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Old 15th December 2021, 07:46 AM   #1
carlitos
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Ongoing Adventures of Kyle Rittenhouse

Mr. Rittenhouse is no longer on trial and moving on to his next phase in life. Here we can discuss the social issues that surround these current events.

Last edited by carlitos; 15th December 2021 at 07:48 AM.
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Old 15th December 2021, 07:48 AM   #2
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For example

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Old 15th December 2021, 07:57 AM   #3
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That's the pic they used? He still has the world's most punchable face.

Wake me up when the Kyle Rittenhouse speed bag hits the market.
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Old 15th December 2021, 08:07 AM   #4
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
That's the pic they used? He still has the world's most punchable face.

Wake me up when the Kyle Rittenhouse speed bag hits the market.
Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
Truth. Dying and killing are nothing to cheer about. It's always a somber affair, even when it has to be done.
I guess physical violence that stops short of death is all fun and games.
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Old 15th December 2021, 08:13 AM   #5
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Someday he'll be old enough to grow a beard. That might help.

Not much. And remember, I said "might."
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Old 15th December 2021, 08:15 AM   #6
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If he's palling around with TPUSA, I wonder if they are paying for him to get some media training, working on his stump speech, etc.

Turning Point USA needs the younger folks like Kyle. The co-founder, Bill Montgomery, died of Covid 19 last year, and Charlie Kirk is a 28-year-old Boomer who sounds like someone's angry old uncle.
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Old 15th December 2021, 08:15 AM   #7
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
I guess physical violence that stops short of death is all fun and games.
What part of that don't you understand? Yours truly is a huge fan of busting a mother ****** in the chops, both recreationally and as a method of expounding on philosophical differences. But don't kill them. Everyone deserves the chance to reconsider their life choices, or at least to fight another day.
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Old 15th December 2021, 08:23 AM   #8
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
What part of that don't you understand? Yours truly is a huge fan of busting a mother ****** in the chops, both recreationally and as a method of expounding on philosophical differences. But don't kill them. Everyone deserves the chance to reconsider their life choices, or at least to fight another day.
What I don't understand is why you think that, once violence starts, it's easy to keep it from escalating to the point where someone does get killed. Violence is very much a slippery slope.
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Old 15th December 2021, 08:34 AM   #9
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
What I don't understand is why you think that, once violence starts, it's easy to keep it from escalating to the point where someone does get killed. Violence is very much a slippery slope.
Lifelong experience, and observation of others.

Note that I didn't advocate actually hitting Kyle. It's the knowledge I have that he is a coward that makes him a focal point for my distaste of cowards, hence a good speed bag image.

And yes, his utter cowardice is a matter of public record now. If you willingly insert yourself into any kind of a brawl with a high powered rifle, having no other possible means of getting out other than to shoot your way out, ya bitch ass is a sniveling coward.
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Old 15th December 2021, 08:41 AM   #10
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
Lifelong experience, and observation of others.

Note that I didn't advocate actually hitting Kyle. It's the knowledge I have that he is a coward that makes him a focal point for my distaste of cowards, hence a good speed bag image.

And yes, his utter cowardice is a matter of public record now. If you willingly insert yourself into any kind of a brawl with a high powered rifle, having no other possible means of getting out other than to shoot your way out, ya bitch ass is a sniveling coward.
I'm not really interested in your opinions of what constitutes cowardice or bravery, it has no relevance to public policy and thus serves no purpose but to justify your emotional response. But the Rittenhouse case seems like it's a prime example of exactly what I'm talking about. You described the situation as a "brawl", suggesting the level of violence wouldn't turn lethal on its own.

And yet, it did turn lethal. Participants other than Kyle initiated violence, knowing full well that a gun was present and might be used. And sure enough, violence escalated to lethal levels. You want to blame the presence of the gun, but fatal violence can happen even in the absence of a gun. I blame the willingness to initiate violence. Fatal violence cannot occur if nobody initiates violence.
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Old 15th December 2021, 08:45 AM   #11
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Originally Posted by carlitos View Post
Ongoing Adventures of Kyle Rittenhouse
I'm more interested in the Ongoing Adventures of Jussie Smollett.
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Old 15th December 2021, 09:18 AM   #12
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
I'm not really interested in your opinions of what constitutes cowardice or bravery, it has no relevance to public policy and thus serves no purpose but to justify your emotional response.
Funny that you think my speed bag preferences are worthy of note, then. I wasn't aware that they impacted public policy. TIL.

Quote:
But the Rittenhouse case seems like it's a prime example of exactly what I'm talking about. You described the situation as a "brawl", suggesting the level of violence wouldn't turn lethal on its own.
No, that's your imagination (although excepting Kyle, it didn't). They can turn lethal, of course, just like driving to the grocery store for milk can. But it not the reasonable intent or expectation.

Quote:
And yet, it did turn lethal.
Thanks, Rittenhouse.

Quote:
Participants other than Kyle initiated violence, knowing full well that a gun was present and might be used. And sure enough, violence escalated to lethal levels. You want to blame the presence of the gun, but fatal violence can happen even in the absence of a gun. I blame the willingness to initiate violence. Fatal violence cannot occur if nobody initiates violence.
You truly don't get how these two went hand-in-hand, do you?

Like you, I don't blame the presence of the gun. I blame the guy who brought it in as his sole means of negotiating his way through a riot. That is "the willingness to initiate violence" in a nutshell. He willingly initiated lethal violence at an unarmed man who had not touched him, and who he could effortlessly retreat from. Hell, Rosenbaum couldn't stay on his feet without stumbling.

A gun as a means of last resort is fine. As a first and only choice, not fine.

But tis the subject of another thread. This one is, I believe, you calling me out for hypocrisy or something?
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Last edited by Thermal; 15th December 2021 at 09:21 AM.
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Old 15th December 2021, 09:27 AM   #13
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Originally Posted by carlitos View Post
It's a picture and they can't even get his tie straight? Or a suit that fits? Or square his shoulders? I had some nice things to say about him recently, I take all of them back. I thought he wanted to let it go and not use the incident to garner a lot of fame. It looks like, as is common with the right wing, he's just another grifter making money from being a douche.

Originally Posted by sir drinks-a-lot View Post
I'm more interested in the Ongoing Adventures of Jussie Smollett.
Then start a thread....Oh! Oh, you just wanted to throw in a whataboutism. That's on par with the quality level of any other post you make.
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Old 15th December 2021, 09:28 AM   #14
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
But tis the subject of another thread. This one is, I believe, you calling me out for hypocrisy or something?
Not hypocrisy as such. You're drawing a distinction which I don't think is really justified, but it's not actually hypocritical.
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Old 15th December 2021, 09:32 AM   #15
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Originally Posted by sir drinks-a-lot View Post
I'm more interested in the Ongoing Adventures of Jussie Smollett.
I’m more interested in how the Winter Olympics are going to deal with Covid.
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Old 15th December 2021, 09:41 AM   #16
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
Not hypocrisy as such. You're drawing a distinction which I don't think is really justified, but it's not actually hypocritical.
My distinction relies on mutual consent, including the implied consent of unnecessarily placing yourself in a riot.

Goofy as it sounds, it's the Fight Club philosophy (if I remember the plot correctly). Better to get violent impulses out in the conventional way, than to buy and train with firearms, fantasizing about the opportunity to take it to the nuclear option as first option. Living with a bloody nose is better than being on trial for shooting an unarmed man that you could easily trot away from, IMO.
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Old 15th December 2021, 09:44 AM   #17
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
My distinction relies on mutual consent
There never was mutual consent, and none of the people involved ever thought there was. Nor would there be in a hypothetical case of someone punching Kyle's "punchable" face.
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Old 15th December 2021, 09:47 AM   #18
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
There never was mutual consent, and none of the people involved ever thought there was.
What should be the expected outcome in willingly placing yourself, adversarially and alone, in a riot?

Quote:
Nor would there be in a hypothetical case of someone punching Kyle's "punchable" face.
Noting that it is in fact "punchable" does not advocate physically doing so.
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Old 15th December 2021, 09:54 AM   #19
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Originally Posted by Dr. Keith View Post
I’m more interested in how the Winter Olympics are going to deal with Covid.
I worry occasionally about the livelihoods of hookers and porn stars too.
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Old 15th December 2021, 10:03 AM   #20
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
What should be the expected outcome in willingly placing yourself, adversarially and alone, in a riot?
What should be the expected outcome of going to a bar late at night with a short skirt? That's consent right there.

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Old 15th December 2021, 10:13 AM   #21
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
What should be the expected outcome of going to a bar late at night with a short skirt? That's consent right there.

No, a bar is a meeting place for socializing, usually with more than a nodding acquaintance with compliance with law, and often security or at least 911. Regardless of skirt length, the social contract is in place. She should have no reason to expect to be raped on a poll table.

A riot is a violent place where mother ******* are off the leash. Do you have an answer to my question?
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Old 15th December 2021, 10:33 AM   #22
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
She should have no reason to expect to be raped on a poll table.
American elections are endlessly fascinating.
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Old 15th December 2021, 10:39 AM   #23
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Just a note that, when I wrote the thread title, I thought that this could be a place where we could discuss what Kyle Rittenhouse is up to, not Jussie Smollett, rape analogies or assault fantasies. I am not a moderator, but I thank you all for your consideration.
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Old 15th December 2021, 10:51 AM   #24
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Originally Posted by sir drinks-a-lot View Post
I'm more interested in the Ongoing Adventures of Jussie Smollett.
There will be a lot less amused speculation around here about Juss-Juss getting gang-raped than there was about Ky-Ky.
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Old 15th December 2021, 10:57 AM   #25
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Originally Posted by Brainster View Post
There will be a lot less amused speculation around here about Juss-Juss getting gang-raped than there was about Ky-Ky.
Can you guys take that **** to the Jussie thread, as carlitos requested? Not everyone cares about Jussie and it has zero relevance to this case.
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Old 15th December 2021, 11:03 AM   #26
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Can we fantasize about who Kyle would shoot if he ran across Jussie getting adventurously and ongoingly raped?
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Old 15th December 2021, 11:05 AM   #27
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
No, a bar is a meeting place for socializing
And for meeting people to have sex with.

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A riot is a violent place where mother ******* are off the leash.
I don't accept that riots are themselves acceptable. I don't accept that people can unilaterally choose to abrogate the social contract that you can't just assault people. I don't accept that being present and abiding by the law constitutes any form of consent to be assaulted.

And you aren't noble for thinking that it is.

Quote:
Do you have an answer to my question?
I think I've made my answer clear: I don't think it matters after the fact. Just like it's worth pondering how short a skirt you should wear BEFORE you go to the bar, but is really of no concern afterwards.
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Old 15th December 2021, 11:44 AM   #28
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
I don't accept that riots are themselves acceptable.
I didn't say it was. But there it is: a lawless and violent situation.

Quote:
I think I've made my answer clear:.
You have not. You've answered other questions that aren't being asked.

Posit: Jussie Smollett is being ongoingly gang raped on a pool table by men who have matching t-shirts on that say "Violently Gang Raping Men Against Their Will Over Here R Us". Kyle adventurously walks in the middle of it. What can Kyle reasonably expect to happen?


Eta: we really do need a thread dedicated to the scope of self defense. This argument comes up a lot.
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Last edited by Thermal; 15th December 2021 at 11:49 AM.
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Old 15th December 2021, 11:52 AM   #29
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
Posit: Jussie Smollett is being ongoingly gang raped on a pool table by men who have matching t-shirts on that say "Violently Gang Raping Men Against Their Will Over Here R Us". Kyle adventurously walks in the middle of it. What can Kyle reasonably expect to happen?
That's too far out of my experience to judge. Perhaps you have experience in such matters.

But I am less concerned by what I should expect to happen than I am in what I think people are justified in doing. One reason is that sometimes my expectations aren't justified because I don't fully understand a situation, another is that events can violate even fully justified expectations.

People are justified in being in public obeying the law. They are justified in defending themselves if attacked. They are not justified in attacking people unprovoked.
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Old 15th December 2021, 12:14 PM   #30
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
I worry occasionally about the livelihoods of hookers and porn stars too.
Now you’ve made me concerned. I’ll have to do some looking into that.
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Old 15th December 2021, 12:18 PM   #31
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Originally Posted by carlitos View Post
Just a note that, when I wrote the thread title, I thought that this could be a place where we could discuss what Kyle Rittenhouse is up to, not Jussie Smollett, rape analogies or assault fantasies. I am not a moderator, but I thank you all for your consideration.
So, we can talk about if Kyle is going the Winter Olympics and how that may impact the livelihood of hookers in the area?
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Old 15th December 2021, 12:24 PM   #32
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I think "Ongoing Adventures of Kyle Rittenhouse" should be a reality show. Just put him in a house with several like-minded yokels and goons, give them some loaded guns, and leave the cameras running.
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Old 15th December 2021, 12:26 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by Dr. Keith View Post
So, we can talk about if Kyle is going the Winter Olympics and how that may impact the livelihood of hookers in the area?
What, has he qualified for Biathlon? I'm not sure how good a skier he is, but he's got the shooting part down pat.
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Old 15th December 2021, 12:29 PM   #34
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How much mileage you figure he gets out of this?

I can't recall how long Zimmerman was a right wing media darling, but it wasn't too long before he was resorting to being a professional scumbag, signing confederate art and the like for pocket change.

Doesn't really seem like it's worth it, a lifetime of stigma just to eek out maybe 6 months to a year of puff pieces on fashy podcasts.
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Old 15th December 2021, 12:51 PM   #35
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Originally Posted by SuburbanTurkey View Post
How much mileage you figure he gets out of this?

I can't recall how long Zimmerman was a right wing media darling, but it wasn't too long before he was resorting to being a professional scumbag, signing confederate art and the like for pocket change.

Doesn't really seem like it's worth it, a lifetime of stigma just to eek out maybe 6 months to a year of puff pieces on fashy podcasts.
Well, he'll probably at least get a book deal out of it, I imagine.

It may not be "worth it" for the fame and fortune, but at least he is alive.
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Old 15th December 2021, 01:01 PM   #36
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Originally Posted by shemp View Post
What, has he qualified for Biathlon? I'm not sure how good a skier he is, but he's got the shooting part down pat.
Some patriots even go as spectators. And to check on the livelihood of the local hookers. For research. And some go to sit in a booth with a microphone and talk to like minded patriots back home about how unAmerican so many foreigners are. Surely OAN will find KyKy doing some of the above.
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Old 15th December 2021, 01:02 PM   #37
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Originally Posted by Warp12 View Post
Well, he'll probably at least get a book deal out of it, I imagine.

It may not be "worth it" for the fame and fortune, but at least he is alive.
Will it be one of those books where you can pick alternate endings?
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Old 15th December 2021, 01:05 PM   #38
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
Will it be one of those books where you can pick alternate endings?
A romance angle and lover's quarrel with Rosenbaum?
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Old 15th December 2021, 01:09 PM   #39
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
Will it be one of those books where you can pick alternate endings?
I heard it was a picture book. That’s the vogue amongst the GQP now.
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Old 15th December 2021, 01:18 PM   #40
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Being able to kill people (the right kind of people) and escape legal consequences for doing so is a common power-fantasy of conservative gun owners, and anyone who manages to accomplish that in real life will attain celebrity in that community as a symbol of vicarious wish-fulfillment. This isn't surprising or compelling stuff.
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