any way qualified. He was criticising the premise of one, specific argument.
Thank you. This is exactly correct.
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Old 22nd January 2018, 10:45 AM   #277
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
There's been a bit of news recently about naval officers who got promoted to high rank, who have now been made to resign, and face criminal charges, due to their actions as military officers. Promotion alone does not always signify qualification or fitness for duty.
and you have any information that this applies to the Congresswoman in question?
Because otherwise your post is utterly irrelevant.
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Old 22nd January 2018, 10:53 AM   #278
NoahFence
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
I'm sure they do. Feel free to make an argument for her qualifications based on that knowledge. If you can show that she has that knowledge, whether from her access as a congressperson or from some other source, I won't even disagree with you.

The argument we're currently examining is that getting injured in combat supposedly provides special insight into military affairs in general.
Don't be absurd. You know as well as I do that any argument I make, if shown to be correct, will only result in your moving the goalposts.
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Old 22nd January 2018, 10:53 AM   #279
WilliamSeger
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
I'm sure they do. Feel free to make an argument for her qualifications based on that knowledge. If you can show that she has that knowledge, whether from her access as a congressperson or from some other source, I won't even disagree with you.

The argument we're currently examining is that getting injured in combat supposedly provides special insight into military affairs in general.
Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
If that's the qualification, then she and Trump are equally qualified. But her claim is that Trump is less qualified than her.
Duckwork also has a B.A. in political science and an M.A. in international affairs from George Washington University, and she graduated from the Army Officers' Reserve Training Corp. So yes, she has infinitely more insight than a draft-dodging failed real estate tycoon and former game show host.

Last edited by WilliamSeger; 22nd January 2018 at 10:59 AM.
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Old 22nd January 2018, 10:59 AM   #280
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Originally Posted by Segnosaur View Post
How can you say that?

Trump had sex with women in the 70s. Avoiding STDs in that era was exactly like fighting a war in Vietnam!
And he did go to military school. That's like being in the military, right?
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