What was the WORST book you have ever read? - Page 12

jimbob · 12th January 2021, 02:43 PM

Originally Posted by lionking

I’ve read and enjoyed a lot of Don DiLillo books, but his latest short novel The Silence was quite pointless. Avoid.

I misread the author name after seeing the quote that theprestige was replying to above yours

Spektator · 12th January 2021, 03:44 PM

I like many of Stephen King's works, but Insomnia, no joke, put me to sleep so many times I gave up on it.

kookbreaker · 12th January 2021, 06:56 PM

Originally Posted by jimbob

David Eddings was the sort of author I used to read on long train journeys. Bearable for that when I didn't want to engage my brain too much.

His range of plot was impressive

Universe makes two stones.

God finds stone
Boy finds stone
God threatens Boy's friend
Boy kills god
Boy lives forever
Another god finds stone
God threatens Boy's friend
Boy kills god
Boy lives forever

I think I had been weakened on Eddings for a while but when I read Redemption of Althalus I felt like he was just resting on his laurels. The book seemed so lazy. I never finished it.

As one more modern critic has stated about Edding's Belgariad: "It was like he just picked up a pile of basic fantasy tropes, shuffled them like a deck of cards and wrote a book based on how he dealt them out, and somehow made it work". But once he started repeating himself I was kind of done.

Craig4 · 12th January 2021, 08:29 PM

Anything Orson Scott Card wrote after "Ender's Game". Either boring and slow or just creepy (and not in a horror genre sort of way more in a what is with this guy and boys kind of way).

EHocking · 12th January 2021, 10:48 PM

Harry Potter.
Read book one and wondered what 9 year old wrote it.

Yes I realise they were children’s books, but still.

fromdownunder · 12th January 2021, 11:29 PM

I will go for Steven Donaldson's The One Tree, the second book in the second Thomas Covenant series. I enjoyed the first series a lot, and was delighted with The Wounded Land. In fact two others I worked with had also read these books, and we speculated for what seemed like forever on where the second Chronicles were going.

Publication seemed to be delayed (and now I know why - if this was what was finally published, I hate to think what all the earlier drafts must have looked like). And our work group, who all read it the week it was released, really did not talk about it at all. We just stopped because there was nothing left to talk about.

It really was that bad. I did read the last one, and it got a bit better, but I never even started the Third Chronicles.

As a postscript, I tried starting the Chronicles again a few years back and find them unreadable now. A bit like trying to re-read Burroughs, which I first started reading about 60 years ago. You cant go home again...

Norm

P.J. Denyer · 13th January 2021, 02:50 AM

Wurm by Matthew Costello. A biological horror story (which depends on every single professional being beyond incompetent) & a supernatural horror story smushed together with added contrived subplots such as a daughter who starts the book perched on the edge of a shark tank & seems to spend the book actively seeking out ever more effective ways of requiring rescuing. It's a shame as there is a decent story idea or two in there but I was constantly frustrated by the transparently stupid way everyone acted to serve the plot.

I wrote a full review on the book's Amazon page.

https://smile.amazon.co.uk/Wurm-Matt...0531116&sr=8-1

catsmate · 13th January 2021, 04:26 AM

Originally Posted by malbui

Major necro here I know, but still.

I was... encouraged... to read Peig as Gaeilge when I was very young.

The only positive thing I can say about it is that that literary genre served to inspire Myles na gCopaleen's savage An Béal Bocht, which as a viciously funny parody of popular Irishry has made me laugh through several re-readings over the years.

In my day it was compulsory reading.

Originally Posted by Lithrael

Sorry bout the necro, but, I’ll put in:

Terry Goodkind’s “Wizard’s First Rule” which I’m reminded of cause it had a bit in the middle that was just a ripoff of that. The book had no nuance. It had anti-nuance. It was a terrible ‘edgy cartoon’ of a book.

I can’t see it appealing to anyone unless it’s literally the first time they ever saw any edgelord content and they’re too excited about it to notice how bad the book is. I’m always walking past gobs of goodkind books at the thrift shops, they must have sold like hotcakes, why.

Glad to see a few other ‘worst’ noms for the guy in the thread.

Originally Posted by Armitage72

I'm a fan of Keith Laumer's "Bolo" stories, science fiction involving massive sapient AI tanks. Military action combined with examinations of what it means to be a person and the nature of courage and loyalty when someone is literally programmed to be brave and loyal.

Then I bought "Road to Damascus", a Bolo novel by John Ringo. Later in his career John Ringo, so the Bolo is secondary to a story in which everyone who agrees with his political views is a shining paragon of honor and nobility, while everyone who disagrees with his politics is a greedy, lazy, manipulative, cowardly, ignorant incompetent living off the work of the good people. The characters had to struggle to achieve two dimensions.

It's a fairly common problem. Kratman (who co-authored the Nazi apaologia Watch on the Rhine with Ringo) did a 'Bolo' story that was so bad he was refused permission to use the Laumer copyrighted bits and had to edit them it. It was a puerile polemic against his supposed enemies (gays, women, liberals, the usual suspects) with one character who was a pastiche of a poster at SpaceBattles who utterly humiliated him in a thread showing the errors in one of his books.
Typical Kratman basically.

jimbob · 13th January 2021, 04:31 AM

Originally Posted by Craig4

Anything Orson Scott Card wrote after "Ender's Game". Either boring and slow or just creepy (and not in a horror genre sort of way more in a what is with this guy and boys kind of way).

Testify.

Don't forget the not-too-subtle proselytizing.

Although if you want creepy in a really unsavoury way, Piers Anthony is

jimbob · 13th January 2021, 04:32 AM

I'm quite pleased with my necro

catsmate · 13th January 2021, 04:32 AM

Originally Posted by Guybrush Threepwood

You don't like leather lesbians with magic torture dildos? What's wrong with you?

I'm equally glad I read the whole thing (Well the main sequence anyway) there's something obsessively magnificent in the way he tortures the plot to illustrate his weirdo politics.

Someone needs a gift subscription to Kink.com.....

Originally Posted by Armitage72

I've only seen the TV series that was based on Goodkind's books, "Legend of the Seeker".

A hero who can permanently enslave anyone she touches, to the point that they'll happily go to their death if she tells them to. A hero who was prepared to kill a helpless prisoner chained to a wall, feeding him to an undead creature he needed information from, and only didn't because someone else killed the prisoner first.
"Heroes"

That's not even getting into the magical brainwashing dominatrixes with their leather catsuits and magical torture weapons that looked suspiciously like sex toys.

It really needs a "special" pastiche...

Originally Posted by lionking

Ah, a thread resurrected from the Golden Age of the forum. Good to see new responses. I’ll add mine when I think about it.

Thinking before you post? That is old.

catsmate · 13th January 2021, 04:35 AM

Originally Posted by Craig4

Anything Orson Scott Card wrote ~~after "Ender's Game".~~ Either boring and slow or just creepy (and not in a horror genre sort of way more in a what is with this guy and boys kind of way).

There

kookbreaker · 13th January 2021, 07:01 AM

Originally Posted by catsmate

In my day it was compulsory reading.

It's a fairly common problem. Kratman (who co-authored the Nazi apaologia Watch on the Rhine with Ringo) did a 'Bolo' story that was so bad he was refused permission to use the Laumer copyrighted bits and had to edit them it. It was a puerile polemic against his supposed enemies (gays, women, liberals, the usual suspects) with one character who was a pastiche of a poster at SpaceBattles who utterly humiliated him in a thread showing the errors in one of his books.
Typical Kratman basically.

Kratman is the guy who spent multiple pages on that forum (vs the same poster from SpaceBattles) insisting that you could disable an M1 Tank by pouring bleach on the air intake and gassing out the crew. First claiming that since the gas masks soldiers wear couldn't handle ammonia then the ones in the tanks could not either. Then when someone pointed out how filters have charcoal, etc to filter these out he declared victory because those things 'absorb, not filter'.

Finster · 13th January 2021, 07:20 AM

I’m embarrassed to admit I read some of the Gor books when I was a teenager (A looong time ago)

ZirconBlue · 13th January 2021, 07:44 AM

Originally Posted by Craig4

Anything Orson Scott Card wrote after "Ender's Game". Either boring and slow or just creepy (and not in a horror genre sort of way more in a what is with this guy and boys kind of way).

I've only read one OSC novel, but I recall liking it: Pastwatch.

Originally Posted by jimbob

Although if you want creepy in a really unsavoury way, Piers Anthony is

He was my favorite author when I was a young teen, but then later work started to creep me out. I've since been afraid to re-read my old favorites for fear they were creepier than I realized at the time.

sts60 · 13th January 2021, 07:58 AM

Originally Posted by Guybrush Threepwood

+1 and it reminded me that the sequels to Arthur C Clarke's Rendezvous with Rama written by Gentry Lee then approved by a senile and/or heavily sedated Clarke really deserve a mention in this thread.

This deserves re-upping after more than a decade. The first sequel was bad. The second sequel was such a wretched abomination that I stopped reading it and briefly considered removing it from my memory with an ice pick.

Armitage72 · 13th January 2021, 08:11 AM

Originally Posted by ZirconBlue

He was my favorite author when I was a young teen, but then later work started to creep me out. I've since been afraid to re-read my old favorites for fear they were creepier than I realized at the time.

I was going to mention Anthony, but his books really seem like low-hanging fruit. I wouldn't want to count how many books contain sexualized underage girls, adult men in relationships with underage girls, and people expressing the opinion that age of consent laws are arbitrary and unfair to people who love each other.
Then there's the whole "Adult Conspiracy" in Xanth, which when you remove the fantasy metaphors, becomes "children want to have sex, but adults won't tell them how it works".

catsmate · 13th January 2021, 09:15 AM

Originally Posted by kookbreaker

Kratman is the guy who spent multiple pages on that forum (vs the same poster from SpaceBattles) insisting that you could disable an M1 Tank by pouring bleach on the air intake and gassing out the crew. First claiming that since the gas masks soldiers wear couldn't handle ammonia then the ones in the tanks could not either. Then when someone pointed out how filters have charcoal, etc to filter these out he declared victory because those things 'absorb, not filter'.

That was it, he whored himself to Jim Been and the rightist nutters for the book and an ex-USMC tanker tore him apart.

Not as bad as his 911 with drigibles though.

jimbob · 13th January 2021, 09:31 AM

Originally Posted by catsmate

That was it, he whored himself to Jim Been and the rightist nutters for the book and an ex-USMC tanker tore him apart.

Not as bad as his 911 with drigibles though.

Wut?

Armitage72 · 13th January 2021, 09:38 AM

Originally Posted by catsmate

It's a fairly common problem. Kratman (who co-authored the Nazi apaologia Watch on the Rhine with Ringo) ...

I've read all of the Legacy of the Aldenata/Posleen War novels (which got steadily worse over time). It was only a couple days ago that I realized the possible significance of the Darhel, the evil Space Bankers who are secretly plotting to enslave any humans who survive the Posleen invasion, having fox-like faces, including prominent muzzles. Evil bankers with protruding noses who are planning to enslave Humanity.
Maybe I'm reading too much into it.

Guybrush Threepwood · 13th January 2021, 09:44 AM

Originally Posted by Armitage72

I've read all of the Legacy of the Aldenata/Posleen War novels (which got steadily worse over time). It was only a couple days ago that I realized the possible significance of the Darhel, the evil Space Bankers who are secretly plotting to enslave any humans who survive the Posleen invasion, having fox-like faces, including prominent muzzles. Evil bankers with protruding noses who are planning to enslave Humanity.
Maybe I'm reading too much into it.

I've only read one Kratman novel (A Desert Called Peace) but I'm confident in saying you are not reading too much into it. He's a racist, misogynist nut case.

theprestige · 13th January 2021, 09:50 AM

Originally Posted by jimbob

Wut?

You dial the police and they send an airship.

jadebox · 13th January 2021, 09:53 AM

Originally Posted by four elevener

Stephen King's From a Buick 8.

The beginning and ending were good. The middle was long, repetitious, and boring (and silly and moronic and ....).

The Da Vinci Code is probably the most hyped, but worst book I read and finished.

I made the mistake of reading one of the books by some nobody that James Patterson slapped his name on. It was gawd-awful.

Resume · 13th January 2021, 10:19 AM

Eye of the Storm by James Forrest.

There used to be a sample chapter on Amazon so you could see for yourselves. It seems to be gone now, but if you read the fifth review down you'll get a notion of just how bad this novel is. The good reviews are from the author's on line buddies I think.

ETA: Randy Wayne White wrote a jacket blurb; I don't see how he could've if he read this book.

theprestige · 13th January 2021, 10:44 AM

I keep trying to think of the worst Stephen King book I ever read. I've actually been pretty pleased with his body of work overall. Some of his later books faltered a bit in places, but none of them stand out in my mind as "... but this was the worst of them all."

Some of the later Dark Tower stuff was kinda weak. From a Buick 8 was okay, but somehow derivative.

I thought Bag of Bones was fine. I thought it was interesting that he explained his process of saving his weaker manuscripts, in case he ever needed to publish second-rate crap while on a deadline with writer's block. "Oh," I thought. "So that's what's going on here."

Then I read Dreamcatcher and thought, "now this is a bag of bones!" But I liked it. It's the kind of book you'd get if Stephen King's estate gave an unfinished manuscript to someone who had a knack for aping King's voice, and knew how to put in all of King's favorite tropes and themes. Not great, but not terrible, either. Gets weaker at the end. For some reason the movie adaptation really digs deep into that weak ending, and makes it even weaker, instead of doing a proper rewrite into something stronger.

Full disclosure: I stopped reading King almost entirely after Bag of Bones, with a couple exceptions here and there. I finished the Dark Tower, and thought the ending went a long way towards redeeming the weakness of the later books in that series. And then after the Dark Tower, I stopped reading King altogether. So I have no idea how good or bad any of his more recent stuff is. For me, it'll always be The Stand, the Derry-verse, and Dark Tower 1-3.

catsmate · 13th January 2021, 02:41 PM

Originally Posted by jimbob

Wut?

Kratman wrote a chunk of awful fanfic after the 911 attacks where a Marry sue dealt with the "Muslim problem" by taking over Panama (where K lived) and turning it into a mercenary power.
Then he sold this crap to Jim Been and it became a series of execrable sci-fi novels called A Desert Called Peace, featuring every right-wing stereotype imaginable. The alt-911 attack involved Muslims crashing drigibles into office towers......

catsmate · 13th January 2021, 02:44 PM

Originally Posted by Guybrush Threepwood

I've only read one Kratman novel (A Desert Called Peace) but I'm confident in saying you are not reading too much into it. He's a racist, misogynist nut case.

He's also a simply terrible writer; he fails to manage to tell a story properly and well. He makes utterly amateurish mistakes.

P.J. Denyer · 13th January 2021, 05:23 PM

Originally Posted by jadebox

The beginning and ending were good. The middle was long, repetitious, and boring (and silly and moronic and ....).

I'm a massive Stephen King fan, but I just don't think he can write sci-fi, Tommy Knockers is meh, Under the Dome has one of the worst deus ex-machina endings ever. No-one can do everything...

turingtest · 13th January 2021, 05:44 PM

Originally Posted by theprestige

I keep trying to think of the worst Stephen King book I ever read. I've actually been pretty pleased with his body of work overall. Some of his later books faltered a bit in places, but none of them stand out in my mind as "... but this was the worst of them all."

Some of the later Dark Tower stuff was kinda weak. From a Buick 8 was okay, but somehow derivative.

I thought Bag of Bones was fine. I thought it was interesting that he explained his process of saving his weaker manuscripts, in case he ever needed to publish second-rate crap while on a deadline with writer's block. "Oh," I thought. "So that's what's going on here."

Then I read Dreamcatcher and thought, "now this is a bag of bones!" But I liked it. It's the kind of book you'd get if Stephen King's estate gave an unfinished manuscript to someone who had a knack for aping King's voice, and knew how to put in all of King's favorite tropes and themes. Not great, but not terrible, either. Gets weaker at the end. For some reason the movie adaptation really digs deep into that weak ending, and makes it even weaker, instead of doing a proper rewrite into something stronger.

Full disclosure: I stopped reading King almost entirely after Bag of Bones, with a couple exceptions here and there. I finished the Dark Tower, and thought the ending went a long way towards redeeming the weakness of the later books in that series. And then after the Dark Tower, I stopped reading King altogether. So I have no idea how good or bad any of his more recent stuff is. For me, it'll always be The Stand, the Derry-verse, and Dark Tower 1-3.

I don't know how you feel about his short story collections, but at least with those, the (relative, in some cases) shortness of the stories means that even the bad ones don't take long to get past. Two of my favorite stories have been "The Things They Left Behind," from Just After Sunset, which I found pretty powerful, and "Premium Harmony," from The Bazaar of Bad Dreams, which I admit made me laugh out loud at the ending and kind of ashamed I did. (Of his novels, I have to say Hearts In Atlantis was my favorite)

Oh, this is bad books, isn't it? Anything by Clive Cussler. I remember reading Raise The Titanic when I was young, and being entertained by it, though I can't recall any specifics about it. A few years ago, based on that vague memory, I gave Valhalla Rising a try, and, from that, have absolutely no desire to re-read Titanic to see why I found it entertaining. Gah, Valhalla was bad, bad, bad- a sample of the dialogue (from memory, may not be word-for-word, but close enough):

(Our hero, Dirk Pitt, is being introduced to some woman, a reporter or something)-

Quote:

"My name is Dirk Pitt." "Oh, such a strong name- I like it," she replied, eyeing him speculatively.

As I said, that's not word for word, but it's close enough to get the flavor. Honestly, every bit of dialogue in the book is like that, stilted readings from characters who know they're in a book. And at one point, the plot has Pitt and a sidekick or somebody stranded out in the middle of the ocean with absolutely no way and no hope of getting to some place they must be right away in order to save the day- no hope, that is, until a stranger with a fancy boat appears and takes them aboard to drop them off where they can get a plane. Who was that stranger?

Quote:

"My name," said he, with a twinkle in his eye, "is...Clive Cussler!"

Apparently, Cussler decided that his success from crap like Titanic excused him for any lapses into blatant "deus ex machina" nonsense.

TragicMonkey · 13th January 2021, 07:31 PM

Originally Posted by P.J. Denyer

I'm a massive Stephen King fan, but I just don't think he can write sci-fi, Tommy Knockers is meh, Under the Dome has one of the worst deus ex-machina endings ever. No-one can do everything...

I've only read a couple of Stephen King books. I wasn't impressed by the plots or the atmosphere but by the characterizations--he excels in constructing quite poignant life stories for minor characters, in a just a few paragraphs to show who they were right before they get brutally slaughtered by whatever-it-is. He did it several times in It with very minor characters; and it's having a window into the interior lives of these people that makes it matter when they get killed by the monster. King's victims aren't just some nameless rabble who were in the wrong place at the wrong time, they are complete human beings with their own unique lives and stories. I found that impressive, it's not something frequently found in the horror genre.

malbui · 15th January 2021, 06:06 AM

(Peig)

Originally Posted by catsmate

In my day it was compulsory reading.

I didn't go through the Irish school system at all but I was raised in a family of... let's call them language enthusiasts.

The Greater Fool · 15th January 2021, 09:36 AM

Originally Posted by TragicMonkey

I've only read a couple of Stephen King books. I wasn't impressed by the plots or the atmosphere but by the characterizations--he excels in constructing quite poignant life stories for minor characters, in a just a few paragraphs to show who they were right before they get brutally slaughtered by whatever-it-is. He did it several times in It with very minor characters; and it's having a window into the interior lives of these people that makes it matter when they get killed by the monster. King's victims aren't just some nameless rabble who were in the wrong place at the wrong time, they are complete human beings with their own unique lives and stories. I found that impressive, it's not something frequently found in the horror genre.

He is a good story teller telling less than great stories.

alfaniner · 15th January 2021, 10:19 AM

Note on an earlier post -- Yesterday I Googled the author's name on my laptop just to see someone's review of his stuff. I have not looked at any of his books or info before.

Last night I'm browsing Facebook on my phone, and an ad for that author's book came up. I have all the standard ad-blocking-do-not-track stuff on my laptop, and I don't use the FB app on either (I access it through Firefox), and I don't stay signed in on Google. It's not unexpected, but it's still somewhat disturbing. FB and Google have their feelers into everything.

Guybrush Threepwood · 15th January 2021, 10:31 AM

Originally Posted by turingtest

I don't know how you feel about his short story collections, but at least with those, the (relative, in some cases) shortness of the stories means that even the bad ones don't take long to get past. Two of my favorite stories have been "The Things They Left Behind," from Just After Sunset, which I found pretty powerful, and "Premium Harmony," from The Bazaar of Bad Dreams, which I admit made me laugh out loud at the ending and kind of ashamed I did. (Of his novels, I have to say Hearts In Atlantis was my favorite)

Oh, this is bad books, isn't it? Anything by Clive Cussler. I remember reading Raise The Titanic when I was young, and being entertained by it, though I can't recall any specifics about it. A few years ago, based on that vague memory, I gave Valhalla Rising a try, and, from that, have absolutely no desire to re-read Titanic to see why I found it entertaining. Gah, Valhalla was bad, bad, bad- a sample of the dialogue (from memory, may not be word-for-word, but close enough):

(Our hero, Dirk Pitt, is being introduced to some woman, a reporter or something)-

As I said, that's not word for word, but it's close enough to get the flavor. Honestly, every bit of dialogue in the book is like that, stilted readings from characters who know they're in a book. And at one point, the plot has Pitt and a sidekick or somebody stranded out in the middle of the ocean with absolutely no way and no hope of getting to some place they must be right away in order to save the day- no hope, that is, until a stranger with a fancy boat appears and takes them aboard to drop them off where they can get a plane. Who was that stranger?

Apparently, Cussler decided that his success from crap like Titanic excused him for any lapses into blatant "deus ex machina" nonsense.

That's just small stuff for Clive Cussler. (He writes himself into lots of the books btw)
My two favourites are when Dirk Pitt sails from Cuba to the US in a bathtub and when the Secretary General of the UN thanks him for saving her life by having sex with him, and despite the fact that Dirk is in a hospital bed with three (I think) bullet holes in him it's the best ride she has ever had.

They just don't write books like that any more. Or at least I hope they don't, I rather suspect some Cussler spawn is still churning them out.

catsmate · 15th January 2021, 04:34 PM

Originally Posted by malbui

(Peig)

I didn't go through the Irish school system at all but I was raised in a family of... let's call them language enthusiasts.

lionking · 15th January 2021, 05:27 PM

The Silmarillion. Like the Bible, but with more boring characters. I loved everything else by Tolkien, but struggled through a handful of pages only.

malbui · 16th January 2021, 01:38 AM

Originally Posted by catsmate

If my grandparents hadn’t been dead for decades I’d be suing them for abuse and childhood trauma.

Maybe I still could, in a kind of nod to Cré na Cille

Wowbagger · 16th January 2021, 10:08 AM

I don't have a habit of reading bad books. I only read that hideous "And Another Thing" (which started this thread) because it claimed (falsely, I believe) to be a continuation of the Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy.

To this very day, I still keep the words "By the way, my first name is NOT Bowerick!!!!" in my sig, on this forum.

A few years ago, before the movie came out, I actually read Ready Player One, by Ernest Cline. It was, I think, a very bland and average book. NOT necessarily a terrible, awful book. But, certainly not a good one, either.
However, it might be the second-worst book I ever finished reading, despite its mediocrity placement in the quality scale. There are certainly plenty of books I started reading that were worse that RP1, but never finished them (other than... you know... that book... the one that started this thread).

I don't think I will be reading Ready Player Two. I hear it's a bit of a mess, even by Kline standards.

And, for the record, I do love VR technology. Just not stories that read more like plain, old lists of 80s references over and over and over again, with little else between them. That's all.

Darat · 16th January 2021, 10:33 AM

Originally Posted by lionking

The Silmarillion. Like the Bible, but with more boring characters. I loved everything else by Tolkien, but struggled through a handful of pages only.

Remember in terms of his now mainstream non-academic works he only published three major pieces The Hobbit, TLOTR, and Farmer Giles and there was a reason for that.....

All the rest is stuff his son found shoved down the back of the sofa, lining the litter box and on a nail in the privy - and Christopher never saw a scribble he wouldn’t monetize. I was always surprised we didn’t get the “Notes to a Milkman 1934 - 1956. Volume 1” or the “Shopping Lists 1955-1964 Volume 8”.

JayUtah · 16th January 2021, 11:35 AM

Ditto here on The Silmarillion. It's like a history textbook for a place you don't care about.

Revisiting Stephen King, I have to admit that many of his books I loved as a teenager aren't as exciting or sophisticated when I reread them as an adult. And I thought he sold out far too casually to the screen adaptation.

(Full disclosure, though: I'm in one of those adaptations. In the old TV miniseries version of The Stand -- not the new one that just released -- you can see me as one of the corpses they clean out of the church. King was on set then and complimented me and the others as the best corpses he'd ever seen.

)

12th January 2021, 02:43 PM	#441
jimbob Uncritical "thinker" Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: UK Posts: 22,654	Originally Posted by lionking I’ve read and enjoyed a lot of Don DiLillo books, but his latest short novel The Silence was quite pointless. Avoid. I misread the author name after seeing the quote that theprestige was replying to above yours
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12th January 2021, 06:56 PM	#443
kookbreaker Evil Fokker Join Date: Aug 2001 Posts: 13,061	Originally Posted by jimbob David Eddings was the sort of author I used to read on long train journeys. Bearable for that when I didn't want to engage my brain too much. His range of plot was impressive Universe makes two stones. God finds stone Boy finds stone God threatens Boy's friend Boy kills god Boy lives forever Another god finds stone God threatens Boy's friend Boy kills god Boy lives forever I think I had been weakened on Eddings for a while but when I read Redemption of Althalus I felt like he was just resting on his laurels. The book seemed so lazy. I never finished it. As one more modern critic has stated about Edding's Belgariad: "It was like he just picked up a pile of basic fantasy tropes, shuffled them like a deck of cards and wrote a book based on how he dealt them out, and somehow made it work". But once he started repeating himself I was kind of done.
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12th January 2021, 08:29 PM	#444
Craig4 Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Alexandria, VA Home to the Deep State. Posts: 22,288	Anything Orson Scott Card wrote after "Ender's Game". Either boring and slow or just creepy (and not in a horror genre sort of way more in a what is with this guy and boys kind of way).
	__________________ A MAGA hat = a Swastika arm band. A vote for Trump is a vote for treason.

12th January 2021, 10:48 PM	#445
EHocking Philosopher Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 8,439	Harry Potter. Read book one and wondered what 9 year old wrote it. Yes I realise they were children’s books, but still.
EHocking Philosopher Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 8,439	__________________ "A closed mouth gathers no feet" "Ignorance is a renewable resource" P.J.O'Rourke "It's all god's handiwork, there's little quality control applied", Fox26 reporter on Texas granite You can't make up anything anymore. The world itself is a satire. All you're doing is recording it. Art Buchwald

12th January 2021, 11:29 PM	#446
fromdownunder Philosopher Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 6,706	I will go for Steven Donaldson's The One Tree, the second book in the second Thomas Covenant series. I enjoyed the first series a lot, and was delighted with The Wounded Land. In fact two others I worked with had also read these books, and we speculated for what seemed like forever on where the second Chronicles were going. Publication seemed to be delayed (and now I know why - if this was what was finally published, I hate to think what all the earlier drafts must have looked like). And our work group, who all read it the week it was released, really did not talk about it at all. We just stopped because there was nothing left to talk about. It really was that bad. I did read the last one, and it got a bit better, but I never even started the Third Chronicles. As a postscript, I tried starting the Chronicles again a few years back and find them unreadable now. A bit like trying to re-read Burroughs, which I first started reading about 60 years ago. You cant go home again... Norm
	__________________ Against stupidity, the Gods themselves contend in Vain

12th January 2021, 03:44 PM	#442
Spektator Watching . . . always watching. Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Southeastern USA Posts: 1,856	I like many of Stephen King's works, but Insomnia, no joke, put me to sleep so many times I gave up on it.

13th January 2021, 02:50 AM	#447
P.J. Denyer Philosopher Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 7,716	Wurm by Matthew Costello. A biological horror story (which depends on every single professional being beyond incompetent) & a supernatural horror story smushed together with added contrived subplots such as a daughter who starts the book perched on the edge of a shark tank & seems to spend the book actively seeking out ever more effective ways of requiring rescuing. It's a shame as there is a decent story idea or two in there but I was constantly frustrated by the transparently stupid way everyone acted to serve the plot. I wrote a full review on the book's Amazon page. https://smile.amazon.co.uk/Wurm-Matt...0531116&sr=8-1
P.J. Denyer Philosopher Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 7,716	__________________ "I know my brain cannot tell me what to think." - Scorpion "Nebulous means Nebulous" - Adam Hills

13th January 2021, 04:26 AM	#448
catsmate No longer the 1 Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 23,429	Originally Posted by malbui Major necro here I know, but still. I was... encouraged... to read Peig as Gaeilge when I was very young. The only positive thing I can say about it is that that literary genre served to inspire Myles na gCopaleen's savage An Béal Bocht, which as a viciously funny parody of popular Irishry has made me laugh through several re-readings over the years. In my day it was compulsory reading. Originally Posted by Lithrael Sorry bout the necro, but, I’ll put in: Terry Goodkind’s “Wizard’s First Rule” which I’m reminded of cause it had a bit in the middle that was just a ripoff of that. The book had no nuance. It had anti-nuance. It was a terrible ‘edgy cartoon’ of a book. I can’t see it appealing to anyone unless it’s literally the first time they ever saw any edgelord content and they’re too excited about it to notice how bad the book is. I’m always walking past gobs of goodkind books at the thrift shops, they must have sold like hotcakes, why. Glad to see a few other ‘worst’ noms for the guy in the thread. Originally Posted by Armitage72 I'm a fan of Keith Laumer's "Bolo" stories, science fiction involving massive sapient AI tanks. Military action combined with examinations of what it means to be a person and the nature of courage and loyalty when someone is literally programmed to be brave and loyal. Then I bought "Road to Damascus", a Bolo novel by John Ringo. Later in his career John Ringo, so the Bolo is secondary to a story in which everyone who agrees with his political views is a shining paragon of honor and nobility, while everyone who disagrees with his politics is a greedy, lazy, manipulative, cowardly, ignorant incompetent living off the work of the good people. The characters had to struggle to achieve two dimensions. It's a fairly common problem. Kratman (who co-authored the Nazi apaologia Watch on the Rhine with Ringo) did a 'Bolo' story that was so bad he was refused permission to use the Laumer copyrighted bits and had to edit them it. It was a puerile polemic against his supposed enemies (gays, women, liberals, the usual suspects) with one character who was a pastiche of a poster at SpaceBattles who utterly humiliated him in a thread showing the errors in one of his books. Typical Kratman basically.
	__________________ As human right is always something given, it always in reality reduces to the right which men give, "concede," to each other. If the right to existence is conceded to new-born children, then they have the right; if it is not conceded to them, as was the case among the Spartans and ancient Romans, then they do not have it. For only society can give or concede it to them; they themselves cannot take it, or give it to themselves.

13th January 2021, 04:31 AM	#449
jimbob Uncritical "thinker" Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: UK Posts: 22,654	Originally Posted by Craig4 Anything Orson Scott Card wrote after "Ender's Game". Either boring and slow or just creepy (and not in a horror genre sort of way more in a what is with this guy and boys kind of way). Testify. Don't forget the not-too-subtle proselytizing. Although if you want creepy in a really unsavoury way, Piers Anthony is
	__________________ OECD healthcare spending Expenditure on healthcare http://www.oecd.org/els/health-systems/health-data.htm link is 2015 data (2013 Data below): UK 8.5% of GDP of which 83.3% is public expenditure - 7.1% of GDP is public spending US 16.4% of GDP of which 48.2% is public expenditure - 7.9% of GDP is public spending

13th January 2021, 04:32 AM	#450
jimbob Uncritical "thinker" Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: UK Posts: 22,654	I'm quite pleased with my necro
	__________________ OECD healthcare spending Expenditure on healthcare http://www.oecd.org/els/health-systems/health-data.htm link is 2015 data (2013 Data below): UK 8.5% of GDP of which 83.3% is public expenditure - 7.1% of GDP is public spending US 16.4% of GDP of which 48.2% is public expenditure - 7.9% of GDP is public spending

13th January 2021, 04:32 AM	#451
catsmate No longer the 1 Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 23,429	Originally Posted by Guybrush Threepwood You don't like leather lesbians with magic torture dildos? What's wrong with you? I'm equally glad I read the whole thing (Well the main sequence anyway) there's something obsessively magnificent in the way he tortures the plot to illustrate his weirdo politics. Someone needs a gift subscription to Kink.com..... Originally Posted by Armitage72 I've only seen the TV series that was based on Goodkind's books, "Legend of the Seeker". A hero who can permanently enslave anyone she touches, to the point that they'll happily go to their death if she tells them to. A hero who was prepared to kill a helpless prisoner chained to a wall, feeding him to an undead creature he needed information from, and only didn't because someone else killed the prisoner first. "Heroes" That's not even getting into the magical brainwashing dominatrixes with their leather catsuits and magical torture weapons that looked suspiciously like sex toys. It really needs a "special" pastiche... Originally Posted by lionking Ah, a thread resurrected from the Golden Age of the forum. Good to see new responses. I’ll add mine when I think about it. Thinking before you post? That is old.
	__________________ As human right is always something given, it always in reality reduces to the right which men give, "concede," to each other. If the right to existence is conceded to new-born children, then they have the right; if it is not conceded to them, as was the case among the Spartans and ancient Romans, then they do not have it. For only society can give or concede it to them; they themselves cannot take it, or give it to themselves.

13th January 2021, 04:35 AM	#452
catsmate No longer the 1 Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 23,429	Originally Posted by Craig4 Anything Orson Scott Card wrote ~~after "Ender's Game".~~ Either boring and slow or just creepy (and not in a horror genre sort of way more in a what is with this guy and boys kind of way). There
	__________________ As human right is always something given, it always in reality reduces to the right which men give, "concede," to each other. If the right to existence is conceded to new-born children, then they have the right; if it is not conceded to them, as was the case among the Spartans and ancient Romans, then they do not have it. For only society can give or concede it to them; they themselves cannot take it, or give it to themselves.

13th January 2021, 07:01 AM	#453
kookbreaker Evil Fokker Join Date: Aug 2001 Posts: 13,061	Originally Posted by catsmate In my day it was compulsory reading. It's a fairly common problem. Kratman (who co-authored the Nazi apaologia Watch on the Rhine with Ringo) did a 'Bolo' story that was so bad he was refused permission to use the Laumer copyrighted bits and had to edit them it. It was a puerile polemic against his supposed enemies (gays, women, liberals, the usual suspects) with one character who was a pastiche of a poster at SpaceBattles who utterly humiliated him in a thread showing the errors in one of his books. Typical Kratman basically. Kratman is the guy who spent multiple pages on that forum (vs the same poster from SpaceBattles) insisting that you could disable an M1 Tank by pouring bleach on the air intake and gassing out the crew. First claiming that since the gas masks soldiers wear couldn't handle ammonia then the ones in the tanks could not either. Then when someone pointed out how filters have charcoal, etc to filter these out he declared victory because those things 'absorb, not filter'.
	__________________ www.spectrum-scientifics.com <- My store of science toys, instruments and general fun! Thanks for helping me win Best Toys in Philly Voter in 2011,2012, and 2014! We won' be discussing the disappointment that was 2013.

13th January 2021, 07:20 AM	#454
Finster Graduate Poster Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 1,074	I’m embarrassed to admit I read some of the Gor books when I was a teenager (A looong time ago)
Finster Graduate Poster Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 1,074	__________________ "You can't help respecting anybody who can spell TUESDAY, even if he doesn't spell it right; but spelling isn't everything. There are days when spelling Tuesday simply doesn't count." - WtP

13th January 2021, 07:44 AM	#455
ZirconBlue Sole Survivor of L-Town Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Lexington, KY, USA, Earth Posts: 13,654	Originally Posted by Craig4 Anything Orson Scott Card wrote after "Ender's Game". Either boring and slow or just creepy (and not in a horror genre sort of way more in a what is with this guy and boys kind of way). I've only read one OSC novel, but I recall liking it: Pastwatch. Originally Posted by jimbob Although if you want creepy in a really unsavoury way, Piers Anthony is He was my favorite author when I was a young teen, but then later work started to creep me out. I've since been afraid to re-read my old favorites for fear they were creepier than I realized at the time.
	__________________ Religion and sex are powerplays. Manipulate the people for the money they pay. Selling skin, selling God The numbers look the same on their credit cards.

13th January 2021, 07:58 AM	#456
sts60 Illuminator Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 3,669	Originally Posted by Guybrush Threepwood +1 and it reminded me that the sequels to Arthur C Clarke's Rendezvous with Rama written by Gentry Lee then approved by a senile and/or heavily sedated Clarke really deserve a mention in this thread. This deserves re-upping after more than a decade. The first sequel was bad. The second sequel was such a wretched abomination that I stopped reading it and briefly considered removing it from my memory with an ice pick.
sts60 Illuminator Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 3,669	Last edited by sts60; 13th January 2021 at 08:55 AM.

13th January 2021, 08:11 AM	#457
Armitage72 Philosopher Join Date: Mar 2012 Location: Rochester, NY Posts: 5,164	Originally Posted by ZirconBlue He was my favorite author when I was a young teen, but then later work started to creep me out. I've since been afraid to re-read my old favorites for fear they were creepier than I realized at the time. I was going to mention Anthony, but his books really seem like low-hanging fruit. I wouldn't want to count how many books contain sexualized underage girls, adult men in relationships with underage girls, and people expressing the opinion that age of consent laws are arbitrary and unfair to people who love each other. Then there's the whole "Adult Conspiracy" in Xanth, which when you remove the fantasy metaphors, becomes "children want to have sex, but adults won't tell them how it works".

13th January 2021, 09:15 AM	#458
catsmate No longer the 1 Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 23,429	Originally Posted by kookbreaker Kratman is the guy who spent multiple pages on that forum (vs the same poster from SpaceBattles) insisting that you could disable an M1 Tank by pouring bleach on the air intake and gassing out the crew. First claiming that since the gas masks soldiers wear couldn't handle ammonia then the ones in the tanks could not either. Then when someone pointed out how filters have charcoal, etc to filter these out he declared victory because those things 'absorb, not filter'. That was it, he whored himself to Jim Been and the rightist nutters for the book and an ex-USMC tanker tore him apart. Not as bad as his 911 with drigibles though.
	__________________ As human right is always something given, it always in reality reduces to the right which men give, "concede," to each other. If the right to existence is conceded to new-born children, then they have the right; if it is not conceded to them, as was the case among the Spartans and ancient Romans, then they do not have it. For only society can give or concede it to them; they themselves cannot take it, or give it to themselves.

13th January 2021, 09:31 AM	#459
jimbob Uncritical "thinker" Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: UK Posts: 22,654	Originally Posted by catsmate That was it, he whored himself to Jim Been and the rightist nutters for the book and an ex-USMC tanker tore him apart. Not as bad as his 911 with drigibles though. Wut?
	__________________ OECD healthcare spending Expenditure on healthcare http://www.oecd.org/els/health-systems/health-data.htm link is 2015 data (2013 Data below): UK 8.5% of GDP of which 83.3% is public expenditure - 7.1% of GDP is public spending US 16.4% of GDP of which 48.2% is public expenditure - 7.9% of GDP is public spending

13th January 2021, 09:38 AM	#460
Armitage72 Philosopher Join Date: Mar 2012 Location: Rochester, NY Posts: 5,164	Originally Posted by catsmate It's a fairly common problem. Kratman (who co-authored the Nazi apaologia Watch on the Rhine with Ringo) ... I've read all of the Legacy of the Aldenata/Posleen War novels (which got steadily worse over time). It was only a couple days ago that I realized the possible significance of the Darhel, the evil Space Bankers who are secretly plotting to enslave any humans who survive the Posleen invasion, having fox-like faces, including prominent muzzles. Evil bankers with protruding noses who are planning to enslave Humanity. Maybe I'm reading too much into it.

13th January 2021, 09:44 AM	#461
Guybrush Threepwood Trainee Pirate Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: An Uaimh Posts: 3,031	Originally Posted by Armitage72 I've read all of the Legacy of the Aldenata/Posleen War novels (which got steadily worse over time). It was only a couple days ago that I realized the possible significance of the Darhel, the evil Space Bankers who are secretly plotting to enslave any humans who survive the Posleen invasion, having fox-like faces, including prominent muzzles. Evil bankers with protruding noses who are planning to enslave Humanity. Maybe I'm reading too much into it. I've only read one Kratman novel (A Desert Called Peace) but I'm confident in saying you are not reading too much into it. He's a racist, misogynist nut case.

13th January 2021, 09:50 AM	#462
theprestige Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Hong Kong Posts: 48,524	Originally Posted by jimbob Wut? You dial the police and they send an airship.

13th January 2021, 09:53 AM	#463
jadebox Graduate Poster Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: USA Posts: 1,865	Originally Posted by four elevener Stephen King's From a Buick 8. The beginning and ending were good. The middle was long, repetitious, and boring (and silly and moronic and ....). The Da Vinci Code is probably the most hyped, but worst book I read and finished. I made the mistake of reading one of the books by some nobody that James Patterson slapped his name on. It was gawd-awful.

13th January 2021, 10:19 AM	#464
Resume Troublesome Passenger Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 18,624	Eye of the Storm by James Forrest. There used to be a sample chapter on Amazon so you could see for yourselves. It seems to be gone now, but if you read the fifth review down you'll get a notion of just how bad this novel is. The good reviews are from the author's on line buddies I think. ETA: Randy Wayne White wrote a jacket blurb; I don't see how he could've if he read this book.
	__________________ He must be removed. George Will on President Donald J. Trump. June 1, 2020

13th January 2021, 10:44 AM	#465
theprestige Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Hong Kong Posts: 48,524	I keep trying to think of the worst Stephen King book I ever read. I've actually been pretty pleased with his body of work overall. Some of his later books faltered a bit in places, but none of them stand out in my mind as "... but this was the worst of them all." Some of the later Dark Tower stuff was kinda weak. From a Buick 8 was okay, but somehow derivative. I thought Bag of Bones was fine. I thought it was interesting that he explained his process of saving his weaker manuscripts, in case he ever needed to publish second-rate crap while on a deadline with writer's block. "Oh," I thought. "So that's what's going on here." Then I read Dreamcatcher and thought, "now this is a bag of bones!" But I liked it. It's the kind of book you'd get if Stephen King's estate gave an unfinished manuscript to someone who had a knack for aping King's voice, and knew how to put in all of King's favorite tropes and themes. Not great, but not terrible, either. Gets weaker at the end. For some reason the movie adaptation really digs deep into that weak ending, and makes it even weaker, instead of doing a proper rewrite into something stronger. Full disclosure: I stopped reading King almost entirely after Bag of Bones, with a couple exceptions here and there. I finished the Dark Tower, and thought the ending went a long way towards redeeming the weakness of the later books in that series. And then after the Dark Tower, I stopped reading King altogether. So I have no idea how good or bad any of his more recent stuff is. For me, it'll always be The Stand, the Derry-verse, and Dark Tower 1-3.
	Last edited by theprestige; 13th January 2021 at 10:47 AM.

13th January 2021, 02:41 PM	#466
catsmate No longer the 1 Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 23,429	Originally Posted by jimbob Wut? Kratman wrote a chunk of awful fanfic after the 911 attacks where a Marry sue dealt with the "Muslim problem" by taking over Panama (where K lived) and turning it into a mercenary power. Then he sold this crap to Jim Been and it became a series of execrable sci-fi novels called A Desert Called Peace, featuring every right-wing stereotype imaginable. The alt-911 attack involved Muslims crashing drigibles into office towers......
	__________________ As human right is always something given, it always in reality reduces to the right which men give, "concede," to each other. If the right to existence is conceded to new-born children, then they have the right; if it is not conceded to them, as was the case among the Spartans and ancient Romans, then they do not have it. For only society can give or concede it to them; they themselves cannot take it, or give it to themselves.

13th January 2021, 02:44 PM	#467
catsmate No longer the 1 Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 23,429	Originally Posted by Guybrush Threepwood I've only read one Kratman novel (A Desert Called Peace) but I'm confident in saying you are not reading too much into it. He's a racist, misogynist nut case. He's also a simply terrible writer; he fails to manage to tell a story properly and well. He makes utterly amateurish mistakes.
	__________________ As human right is always something given, it always in reality reduces to the right which men give, "concede," to each other. If the right to existence is conceded to new-born children, then they have the right; if it is not conceded to them, as was the case among the Spartans and ancient Romans, then they do not have it. For only society can give or concede it to them; they themselves cannot take it, or give it to themselves.

13th January 2021, 05:23 PM	#468
P.J. Denyer Philosopher Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 7,716	Originally Posted by jadebox The beginning and ending were good. The middle was long, repetitious, and boring (and silly and moronic and ....). I'm a massive Stephen King fan, but I just don't think he can write sci-fi, Tommy Knockers is meh, Under the Dome has one of the worst deus ex-machina endings ever. No-one can do everything...
P.J. Denyer Philosopher Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 7,716	__________________ "I know my brain cannot tell me what to think." - Scorpion "Nebulous means Nebulous" - Adam Hills

13th January 2021, 05:44 PM	#469
turingtest Mistral, mistral wind... Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Embedded, reporting from Mississippi Posts: 4,529	Originally Posted by theprestige I keep trying to think of the worst Stephen King book I ever read. I've actually been pretty pleased with his body of work overall. Some of his later books faltered a bit in places, but none of them stand out in my mind as "... but this was the worst of them all." Some of the later Dark Tower stuff was kinda weak. From a Buick 8 was okay, but somehow derivative. I thought Bag of Bones was fine. I thought it was interesting that he explained his process of saving his weaker manuscripts, in case he ever needed to publish second-rate crap while on a deadline with writer's block. "Oh," I thought. "So that's what's going on here." Then I read Dreamcatcher and thought, "now this is a bag of bones!" But I liked it. It's the kind of book you'd get if Stephen King's estate gave an unfinished manuscript to someone who had a knack for aping King's voice, and knew how to put in all of King's favorite tropes and themes. Not great, but not terrible, either. Gets weaker at the end. For some reason the movie adaptation really digs deep into that weak ending, and makes it even weaker, instead of doing a proper rewrite into something stronger. Full disclosure: I stopped reading King almost entirely after Bag of Bones, with a couple exceptions here and there. I finished the Dark Tower, and thought the ending went a long way towards redeeming the weakness of the later books in that series. And then after the Dark Tower, I stopped reading King altogether. So I have no idea how good or bad any of his more recent stuff is. For me, it'll always be The Stand, the Derry-verse, and Dark Tower 1-3. I don't know how you feel about his short story collections, but at least with those, the (relative, in some cases) shortness of the stories means that even the bad ones don't take long to get past. Two of my favorite stories have been "The Things They Left Behind," from Just After Sunset, which I found pretty powerful, and "Premium Harmony," from The Bazaar of Bad Dreams, which I admit made me laugh out loud at the ending and kind of ashamed I did. (Of his novels, I have to say Hearts In Atlantis was my favorite) Oh, this is bad books, isn't it? Anything by Clive Cussler. I remember reading Raise The Titanic when I was young, and being entertained by it, though I can't recall any specifics about it. A few years ago, based on that vague memory, I gave Valhalla Rising a try, and, from that, have absolutely no desire to re-read Titanic to see why I found it entertaining. Gah, Valhalla was bad, bad, bad- a sample of the dialogue (from memory, may not be word-for-word, but close enough): (Our hero, Dirk Pitt, is being introduced to some woman, a reporter or something)- Quote: "My name is Dirk Pitt." "Oh, such a strong name- I like it," she replied, eyeing him speculatively. As I said, that's not word for word, but it's close enough to get the flavor. Honestly, every bit of dialogue in the book is like that, stilted readings from characters who know they're in a book. And at one point, the plot has Pitt and a sidekick or somebody stranded out in the middle of the ocean with absolutely no way and no hope of getting to some place they must be right away in order to save the day- no hope, that is, until a stranger with a fancy boat appears and takes them aboard to drop them off where they can get a plane. Who was that stranger? Quote: "My name," said he, with a twinkle in his eye, "is...Clive Cussler!" Apparently, Cussler decided that his success from crap like Titanic excused him for any lapses into blatant "deus ex machina" nonsense.
	__________________ I'm tired of the bombs, tired of the bullets, tired of the crazies on TV; I'm the aviator, a dream's a dream whatever it seems Deep Purple- "The Aviator" Life was a short shelf that came with bookends- Stephen King Last edited by turingtest; 13th January 2021 at 05:46 PM. Reason: clarify

13th January 2021, 07:31 PM	#470
TragicMonkey Poisoned Waffles Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Monkey Posts: 58,842	Originally Posted by P.J. Denyer I'm a massive Stephen King fan, but I just don't think he can write sci-fi, Tommy Knockers is meh, Under the Dome has one of the worst deus ex-machina endings ever. No-one can do everything... I've only read a couple of Stephen King books. I wasn't impressed by the plots or the atmosphere but by the characterizations--he excels in constructing quite poignant life stories for minor characters, in a just a few paragraphs to show who they were right before they get brutally slaughtered by whatever-it-is. He did it several times in It with very minor characters; and it's having a window into the interior lives of these people that makes it matter when they get killed by the monster. King's victims aren't just some nameless rabble who were in the wrong place at the wrong time, they are complete human beings with their own unique lives and stories. I found that impressive, it's not something frequently found in the horror genre.
	__________________ You added nothing to that conversation, Barbara.

15th January 2021, 06:06 AM	#471
malbui Beauf Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 2,751	(Peig) Originally Posted by catsmate In my day it was compulsory reading. I didn't go through the Irish school system at all but I was raised in a family of... let's call them language enthusiasts.
malbui Beauf Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 2,751	__________________ "But Master! Does not the fire need water too? Does not the mountain need the storm? Does not your scrotum need kicking?"

15th January 2021, 09:36 AM	#472
The Greater Fool Illuminator Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Milky Way, Sol, Earth, Northern Hemisphere, USA, AZ, Scottsdale Posts: 4,291	Originally Posted by TragicMonkey I've only read a couple of Stephen King books. I wasn't impressed by the plots or the atmosphere but by the characterizations--he excels in constructing quite poignant life stories for minor characters, in a just a few paragraphs to show who they were right before they get brutally slaughtered by whatever-it-is. He did it several times in It with very minor characters; and it's having a window into the interior lives of these people that makes it matter when they get killed by the monster. King's victims aren't just some nameless rabble who were in the wrong place at the wrong time, they are complete human beings with their own unique lives and stories. I found that impressive, it's not something frequently found in the horror genre. He is a good story teller telling less than great stories.
	__________________ - "Who is the greater fool? The fool? Or the one arguing with the fool?" [Various; Uknown] - "The only way to win is not to play." [Tsig quoting 'War Games']

15th January 2021, 10:19 AM	#473
alfaniner Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Aug 2001 Posts: 24,540	Note on an earlier post -- Yesterday I Googled the author's name on my laptop just to see someone's review of his stuff. I have not looked at any of his books or info before. Last night I'm browsing Facebook on my phone, and an ad for that author's book came up. I have all the standard ad-blocking-do-not-track stuff on my laptop, and I don't use the FB app on either (I access it through Firefox), and I don't stay signed in on Google. It's not unexpected, but it's still somewhat disturbing. FB and Google have their feelers into everything.
	__________________ Science is self-correcting. Woo is self-contradicting.

15th January 2021, 10:31 AM	#474
Guybrush Threepwood Trainee Pirate Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: An Uaimh Posts: 3,031	Originally Posted by turingtest I don't know how you feel about his short story collections, but at least with those, the (relative, in some cases) shortness of the stories means that even the bad ones don't take long to get past. Two of my favorite stories have been "The Things They Left Behind," from Just After Sunset, which I found pretty powerful, and "Premium Harmony," from The Bazaar of Bad Dreams, which I admit made me laugh out loud at the ending and kind of ashamed I did. (Of his novels, I have to say Hearts In Atlantis was my favorite) Oh, this is bad books, isn't it? Anything by Clive Cussler. I remember reading Raise The Titanic when I was young, and being entertained by it, though I can't recall any specifics about it. A few years ago, based on that vague memory, I gave Valhalla Rising a try, and, from that, have absolutely no desire to re-read Titanic to see why I found it entertaining. Gah, Valhalla was bad, bad, bad- a sample of the dialogue (from memory, may not be word-for-word, but close enough): (Our hero, Dirk Pitt, is being introduced to some woman, a reporter or something)- As I said, that's not word for word, but it's close enough to get the flavor. Honestly, every bit of dialogue in the book is like that, stilted readings from characters who know they're in a book. And at one point, the plot has Pitt and a sidekick or somebody stranded out in the middle of the ocean with absolutely no way and no hope of getting to some place they must be right away in order to save the day- no hope, that is, until a stranger with a fancy boat appears and takes them aboard to drop them off where they can get a plane. Who was that stranger? Apparently, Cussler decided that his success from crap like Titanic excused him for any lapses into blatant "deus ex machina" nonsense. That's just small stuff for Clive Cussler. (He writes himself into lots of the books btw) My two favourites are when Dirk Pitt sails from Cuba to the US in a bathtub and when the Secretary General of the UN thanks him for saving her life by having sex with him, and despite the fact that Dirk is in a hospital bed with three (I think) bullet holes in him it's the best ride she has ever had. They just don't write books like that any more. Or at least I hope they don't, I rather suspect some Cussler spawn is still churning them out.

15th January 2021, 04:34 PM	#475
catsmate No longer the 1 Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 23,429	Originally Posted by malbui (Peig) I didn't go through the Irish school system at all but I was raised in a family of... let's call them language enthusiasts.
	__________________ As human right is always something given, it always in reality reduces to the right which men give, "concede," to each other. If the right to existence is conceded to new-born children, then they have the right; if it is not conceded to them, as was the case among the Spartans and ancient Romans, then they do not have it. For only society can give or concede it to them; they themselves cannot take it, or give it to themselves.