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1st April 2016, 02:12 AM | #201 |
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It's the first post in a series of posts on the subject over five pages He's long been banned, and is therefore fair game as long as one stays within forum rules. (Your personal attacks on currently active members (and moderators) of the forum are a different matter) |
1st April 2016, 02:19 AM | #202 |
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So much dishonesty from FF - it's a truther trait afterall. The question has been answered and the the original justification from the fire department shown, so why continue? You know he's just going to shut his eyes, stick his fingers in his ears and shout lalalala, whist posting single line rubbish. I doubt he's older than 15.
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1st April 2016, 02:23 AM | #203 |
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It is April the first, perhaps he's building up to a big Lol/Gotcha moment.
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1st April 2016, 02:25 AM | #204 |
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1st April 2016, 02:26 AM | #205 |
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1st April 2016, 02:29 AM | #206 |
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1st April 2016, 02:31 AM | #207 |
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1st April 2016, 02:37 AM | #208 |
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Evidence would suggest otherwise. Your post count is huge for the time frame and 99% of it is utter drivel and demonstrates that you have zero educational qualifications to discuss the matters at hand and a complete unwillingness to learn from those that do possess them.
Heck, you couldn't even find the information regarding your OP even though it's been in the public domain for a decade. This is why we laugh at truthers, you're all perfect examples of the Dunning-Kruger effect. No self awareness at all. |
1st April 2016, 03:00 AM | #209 |
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Thanks for the suggestion, but I'm happy to see how the scenario pans out across multiple existing threads. Regarding the topic, did you have any thoughts about this: I feel it demonstrates a degree of even-handedness in its refusal to grant access, no? |
1st April 2016, 05:14 AM | #210 |
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Sabrina - That's not enough to protect privacy because (list of reasons).
OP - (ignores it) Oystein - In the court case the FD provided three reasons, of which privacy was only one: (list of reasons). OP - (ignores the other two). IOW: OP - (claims victory after completely ignoring the reasons given) |
1st April 2016, 05:22 AM | #211 |
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False Flag, your answer basically boils down to "I don't know".
Now, given that most of the information has now been released, can you yourself think of any reason why TPTB would want to hide it? If the reason was for secrecy not privacy, has anything come to light that you think is significant? I myself cannot see how anything in those transcripts adds to the overall story of what happened on that tragic day. No smoking guns of government involvement, no sign of a cover-up. Beyond a rather ghoulish desire to pore over the personal, often heartbreaking reactions of those caught up in the events, I see no good reason to need to know this. |
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1st April 2016, 06:15 AM | #212 |
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Exactly how big do I have to make my text before FF finally acknowledges it?
This big? This big? Ah heck with it; I'll go for broke. *ahem* THE ANONYMITY OF THE FIRST RESPONDERS WOULD NOT BE PROTECTED SIMPLY BY REDACTING THE NAMES IN THEIR TESTIMONY, BECAUSE ONE CAN EASILY INFER WHO THEY ARE FROM THE WRITTEN ACCOUNTS WE HAVE OF FIRST RESPONDERS THAT INDICATE WHERE THEY WERE AND WHAT THEY WERE DOING AT PARTICULAR TIMES. GIVEN THIS, IT BECOMES IMPOSSIBLE TO "ANONYMIZE" THE TESTIMONIES OF THE FIRST RESPONDERS AND THEREFORE THEIR PRIVACY WOULD BE VIOLATED EASILY BY TRUTHERS WANTING TO CONFRONT THEM FOR RIDICULOUS REASONS. Apologies for yelling, but at this point I'm fairly confident that FF is going to ignore my response to his "anonymity" defense if I don't. |
1st April 2016, 06:30 AM | #213 |
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1st April 2016, 06:36 AM | #214 |
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1st April 2016, 06:43 AM | #215 |
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1st April 2016, 06:49 AM | #216 |
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To the bold. One would guess from this statement you are a lawyer knowing all of the legal concerns lawyers might have allowing public disclosure before the trials. Are you a lawyer? Perhaps the families of the victims requested those calls be kept private for a period of time. I'm guessing you weren't personally involved with 9/11 and because of that non involvement I gather you don't really know what transpired within the court system do you. with that in mind all you are doing is creating a narrative that easily explains the frighteningly chaotic events of recent history. An article for you. http://www.ibtimes.com/911-conspirac...-break-2091474
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1st April 2016, 06:59 AM | #217 |
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The simple truth is there are people and groups and political organizations on this planet that hate everything about the USA and much of western societies values and would do what they can to disrupt to the point of destroying it and them. As a matter of fact they seek to destroy any persons or states that don't agree with their particular political or religious values.
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1st April 2016, 07:06 AM | #218 |
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1st April 2016, 08:24 AM | #219 |
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1st April 2016, 09:02 AM | #220 |
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Or paying so little attention to them that you end up arguing with someone who is doing his damnedest to agree with you-
That was some pretty funny stuff right there; Malbec a skeptic, uh huh |
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1st April 2016, 09:09 AM | #221 |
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But phrased as "secrecy! They're hiding something!"- as with creationists who yammer "goddidit!" as their counter to the TOE, an answer that boils down to no answer at all, just a substitute for one. It's turtles all the way down in either case, a bottomless resource for incredulity.
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I'm tired of the bombs, tired of the bullets, tired of the crazies on TV; I'm the aviator, a dream's a dream whatever it seems Deep Purple- "The Aviator" Life was a short shelf that came with bookends- Stephen King |
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1st April 2016, 09:25 AM | #222 |
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1st April 2016, 05:10 PM | #223 |
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Quote:
The possible benefits to Truthers are enormous, while the only costs would be being stripped of their delusions. But I've suggested to many a Truther that they do such interviews, and they all reacted like Count Dracula being offered a bowl of garlic soup, a holy water cocktail, and a crucifix. Why is that? |
1st April 2016, 07:14 PM | #224 |
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Here's your primary mistake: You're late to the game.
There are volumes of threads on this forum that you clearly have not bothered to read, or have read and do not comprehend. You start threads with ancient and weather-worn arguments that have largely been resolved, or in the case of structural failures - you do not understand. Your other problem is your screen name, it indicates that you have come here looking to troll the board, not seek answers. And you willingly live down to your name with your attitude. You know nothing about the United States, and less about New York City. Worse, you don't care that you lack knowledge, and that has lead you to start this thread. In the years right after the attack there was a lot of issues to be resolved in New York surrounding the dead and the injured. Lawyers were out in force for the city, the unions, the WTC tenants, insurance companies for the WTC & neighboring buildings. Then you had investigations by NYC, NY State, and a host of Federal Agencies lead by the FBI, but there were a half-dozen others too. I don't know what things are like in your country, but when you have a large army of lawyers and investigators crawling through your city and your files everybody covers their backsides. Like I said before, you clearly know nothing about the United States because while you're so hung up on the mythical powers of the US government you fail to understand just how unpleasant they can actually make your life while an investigation is underway - even when you are innocent. So the fact that New York City was over cautious about releasing the oral histories is not a surprise to any Americans...even Truthers... |
1st April 2016, 09:27 PM | #225 |
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It should be pointed out that the USA is a particularly litigious place. Privacy and individual rights were of paramount concern to the public. It is prudent for the FDNY to have been very guarded about public release of personal histories and the last words of 911 callers, until a court had cleared it.
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1st April 2016, 10:06 PM | #226 |
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This is your opinion and nothing more.
Quote:
Quote:
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1st April 2016, 10:08 PM | #227 |
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1st April 2016, 10:09 PM | #228 |
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1st April 2016, 10:10 PM | #229 |
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I am not going to speculate on a reason. You skeptics are drooling over this, just so you will have something to argue against. I'm not playing your game.
The release of the oral histories was blocked, and a court had to intervene and order their release. That is the issue. |
1st April 2016, 10:22 PM | #230 |
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I had no idea this forum had a "temper tantrum" font. Thanks for letting me know about it.
For the sake of argument, I am going to copy and paste the entire oral history of a first responder. It is the very first one on the list. I have not chosen it because of the contents. It's just the first on the page, so I wanted to start there. It does not matter what oral history is chosen, the same technique can apply to all of them. Here is a link to the oral history collection - http://graphics8.nytimes.com/package...s_full_01.html Here is a link to the very first oral history in the collection (alphabetically) - http://graphics8.nytimes.com/package...IC/9110071.PDF
Quote:
Secrecy has no place in a democracy. If you want secrecy in your government, please consider moving to North Korea. |
1st April 2016, 10:23 PM | #231 |
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1st April 2016, 10:27 PM | #232 |
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This is funny. Are you a lawyer? Even if you were, it's not relevant to this thread.
9/11 was the worst attack on America in the 21st century. I don't give a damn about the privacy of the families, when that excuse can be misused to withhold information that the survivors might need to understand what happened. The security of 310 million Americans far outweighs the needs of the families. Period. Again, privacy could have been addressed through anonymity. Stop using it as an excuse to support secrecy. If you want to live in a society where secrecy is OK, move to Russia or North Korea. As an American, I will not accept your BS arguments over this issue. |
1st April 2016, 10:32 PM | #233 |
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If you blindly trust your government, you are too far gone to help.
The oral histories should never have been blocked. There should have been an immediate public discussion about how to handle the privacy issue(s). Where privacy was a major, legitimate concern, personal information could have been redacted before releasing the information to the general public. Under no circumstances whatsoever should any information have been withheld from any government agency or investigative body. The information should have been released to these agencies as soon as it was created, so that a thorough, proper investigation could have happened. |
1st April 2016, 10:33 PM | #234 |
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1st April 2016, 10:34 PM | #235 |
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1st April 2016, 10:39 PM | #236 |
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If you have nothing to hide, then you have no reason to block the release of anything.
What you are really saying is that the people responsible for this knew there was damning information in the oral histories, so they did everything they could to block the release as long as possible so they could settle the lawsuits and pay the claims before the information became available. I'm not saying this, you are. And don't ever question the fact that I am an American. Don't even go there. |
1st April 2016, 10:40 PM | #237 |
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1st April 2016, 10:46 PM | #238 |
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He's not saying that. JDH is Canadian and I'm (English born) Aussie. And we are both obviously more familiar with the founding principles of the US Constitution than you seem to be from the nonsense you post.
Start with the Preamble "We the people....." ...come back when you can tell us what is wrong with your post. |
1st April 2016, 11:05 PM | #239 |
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1st April 2016, 11:25 PM | #240 |
Now. Do it now.
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