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Tags 9/11 , 9/11 conspiracy theories , 9/11 truthers , truthers

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Old 15th March 2020, 05:45 PM   #1
Allen773
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How do Truthers explain the cooperation/coordination needed within the US govt...

....for an “inside job?” of 9/11?

Do they know how the US government works? Do they know how its many, many decentralized departments, bureaus, divisions, agencies, and subagencies are structured, what their roles and functions are, whether or not one part of the government’s function contradicts another part’s function, and most importantly...how the many hundreds of thousands of people (aka human beings, whom are notoriously not perfect) within and across the US government operate in practice?

And what about all of the various state and local government bodies on the East Coast, along with the private sector, from the firms working in the World Trade Center to American and United Airlines?

Note I haven’t even mentioned the presidential administrations of Bill Clinton and George W. Bush, which the plotting of 9/11 straddled timeline-wise.

“Hey Dubya, I know you don’t like me for beating your daddy in 92 or for my Vice President’s ugly election fight with you in Florida, but can you help me out with this whole False Flag terrorist attack business? We’ll kill thousands of Americans and destroy the World Trade Center and damage the Pentagon, and we’ll blame it all on Islamic jihadists!”

“Hey Bubba, are you kidding?! I had the exact same idea, hehehehe. Yeah, no one’s gonna suspect a thing, other than some funny conspiracy-minded folks on the Internet. I got Cheney on the other line as we speak, he’s creating the plan now! And all is forgiven with Gore and my father!”

Meanwhile, in the United Kingdom...

MI6 guy: “Mr. Prime Minister, it appears that the Americans are going to carry out massive false flag attacks in New York and Washington. Should we be concerned?”

Tony Blair: “No, no, Bush and I are friends. I want to go to war with him against Saddam Hussein so bad, what’s a few thousand or so dead civilians?”

“Very well, thank you sir.”

(Above scene repeated in every other county’s government and intelligence services)

Oh, and we can’t forget The Media (TM)

Editor: You know, we’ve got some credible sources within the US government that a major false flag attack will be carried out in New York and Washington. Obviously most people in the government are on board with this plan, but there are a few courageous whistleblowers who’ve come forward. Looks like this could be the scandal of the century!

More senior editor: Nah, we’ll let them do it and help them cover it up, blame it on a terrorist group most Americans haven’t heard of instead of the real culprits, the CIA and Pentagon etc. After all, what’s a few thousand dead New Yorkers to us at the New York Times?

All of the people above and countless others: “OK, we’re all going to stay on message. Remember, Osama bin Laden did this. And we’re all genuinely sad and shook up. And we’ll all dismiss the conspiracy theorists on the Internet as fabricators or crazy or not worth our time, even though they will threaten to blow the whole thing open. Alright? Alright!”

—————

Seems plausible.

Last edited by Allen773; 15th March 2020 at 06:00 PM.
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Old 15th March 2020, 09:52 PM   #2
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"How do Truthers explain the cooperation/coordination needed within the US govt for an “inside job?” of 9/11?"

They can't.

/thread
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Old 16th March 2020, 06:19 AM   #3
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Originally Posted by smartcooky View Post
"How do Truthers explain the cooperation/coordination needed within the US govt for an “inside job?” of 9/11?"

They can't.

/thread

/thread

GOLD -The picklock that never fails
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Old 16th March 2020, 07:30 AM   #4
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Galaxy brain:

All the people that were in the towers when they were destroyed by controlled detonation were actually the people that coordinated the whole scheme. A smaller clique of elites within the conspiracy perpetrated a meta-conspiracy to make sure all the collaborators were killed to remain silent.

The controlled demo collaborators were told that 9/11 was a dress rehearsal without real explosives. They were all crowded into the top floors of the towers for a debrief when the real bombs went off, guaranteeing their silence. Like the Pharaohs of old, GWB entombed his workers so his secrets would remain safe forever.

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Old 16th March 2020, 08:27 AM   #5
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Originally Posted by smartcooky View Post
"How do Truthers explain the cooperation/coordination needed within the US govt for an “inside job?” of 9/11?"

They can't.

/thread
/subforum
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Old 16th March 2020, 08:31 AM   #6
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Originally Posted by Fonebone View Post
/thread

GOLD -The picklock that never fails
So, in cash terms, how much would they need to pay you to shut up about it?

Dave
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Old 16th March 2020, 08:50 AM   #7
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Originally Posted by smartcooky View Post
"How do Truthers explain the cooperation/coordination needed within the US govt for an “inside job?” of 9/11?"

They can't.

/thread
Every year, or so, we review the continuation of government plans. How do we know if they work if we don't test them?
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Old 16th March 2020, 09:18 AM   #8
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Originally Posted by Fonebone View Post
/thread

GOLD -The picklock that never fails
It is hard to contain massive ignorance on 9/11.

Who is paying 9/11 truthers to act paranoid, spread stupid theories/lie, and believe 9/11 truth massive array of stupid claims? How much does 9/11 truth pay 9/11 truthers to support stupid stuff?

It would be cool to be paid, then earn the biggest Pulitzer Prize in history for the vast array of idiotic theories of 9/11 truths uncoordinated BS if true? Which claim is true, which 88g NoC flight path to woo is true?

How much would you have to paid to believe 9/11 truth's dumbed down lies?
Free
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Old 16th March 2020, 09:23 AM   #9
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Remember how AE911Truth blamed THE GENERAL POPULATION for the cover-up? So everyone got the memo, and chose to stay on message.

Say, is it possible that the massive tax breaks of the Bush the Lesser and the Trump administrations were really just hush-money to enshill the General Population into kidding one another?

And Truthers are the only ones who didn't get a tax break (because, living in their moms' basements off their moms' welfare handouts, they never paid any taxes to begin with)? Or, like Richard Gage, set up fake Charities to live the sweet life tax-free and thus being invulnerable to shill money?
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Old 16th March 2020, 09:24 AM   #10
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I can't come up with a rational 9/11 truth plot

government planning office of woo - people will think the USAF stood down. Nope, the armed fighters launch into the ADIZ, they don't do hijacking. If we fake hijackings with our 50 billion dollar secret remote control take over Boeing jets project so secret, no one will know, NORAD would take an hour before the fake hijacking are found to be WMD.

Now, we need to get 19 fake UBL buddies on four planes.

/what a load of BS

How do you fake the 19 terrorists in 9/11 truth demented minds filled with mush.
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Old 16th March 2020, 09:37 AM   #11
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Originally Posted by Dave Rogers View Post
So, in cash terms, how much would they need to pay you to shut up about it?

Dave
Fonebone, this is a serious question. If you had been a part of a plot to kill about 3,000 of your own countrymen and start unlawful wars in Asia and the Middle East, how much money would have persuaded you, personally, to remain silent about it for at least the next two decades?

Dave
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Old 16th March 2020, 09:38 AM   #12
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Originally Posted by Dave Rogers View Post
So, in cash terms, how much would they need to pay you to shut up about it?

Dave

Betraying my country and soiling my good name.... 100 Mill US


Some would betray their country for less.
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Old 16th March 2020, 09:52 AM   #13
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Originally Posted by Fonebone View Post
Betraying my country and soiling my good name.... 100 Mill US
Doing your best to give a meaningless answer, I see.

Originally Posted by Fonebone View Post
Some would betray their country for less.
Yet not all. And the silence of many thousands would have to have been bought. How much would it have taken, for not a single one of them to speak up after two decades?

Dave
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Old 16th March 2020, 10:01 AM   #14
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You don’t understand, Dave, that there’s tons of gold that They are hiding in undisclosed locations around the world but that is also being paid out every month to many thousands of people to keep them quiet about the Truth of 9/11.

Somehow, no one else has noticed any friends, family members, co-workers, neighbors, etc. receiving mysterious shipments of gold every month for the past 20 or more years (whenever the plotting of the “inside job” false flag attacks of 9/11 started). But that’s just nitpicking, obviously.

Last edited by Allen773; 16th March 2020 at 10:02 AM.
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Old 16th March 2020, 10:05 AM   #15
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See, all the bigwigs are pedophiles who've been filmed having sex with children in the basement of that pizza parlor. So if they start to go off the reservation, they get Epsteined.
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Old 16th March 2020, 10:07 AM   #16
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Originally Posted by Leftus View Post
Every year, or so, we review the continuation of government plans. How do we know if they work if we don't test them?
Exactly. Which is why every year, the entire top layer of the US government is annihilated in a self-inflicted nuclear attack. It’s just routine testing.
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Old 16th March 2020, 10:13 AM   #17
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Originally Posted by Brainster View Post
See, all the bigwigs are pedophiles who've been filmed having sex with children in the basement of that pizza parlor. So if they start to go off the reservation, they get Epsteined.
But why would notorious con man and sex criminal Epstein go off the reservation in the first place? Because the federal government finally went after him in a serious way? What would motivate federal prosecutors and law enforcement to do such a thing? Aren’t they all in on it too?

Was it because of the increased media exposure? Why would the media, of all people, go after Epstein? Everyone knows that the media is all CIA-controlled Mockingbird propaganda.

I’m not trying to debunk any conspiracy theories, by any means. I’m just.....what is the phrase...

Just Asking Questions.
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Old 16th March 2020, 11:26 AM   #18
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Nobody working in black-ops would have signed onto any of the 911 Truth's versions of the attacks. Too many moving parts in a crowded location full of educated people. Both locations, WTC and Pentagon, had stepped up security on the ground meaning that moving and planting charges would have been impossible considering the prep work needed for CD.

Then there is the problem of Johnny Bag O'Donuts.

Every elite unit in the US: SFOD-D, DEVGRU, MARSOC, CIA-SOG, FBI-HRT, DEA FAST has at least one Johnny Bag O'Donuts in the origination. Johnny's a screw up, not a daily screw up, but the guy who screws up at exactly the worst time. Johnny also likes to run his mouth. And because Johnny is a state of mind he is impossible to get rid of and this means he has to be factored into any operation's worst case scenario.

We've never heard from Johnny Bag O'Donuts about black ops teams in NYC.

We have heard from Johnny in relationship to the FDNY's crap communications system which left fire crews in WTC1 unaware of the collapse of the South Tower leading to their deaths. Johnny Bad O'Donuts shows up again with the EPA lying about the air at Ground Zero being safe to breathe. Johnny was there as the ANG took off looking for AA77 and UA93 and headed out over the Atlantic. Johnny Bag O'Donuts later told us about the CIA's torture of Al Qaeda suspects at black sites and the NSA's domestic eavesdropping.

Johnny Bag O'Donuts cannot be silenced and yet there is no evidence of CD or staged operations on 911.

On the flip side when you talk to anyone who's worked black ops they'd tell you the easiest way to pull off 911 was to send five-man teams onto jet liners, hijack them, and fly them into their targets. And even then Al Qaeda had their own Johnny Bag Al Donuts who was talking to the local press about an upcoming strike inside the US.
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Old 16th March 2020, 11:52 AM   #19
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9/11 truthers, might be morally corrupt and would do things and be quiet for money

Originally Posted by Fonebone View Post
Betraying my country and soiling my good name.... 100 Mill US

Some would betray their country for less.
So say 9/11 truth liars... FTFY

I agree, the 9/11 truthers have no morals when it comes to speading lies for free, they don't care.

To think people sell their moral stand for money is called projection. Sad to see the claims of money when it means 9/11 truthers might be bought, as they project the imaginary bad guys in their 9/11 truth 9/11 plot are paid, and have no morals. It is projection.
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Old 16th March 2020, 01:01 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by Axxman300 View Post
Nobody working in black-ops would have signed onto any of the 911 Truth's versions of the attacks. Too many moving parts in a crowded location full of educated people. Both locations, WTC and Pentagon, had stepped up security on the ground meaning that moving and planting charges would have been impossible considering the prep work needed for CD.

Then there is the problem of Johnny Bag O'Donuts.

Every elite unit in the US: SFOD-D, DEVGRU, MARSOC, CIA-SOG, FBI-HRT, DEA FAST has at least one Johnny Bag O'Donuts in the origination. Johnny's a screw up, not a daily screw up, but the guy who screws up at exactly the worst time. Johnny also likes to run his mouth. And because Johnny is a state of mind he is impossible to get rid of and this means he has to be factored into any operation's worst case scenario.

We've never heard from Johnny Bag O'Donuts about black ops teams in NYC.

We have heard from Johnny in relationship to the FDNY's crap communications system which left fire crews in WTC1 unaware of the collapse of the South Tower leading to their deaths. Johnny Bad O'Donuts shows up again with the EPA lying about the air at Ground Zero being safe to breathe. Johnny was there as the ANG took off looking for AA77 and UA93 and headed out over the Atlantic. Johnny Bag O'Donuts later told us about the CIA's torture of Al Qaeda suspects at black sites and the NSA's domestic eavesdropping.

Johnny Bag O'Donuts cannot be silenced and yet there is no evidence of CD or staged operations on 911.

On the flip side when you talk to anyone who's worked black ops they'd tell you the easiest way to pull off 911 was to send five-man teams onto jet liners, hijack them, and fly them into their targets. And even then Al Qaeda had their own Johnny Bag Al Donuts who was talking to the local press about an upcoming strike inside the US.
Johnny Bag O’Donuts blew the whistle on the entire US military chain-of-command with the Pentagon Papers and also brought down Richard Nixon with the help of Deep Throat, Woodward and Bernstein, and eventually John Dean.

Johnny Bag O’Donuts also revealed the CIA and FBI abuses and illegal/unconstitutional activities in the 1970s, leading to the Church Committee, the Pike Committee, the Rockefeller Commission, the revelation of the “Family Jewels”, and the Congressional investigations into political assassinations.

Oh, and Johnny Bag O’Donuts blew the whistle on Iran-Contra, Bank of Credit and Commerce International, and various other scandals for good measure.

Yet despite repeated interviews, Johnny Bag O’Donuts has always maintained that he never saw any gunmen on the Grassy Knoll, and he never saw any evidence whatsoever that either Lee Harvey Oswald or Jack Ruby worked for the US government. I keep asking him, and he keeps sticking to the same story. Mighty frustrating, I tell ya.
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Old 16th March 2020, 04:22 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by Allen773 View Post
Johnny Bag O’Donuts blew the whistle on the entire US military chain-of-command with the Pentagon Papers and also brought down Richard Nixon with the help of Deep Throat, Woodward and Bernstein, and eventually John Dean.

Johnny Bag O’Donuts also revealed the CIA and FBI abuses and illegal/unconstitutional activities in the 1970s, leading to the Church Committee, the Pike Committee, the Rockefeller Commission, the revelation of the “Family Jewels”, and the Congressional investigations into political assassinations.

Oh, and Johnny Bag O’Donuts blew the whistle on Iran-Contra, Bank of Credit and Commerce International, and various other scandals for good measure.

Yet despite repeated interviews, Johnny Bag O’Donuts has always maintained that he never saw any gunmen on the Grassy Knoll, and he never saw any evidence whatsoever that either Lee Harvey Oswald or Jack Ruby worked for the US government. I keep asking him, and he keeps sticking to the same story. Mighty frustrating, I tell ya.
Johnny Bag O'Donuts also blew the whistle on Bill Clinton porking a White House intern, at a point where Billy Boy and the intern where the only ones who knew.
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Old 16th March 2020, 07:08 PM   #22
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So the project manager for the 9/11 false flag operation has to find a large team of construction workers, engineers and demolition experts and approach them and say "Here's what we would like you to do - betray your country and murder thousands of your fellow citizens in cold blood and never tell anyone for the rest of your life. But if you don't want to be involved, just don't tell anybody that we asked you, OK?".

And hundreds, if not thousands, all reply "Sure, no problem".

I don't think so.

And they approach two airlines and say "we need you to falsify some information for us so that we can murder thousands of Americans in cold blood"

And the airlines say "Sure, any help we can give you just ask".

And in turn they say to their employees in accounts, IT, flight planning etc "Hey, here is a list of information we need you to falsify so that the Government can murder thousands of Americans in cold blood. Just don't ever tell anyone about this."

As Allen773 says in the OP, very plausible.
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Old 16th March 2020, 09:17 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by smartcooky View Post
Johnny Bag O'Donuts also blew the whistle on Bill Clinton porking a White House intern, at a point where Billy Boy and the intern where the only ones who knew.
Yet the intern, ironically, was by no means the first person to “blow the whistle” on Bill, so to speak.


I’ll show myself out.
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Old 16th March 2020, 10:47 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by Robin View Post
So the project manager for the 9/11 false flag operation has to find a large team of construction workers, engineers and demolition experts and approach them and say "Here's what we would like you to do - betray your country and murder thousands of your fellow citizens in cold blood and never tell anyone for the rest of your life. But if you don't want to be involved, just don't tell anybody that we asked you, OK?".

And hundreds, if not thousands, all reply "Sure, no problem".

I don't think so.

And they approach two airlines and say "we need you to falsify some information for us so that we can murder thousands of Americans in cold blood"

And the airlines say "Sure, any help we can give you just ask".

And in turn they say to their employees in accounts, IT, flight planning etc "Hey, here is a list of information we need you to falsify so that the Government can murder thousands of Americans in cold blood. Just don't ever tell anyone about this."

As Allen773 says in the OP, very plausible.
SECRET BLACK-OPS MEETING TRANSCRIPT:

Mr.X : The plan is to fake an attack on the US by flying four jumbo jets into specific targets.

Col. Y: What are the targets?

Mr. X: Both towers of the WTC in New York, the Pentagon, and a field somewhere in Pennsylvania.

Col. Y: Okay, what? Why crash a plane into Pennsylvania?

Mr.X: I'll get to that. Phase 1 will be the crashes, and Phase 2 will be the collapse of the buildings using controlled demolition.

Col Y: Are you nuts? Why not rig the buildings with explosives and set them off instead of flying jumbo jets into them?

Mr.X: We need a believable narrative?

Col Y: What kind of narrative?

Mr.X: We plan to invade Afghanistan and Iraq under the cover of these attacks. Those buildings need to come down.

Col Y: Why isn't crashing jets into the targets enough?

Mr X: We need the visuals, footage of the towers collapsing will be played over and over enraging the American people until they demand revenge.

Col Y: Okay. And we frame Iraqi Republican Guards and the Taliban for the attacks?

Mr.X: No, we'll frame Egyptians, Saudis, and everyone but Iraqis?

Col Y: But you said we're using the attacks as an excuse to invade Iraq and Afghanistan? Why aren't we going to frame their governments?

Mr X: Too obvious.

Col Y: But won't the American people prefer we deal with the Saudis?

Mr.X: Leave that to me.

Col Y: Okay, so we invade Iraq and Afghanistan a week after the attack, right?

Mr X: No, fool, we invade Afghanistan first because we're framing Al Qaeda.

Col Y: Why not just strike Al Qaeda now? They bombed two of our embassies and the USS Cole. Why not just fake an intelligence report that they're planning a big strike in the US and then thwack them and invade Afghanistan under that pretense?

Mr X: We need dead Americans.

Col Y: When do we invade Iraq?

Mr X: Two years later. We're going to claim that they're stockpiling WMD's.

Col Y: They don't have any WMD's. Are we going to fly in some of our chemical stockpile to plant in Iraq?

Mr X: No.

Col Y: So we're going to wire three buildings with demo charges and fly jumbo jets - not hijacked by Iraqis or Afghans - into these targets to invade two countries...because why?

Mr X: Money and control.

Col Y: My kid is at Harvard and he says the money will be in something called Social Media.

Mr X: No, war is the answer (twirls mustache).
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Old 17th March 2020, 04:56 AM   #25
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Originally Posted by Axxman300 View Post
SECRET BLACK-OPS MEETING TRANSCRIPT:

Mr.X : The plan is to fake an attack on the US by flying four jumbo jets into specific targets.

Col. Y: What are the targets?

Mr. X: Both towers of the WTC in New York, the Pentagon, and a field somewhere in Pennsylvania.

Col. Y: Okay, what? Why crash a plane into Pennsylvania?

Mr.X: I'll get to that. Phase 1 will be the crashes, and Phase 2 will be the collapse of the buildings using controlled demolition.

Col Y: Are you nuts? Why not rig the buildings with explosives and set them off instead of flying jumbo jets into them?

Mr.X: We need a believable narrative?

Col Y: What kind of narrative?

Mr.X: We plan to invade Afghanistan and Iraq under the cover of these attacks. Those buildings need to come down.

Col Y: Why isn't crashing jets into the targets enough?

Mr X: We need the visuals, footage of the towers collapsing will be played over and over enraging the American people until they demand revenge.

Col Y: Okay. And we frame Iraqi Republican Guards and the Taliban for the attacks?

Mr.X: No, we'll frame Egyptians, Saudis, and everyone but Iraqis?

Col Y: But you said we're using the attacks as an excuse to invade Iraq and Afghanistan? Why aren't we going to frame their governments?

Mr X: Too obvious.

Col Y: But won't the American people prefer we deal with the Saudis?

Mr.X: Leave that to me.

Col Y: Okay, so we invade Iraq and Afghanistan a week after the attack, right?

Mr X: No, fool, we invade Afghanistan first because we're framing Al Qaeda.

Col Y: Why not just strike Al Qaeda now? They bombed two of our embassies and the USS Cole. Why not just fake an intelligence report that they're planning a big strike in the US and then thwack them and invade Afghanistan under that pretense?

Mr X: We need dead Americans.

Col Y: When do we invade Iraq?

Mr X: Two years later. We're going to claim that they're stockpiling WMD's.

Col Y: They don't have any WMD's. Are we going to fly in some of our chemical stockpile to plant in Iraq?

Mr X: No.

Col Y: So we're going to wire three buildings with demo charges and fly jumbo jets - not hijacked by Iraqis or Afghans - into these targets to invade two countries...because why?

Mr X: Money and control.

Col Y: My kid is at Harvard and he says the money will be in something called Social Media.

Mr X: No, war is the answer (twirls mustache).
ROFLMAO
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Old 17th March 2020, 07:51 AM   #26
Leftus
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Originally Posted by Axxman300 View Post
SECRET BLACK-OPS MEETING TRANSCRIPT:

Mr.X : The plan is to fake an attack on the US by flying four jumbo jets into specific targets.

Col. Y: What are the targets?

Mr. X: Both towers of the WTC in New York, the Pentagon, and a field somewhere in Pennsylvania.

Col. Y: Okay, what? Why crash a plane into Pennsylvania?

Mr.X: I'll get to that. Phase 1 will be the crashes, and Phase 2 will be the collapse of the buildings using controlled demolition.

Col Y: Are you nuts? Why not rig the buildings with explosives and set them off instead of flying jumbo jets into them?

Mr.X: We need a believable narrative?

Col Y: What kind of narrative?

Mr.X: We plan to invade Afghanistan and Iraq under the cover of these attacks. Those buildings need to come down.

Col Y: Why isn't crashing jets into the targets enough?

Mr X: We need the visuals, footage of the towers collapsing will be played over and over enraging the American people until they demand revenge.

Col Y: Okay. And we frame Iraqi Republican Guards and the Taliban for the attacks?

Mr.X: No, we'll frame Egyptians, Saudis, and everyone but Iraqis?

Col Y: But you said we're using the attacks as an excuse to invade Iraq and Afghanistan? Why aren't we going to frame their governments?

Mr X: Too obvious.

Col Y: But won't the American people prefer we deal with the Saudis?

Mr.X: Leave that to me.

Col Y: Okay, so we invade Iraq and Afghanistan a week after the attack, right?

Mr X: No, fool, we invade Afghanistan first because we're framing Al Qaeda.

Col Y: Why not just strike Al Qaeda now? They bombed two of our embassies and the USS Cole. Why not just fake an intelligence report that they're planning a big strike in the US and then thwack them and invade Afghanistan under that pretense?

Mr X: We need dead Americans.

Col Y: When do we invade Iraq?

Mr X: Two years later. We're going to claim that they're stockpiling WMD's.

Col Y: They don't have any WMD's. Are we going to fly in some of our chemical stockpile to plant in Iraq?

Mr X: No.

Col Y: So we're going to wire three buildings with demo charges and fly jumbo jets - not hijacked by Iraqis or Afghans - into these targets to invade two countries...because why?

Mr X: Money and control.

Col Y: My kid is at Harvard and he says the money will be in something called Social Media.

Mr X: No, war is the answer (twirls mustache).
Seems legit. The major flaw in every conspiracy theory is that there were much easier ways of getting the same end goal without even really trying. Dummy up some intelligence reports, start war. Or, just start the war. Justify it later.
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Old 17th March 2020, 02:24 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by Robin View Post
So the project manager for the 9/11 false flag operation has to find a large team of construction workers, engineers and demolition experts and approach them and say "Here's what we would like you to do - betray your country and murder thousands of your fellow citizens in cold blood and never tell anyone for the rest of your life. But if you don't want to be involved, just don't tell anybody that we asked you, OK?".

And hundreds, if not thousands, all reply "Sure, no problem".

I don't think so.

And they approach two airlines and say "we need you to falsify some information for us so that we can murder thousands of Americans in cold blood"

And the airlines say "Sure, any help we can give you just ask".

And in turn they say to their employees in accounts, IT, flight planning etc "Hey, here is a list of information we need you to falsify so that the Government can murder thousands of Americans in cold blood. Just don't ever tell anyone about this."

As Allen773 says in the OP, very plausible.
You've summed up wonderfully why the whole conspiracy narrative is a non-starter for me.
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Old 17th March 2020, 03:36 PM   #28
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Originally Posted by Leftus View Post
Seems legit. The major flaw in every conspiracy theory is that there were much easier ways of getting the same end goal without even really trying. Dummy up some intelligence reports, start war. Or, just start the war. Justify it later.
Remember the No-Fly Zone? Every time Iraq shot at one of our planes it was a violation of the cease-fire agreement they sign. Clinton used a couple of attacks to blow up a bunch of stuff in Iraq while he was POTUS. Cease-Fire doesn't mean we were at peace with Iraq, it meant we'd stop shooting at them if they stopped shooting at us. We didn't 911, we didn't need WMD's, all we had to do - if the plan was to invade Iraq - was to wait until Saddam did something massively stupid...which would have come sooner or later...
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Old 18th March 2020, 09:26 AM   #29
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Originally Posted by Axxman300 View Post
Remember the No-Fly Zone? Every time Iraq shot at one of our planes it was a violation of the cease-fire agreement they sign. Clinton used a couple of attacks to blow up a bunch of stuff in Iraq while he was POTUS. Cease-Fire doesn't mean we were at peace with Iraq, it meant we'd stop shooting at them if they stopped shooting at us. We didn't 911, we didn't need WMD's, all we had to do - if the plan was to invade Iraq - was to wait until Saddam did something massively stupid...which would have come sooner or later...
Agreed. There were also things part of the cease fire, the return of Kuwait artifacts if I remember correctly, than also never happened.

Hell, we were so certain he had WMDs we didn't even bother trying to plant any. But yeah, wait or manufacture something far less complicated.


Also, people assume the outcome was the intent. Nobody thought the WTCs would collapse. So basing the theory on something not intended is wrong on multiple levels.
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Old 18th March 2020, 02:21 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robin
So the project manager for the 9/11 false flag operation has to find a large team of construction workers, engineers and demolition experts and approach them and say "Here's what we would like you to do - betray your country and murder thousands of your fellow citizens in cold blood and never tell anyone for the rest of your life. But if you don't want to be involved, just don't tell anybody that we asked you, OK?".

And hundreds, if not thousands, all reply "Sure, no problem".

I don't think so.

And they approach two airlines and say "we need you to falsify some information for us so that we can murder thousands of Americans in cold blood"

And the airlines say "Sure, any help we can give you just ask".

And in turn they say to their employees in accounts, IT, flight planning etc "Hey, here is a list of information we need you to falsify so that the Government can murder thousands of Americans in cold blood. Just don't ever tell anyone about this."

As Allen773 says in the OP, very plausible.
Originally Posted by pgimeno View Post
You've summed up wonderfully why the whole conspiracy narrative is a non-starter for me.
The solution is obvious: "They" organized the team by invading the homes of all these experts, shot the dog or whatever to prove this was no joke, threw the person to the ground, began dumping Krugerrands in front of them until the floor began to groan under the weight, then held a gun to their head and told them they could "take the gold or take the bullet".

Ever since, they get a sack of gold personally delivered to their door. It makes more sense than any other Truther explanation.
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Old 18th March 2020, 02:55 PM   #31
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The thing I love about Truthers is they clearly do no understand New Yorkers. They certainly do not understand the NYPD or the FDNY.

First off, the idea that law enforcement can act with impunity in NYC is a joke. New Yorkers will get in the face of anyone with a badge that they feel is not explaining the situation to their satisfaction. And they will do so loudly. New Yorkers don't care if you're wearing FBI or ATF windbreakers they will stop you and ask what the hell is going on and when are you moving the vans and are you going to pay my parking ticket?

New Yorkers are fun this way.

The NYPD takes guff from the citizenry but it doesn't take crap. 23 uniformed officers of the NYPD were killed on 911. 37 Port Authority Police officers were killed on 911. Nobody murders an NYPD officer and gets away with it. In fact, for some reason cop-killers in NYC are rarely taken alive. The idea that they would ignore evidence of explosives or cow to the FBI/CIA/Insert Your Evil Doer Here is not just naive, it's stupid. And yes, it is safe to assume that members of the NYPD and retired NYPD detectives quietly looked into conspiracy theories over the years because that's what they do. Had they found anything like the 911 nutjobs claim it would be front page news. All they've got is Saudi money going to Al Qaeda, and that was not really a secret.

Seriously, try to tell a New Yorker to shut up sometime.
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Old 18th March 2020, 06:00 PM   #32
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Originally Posted by Axxman300 View Post
The thing I love about Truthers is they clearly do no understand New Yorkers. They certainly do not understand the NYPD or the FDNY.
...
Seriously, try to tell a New Yorker to shut up sometime.
They also assume the absolute worst about members of the military and federal government as a whole. As someone who has been both, it's not filled with sociopaths.

Someone would have at least raised an objection by now. A polite cough? But nope, nothing. And as big as it would have to had been, someone in the group would have certainly not been sociopathic all the time. Gone back on the meds or something.
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Old 18th March 2020, 08:57 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by beachnut View Post
To think people sell their moral stand for money is called projection.

That was always my first thought when a truther threw that one out.

“Never occurred to me. Sounds like something you would do, given the opportunity”.
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Old 19th March 2020, 04:32 AM   #34
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It's that special type of compartmentalisation when no one knows what other people are doing yet simultaneously worth closely with them.
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Old 19th March 2020, 12:27 PM   #35
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A good model of a large covert operation was the F-117 Program. The plane originated with a handful of competing aircraft prototypes in the late 1970's, all of them managed to stay secret until the late 1990's. The F-117 grew out of Lockheed Skunkwork's Have Blue prototype, which first flew in 1981, and the USAF spun up an active F-117 squadron in 1983, and was able to maintain secrecy until 1988 when an accident helped force the USAF's hand and they revealed the plane's existence to the public.

The F-117 was a program which involved hundreds of people in both the military and civilian world. The planes were built in Burbank, CA, and flown out to Groom Lake, and eventually based at Tonopah, NV (still there, BTW). They were flown at night, had their own dedicated KC-135 air tankers, and everyone was sworn to secrecy which was easy because the F-117 was too cool for school.

Problem was that it wasn't entirely secret.

In the mid-1980's rumors swirled within the aviation community about the USAF flying something weird in the middle of the night out in the desert south-west. The Japanese company, Hasagawa, who makes plastic airplane model kits, featured a mysterious silver stealth aircraft shadowing an A-7 in it's box art picture. The F-117's cover story was they were a squadron of A-7's with new ELINT goodies. Somehow the Japanese put two and two together.

By 1988 the USAF was forced to go public if for no other reason than keeping the program secret was expensive. And by that time Popular Mechanics was running cover stories and the F-117 was more trouble as a secret than just another cool plane.

The lesson?

A good black-op can count on 10 years of secrecy - IF IT'S LUCKY. Even then someone always knows something's up. With the F-117 the stories were always consistent: planes flew at night, dead pilots were given cover-stories about flying A-7's, whatever it was it was out at Tonopah. This contrasts dramatically with 911 Truthers whose stories are all over the place, and to date not one has been substantiated. The only side conspiracies, such as they are, the CIA-FBI bungling and the Saudi money were known in principle on 9/12/2001, and have only been fleshed out over time.
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Old 20th March 2020, 05:53 AM   #36
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Originally Posted by Athyrio View Post
That was always my first thought when a truther threw that one out.

“Never occurred to me. Sounds like something you would do, given the opportunity”.
They’d be the first to opportune from any grift or bribe they can make from the conspiracy, yet they constantly try to present themselves as the only honest men.
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Old 20th March 2020, 06:56 AM   #37
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Originally Posted by Fonebone View Post
Betraying my country and soiling my good name.... 100 Mill US


Some would betray their country for less.
$100,000 seems pretty cheap to sell out your country and help murder thousands of people.
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Old 20th March 2020, 07:24 AM   #38
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Originally Posted by heymatto70 View Post
$100,000 seems pretty cheap to sell out your country and help murder thousands of people.



[excerpt]
The Coinage Act of 1792 established the dime (spelled "disme" in the legislation), cent, and mill as
subdivisions of the dollar equal to ​1⁄10, ​1⁄100 and ​1⁄1000 dollar respectively.
The first known proposal for a decimal-based coinage system in the United States was made in 1783....[/excerpt]


One hundred MILL equals ten cents US
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Old 20th March 2020, 08:24 AM   #39
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Originally Posted by Fonebone View Post
[excerpt]
The Coinage Act of 1792 established the dime (spelled "disme" in the legislation), cent, and mill as
subdivisions of the dollar equal to ​1⁄10, ​1⁄100 and ​1⁄1000 dollar respectively.
The first known proposal for a decimal-based coinage system in the United States was made in 1783....[/excerpt]


One hundred MILL equals ten cents US
Wait, so you are saying you would betray your country and soil your good name for 10 cents?
Is this your explanation for the question in the OP? That everyone is as cheap, cynical and self-hating as you?
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Old 20th March 2020, 11:15 AM   #40
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I for one am quite confident in the US government’s ability to coordinate large operations, as evidenced by the response to the Coronavirus pandemic.
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