ISF Logo   IS Forum
Forum Index Register Members List Events Mark Forums Read Help

Go Back   International Skeptics Forum » General Topics » Social Issues & Current Events
 


Welcome to the International Skeptics Forum, where we discuss skepticism, critical thinking, the paranormal and science in a friendly but lively way. You are currently viewing the forum as a guest, which means you are missing out on discussing matters that are of interest to you. Please consider registering so you can gain full use of the forum features and interact with other Members. Registration is simple, fast and free! Click here to register today.
Tags gun incidents , police incidents , police misconduct charges , shooting incidents

Reply
Old 26th June 2017, 06:48 PM   #801
alfaniner
Penultimate Amazing
 
alfaniner's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Posts: 17,023
If I may offer a rare totally cynical comment...

I wonder if the girlfriend Diamond Reynolds is going to challenge the family for some of that money. After all, she was in the car. And so was her girl.

Does she deserve some of it? I honestly think, yes.
__________________
Science is self-correcting.
Woo is self-contradicting.
alfaniner is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 26th June 2017, 07:30 PM   #802
KatieG
Rootin' Tootin' Raspberry
 
KatieG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: at the end of the Oregon Trail
Posts: 3,731
I think she's filed her own suit. Must go look.
__________________
"I never thought leopards would eat MY face", sobs the woman who voted for Leopards Eating People's Faces Party
KatieG is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 26th June 2017, 07:36 PM   #803
quadraginta
Becoming Beth
 
quadraginta's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Central Vale of Humility
Posts: 18,690
Originally Posted by alfaniner View Post
If I may offer a rare totally cynical comment...

I wonder if the girlfriend Diamond Reynolds is going to challenge the family for some of that money. After all, she was in the car. And so was her girl.

Does she deserve some of it? I honestly think, yes.

Is there some reason to think she needs to?

Challenge them, that is?
__________________
"It never does just what I want, but only what I tell it."
quadraginta is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 26th June 2017, 08:02 PM   #804
a_unique_person
Director of Hatcheries and Conditioning
 
a_unique_person's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Waiting for the pod bay door to open.
Posts: 38,011
Originally Posted by Skeptic Tank View Post
I dunno, personally... I think that when an armed police officer who you've just informed about your gun starts loudly and repeatedly screaming "don't reach for it! don't pull it out!" and then even goes so far as to reach into your car and try to stop your hand from getting where it's going... it's pretty clear that he wants you to halt all hand movements and keep your hands where he can see them.
He was probably moving his hands away from the gun.
__________________
Continually pushing the boundaries of mediocrity.
Everything is possible, but not everything is probable.
For if a man pretend to me that God hath spoken to him supernaturally, and immediately, and I make doubt of it, I cannot easily perceive what argument he can produce to oblige me to believe it. Hobbes
a_unique_person is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 27th June 2017, 07:11 AM   #805
alfaniner
Penultimate Amazing
 
alfaniner's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Posts: 17,023
Originally Posted by quadraginta View Post
Is there some reason to think she needs to?

Challenge them, that is?
My initial, cynical thought was "entitlement". But I think she would have a case with reckless endangerment for herself and her child.
__________________
Science is self-correcting.
Woo is self-contradicting.
alfaniner is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 27th June 2017, 09:04 AM   #806
quadraginta
Becoming Beth
 
quadraginta's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Central Vale of Humility
Posts: 18,690
Originally Posted by alfaniner View Post
My initial, cynical thought was "entitlement". But I think she would have a case with reckless endangerment for herself and her child.

What I was getting at is whether there is reason to believe the family is withholding any share of the settlement from her and the child.

Do we have reason to believe they are?
__________________
"It never does just what I want, but only what I tell it."
quadraginta is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 27th June 2017, 09:07 AM   #807
ponderingturtle
Orthogonal Vector
 
ponderingturtle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 39,292
At least we have the juries finding that knowing someone has a gun is a rational reason to be afraid of them. CCW's do invoke fear in people and that is found to be reasonable in court.
__________________
Sufficiently advanced Woo is indistinguishable from Parody
"There shall be no *poofing* in science" Paul C. Anagnostopoulos
Force ***** on reasons back" Ben Franklin
ponderingturtle is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 27th June 2017, 10:32 AM   #808
Mumbles
Illuminator
 
Mumbles's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 4,591
Originally Posted by quadraginta View Post
Anyone want a pool on how long it takes Officer Yanez to get hired on by a different police dept. somewhere else?
I hope he takes his training to heart, and simply refuses to get involved in situations like this again, ever.

But...

He can show up again...
Mumbles is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 27th June 2017, 11:20 AM   #809
quadraginta
Becoming Beth
 
quadraginta's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Central Vale of Humility
Posts: 18,690
Originally Posted by ponderingturtle View Post
At least we have the juries finding that knowing someone has a gun is a rational reason to be afraid of them. CCW's do invoke fear in people and that is found to be reasonable in court.

It would be better if that realization applied to parties beyond cops blowing away brown people while in a state of panic.
__________________
"It never does just what I want, but only what I tell it."
quadraginta is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 27th June 2017, 11:22 AM   #810
quadraginta
Becoming Beth
 
quadraginta's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Central Vale of Humility
Posts: 18,690
Originally Posted by Mumbles View Post
I hope he takes his training to heart, and simply refuses to get involved in situations like this again, ever.

But...

He can show up again...

I'm going with more than a year, less than three.

He might have to take a short sabbatical as a mall rent-a-cop until the heat dies down.
__________________
"It never does just what I want, but only what I tell it."
quadraginta is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 27th June 2017, 11:24 AM   #811
ponderingturtle
Orthogonal Vector
 
ponderingturtle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 39,292
Originally Posted by quadraginta View Post
It would be better if that realization applied to parties beyond cops blowing away brown people while in a state of panic.
But it is a reasonable panic. The jury said so.
__________________
Sufficiently advanced Woo is indistinguishable from Parody
"There shall be no *poofing* in science" Paul C. Anagnostopoulos
Force ***** on reasons back" Ben Franklin
ponderingturtle is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 27th June 2017, 11:28 AM   #812
Mumbles
Illuminator
 
Mumbles's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 4,591
Originally Posted by quadraginta View Post
I'm going with more than a year, less than three.

He might have to take a short sabbatical as a mall rent-a-cop until the heat dies down.
That's quite possibly true. I'd like to think that'd that we are at least win this restriction.

But sadly, you may absolutely correct.
Mumbles is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 27th June 2017, 01:23 PM   #813
Skeptic Tank
Trigger Warning
 
Skeptic Tank's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 2,210
Originally Posted by quadraginta View Post
It would be better if that realization applied to parties beyond cops blowing away brown people while in a state of panic.
What are you basing your assertion that this case hinged on Mr. Castile's race on?

Your assertion that Officer Yanez's concern over his actions was connected to, or amplified by, his race?

Where's that coming from?

You realize Officer Yanez is also brown right?
__________________
"Nothing is more certainly written in the book of fate than that these people are to be free. Nor is it less certain that the two races, equally free, cannot live in the same government. Nature, habit, opinion has drawn indelible lines of distinction between them." - Thomas Jefferson
Reality is going to force you to become me.
Skeptic Tank is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 27th June 2017, 02:46 PM   #814
quadraginta
Becoming Beth
 
quadraginta's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Central Vale of Humility
Posts: 18,690
Originally Posted by Mumbles View Post
That's quite possibly true. I'd like to think that'd that we are at least win this restriction.

But sadly, you may absolutely correct.

Sheriff Clarke would probably hire him straight off. With a raise and a bonus, I expect.

Unless he's too busy trying to go to work for Trump.
__________________
"It never does just what I want, but only what I tell it."
quadraginta is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 27th June 2017, 07:27 PM   #815
Mumbles
Illuminator
 
Mumbles's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 4,591
Originally Posted by quadraginta View Post
Sheriff Clarke would probably hire him straight off. With a raise and a bonus, I expect.

Unless he's too busy trying to go to work for Trump.
I'm sure that a-hole Clarke would. But he's absolutely evil - the exact person I want to kick out of any authority.

So...I guess look toward local elections?
Mumbles is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 12th July 2017, 01:05 PM   #816
ponderingturtle
Orthogonal Vector
 
ponderingturtle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 39,292
http://www.pbs.org/newshour/rundown/...eceive-buyout/

Well he is not longer a cop there. So he only made $48,000 for shooting Philando Castile.
__________________
Sufficiently advanced Woo is indistinguishable from Parody
"There shall be no *poofing* in science" Paul C. Anagnostopoulos
Force ***** on reasons back" Ben Franklin
ponderingturtle is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 12th July 2017, 01:35 PM   #817
Mumbles
Illuminator
 
Mumbles's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 4,591
Originally Posted by ponderingturtle View Post
http://www.pbs.org/newshour/rundown/...eceive-buyout/

Well he is not longer a cop there. So he only made $48,000 for shooting Philando Castile.
seems like a good price to get rid of him. I'm still worried that the cop in question will just end up as a cop at another department - and it doesn't help that the white supremacist PD over in Ferguson actually sent him words of encouragement.
Mumbles is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 12th July 2017, 02:17 PM   #818
quadraginta
Becoming Beth
 
quadraginta's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Central Vale of Humility
Posts: 18,690
Originally Posted by ponderingturtle View Post
http://www.pbs.org/newshour/rundown/...eceive-buyout/

Well he is not longer a cop there. So he only made $48,000 for shooting Philando Castile.

Plus "... up to 600 hours of unused personal leave pay.", which ballparks out to around another twenty grand.

Not bad for a day's work.

It'll give him plenty of cushion while he's picking another cop shop to work for.
__________________
"It never does just what I want, but only what I tell it."
quadraginta is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 13th July 2017, 03:14 AM   #819
ponderingturtle
Orthogonal Vector
 
ponderingturtle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 39,292
Originally Posted by Mumbles View Post
seems like a good price to get rid of him. I'm still worried that the cop in question will just end up as a cop at another department - and it doesn't help that the white supremacist PD over in Ferguson actually sent him words of encouragement.
Probably. Kind of puts lie to those claims that cops are fired for failures to follow policy and such. If that really happened they wouldn't have had to buy this guy out.
__________________
Sufficiently advanced Woo is indistinguishable from Parody
"There shall be no *poofing* in science" Paul C. Anagnostopoulos
Force ***** on reasons back" Ben Franklin
ponderingturtle is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 13th July 2017, 11:38 AM   #820
Ranb
Philosopher
 
Ranb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: WA USA
Posts: 8,154
The NRA finally has more to say. But maybe they shouldn't have bothered at all.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/...b02e9bdb0e0e9e
Quote:
On CNN, Loesch said on behalf of the NRA that the death of Castile is “absolutely awful” and “a terrible tragedy that could have been avoided.”


“I don’t agree with every single decision that comes out from courtrooms of America. There are a lot of variables in this particular case and there were a lot of things that I wish would have been done differently,” Loesch told the CNN host. “Do I believe that Philando Castile deserved to lose his life over a [traffic] stop? I absolutely do not. I also think that this is why we have things like NRA carry guard, not only to reach out to the citizens to go over what to do during stops like this, but also to work with law enforcement so that they understand what citizens are experiencing when they go through stops like this.”
If the NRA can call the ATF jack booted thugs, then at the very least they could have called the cop who shot Castile a 150 pound pussy with a badge and gun. But they didn't; after all in the NRA's eyes he was probably just another man killed because he was "carrying while black".

Did she really use this event to push their "carry guard" crap? Or was she actually putting the blame on the victim?

Last edited by Ranb; 13th July 2017 at 11:40 AM.
Ranb is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 13th July 2017, 11:43 AM   #821
quadraginta
Becoming Beth
 
quadraginta's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Central Vale of Humility
Posts: 18,690
Originally Posted by Ranb View Post
The NRA finally has more to say. But maybe they shouldn't have bothered at all.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/...b02e9bdb0e0e9e

If the NRA can call the ATF jack booted thugs, then at the very least they could have called the cop who shot Castile a 150 pound pussy with a badge and gun. But they didn't; after all in the NRA's eyes he was probably just another man killed because he was "carrying while black".

Did she really use this event to push their "carry guard" crap? Or was she actually putting the blame on the victim?

Well, he was "carrying while black", so I don't think his guilt can be questioned as far as that goes.

That's why his killer got a nearly $70,000 bonus along with his exoneration.
__________________
"It never does just what I want, but only what I tell it."

Last edited by quadraginta; 13th July 2017 at 11:45 AM.
quadraginta is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 13th July 2017, 12:15 PM   #822
ponderingturtle
Orthogonal Vector
 
ponderingturtle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 39,292
Originally Posted by Ranb View Post
The NRA finally has more to say. But maybe they shouldn't have bothered at all.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/...b02e9bdb0e0e9e

If the NRA can call the ATF jack booted thugs, then at the very least they could have called the cop who shot Castile a 150 pound pussy with a badge and gun. But they didn't; after all in the NRA's eyes he was probably just another man killed because he was "carrying while black".

Did she really use this event to push their "carry guard" crap? Or was she actually putting the blame on the victim?
Of course the NRA isn't going to support the rights of black gun owners, they have a long history of fighting those. When some uppity black guy thinks he has actual second amendment rights he is going to get into trouble.

The NRA isn't ever going to criticise a cop just for shooting a black man. So they needed to pretend this was just a minor misunderstanding. Funny really.
__________________
Sufficiently advanced Woo is indistinguishable from Parody
"There shall be no *poofing* in science" Paul C. Anagnostopoulos
Force ***** on reasons back" Ben Franklin

Last edited by ponderingturtle; 13th July 2017 at 12:18 PM.
ponderingturtle is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 13th July 2017, 12:17 PM   #823
ponderingturtle
Orthogonal Vector
 
ponderingturtle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 39,292
Originally Posted by quadraginta View Post
Well, he was "carrying while black", so I don't think his guilt can be questioned as far as that goes.

That's why his killer got a nearly $70,000 bonus along with his exoneration.
If they felt he really did anything wrong they wouldn't have had to pay him off to fire him. Clearly in the eyes of his fellow cops he wasn't all that far out there.
__________________
Sufficiently advanced Woo is indistinguishable from Parody
"There shall be no *poofing* in science" Paul C. Anagnostopoulos
Force ***** on reasons back" Ben Franklin
ponderingturtle is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 13th July 2017, 12:44 PM   #824
quadraginta
Becoming Beth
 
quadraginta's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Central Vale of Humility
Posts: 18,690
Originally Posted by ponderingturtle View Post
If they felt he really did anything wrong they wouldn't have had to pay him off to fire him. Clearly in the eyes of his fellow cops he wasn't all that far out there.

Sorry, but ya gotta go. Here's a bunch of cash to ease the way. Fare well.
__________________
"It never does just what I want, but only what I tell it."
quadraginta is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 13th July 2017, 01:57 PM   #825
Mumbles
Illuminator
 
Mumbles's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 4,591
Originally Posted by Ranb View Post
The NRA finally has more to say. But maybe they shouldn't have bothered at all.
I think the vast majority of black gun owners were expecting that - which is why they created their own organizations to represent their interests.
Mumbles is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 17th July 2017, 02:55 PM   #826
alfaniner
Penultimate Amazing
 
alfaniner's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Posts: 17,023
This thread is related because it's the third (crazy) police incident in the area in recent times.

Australian woman shot dead by Minneapolis police
__________________
Science is self-correcting.
Woo is self-contradicting.
alfaniner is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 17th July 2017, 05:03 PM   #827
Hungry81
Graduate Poster
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 1,445
Originally Posted by alfaniner View Post
This thread is related because it's the third (crazy) police incident in the area in recent times.

Australian woman shot dead by Minneapolis police
Poor widdle powice being confronted by a nasty pyjama wielding victim. So scared they couldn't even manage to turn their body cameras on. Poor babies. Someone get them on paid stress leave and a promotion stat.
Hungry81 is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Reply

International Skeptics Forum » General Topics » Social Issues & Current Events

Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 05:04 PM.
Powered by vBulletin. Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
2014, TribeTech AB. All Rights Reserved.
This forum began as part of the James Randi Education Foundation (JREF). However, the forum now exists as
an independent entity with no affiliation with or endorsement by the JREF, including the section in reference to "JREF" topics.

Disclaimer: Messages posted in the Forum are solely the opinion of their authors.