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Old 10th November 2010, 05:13 AM   #81
Garrette
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Originally Posted by Dancing David View Post
How are you assigning these probabilities.
Quoted because I asked mushy a similar question earlier. A question that remains unanswered as does pretty much every comment addressed to him.

Mushy?
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Old 10th November 2010, 05:14 AM   #82
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Originally Posted by mushy View Post
I never said my theory was correct. I said it was plausable.
Yes, the theory that you did not present? Almost any thing is plausible, again we are here to deal with what is probable.

So which post exactly was your theory presented in?
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Old 10th November 2010, 05:16 AM   #83
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Originally Posted by mushy View Post
Well, i know i posted about this on other forums a year ago or more. But you don't have to believe that. I don't discard hypothermia as reason for them dying. I discard it as an explination for them cutting the tent open and running down the mountain with no clothes on. (I provided a better explination for this already.)
Um, we are not reading other forums, so where is the data that they cut open the tent and ran away naked. We need the data, then we look at alternatives, confounding factors and likely hoods.
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Old 10th November 2010, 05:18 AM   #84
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Originally Posted by mushy View Post
Also its good to know where you stand Apology. Apprently there is no need to discuss anything over 50 years old. I'll get on the phone to the science community and tell them to stop worrying about the big bang. Over 50 years ago and no eyewitnesses? Leave it!?
The evidence that is explained by the theory of the big bang is still all a round us, your ignorance of the history of the hubble constant could be remedied.
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Old 10th November 2010, 05:29 AM   #85
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Originally Posted by Garrette View Post
Thanks, jharyn. I'll read that when I get a chance. Two comments based on your quotations from the link, though:

1. An avalanche would not have had to sweep the hikers 1.5 kilometers into the ravine if those people were not at the tent. The party need not have remained together; those hikers could have been very near the ravine already.

2. Expertise in skiing is not a guarantee against mistakes or being caught in an avalanche. Experts make mistakes all the time, especially when the phenomenon in question is not perfectly predictable.
I agree with both points made. No way to prove or disprove the first point unless big brother releases the satellite pictures that I'm sure they have. (LOL)
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Old 10th November 2010, 05:32 AM   #86
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Originally Posted by jharyn View Post
I agree with both points made. No way to prove or disprove the first point unless big brother releases the satellite pictures that I'm sure they have. (LOL)
ETA: No way to prove/disprove that I can think of at the moment anyway.
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Old 10th November 2010, 06:03 AM   #87
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Originally Posted by mushy View Post
No. Again you all miss the point. Just because something is technically plausable you accept it as long as it agrees with the skeptic viewpoints... i.e its not paranormal. Even if the scenario is so absurd that is only has a 100000 in one chance of happening.

Your suggestion that hypothermia explains their behaviour is crazy. Just because there is a tiny chance that it might happen. You ignore the obvious just because i suggested it.
Mushy- Have you ever been in a situation where anyone experienced severe (life threatening) levels of hypothermia?
I have.
Imagine someone very drunk, floundering in a melting snowdrift. They act just like that.

I have never actually seen anyone strip off, I suspect because their hands were too cold to achieve that. But I have seen someone discard a backpack he absolutely needed, because it was "annoying" him. In a blizzard. In Scotland.
Temperature at the time was actually above zero, if you ignored wind chill. This was less than three hours after leaving a warm car. ie the conditions were far, far milder than what can happen in winter in the Urals. It does not surprise me at all that people several days into a trip like this might act irrationally.

If you choose to think I'm accepting any solution , no matter how unlikely, so long as it fits with rationality, you are dead right. That's precisely what I will continue to do until I see a reason to think irrationally.
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Old 10th November 2010, 06:14 AM   #88
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I've read jharyn's link now, and it is well presented though without references. The analysis seems rational enough, and I lean a little more to the idea of "no avalanche" after reading it, but it isn't conclusive by any means.

Most disappointing is the supposition without explanation of infrasound as the culprit.

Absent that explanation, I think hypothermia can still account for the whole incident, even without avalanche. The link explains the injuries being consistent with a fall from a height similar to that of the ravine the injured bodies were found in.

Most of all, it goes back to saying "we don't know, but there is absolutely zero reason to assume anything paranormal" (and, yes, I know mushy wasn't proposing anything paranormal).

But it also gets to the idea that there isn't really a mystery here unless you mean a mystery on exactly the same order of the occasional mystery that occurs in my house when I ask myself "How did my keys get here?"
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Old 10th November 2010, 07:18 AM   #89
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I prefer references as well and would like there to be a more thorough explanation of infrasound and possible causes in the area at the time. I was attempting to find a plausible reason for the team leaving the tent the way they did because that is the mystery here.

Another mystery that may or may not be related is why the remaining members, after several companions died horrible deaths, traveled away from the campsite. That one puzzles me although hypothermia disorientation is plausible and is an explanation that I accept as the most probable.
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Old 10th November 2010, 07:28 AM   #90
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The most plausable explanation is an avalance. Not infrasound mind****
Mod WarningBreach of rule 10 removed.
Posted By:Cuddles

Last edited by Cuddles; 10th November 2010 at 07:51 AM.
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Old 10th November 2010, 07:50 AM   #91
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Originally Posted by mushy View Post
The most plausable explanation is an avalance. Not infrasound mind****
Edited by Cuddles:  Edited quote of moderated post.

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.
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Old 10th November 2010, 08:13 AM   #92
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Originally Posted by mushy View Post
The most plausable explanation is an avalance. Not infrasound mind****
Mod WarningBreach of rule 10 removed.
Posted By:Cuddles
No. Avalanche is among the plausible explanations. Whether it is more or less plausible than just hypothermia is up for debate, and assuming jharyn's link is correct (it well may not be) then hypothermia alone is first.

But I'm not going to push for that because We Don't Know. Just like You Don't Know.

Mushy, are you going to tell us how you know they cut the tent open from the inside and ran away?

Any idea when you will get the Russian links for me?
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Old 10th November 2010, 08:35 AM   #93
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Originally Posted by jharyn View Post
I agree with both points made. No way to prove or disprove the first point unless big brother releases the satellite pictures that I'm sure they have. (LOL)
If you are serious:

ROFLMAO!

What makes you think they would have had a sattelite camera pointed at that area at that time, especially 1959?
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Old 10th November 2010, 08:37 AM   #94
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Hmmmm. I think the biggest mistake you're all making is not agreeing with mushy. I think all mushy wanted - and expects - is that you all simply agree with whatever he says; do not attempt to think for yourselves or question him; and certainly do not attempt to provide any evidence to the contrary of any claims he makes, or opinions he states.

Remember; you and your opinions and facts are not important - only mushy is important. Easy mistake to make.
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Old 10th November 2010, 08:42 AM   #95
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Originally Posted by Dancing David View Post
If you are serious:

ROFLMAO!

What makes you think they would have had a sattelite camera pointed at that area at that time, especially 1959?
You obviously know what 'ROFLMAO' means; this would logically suggest that you know what 'LOL' means, and the implications of it being used by jharyn in his/her post.

(Quick clue - jharyn wasn't being serious.)
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Old 10th November 2010, 08:49 AM   #96
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Originally Posted by mushy View Post
Also its good to know where you stand Apology. Apprently there is no need to discuss anything over 50 years old. I'll get on the phone to the science community and tell them to stop worrying about the big bang. Over 50 years ago and no eyewitnesses? Leave it!?
The strawmen didit.
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Old 10th November 2010, 09:10 AM   #97
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Originally Posted by mushy View Post
They cut their tent open from inside to calmly walk out?
Maybe the zipper was frozen.
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Old 10th November 2010, 10:19 AM   #98
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Originally Posted by Dancing David View Post
If you are serious:

ROFLMAO!

What makes you think they would have had a sattelite camera pointed at that area at that time, especially 1959?

LOL - Laugh Out Loud , indicates a joke.

It was sarcasm. But with some of the people on this forum, I understand your comment.
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Old 10th November 2010, 10:38 AM   #99
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I am still looking for an actual study and the results on infrasound, but have not found anything official yet. I am on limited free time today.

But what I was trying to say is that the infrasound caused them to perceive an avalanche and react to it with understandable fear as if there was one. The site I posted says that the investigation showed no sign of an avalanche and the area was not known for them. But they have not posted (that I can find anywhere) the report that they refer to numerous times. So just another possibility on the list. One that I find interesting though.

There are some documents in Russian but I cannot read them and have no idea what they are.
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Old 10th November 2010, 12:15 PM   #100
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Originally Posted by Soapy Sam View Post
Mushy- Have you ever been in a situation where anyone experienced severe (life threatening) levels of hypothermia?
I have.
Interesting Soapy Sam...
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Old 10th November 2010, 12:54 PM   #101
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Originally Posted by SatansMaleVoiceChoir View Post
You obviously know what 'ROFLMAO' means; this would logically suggest that you know what 'LOL' means, and the implications of it being used by jharyn in his/her post.

(Quick clue - jharyn wasn't being serious.)
That is why I put the 'If you are serious', but then I may have been in the wrong state of mind.
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Old 10th November 2010, 12:55 PM   #102
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Originally Posted by jharyn View Post
LOL - Laugh Out Loud , indicates a joke.

It was sarcasm. But with some of the people on this forum, I understand your comment.
Sorry, I need a reset. Too many reads in Politics.
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Old 10th November 2010, 01:29 PM   #103
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Originally Posted by Dancing David View Post
Sorry, I need a reset. Too many reads in Politics.
And I forgot the nature of these forms. It's all good.
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Old 10th November 2010, 02:42 PM   #104
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Originally Posted by jharyn View Post
There are some documents in Russian but I cannot read them and have no idea what they are.
The Wiki cites several but links to none. However, I'm not interested in doing full blown research on the incident itself but on a tangential issue that mushy brought up -- that of the reported orange spheres in the sky. He says he read some Russian documents discounting any military explanation for those and agreed to provide those documents (references, links, what-have-you) when I asked.
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Old 11th November 2010, 06:22 AM   #105
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FYI: Mushy has now declined in another thread to provide the Russian documents he claims to have reviewed. His reason is that they are in hard copy only and in Russian, and he does not want to type them into his computer.

I said I would be satisfied with just the citation information in either Russian or English. He declined to respond.

Since it was a derail in the other thread (which mushy declared on his own was "over" and suggested I stop posting there, even when on topic), I will repost it here.

Mushy: You do not need to type the entire documents into the computer. I offer you three options:

1. Scan the documents and email them to me.

2. Scan just the pages with the publication information and email them to me.

3. Retype just the pages (in either Russian or English) with the publication information and post it here.

That should not be difficult.

What do you say?
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Old 11th November 2010, 06:38 AM   #106
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1 / 2 : I don't have a scanner.
3) No, i'm not going to retype 13 block pages of russian because you don't want to do your own research.
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Old 11th November 2010, 06:42 AM   #107
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Originally Posted by mushy View Post
1 / 2 : I don't have a scanner.
3) No, i'm not going to retype 13 block pages of russian because you don't want to do your own research.
Just the publication information, mushy. Just one of your papers if you won't do them all.

And regarding your attempted slur, it is quite apparent to readers of this thread which of us actually does research.
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Old 11th November 2010, 06:48 AM   #108
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It is an interesting story. It is a mystery. It's just not a mystery I care about. What really happened in Dyalovs Pass on February 2, 1959? I don't know and I don't care.

What really happened in Old Farmer Johnson's barn on July 19, 1974? Did Jimmy Swain forget to put the shovel away or did the cow knock it down? Someone reported seeing an orange goose in the area that day. It's a mystery.
I don't know and I don't care.
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Old 11th November 2010, 06:49 AM   #109
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Originally Posted by Garrette View Post
Just the publication information, mushy. Just one of your papers if you won't do them all.

And regarding your attempted slur, it is quite apparent to readers of this thread which of us actually does research.
Garrette, you might want to check this site out for further info, before wasting too much time.
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Old 11th November 2010, 06:54 AM   #110
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Thanks, Guybrush. Most interesting.

So I was correct but incomplete in another thread when I said mushy is either a poor troll or a sadly deluded person.

The bit I left out is that he is also a liar.
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Old 11th November 2010, 09:44 AM   #111
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Originally Posted by Guybrush Threepwood View Post
Garrette, you might want to check this site out for further info, before wasting too much time.
Originally Posted by Garrette View Post
Thanks, Guybrush. Most interesting.

So I was correct but incomplete in another thread when I said mushy is either a poor troll or a sadly deluded person.

The bit I left out is that he is also a liar.
And apparently---oddly misshapen although you can't believe everything you read on the internet, I so badly want to believe what Threepwood linked is true, help me people.
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Old 11th November 2010, 10:28 AM   #112
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Lest anyone think I am being too harsh on mushy:

Mushy said he had verified, through his research, that the orange spheres reported at the time of the incident were not of military origin.

I said it was a shame he could not share those sources. He then said this:

Originally Posted by mushy View Post
Gar, I am in work now. I will try to find the sites i got the info from later. However you will have to translate them yourself. I work with alot of interpreters because i deal with alot of foreign nationals. I got them to help me translate the russian.
I said that Russian would be fine.

He did not provide those sources despite repeated requests, nor did he tell me when he would provide those sources despite repeated requests.

On another thread he started, I asked again, at which point he said he wasn't going to do it. I moved it back to this thread and now you see what has happened.

Here's my take: mushy didn't actually research this at all and has no Russian sources he used to discount military explanations for the orange spheres. He simply didn't count on someone being okay with Russian sources. In short, I called his bluff, and he ran.

I could be wrong, but mushy would have to provide the information to demonstrate it. He won't because he can't.

ETA: And I didn't even notice until after posting this that mushy changed from getting his info from Russian web sites to having actual Russian documents at his house.

Shame on me for missing that clear sign of outright lying.
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Old 11th November 2010, 10:41 AM   #113
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Originally Posted by Garrette View Post
Lest anyone think I am being too harsh on mushy:
No one's going to think that.
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Old 11th November 2010, 10:47 AM   #114
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Originally Posted by mushy View Post
1 / 2 : I don't have a scanner.
3) No, i'm not going to retype 13 block pages of russian because you don't want to do your own research.
So just give the publication citations, that should be a very small amount, title, author, publication, publication date.
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Old 30th June 2020, 07:38 PM   #115
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And now, 10 years later.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dyatlov_Pass_incident

I see that this was looked into about 10 years ago, but I missed it, only reading about the incident on another forum today.

I am hoping someone not already sick of the subject, could give me any idea if the past years have altered opinions or open other possibilities?
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Old 30th June 2020, 08:04 PM   #116
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"[shemp is] a most notable coward, an infinite and endless liar, an hourly promise breaker, the owner of no one good quality." - Shakespeare
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Old 30th June 2020, 11:32 PM   #117
dann
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A radioactive Bigfoot pack.
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/dann
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"The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is required for their real happiness. The demand to give up the illusion about its condition is the demand to give up a condition which needs illusions." K. Marx
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Old 1st July 2020, 12:43 AM   #118
EHocking
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Originally Posted by dann View Post
A radioactive Bigfoot pack.
There is no evidence that the bigfoots were radioactive.
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Old 1st July 2020, 04:18 AM   #119
Gord_in_Toronto
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Originally Posted by EHocking View Post
There is no evidence that the bigfoots were radioactive.
So you say. Go ahead, prove they are not!
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Old 1st July 2020, 04:29 AM   #120
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dup post. My bad.
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