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Tags donald trump , fascism charges , Trump controversies

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Old 4th September 2020, 08:06 AM   #361
Upchurch
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Encouraging people to vote twice is Orange Man GoodTM!
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Old 4th September 2020, 08:06 AM   #362
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
This entire forum is essentially just Orange Man BadTM now, and you think I need a new tune?
Yes.
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Old 4th September 2020, 08:08 AM   #363
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
He's not a fascist, he's not going to cancel elections, try to turn America into a dictatorship, stay in office past his term, or any of the other myriad things that he's being accused of on a regular basis here.
You say that like he hasn't actually suggested some of those things. That's not so much accusing him as it is accurately discussing his words.
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Old 4th September 2020, 08:21 AM   #364
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Originally Posted by Upchurch View Post
You say that like he hasn't actually suggested some of those things. That's not so much accusing him as it is accurately discussing his words.
It would be funny if it wasn't so demented.

Remember when Republicans used to pretend not to be vote suppressors? Ah the good old days.
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Old 4th September 2020, 08:22 AM   #365
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Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
Yes.
No he's right, Morgue and co have become a one trick pony. All orange man bad all the time.
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Old 4th September 2020, 08:23 AM   #366
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Originally Posted by varwoche View Post
Remember when Republicans used to pretend not to be vote suppressors? Ah the good old days.
Was that before or after conspiring with Russia became the most American thing you can do?
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Old 4th September 2020, 08:27 AM   #367
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Originally Posted by varwoche View Post
It would be funny if it wasn't so demented.

Remember when Republicans used to pretend not to be vote suppressors? Ah the good old days.
And some didnt collude with China to screw the pooch in the election? What have you got against Taiwan anyway?
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Old 4th September 2020, 08:55 AM   #368
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Originally Posted by Upchurch View Post
You say that like he hasn't actually suggested some of those things. That's not so much accusing him as it is accurately discussing his words.
I wonder if Ziggy thinks Putin is a dictator. Putin was elected and re-elected, after all...
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Old 4th September 2020, 08:57 AM   #369
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Originally Posted by rockysmith76 View Post
No he's right, Morgue and co have become a one trick pony. All orange man bad all the time.
I bet they also eat food everyday. They are so unoriginal, therefore they are wrong.
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Old 4th September 2020, 09:02 AM   #370
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If I was Zigg I wouldn't be standing for someone trying to take my throne like this.
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Old 4th September 2020, 09:02 AM   #371
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Originally Posted by thaiboxerken View Post
I bet they also eat food everyday. They are so unoriginal, therefore they are wrong.
One. Trick. Pony.
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Old 4th September 2020, 09:52 AM   #372
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191,392 Trump Covid deaths. That's more than one trick.
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Old 4th September 2020, 10:06 AM   #373
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Originally Posted by thaiboxerken View Post
191,392 Trump Covid deaths. That's more than one trick.
That's only 64 9/11s or around 48,000 Benghazis. Try to keep some perspective.
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Old 4th September 2020, 10:09 AM   #374
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Originally Posted by rockysmith76 View Post
No he's right, Morgue and co have become a one trick pony. All orange man bad all the time.
Your arguments, on the other hand, are nuanced and varied.
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Old 4th September 2020, 11:17 AM   #375
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Originally Posted by Upchurch View Post
That's only 64 9/11s or around 48,000 Benghazis. Try to keep some perspective.
Trump is responsible for the Covid deaths the same way Obama is responsible for the Benghazi deaths. The same way Trump would have been responsible for the Benghazi deaths if it had happened on his watch. The same way Obama would be responsible for the Covid deaths if the pandemic had happened on his watch.
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Old 4th September 2020, 11:36 AM   #376
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Trump is responsible for the Covid deaths the same way Obama is responsible for the Benghazi deaths.
Well, if Americans had been dying at Benghazi for 5+ months and Obama had did very little to mitigate those deaths, maybe.

Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
The same way Trump would have been responsible for the Benghazi deaths if it had happened on his watch.
Republicans felt Clinton was pretty darn responsible for the Benghazi deaths. What was it? 7 investigations? 8?

Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
The same way Obama would be responsible for the Covid deaths if the pandemic had happened on his watch.
Or, perhaps the same way Obama was responsible for his handling of Ebola that happened on his watch?
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Last edited by Upchurch; 4th September 2020 at 11:37 AM.
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Old 5th September 2020, 02:36 AM   #377
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
He's not a fascist, he's not going to cancel elections, try to turn America into a dictatorship, stay in office past his term, or any of the other myriad things that he's being accused of on a regular basis here. And when have Democrats ever thought a Republican president wasn't bad? Before you bother saying it, no, I'm not claiming Republicans are any better in that regard, they think every Democrat president is bad too.
Just for clarification:

is your argument that Trump isn't any worse than any other Republican President?

Because I hope that your argument isn't "you have been wrong in the past, so now, when you are right, it doesn't count."
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Old 5th September 2020, 02:47 AM   #378
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Trump is responsible for the Covid deaths the same way Obama is responsible for the Benghazi deaths. The same way Trump would have been responsible for the Benghazi deaths if it had happened on his watch. The same way Obama would be responsible for the Covid deaths if the pandemic had happened on his watch.
Yeah, if the 1st American died in March and the last (of the 4) next year or later, absolutely it would be an analogue (though of course the numbers of dead people, kind of are in slightly different class). Though there obviously would have been tens of thousands dead in any case, but if this malicious clown of a sociopath would have shown traditional American leadership, we would be talking about quite a different situation. But he didn't and he still has over 40% approval rating - talk about a state in the process of failing.
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Old 5th September 2020, 03:41 AM   #379
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If Trump isn't responsible for the US having the 10th highest per capita covid death rate in the world (and closing in rapidly on 9th), then you have to wonder who is. Whose job is it to implement policies which mitigate an epidemic? Whose responsibility is it that the pandemic response team was disbanded and the pandemic response procedures were thrown out and not implemented?

Is the argument here that he's impotent, or incompetent? I'm not sure either option is much of a defence, but "hey, you can't hold them responsible for being **** at their jobs" seems to be the new right-wing defence of this administration. It's truly bizarre.
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Old 5th September 2020, 03:59 AM   #380
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Trump is responsible for the Covid deaths the same way Obama is responsible for the Benghazi deaths. The same way Trump would have been responsible for the Benghazi deaths if it had happened on his watch. The same way Obama would be responsible for the Covid deaths if the pandemic had happened on his watch.
Really. Such reasoning! Or is it seasoning?

Known and effective health measures have been resisted and ridiculed since day one by Trump's GOP, and his administration has been behind the curve all the way. After the very public and documented evolution of the epidemic in NY state, together with professional healthcare guidelines explained ad infinitum ad naseum across the planet by those successful at controlling the outbreak, not a single whining US public official in any office has any excuse for not knowing what to do, how to do it, when to do it, or why.

Your post content is a frank and open capitulation to stunning and uninformed irrationality.
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Old 5th September 2020, 05:04 AM   #381
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Originally Posted by Hlafordlaes View Post
uninformed
I disagree. He and the others are making this argument with eyes wide open.
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Old 5th September 2020, 05:22 AM   #382
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
He's not a fascist, he's not going to cancel elections, try to turn America into a dictatorship, stay in office past his term, or any of the other myriad things that he's being accused of on a regular basis here. And when have Democrats ever thought a Republican president wasn't bad? Before you bother saying it, no, I'm not claiming Republicans are any better in that regard, they think every Democrat president is bad too.
I asked is he not bad?
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Old 5th September 2020, 06:49 AM   #383
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Originally Posted by Darat View Post
I asked is he not bad?
I'm not interested in playing motte and bailey with you.
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Old 5th September 2020, 06:57 AM   #384
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Not only is he responsible for the 192,000 deaths and counting. He's actively taking measure to increase the spread.
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Old 5th September 2020, 07:16 AM   #385
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Originally Posted by thaiboxerken View Post
Not only is he responsible for the 192,000 deaths and counting. He's actively taking measure to increase the spread.
Governor's have their own health departments. They bear some responsibility.

But ultimately, responsibility falls on the individuals who transmitted it to someone.

Last edited by BobTheCoward; 5th September 2020 at 07:18 AM.
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Old 5th September 2020, 07:18 AM   #386
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Originally Posted by thaiboxerken View Post
Not only is he responsible for the 192,000 deaths and counting. He's actively taking measure to increase the spread.
Are you claiming that a different president could have kept the death toll to zero?
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Old 5th September 2020, 08:00 AM   #387
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
Are you claiming that a different president could have kept the death toll to zero?
In the alternate timeline President Clinton has been impeached over her disastrous mishandling of the Covid-19 situation that caused the deaths of over two hundred innocent Americans.

So not perfect, but about a thousand times better seems right.
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Old 5th September 2020, 08:28 AM   #388
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Germany has handled the covid crisis well. It's had a fifth of the per capita deaths of the US.

I don't think anybody is expecting the US to have been New Zealand (fewer than a hundredth of the deaths per capita), but there's no reason it couldn't have done as well as Germany.
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Old 5th September 2020, 08:42 AM   #389
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Trump is responsible for the Covid deaths the same way Obama is responsible for the Benghazi deaths. The same way Trump would have been responsible for the Benghazi deaths if it had happened on his watch. The same way Obama would be responsible for the Covid deaths if the pandemic had happened on his watch.
If Obama said this...

Originally Posted by What Obama Didn't Say
The strife in the middle east will go away by itself. We don't need security at our embassies.
... you'd be semi right.
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Last edited by varwoche; 5th September 2020 at 09:17 AM.
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Old 5th September 2020, 08:46 AM   #390
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Originally Posted by varwoche View Post
If Obama said this...

... you'd be semi right.
And if a Democratic lead congress hamstrung the Covid response's funding, it might be semi-right.
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Old 5th September 2020, 09:00 AM   #391
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Originally Posted by thaiboxerken View Post
I wonder if Ziggy thinks Putin is a dictator. Putin was elected and re-elected, after all...

Donnie wouldnít want anyone to say anything bad about Putin.
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Old 5th September 2020, 10:35 AM   #392
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
I'm not interested in playing motte and bailey with you.
How interesting, you can't answer such a simple question.
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Old 5th September 2020, 10:36 AM   #393
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
Are you claiming that a different president could have kept the death toll to zero?
Should this not be answered with:

I'm not interested in playing motte and bailey with you.
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Old 5th September 2020, 11:00 AM   #394
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Perhaps it's not the "bad" part of "orange man bad" that people have a problem with. Perhaps it's the "orange".

Tangerine man, perhaps? Hey, Mr. Tangerine man?
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Old 5th September 2020, 11:57 AM   #395
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Originally Posted by Squeegee Beckenheim View Post
Perhaps it's not the "bad" part of "orange man bad" that people have a problem with. Perhaps it's the "orange".

Tangerine man, perhaps? Hey, Mr. Tangerine man?
... slay a spic for me
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Old 5th September 2020, 02:39 PM   #396
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Originally Posted by varwoche View Post
... slay a spic for me
The Chinese hate latinos now. Your masters are peculiar.
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Old 5th September 2020, 03:28 PM   #397
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Originally Posted by BobTheCoward View Post
Governor's have their own health departments. They bear some responsibility.

But ultimately, responsibility falls on the individuals who transmitted it to someone.
Then by that reasoning the US has among the most irresponsible citizens in the world. But in a way, Bob, I guess you're right. Most other nations sure demonstrated far better concern and caring. Must be that uniquely American ethos of, "**** you, I've got mine!" And the kind of selfishness evinced by impatience to endure a brief pain for a sooner enjoyed relief.
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Old 5th September 2020, 03:34 PM   #398
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
Are you claiming that a different president could have kept the death toll to zero?
Oh fer chrissakes! No one claims zero. But *at least* no more than 1/4 the number of deaths.

I've said it before. After the dust settles, a sober look back will, I strongly feel, reveal that reasonably sensible action could have kept the death count to near of order one magnitude smaller. That is, the actual toll will *approach* a factor of ten larger than reasonably could have been avoided.
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Old 5th September 2020, 04:01 PM   #399
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Originally Posted by Lurch View Post
Oh fer chrissakes! No one claims zero.
If it's not zero, then thai's number doesn't make sense.

Quote:
I've said it before. After the dust settles, a sober look back will, I strongly feel, reveal that reasonably sensible action could have kept the death count to near of order one magnitude smaller. That is, the actual toll will *approach* a factor of ten larger than reasonably could have been avoided.
Maybe China could have kept it down by an order of magnitude, if they acted differently at the start. But I seriously doubt anyone else was ever in a position to limit it anywhere close to that much.
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Old 5th September 2020, 09:23 PM   #400
Hlafordlaes
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
Are you claiming that a different president could have kept the death toll to zero?
A different president, say, one with an IQ, could have taken the playbook Governor Cuomo handed him on a silver platter and run with it, greatly limiting subsequent outbreaks. NY was hit unawares and had to come back from a full-on pandemic... and did so using science and good practice. That anyone, of any party or persuasion, should suggest Trump, the GOP, and GOP voters did not fail miserably on this score is patently ridiculous. No excuse, this is an epic American failure for the history books, the track record of shame and profound guilt has been factually laid down.

Much of the planet watched Cuomo and learned there are shockingly two very distinct countries called "USA": Duly diligent NY, and 49 Hellholes of Ignorant White Hubris.
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