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Old 25th March 2020, 07:26 PM   #1881
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Not all racists and bigots wear white hooded sheets or march at demonstrations. Some just post anonymously on the internet.
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Old 25th March 2020, 07:34 PM   #1882
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A Youtube video posted on March 22 from the same guy (Legal Eagle) who suggested that Trump might not be guilty of collusion.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r4EVn03aCJg
Quote:
1. Trump dismissed most of the 30 people who attended the meeting with Obama in 2016 regarding pandemics.
2. Trump said he was surprised by the pandemic; maybe true because he dismissed all the people who weren't surprised.
3. In May 2018 Trump disbanded the pandemic team then later said he didn't know anything about it.
4. Trump complained about allowing Americans back into the country during the Ebola pandemic.
5. Cuts to pandemic response budgets were done to save money with Trump telling us he could get the people back; they are not back yet.
5. Korea and Singapore responded aggressively and have had more success in dealing with the pandemic whereas Italy (and the USA so far) was not aggressive and is less successful.
6. USA was slow to begin wide spread testing. It lagged behind the entire industrialized world. Our initial tests were inaccurate. States had to wait for FDA approval to use their own tests. Trump deflected the need for tests by saying it was under control and would go away in April.
7. Trump was asked about fearful Americans he said the reporter was terrible.
8. Reports that various health experts were discouraged from talking to the president. VP Pence was appointed instead of actual experts. Pence's anti science actions are what we do not need.
9. Trump turned to Jarred Kurshner who in turn turned to Dr. Kloss for information. Kloss used Facebook for information which was turned over to the White House.
10. Early on the administration was classifying covid-19 information instead of releasing it to the public.
11. Trump claims all travel from Europe was banned; not true
12. Trump claimed insurance companies would waive the cost of testing; actually they only waive co-pays.
13. Trump vowed that Americans would be able to go to testing sites; companies had no idea how they would do this. Also claimed Google would develop a website to facilitate testing; it was news to Google.
14. Trump stated destroying the country was okay as long as we can win the election.
I was familiar with most of these claims, but a few were new to me.

A March 24, Dr. Mike video fact checking politicians.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nt9ldBsMggg
Quote:
1. Trump's claim about effective drugs; not game changer, yet. Actually, no clinical trials yet. Other patients can't get the drugs Trump has said were effective for covid-19
2. LtGov Patrick; "We can choose between saving the aged or saving the economy".
3. Trump; "If doctors had their way they would shut down the entire country".
4. Democrats candidates claim Trump cut CDC funding; instead Congress authorized increases to the budget.
5. Commissioner Culpepper; "Kill covid -19 with a blow dryer" WTF? That would cook the nose to medium rare.
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Old 25th March 2020, 07:51 PM   #1883
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Originally Posted by Meadmaker View Post
I think by Friday.
I posted the above yesterday.

We're on pace to become number one in confirmed cases by the end of the day tomorrow, but certainly by Friday.
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Old 25th March 2020, 09:24 PM   #1884
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Also, I see that after a week of "I've never downplayed anything, I always said this was going to be a very bad pandemic even before the doctors were saying it", he's decided to go back with "it's just like a mild flu, there's nothing to worry about".
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Old 25th March 2020, 09:24 PM   #1885
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Who Americans trust (or do not trust) for Coronavirus information...

Quote:

Democrats:

CDC 87%
Your governor 75%
National media 72%
Friends/family 72%
Religious leaders 44%
Trump 14%

Republicans:

Trump 90%
CDC 84%
Friends/family 81%
Religious leaders 71%
You governor 65%
National media 13%

-CBS/YouGov
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Old 25th March 2020, 09:48 PM   #1886
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Originally Posted by Resume View Post
The Mexicans displaying a cavalier attitude towards this pandemic are just as idiotic as the US citizens displaying a similar attitude, or their idiot-in-chief.

Those do not represent all Mexicans as the spring breakers do not represent all US citizens. All people demonstrate poor judgement some of the time, but if you're saying that all Mexicans have inferior cognitive abilities, you are a bigoted fool.
More specifically, the President of Mexico appears to be an idiot over this.
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Old 25th March 2020, 09:49 PM   #1887
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Originally Posted by Checkmite View Post
Also, I see that after a week of "I've never downplayed anything, I always said this was going to be a very bad pandemic even before the doctors were saying it", he's decided to go back with "it's just like a mild flu, there's nothing to worry about".
Ocenia was always at war with Eurasia and and peace with Eastasia.
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Old 25th March 2020, 09:58 PM   #1888
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All right, I've been including this information in my regular posts on the main 2019-nCoV / Corona virus thread(s), but I'm reposting this part here because I'd like to hear people's opinions.

First, the raw numbers.

Canada vs the USA. Because Canada's population is 1/8.7 that of the States, typically ratios for raw numbers in many areas run 1:8.7 (or 10 to 87) for Canada:USA. For example, for every pound of spaghetti sold in Canada, one can reasonably expect there to be 8.7 pounds sold in the US.

The source for Tested is Wikipedia. The source for Confirmed cases and Deaths is also Wikipedia.

MetricCanadaExpected US number based on 1:8.7 ratioActual US NumberActual Canada:US ratioYesterday's ratio
COVID-19 tests142,1541,236,740472,8201:3.31:2.6
COVID-19 cases3,40929,65869,0471:201:20
COVID-19 deaths353051,0461:301:29

All other things being equal, one would expect that for every 10 Canadian who died from COVID-19 there would be 87 American deaths. But the actual number is much higher than that: 299 deaths. At this point in time, 35 Canadians have died from this, and at the 1:8.7 ratio one would expect only 305 American deaths. But the death toll is far higher at 1,046. Not only that, the ratio of Canadian deaths to Americans is widening. Two days ago it was 1:27. Yesterday it was at 1:29. Today's is 1:30. Who knows where it will end up?

Now, my questions:
  1. If the US had acted as quickly as Canada, is it safe to assume there would be only 305 deaths as of tonight instead of 1,046?
  2. How much of the difference in the "expected" (when compared to Canada) deaths (305) vs actual (1,046) can be laid at the feet of the Trump administration? Is Donald Trump responsible, either personally or in his role as the President of the United States, for the additional 741 deaths—a number that is likely to be far higher once this emergency is over?
  3. Can some of the blame for this difference be given to the administration for its long time attack on the ACA/Obamacare?
  4. Are there differences other than political that can be used to explain the "extra" American deaths?
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Old 25th March 2020, 10:06 PM   #1889
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Originally Posted by dudalb View Post
More specifically, the President of Mexico appears to be an idiot over this.
Too late. He said "the Mexicans".
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Old 25th March 2020, 10:22 PM   #1890
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Originally Posted by sir drinks-a-lot View Post
Too late. He said "the Mexicans".
It's not too late for you to reread for comprehension, chief.
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Old 26th March 2020, 12:26 AM   #1891
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Originally Posted by Baylor View Post
The US opens its border to include third world people, and "first world" people think US citizens are dumb.

I always find this interesting.
Speaking of 'dumb'....

https://www.facebook.com/TheYoungTur...2599776876512/
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Old 26th March 2020, 12:42 AM   #1892
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Originally Posted by Blue Mountain View Post
[*] Can some of the blame for this difference be given to the administration for its long time attack on the ACA/Obamacare?

WITCH HUNT!!!
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Old 26th March 2020, 12:45 AM   #1893
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Originally Posted by Checkmite View Post
Also, I see that after a week of "I've never downplayed anything, I always said this was going to be a very bad pandemic even before the doctors were saying it", he's decided to go back with "it's just like a mild flu, there's nothing to worry about".

The Joy of Cognitive Dissonance ...
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"Stupidity renders itself invisible by assuming very large proportions. Completely unreasonable claims are irrefutable. Ni-en-leh pointed out that a philosopher might get into trouble by claiming that two times two makes five, but he does not risk much by claiming that two times two makes shoe polish." B. Brecht
"The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is required for their real happiness. The demand to give up the illusion about its condition is the demand to give up a condition which needs illusions." K. Marx
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Old 26th March 2020, 12:55 AM   #1894
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Originally Posted by Meadmaker View Post
I posted the above yesterday.

We're on pace to become number one in confirmed cases by the end of the day tomorrow, but certainly by Friday.
Nearly double the number of new cases compared to the second-highest, Spain.

But again, of course, confirmed cases is a poor metric by which to judge, given that it's so largely dependent on tests done and that number varies wildly.

The US is the third highest in new deaths, and that number is currently doubling every three days. It won't be too long before nobody can downplay it.
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Old 26th March 2020, 12:57 AM   #1895
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Originally Posted by Blue Mountain View Post
All right, I've been including this information in my regular posts on the main 2019-nCoV / Corona virus thread(s), but I'm reposting this part here because I'd like to hear people's opinions.

First, the raw numbers.

Canada vs the USA. Because Canada's population is 1/8.7 that of the States, typically ratios for raw numbers in many areas run 1:8.7 (or 10 to 87) for Canada:USA. For example, for every pound of spaghetti sold in Canada, one can reasonably expect there to be 8.7 pounds sold in the US.

The source for Tested is Wikipedia. The source for Confirmed cases and Deaths is also Wikipedia.

MetricCanadaExpected US number based on 1:8.7 ratioActual US NumberActual Canada:US ratioYesterday's ratio
COVID-19 tests142,1541,236,740472,8201:3.31:2.6
COVID-19 cases3,40929,65869,0471:201:20
COVID-19 deaths353051,0461:301:29

All other things being equal, one would expect that for every 10 Canadian who died from COVID-19 there would be 87 American deaths. But the actual number is much higher than that: 299 deaths. At this point in time, 35 Canadians have died from this, and at the 1:8.7 ratio one would expect only 305 American deaths. But the death toll is far higher at 1,046. Not only that, the ratio of Canadian deaths to Americans is widening. Two days ago it was 1:27. Yesterday it was at 1:29. Today's is 1:30. Who knows where it will end up?

Now, my questions:
  1. If the US had acted as quickly as Canada, is it safe to assume there would be only 305 deaths as of tonight instead of 1,046?
  2. How much of the difference in the "expected" (when compared to Canada) deaths (305) vs actual (1,046) can be laid at the feet of the Trump administration? Is Donald Trump responsible, either personally or in his role as the President of the United States, for the additional 741 deaths—a number that is likely to be far higher once this emergency is over?
  3. Can some of the blame for this difference be given to the administration for its long time attack on the ACA/Obamacare?
  4. Are there differences other than political that can be used to explain the "extra" American deaths?
Is this deaths as of today, or deaths at comparable points in their respective timelines? If it's the former, then it's meaningless. Most graphs are tracking deaths since 10 or 25 deaths in each respective country.
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Old 26th March 2020, 02:25 AM   #1896
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I'll be interested to see how this plays out among the Trumpublicans:

Quote:
A makeshift morgue was set up outside Bellevue Hospital, and the city’s police, their ranks dwindling as more fall ill, were told to patrol nearly empty streets to enforce social distancing. Another was erected outside a hospital in Elmhurst, Queens.
https://www.huffpost.com/entry/new-y...b6cb08a927d265
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Old 26th March 2020, 02:30 AM   #1897
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And a spot of mud in the eye for everyone, courtesy of China.

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2020/...085419818.html
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Old 26th March 2020, 02:33 AM   #1898
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Originally Posted by The Atheist View Post
I'll be interested to see how this plays out among the Trumpublicans:



https://www.huffpost.com/entry/new-y...b6cb08a927d265
Fake news!
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Old 26th March 2020, 02:39 AM   #1899
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What stupid petty ***** Pompeo and Trump are in trying to force “Wuhan Virus” into G7 joint statements. America is a bad joke.
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Old 26th March 2020, 02:40 AM   #1900
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Originally Posted by Resume View Post
The Mexicans displaying a cavalier attitude towards this pandemic are just as idiotic as the US citizens displaying a similar attitude, or their idiot-in-chief.
This isn't what was being litigated so this logic pretzel is pointless.

Here is the argument:
Originally Posted by Ivor the Engineer View Post
Because everything else people have tried to drag Trump down with have been to do with his current and historic dealings with other people or politics.

Perhaps I am mistaken as to just how dumb US citizens are, but if the Chief Medical Officer and wider medical community in the UK publicly contradicted the PM I'm fairly sure the PM would change tack pretty quickly with a "clarification".
The Mexican president is "contradicting the wider medical community," and the citizens of Mexico seem to be siding with their president instead of the "wider medical community."

So, Ivor the Engineer thinks Mexicans are dumb.


Originally Posted by Resume View Post
people demonstrate poor judgement some of the time, but if you're saying that all Mexicans have inferior cognitive abilities, you are a bigoted fool.
That's a horrible thing to say about Ivor the Engineer.
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Old 26th March 2020, 02:42 AM   #1901
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Originally Posted by The Atheist View Post
I'll be interested to see how this plays out among the Trumpublicans:

Quote:
A makeshift morgue was set up outside Bellevue Hospital, and the city’s police, their ranks dwindling as more fall ill, were told to patrol nearly empty streets to enforce social distancing. Another was erected outside a hospital in Elmhurst, Queens.
https://www.huffpost.com/entry/new-y...b6cb08a927d265
How about.....

Cuomo is screwing things up terribly in stark contrast to President Trump who is handling the Coronavirus masterfully and who will make sure that everything is back to normal by Easter.

Also New York is full of immigrants and is a sanctuary city which highlights how smart President Trump was to close our borders - saving hundreds of thousands of lives in the process. If only the do-nothing Democrats had done the same then the US wouldn't have any cases.
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Old 26th March 2020, 02:45 AM   #1902
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Originally Posted by Blue Mountain View Post
All right, I've been including this information in my regular posts on the main 2019-nCoV / Corona virus thread(s), but I'm reposting this part here because I'd like to hear people's opinions.

First, the raw numbers.

Canada vs the USA. Because Canada's population is 1/8.7 that of the States, typically ratios for raw numbers in many areas run 1:8.7 (or 10 to 87) for Canada:USA. For example, for every pound of spaghetti sold in Canada, one can reasonably expect there to be 8.7 pounds sold in the US.

The source for Tested is Wikipedia. The source for Confirmed cases and Deaths is also Wikipedia.

MetricCanadaExpected US number based on 1:8.7 ratioActual US NumberActual Canada:US ratioYesterday's ratio
COVID-19 tests142,1541,236,740472,8201:3.31:2.6
COVID-19 cases3,40929,65869,0471:201:20
COVID-19 deaths353051,0461:301:29

All other things being equal, one would expect that for every 10 Canadian who died from COVID-19 there would be 87 American deaths. But the actual number is much higher than that: 299 deaths. At this point in time, 35 Canadians have died from this, and at the 1:8.7 ratio one would expect only 305 American deaths. But the death toll is far higher at 1,046. Not only that, the ratio of Canadian deaths to Americans is widening. Two days ago it was 1:27. Yesterday it was at 1:29. Today's is 1:30. Who knows where it will end up?

Now, my questions:
  1. If the US had acted as quickly as Canada, is it safe to assume there would be only 305 deaths as of tonight instead of 1,046?
  2. How much of the difference in the "expected" (when compared to Canada) deaths (305) vs actual (1,046) can be laid at the feet of the Trump administration? Is Donald Trump responsible, either personally or in his role as the President of the United States, for the additional 741 deaths—a number that is likely to be far higher once this emergency is over?
  3. Can some of the blame for this difference be given to the administration for its long time attack on the ACA/Obamacare?
  4. Are there differences other than political that can be used to explain the "extra" American deaths?
My opinion? You're drawing stupid conclusions based on nothing but your own ignorance.

Spain and Italy have a fraction of the population of the US but more than 3 and 7x's the Covid-19 related deaths? France also has a fraction of the population and more deaths.

What stupid conclusions about Obamacare do you want to draw about that?

Last edited by Baylor; 26th March 2020 at 02:56 AM.
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Old 26th March 2020, 03:01 AM   #1903
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Originally Posted by Baylor View Post
My opinion? You're drawing stupid conclusions based on nothing but your own ignorance.

Spain and Italy have a fraction of the population of the US but more than 3 and 7x's the Covid-19 related deaths? France also has a fraction of the population and more deaths.

What stupid conclusions about Obamacare do you want to draw about that?
The US is also about 2 weeks behind Europe in terms of the Covid-19 outbreak.
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Old 26th March 2020, 03:07 AM   #1904
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Originally Posted by The Don View Post
The US is also about 2 weeks behind Europe in terms of the Covid-19 outbreak.
The 2019–20 coronavirus pandemic was confirmed to have spread to France on 24 January 2020,

The first known case of COVID-19 in the U.S. was confirmed on January 20, 2020,

An ongoing worldwide pandemic of coronavirus disease 2019 (COVID-19), a novel infectious disease caused by severe acute respiratory syndrome coronavirus 2 (SARS-CoV-2), was first confirmed to have spread to Italy on 31 January 2020,

The 2019–20 coronavirus pandemic was confirmed to have spread to Spain on 31 January 2020,
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Old 26th March 2020, 03:21 AM   #1905
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Originally Posted by The Atheist View Post
I'll be interested to see how this plays out among the Trumpublicans:



https://www.huffpost.com/entry/new-y...b6cb08a927d265
It's actually a hospitality tent for people playing a round of golf.
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Old 26th March 2020, 04:49 AM   #1906
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Originally Posted by Baylor View Post
<snip>

The Mexican president is "contradicting the wider medical community," and the citizens of Mexico seem to be siding with their president instead of the "wider medical community."

<snip>

So, Ivor the Engineer thinks Mexicans are dumb.


That's a horrible thing to say about Ivor the Engineer.
I haven't been following the Mexican approach to dealing with the pandemic, but in the context of my argument, if there is an equivalent of the CMO in Mexico, has she or he directly contradicted the President during a broadcast?

And quite frankly the only evidence I personally need to convince me large swathes of the US population are dumb is to look at who you put in the White house.
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Old 26th March 2020, 04:57 AM   #1907
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https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1242974655293435907

Quote:
The Trump campaign seriously just issued a cease and desist for this ad so I'm doing my part and sharing it as widely as humanly possible.
Video embedded in tweet.
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Old 26th March 2020, 05:36 AM   #1908
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Originally Posted by Baylor View Post
My opinion? You're drawing stupid conclusions based on nothing but your own ignorance.
Well, that, plus data. You know, actual facts. Statistics. That sort of thing.

Quote:
France also has a fraction of the population and more deaths.
Recheck those numbers by the end of today.


By the end of today, we will pass France in deaths, and we will pass everyone, including China, in confirmed cases.


One month ago today, Donald Trump said that the number of cases in the US would soon drop to zero.
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Old 26th March 2020, 06:31 AM   #1909
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Originally Posted by Squeegee Beckenheim View Post
A cease and desist order?

Can that be serious?

I want to believe that the "cease and desist" portion is fake news, that they didn't really do that, because I can understand how an inept leader could screw up a pandemic response. I can even understand how Trump himself would want a cease and desist order. However, I can't understand how any lawyer would actually draft the request for one. On what basis?

ETA: It seems that the basis for that request was that there was a reference to Trump talking about a "hoax" in relation to the virus. So, the basis seems to be that a politician thinks it's illegal to have his words taken out of context. Pssst….Donald. It wasn't misleading, and your words sounded even stupider with the full context, and, perhaps even more importantly, we still have free speech in this country, and I don't think that even very many of the idiots who think you're a super awesome President want to change that.

Last edited by Meadmaker; 26th March 2020 at 06:58 AM.
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Old 26th March 2020, 07:07 AM   #1910
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Originally Posted by Squeegee Beckenheim View Post
Is this deaths as of today, or deaths at comparable points in their respective timelines? If it's the former, then it's meaningless. Most graphs are tracking deaths since 10 or 25 deaths in each respective country.
I don't trust the USA government's numbers on this as I'm certain that the Trump regime is doing all they can to suppress the information and not count the deaths accurately, and/or have the ability to.
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Old 26th March 2020, 07:17 AM   #1911
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Originally Posted by thaiboxerken View Post
I don't trust the USA government's numbers on this as I'm certain that the Trump regime is doing all they can to suppress the information and not count the deaths accurately, and/or have the ability to.
If the recently deceased aren't routinely tested then it's entirely possible that the majority of cases aren't being recorded. After all if an 80-something living in a care home dies of respiratory illness, a postmortem wouldn't usually be required.

I suppose that it could be possible to estimate the number of deaths after the fact from the excess deaths but then again improved hand-washing and shelter in place may significantly reduce the death toll from other causes.
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Old 26th March 2020, 07:26 AM   #1912
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I wonder why the free-market hasn't destroyed this disease. That invisible hand is more invisible these days...
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Old 26th March 2020, 08:32 AM   #1913
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Originally Posted by thaiboxerken View Post
I wonder why the free-market hasn't destroyed this disease. That invisible hand is more invisible these days...
Its busy slapping faces and gut punching with few tugs for billionaires these days.
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Old 26th March 2020, 08:46 AM   #1914
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Originally Posted by Cabbage View Post
It didn't come out of nowhere and you know it. It came out of a solid eight years of people screaming bloody murder over trivialities while Obama was President.
It’s just gaslighting and alt-right trolling.

And not particularly good attempts at either.
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Old 26th March 2020, 09:11 AM   #1915
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Originally Posted by sir drinks-a-lot View Post
Too late. He said "the Mexicans".
Had you found time to assess the Trump administration’s response to the pandemic yet?

Or is posting delightful zingers filling up most of your schedule?
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Old 26th March 2020, 09:17 AM   #1916
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Originally Posted by johnny karate View Post
Had you found time to assess the Trump administration’s response to the pandemic yet?
This is not a fair question. Trump didn't have a response to the pandemic.....
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Old 26th March 2020, 10:21 AM   #1917
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Pack them churches.
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...-a9424456.html

Quote:
In early March, before First Assembly of God church in Greers Ferry, Arkansas, called off all of its activities to prevent the spread of coronavirus, just like other churches across the country, dozens of participants gathered at the church for a children’s program.

Now, 34 people who attended that event have come down with the coronavirus, according to a deacon at this rural evangelical church 75 miles north of Little Rock, who spoke to the Arkansas Democrat-Gazette.

Two visiting evangelists who led the event tested positive. One child who visited the church for the program has the illness. Thirty-one church members and staff have all tested positive, with more still awaiting their test results.
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Old 26th March 2020, 10:42 AM   #1918
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Originally Posted by johnny karate View Post
It’s just gaslighting and alt-right trolling.

And not particularly good attempts at either.
You didn't say "people" (whoever he was talking about), you said "the same poster" without specifying which one. I asked you to clarify, instead of clarifying you said you would clarify but never did. Then you said you "clearly" made your point when whoever you were referring to was ambiguous.

Last edited by Baylor; 26th March 2020 at 10:47 AM.
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Old 26th March 2020, 10:46 AM   #1919
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Originally Posted by Ivor the Engineer View Post
I haven't been following the Mexican approach to dealing with the pandemic, but in the context of my argument, if there is an equivalent of the CMO in Mexico, has she or he directly contradicted the President during a broadcast?
Yes. And the president of Mexico is actively encouraging people to hug each other. So, without any doubt, you think Mexicans are dumb.

Originally Posted by Ivor the Engineer View Post
And quite frankly the only evidence I personally need to convince me large swathes of the US population are dumb is to look at who you put in the White house.
Nice bait and switch.
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Old 26th March 2020, 10:48 AM   #1920
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Originally Posted by Baylor View Post
you said "the same poster" without specifying which one. I asked you to clarify, instead of clarifying you said you would clarify but never did. Then you said you "clearly" made your point when whoever you were referring to was ambiguous.
And yet other posters seem to understand perfectly what I meant.

Perhaps the problem is with your abilities of comprehension.
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