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Old 30th June 2019, 04:02 AM   #1
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Trump official behind fake Biden web site

https://mobile.twitter.com/SethAbram...92125639368704

The best people.
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Old 30th June 2019, 04:29 AM   #2
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So this is the new angle, "Metoo stories about Biden are due to RUSSIAN BOTS!"
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Old 30th June 2019, 04:44 AM   #3
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It's a Trump campaign official - completely innocent.

They also have websites for all the other D candidates.
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Old 30th June 2019, 05:12 AM   #4
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Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza View Post
It's a Trump campaign official
Should've put that in the thread title.
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Old 30th June 2019, 08:13 AM   #5
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Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza View Post
It's a Trump campaign official - completely innocent.
Not sure if you're being sarcastic, unless I'm mistaken about some part of this. Isn't the issue that it's a fake site that tries to appear like an official Biden site?
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Old 30th June 2019, 09:02 AM   #6
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Originally Posted by Safe-Keeper View Post
Not sure if you're being sarcastic, unless I'm mistaken about some part of this. Isn't the issue that it's a fake site that tries to appear like an official Biden site?
Not the worst idea. Are there any of these targeting Trump?
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Old 30th June 2019, 08:55 PM   #7
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Same article:

Quote:
It is buyer beware, and not just for unwitting Democrats. In 2017, a group of Democrats took a page out of the Russian playbook and posed as conservatives to try to divide Republicans in Alabama’s special Senate election, a race narrowly won by a Democrat. And as the 2020 campaign gets underway, election experts say they see signs that Americans from both sides of the political divide are getting ready to do the same.
https://joebiden.info

Y'all really think this looks like a Biden website? Photos of his creepy touching and sniffing of girls? Give me a break.

These stories sound so bad until you actually bother to look at what is being talked about.
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Old 30th June 2019, 08:56 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by Safe-Keeper View Post
Not sure if you're being sarcastic, unless I'm mistaken about some part of this. Isn't the issue that it's a fake site that tries to appear like an official Biden site?
It looks nothing like a Biden site, see for yourself.

https://joebiden.info
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Old 30th June 2019, 10:30 PM   #9
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Originally Posted by Safe-Keeper View Post
It's deceptive, yes, but not big news. Campaign organizations do this all the time. I don't go for "buyer beware" and would support having some way of forcing the sponsors name and pedigree onto the top of the first page, but it appears that they succeeded in their "plausible deniability" efforts.

I've seen much worse examples.

I supposed it can be argued that the Trump campaign's concern - the not-real-bright blue collar brigade who fell for Trump's crap are the most likely to fall for something like this, but that would be disrespecting the deplorables and we're not supposed to do that, I guess.
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Old 30th June 2019, 10:32 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by Safe-Keeper View Post
Not sure if you're being sarcastic, unless I'm mistaken about some part of this. Isn't the issue that it's a fake site that tries to appear like an official Biden site?
I'm pretty sure it was sarcasm. Donnie's used the "campaign worker" dodge to try to distance himself from his swamp-dwelling staff quite a few times.
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Old 30th June 2019, 10:59 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by NWO Sentryman View Post
So this is the new angle, "Metoo stories about Biden are due to RUSSIAN BOTS!"

"Website featuring creepy Joe Biden is run by Trump consultant." So close!!
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Old 30th June 2019, 11:57 PM   #12
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The plan is to divert google searches away from the legit Candidate site to a fake, derogatory one.
How accurate or defamatory these are is secondary: every click that goes to the wrong page hurts the candidate.

It's a very despicable tacit, but not new.
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Old 1st July 2019, 12:01 AM   #13
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Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza View Post
The plan is to divert google searches away from the legit Candidate site to a fake, derogatory one.
How accurate or defamatory these are is secondary: every click that goes to the wrong page hurts the candidate.

It's a very despicable tacit, but not new.
Aren't there rules for the website providers against this sort of thing? And the URL registrations?

If so, should be easy enough to have it taken down. Or better still, pointed at the legit website.
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Old 1st July 2019, 02:06 AM   #14
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If it's clearly labeled as parody on the site, I don't think it's illegal, nor should it be.

If it's not clearly labeled, it should be illegal.
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Old 1st July 2019, 03:18 AM   #15
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Originally Posted by uke2se View Post
If it's clearly labeled as parody on the site, I don't think it's illegal, nor should it be.

If it's not clearly labeled, it should be illegal.
Tiny font down the bottom of a very long page. So not clearly labelled, no.
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Old 1st July 2019, 03:41 AM   #16
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Biden is failing fine all by himself, no help is needed
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Old 1st July 2019, 03:52 AM   #17
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Originally Posted by Norman Alexander View Post
Tiny font down the bottom of a very long page. So not clearly labelled, no.
Up to lawyers to lawyer about, I suppose.

Don't get upset about this. Get even.
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Old 1st July 2019, 04:03 AM   #18
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Originally Posted by applecorped View Post
Biden is failing fine all by himself, no help is needed
Perhaps you should advise the Trump campaign about this, since they clearly don't know what you do.
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Old 1st July 2019, 04:24 AM   #19
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If I was motivated enough, I'd set up a Poe-Trump website and sell KAG-swag, invitations to places where Ivanka stuff is sold and plenty of others ways to make the nutters give their money to me instead.
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Old 1st July 2019, 04:51 AM   #20
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Other than the actual url, the whole thing looks very transparently like a parody site. Pretty well done, I thought.

Last edited by Civet; 1st July 2019 at 04:52 AM.
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Old 1st July 2019, 06:14 AM   #21
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Originally Posted by Norman Alexander View Post
Aren't there rules for the website providers against this sort of thing? And the URL registrations?

If so, should be easy enough to have it taken down. Or better still, pointed at the legit website.
As long as the URL isn't taken you can have pretty much anything you want as your URL. There's a hosting service that'll host pretty much everything.
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Old 1st July 2019, 07:17 AM   #22
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I'm still trying to figure out what Trump organization this guy is an officer in.
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Old 1st July 2019, 09:46 AM   #23
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By "Trump Official" you mean "Republican consulting agency guy" I guess?
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Old 1st July 2019, 09:56 AM   #24
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Originally Posted by carlitos View Post
By "Trump Official" you mean "Republican consulting agency guy" I guess?
hired and paid by Trump campaign...

... or are you suggesting that they would be doing that on their own without compensation?
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Old 1st July 2019, 10:10 AM   #25
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Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza View Post
hired and paid by Trump campaign...

... or are you suggesting that they would be doing that on their own without compensation?
I'm suggesting that the words "Trump official" mean something. No one, anywhere is calling this guy a "Trump official" except for this topic on this forum. Maybe the OP can ask for the title to be edited.
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Old 1st July 2019, 10:16 AM   #26
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Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza View Post
hired and paid by Trump campaign...

... or are you suggesting that they would be doing that on their own without compensation?
Is everyone who contracts with an organization an official in that organization?

What *is* the official Trump campaign organization, anyway? Who are its officers? Where is it headquartered (some Trump property, no doubt)? Etc.

---

Hell, I'm a full-time employee of an organization. Nobody in their right mind would call me an official in this org.
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Old 1st July 2019, 10:19 AM   #27
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Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza View Post
hired and paid by Trump campaign...

... or are you suggesting that they would be doing that on their own without compensation?
I'm not saying it's happening in this case, but from time to time private citizens do in fact spend their own resources to put out a political message, without actually being hired by any politician to do so.
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Old 1st July 2019, 10:27 AM   #28
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I was the first to point out that this was a Trump Campaign project, not a White House one.
But someone "official" in the Trump campaign must have agreed to this and keeps signing the cheques.
So I see nothing wrong with calling this a "Trump campaign official" project.
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Old 1st July 2019, 10:37 AM   #29
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Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza View Post
I was the first to point out that this was a Trump Campaign project, not a White House one.
But someone "official" in the Trump campaign must have agreed to this and keeps signing the cheques.
So I see nothing wrong with calling this a "Trump campaign official" project.
Are you sure about all this? I mean, it's plausible. It's just as plausible that someone skilled in the art shelled out some of his own time and money, hobbyist-style, to make a parody website using the skills and tools he was already well familiar with.

Someone in the Trump Campaign ordered it and is paying for it? That's a claim that requires more evidence. Or maybe not. This wouldn't be the first time political partisans have indicted each other on nothing more than innuendo, circumstance, and their own partisan bias.

Hell, there's a lot more evidence that Hillary Clinton committed crimes, and the State Department and DOJ suppressed them, than there is that this guy actually got paid by the Trump Campaign for this site.

Not that it matters much to me. I'm not seeing a big problem here either way. I'm more interested in the epistemological question, and how it interacts with our partisan biases in debate.

You want people to believe this is an official Trump campaign website. You want me to admit that it's an official Trump campaign website. The partisan in me says, of course you want that, but can you prove it? The contrarian in me says you can claim this stuff all you want, but until you bring evidence, it didn't happen.

---

In before, "you're just defending Dear Leader because of how racist you are!" and assorted other deranged crap.
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Old 1st July 2019, 10:38 AM   #30
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Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza View Post
So I see nothing wrong with calling this a "Trump campaign official" project.
The only thing I see wrong with this is that you've failed to actually identify a Trump campaign official that's involved with this project.
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Old 1st July 2019, 10:41 AM   #31
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Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza View Post
I was the first to point out that this was a Trump Campaign project, not a White House one.
But someone "official" in the Trump campaign must have agreed to this and keeps signing the cheques.
So I see nothing wrong with calling this a "Trump campaign official" project.
You are here defending this using your time and money, so I'm comfortable calling you a "Democrat campaign official."
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Old 1st July 2019, 10:59 AM   #32
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Originally Posted by carlitos View Post
You are here defending this using your time and money, so I'm comfortable calling you a "Democrat campaign official."
That's not quite fair.

Nobody is disputing that the guy in question has gotten or is getting a paycheck for work he's done at the request of the Trump campaign. That actually creates some clear dots to connect, that aren't present in TGZ's own body of work.

It's still connecting the dots, though.
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Old 1st July 2019, 11:08 AM   #33
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Originally Posted by carlitos View Post
By "Trump Official" you mean "Republican consulting agency guy" I guess?
When you don't have much of a reply, nitpick something.

From the OP link:
Quote:
Patrick Mauldin—who, per the NEW YORK TIMES, "makes videos and other digital content for President’s Trump’s re-election campaign. Together with his brother Ryan, Mr. Mauldin also runs Vici Media Group." Yet the "Biden" website hid its creator's identity.
Business Insider: A Trump campaign consultant is reportedly making fake websites for Democratic candidates — and it's working
Quote:
A digital consultant for President Donald Trump's 2020 re-election campaign used his spare time to create fake campaign websites for top Democratic candidates, The New York Times reported Saturday.

The consultant, Patrick Mauldin, runs a Republican political consulting firm called Vici Media Group, which the Trump campaign hired for the 2016 election and currently has on retainer for 2020.

But Mauldin's professional website doesn't disclose his hobby - making parody webpages that appeal to voters to the left of candidates like Joe Biden.
You can nitpick "official". Does it make one lick of difference? When Trump campaign 'officials' get caught doing something unethical or illegal, Trump calls them coffee-boys anyway. So the term "official" when it comes to Trump's campaign is a pretty loose term by their own standards.
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Old 1st July 2019, 11:17 AM   #34
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Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
When you don't have much of a reply, nitpick something.

From the OP link:

Business Insider: A Trump campaign consultant is reportedly making fake websites for Democratic candidates — and it's working

You can nitpick "official". Does it make one lick of difference? When Trump campaign 'officials' get caught doing something unethical or illegal, Trump calls them coffee-boys anyway. So the term "official" when it comes to Trump's campaign is a pretty loose term by their own standards.
Do you believe this is an official Trump campaign website, commissioned and funded by the Trump campaign?
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Old 1st July 2019, 11:20 AM   #35
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
The only thing I see wrong with this is that you've failed to actually identify a Trump campaign official that's involved with this project.
He is working for the Trump campaign, which , like any campaign these cases, has the ability to tell him to cut it out or they'll distance themselves from him.

The Trump campaign has blessed this move, explicitly or implicitly.

So yeah, someone with authority in the chain is ok with this.
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Old 1st July 2019, 11:31 AM   #36
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Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
When you don't have much of a reply, nitpick something.

From the OP link:

Business Insider: A Trump campaign consultant is reportedly making fake websites for Democratic candidates — and it's working

You can nitpick "official". Does it make one lick of difference? When Trump campaign 'officials' get caught doing something unethical or illegal, Trump calls them coffee-boys anyway. So the term "official" when it comes to Trump's campaign is a pretty loose term by their own standards.
That still doesn't say that he's working on behalf of Trump. It actually specifically says he used his free time to make the sites.
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Old 1st July 2019, 11:35 AM   #37
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Originally Posted by plague311 View Post
That still doesn't say that he's working on behalf of Trump. It actually specifically says he used his free time to make the sites.
so?

Any normal campaign would have told him to shut them down.
The fact that Trump didn't means they are ok with it. Which is the same as supporting it.
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Old 1st July 2019, 11:38 AM   #38
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Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza View Post
He is working for the Trump campaign, which , like any campaign these cases, has the ability to tell him to cut it out or they'll distance themselves from him.

The Trump campaign has blessed this move, explicitly or implicitly.

So yeah, someone with authority in the chain is ok with this.
Even if that were true, it's still a far cry from being an official campaign website.

If an actual, accredited officer in the Trump campaign organization issues a statement saying that the campaign didn't ask for it and isn't paying for it, and whatever the guy does with his own resources on his own time is his business as a private citizen, would you agree that it's not an official website?
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Old 1st July 2019, 11:39 AM   #39
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Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza View Post
so?

Any normal campaign would have told him to shut them down.
The fact that Trump didn't means they are ok with it. Which is the same as supporting it.
I'm not arguing with any of that. That being said, he wasn't working in any form of official capacity when he made those sites. He was using his own free time.

I'm of the mindset that this means little to me. I live in the tech world, I can identify fake sites easily, especially one that looks like that.

That being said, as we have concluded in other threads, words mean things. These sites weren't requested, they weren't paid for, they were done by a person on their free time that also happened to work for the company that Trump does business with.

That's it, I have no dog in this race.
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Old 1st July 2019, 11:41 AM   #40
theprestige
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Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 35,815
Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza View Post
so?

Any normal campaign would have told him to shut them down.
So? Aside from the begged questions, so what? Trump isn't obliged to run a "normal" campaign. You can't make something official just by complaining that the other guy didn't do "enough" to suppress it. Get over yourself.

Quote:
The fact that Trump didn't means they are ok with it. Which is the same as supporting it.
That's already a stretch. It's even more of a stretch from there to "official campaign website".

And all this for a Joe Biden parody website. So what if the Trump campaign doesn't go after it?
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