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Tags classified information , donald trump , national security issues , Trump controversies

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Old Yesterday, 09:04 AM   #1001
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Theresa May, Prime Minister of the UK, says she'll complain directly to Trump and demand that the Trump administration stop blabbing out secret service information; such as happened wrt to the Manchester bombing, when, soon after, US media were printing classified information that UK services had shared with US counterparts on the understanding that those would be kept confidential.
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Old Yesterday, 12:18 PM   #1002
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Originally Posted by TofuFighter View Post
Thanks for posting this, it probably saves me some future time. I wish I'd known it before I read through those meaningless Snopes links that you posted and written a long rebuttal.
The Snopes links weren't meaningless. Nor are most of the arguments I've made. However, the patently obvious absurdity of my great aunt ambassador complaining to me about some US representative should have been patently obvious as absurdity, while still being able to communicate that "illegal for private citizens to meddle in foreign affairs" is probably not an accurate claim.

Now I need to recalibrate, and make sure I'm sooper XXtra specific. I suppose I just won't assume that you understand anything.
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Old Yesterday, 12:36 PM   #1003
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Originally Posted by Oystein View Post
Theresa May, Prime Minister of the UK, says she'll complain directly to Trump and demand that the Trump administration stop blabbing out secret service information; such as happened wrt to the Manchester bombing, when, soon after, US media were printing classified information that UK services had shared with US counterparts on the understanding that those would be kept confidential.
Do we know who blabbed?
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Old Yesterday, 12:38 PM   #1004
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General comment... I'm pretty concerned about the sheer volume of classified and confidential information that is showing up in the news. The whole damn government is as leaky as a sieve.
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Old Yesterday, 12:47 PM   #1005
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Originally Posted by Emily's Cat View Post
General comment... I'm pretty concerned about the sheer volume of classified and confidential information that is showing up in the news. The whole damn government is as leaky as a sieve.
There are always leaks but it's never been this bad. Not in my lifetime or even my father's lifetime. And like it or not, the reason is Trump. It starts with the leader. He's declared war on the government, our government and for every action there is a reaction.
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Old Yesterday, 12:52 PM   #1006
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Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
There are always leaks but it's never been this bad. Not in my lifetime or even my father's lifetime. And like it or not, the reason is Trump. It starts with the leader. He's declared war on the government, our government and for every action there is a reaction.
Dahell?

1) How did he "declare war on the government"? That's an amazing absurdity.

2) You seem to be implying that the leaks are Trump's fault, as if he and his supporters are doing the leaking... But there seems to be a lot of leaks coming out that are aimed at discrediting Trump. The "reason" might be Trump, in that the people doing the leaking don't like him... but I don't think that justifies leaking intelligence and classified or confidential information.
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Old Yesterday, 12:57 PM   #1007
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Originally Posted by Emily's Cat View Post
General comment... I'm pretty concerned about the sheer volume of classified and confidential information that is showing up in the news. The whole damn government is as leaky as a sieve.
In this administration I'm thinking transparency is a good thing. Especially with a Republican Congress. It helps keep their feet to the fire and remind them who they are ultimately working for.
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Old Yesterday, 12:58 PM   #1008
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Originally Posted by Emily's Cat View Post
Dahell?

1) How did he "declare war on the government"? That's an amazing absurdity.

2) You seem to be implying that the leaks are Trump's fault, as if he and his supporters are doing the leaking... But there seems to be a lot of leaks coming out that are aimed at discrediting Trump. The "reason" might be Trump, in that the people doing the leaking don't like him... but I don't think that justifies leaking intelligence and classified or confidential information.
By accusing every single branch of working against the interest of the American people? By calling them all incompetent?
Trump has slandered the FBI, CIA, NSA, the Military, Congress, the White House and every single Department.
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Old Yesterday, 01:11 PM   #1009
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Originally Posted by Emily's Cat View Post
Dahell?

1) How did he "declare war on the government"? That's an amazing absurdity.

2) You seem to be implying that the leaks are Trump's fault, as if he and his supporters are doing the leaking... But there seems to be a lot of leaks coming out that are aimed at discrediting Trump. The "reason" might be Trump, in that the people doing the leaking don't like him... but I don't think that justifies leaking intelligence and classified or confidential information.
Your kidding right? Agency after agency, he has proposed cutting. He has no use for Intelligence services.

I absolutely do believe that the sheer volume of leaks is Trump's fault. Not specifically any of them. It's the culture Trump fosters. Trust is something one earns. Do you think his staff admires him or sees him as a means to an end?

Do you think the thousands of non-partisan civil service employees who work to serve the American people who's goals for their country and livelihood that are threatened are on board with Team Trump?

And yes I agree, it doesn't justify leaking classified information.
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Old Yesterday, 01:11 PM   #1010
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Originally Posted by Emily's Cat View Post
Dahell?

1) How did he "declare war on the government"? That's an amazing absurdity.

2) You seem to be implying that the leaks are Trump's fault, as if he and his supporters are doing the leaking... But there seems to be a lot of leaks coming out that are aimed at discrediting Trump. The "reason" might be Trump, in that the people doing the leaking don't like him... but I don't think that justifies leaking intelligence and classified or confidential information.
The ship of state is the only ship that leaks from the top.


If you treat your staff badly and blurt out state secrets to one's antagonists, and ignore advice about compromised potential staff members, then one's staff are going to get into the habit of leaking. Especially when most of the leaks can be considered to be in the public interest.

The Manchester photos are the first that I am aware of that aren't.
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Old Yesterday, 02:22 PM   #1011
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Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
Your kidding right? Agency after agency, he has proposed cutting. He has no use for Intelligence services.

I absolutely do believe that the sheer volume of leaks is Trump's fault. Not specifically any of them. It's the culture Trump fosters. Trust is something one earns. Do you think his staff admires him or sees him as a means to an end?

Do you think the thousands of non-partisan civil service employees who work to serve the American people who's goals for their country and livelihood that are threatened are on board with Team Trump?

And yes I agree, it doesn't justify leaking classified information.
I end up seeing the two highlighted statements as being contradictory. I'm certain that isn't your perspective. How do you reconcile them?
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Old Yesterday, 02:28 PM   #1012
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Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza View Post
By accusing every single branch of working against the interest of the American people? By calling them all incompetent?
Trump has slandered the FBI, CIA, NSA, the Military, Congress, the White House and every single Department.
Lemme get this straight. Trump says bad things about the intelligence community, congress, and white house staff. They retaliate against him calling them incompetent, by leaking classified and confidential information to the press.

Is it acceptable to you simply because it makes Trump look bad?

Well Mr. President, if you didn't say bad things about me, I wouldn't have to violate protocol and leak info to the press in order to show people how bad you are... You know you shouldn't make me have to beat you.
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Old Yesterday, 02:32 PM   #1013
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Originally Posted by Emily's Cat View Post
I end up seeing the two highlighted statements as being contradictory. I'm certain that isn't your perspective. How do you reconcile them?
Roughly: two wrongs don't make a right.

Originally Posted by Emily's Cat View Post
Lemme get this straight. Trump says bad things about the intelligence community, congress, and white house staff. They retaliate against him calling them incompetent, by leaking classified and confidential information to the press.

Is it acceptable to you simply because it makes Trump look bad?

Well Mr. President, if you didn't say bad things about me, I wouldn't have to violate protocol and leak info to the press in order to show people how bad you are... You know you shouldn't make me have to beat you.
It seems an explanation, not justification.
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Old Yesterday, 02:32 PM   #1014
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Originally Posted by jimbob View Post
If you treat your staff badly and blurt out state secrets to one's antagonists, and ignore advice about compromised potential staff members, then one's staff are going to get into the habit of leaking. Especially when most of the leaks can be considered to be in the public interest.

The Manchester photos are the first that I am aware of that aren't.
What part of "Israeli Agent placed inside ISIS" is in the public's best interest? That isn't something that ANYONE has accused Trump of revealing. He was accused of telling Russia the info originated from a particular city. Everything else was very kindly supplied by other people.

Trump sharing one piece of information outside of protocol somehow justifies all of the staff and other agencies proceeding to leak confidential and classified information left and right? How does that logic work for you?
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Old Yesterday, 03:35 PM   #1015
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Originally Posted by Emily's Cat View Post
I end up seeing the two highlighted statements as being contradictory. I'm certain that isn't your perspective. How do you reconcile them?
...er... that Trump does bad things that foster a culture of leaks which are also bad?

How are they contradictory?
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Old Yesterday, 03:48 PM   #1016
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Originally Posted by Emily's Cat View Post
I end up seeing the two highlighted statements as being contradictory. I'm certain that isn't your perspective. How do you reconcile them?
I don't see how they are contradictory. There is no need to reconcile.
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Old Yesterday, 04:12 PM   #1017
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Originally Posted by jimbob View Post
The ship of state is the only ship that leaks from the top.


If you treat your staff badly and blurt out state secrets to one's antagonists, and ignore advice about compromised potential staff members, then one's staff are going to get into the habit of leaking. Especially when most of the leaks can be considered to be in the public interest.

The Manchester photos are the first that I am aware of that aren't.
Originally Posted by Emily's Cat View Post
What part of "Israeli Agent placed inside ISIS" is in the public's best interest? That isn't something that ANYONE has accused Trump of revealing. He was accused of telling Russia the info originated from a particular city. Everything else was very kindly supplied by other people.

Trump sharing one piece of information outside of protocol somehow justifies all of the staff and other agencies proceeding to leak confidential and classified information left and right? How does that logic work for you?

And let's not forget that CNN had that all that code-word secret info back in March when they were asked not to disclose it for their story on laptop bombs.
The leak predated Trump's revelation to the Russians.
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Old Yesterday, 04:36 PM   #1018
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Originally Posted by Emily's Cat View Post
1) How did he "declare war on the government"? That's an amazing absurdity.
Does the phrase, "I'm going to drain the swamp and fix all of the corruption in Washington", or something loosely close to that, ring a bell? How about do an extremely simplistic "Trump War on Government" google search? I mean, this is literally the most basic level of research one can do, but trust me it's been implied and even stated multiple times during his election. Him saying, "I know more than the generals" was insulting to the military just in and of itself. Then the derogatory way he treated a gold star family, the comments on McCain. Seriously, beginner level stuff.

Originally Posted by Emily's Cat View Post
2) You seem to be implying that the leaks are Trump's fault, as if he and his supporters are doing the leaking... But there seems to be a lot of leaks coming out that are aimed at discrediting Trump. The "reason" might be Trump, in that the people doing the leaking don't like him... but I don't think that justifies leaking intelligence and classified or confidential information.
As stated before, you seem to be confusing "justifies" with "explanation as to why". Then you posted another post where you acted completely oblivious to the fact that the ability to reverse investigate something even exists led me to believe that you just didn't know the difference.

The ends people will go to in order to justify, which is what you're doing, the behavior of Trump is insane to me. I can't even imagine.
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Old Yesterday, 09:53 PM   #1019
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Originally Posted by Emily's Cat View Post
What part of "Israeli Agent placed inside ISIS" is in the public's best interest? That isn't something that ANYONE has accused Trump of revealing. He was accused of telling Russia the info originated from a particular city. Everything else was very kindly supplied by other people.

Trump sharing one piece of information outside of protocol somehow justifies all of the staff and other agencies proceeding to leak confidential and classified information left and right? How does that logic work for you?
The part where the papers disclosed that Trump had revealed this information to the Russians on an impulse but nit what the information was. The fact that it came from Israel seems to have been put into the public domain by the Israelis, presumably because their source had already been compromised and they wanted to make yhe US public aware of how it became compromised.
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Old Yesterday, 10:33 PM   #1020
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Originally Posted by jimbob View Post
The part where the papers disclosed that Trump had revealed this information to the Russians on an impulse but nit what the information was.
Are you channelling the spirit of Officer Crabtree ?
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Old Today, 12:27 AM   #1021
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Originally Posted by Emily's Cat View Post
The Snopes links weren't meaningless. Nor are most of the arguments I've made. However, the patently obvious absurdity of my great aunt ambassador complaining to me about some US representative should have been patently obvious as absurdity, while still being able to communicate that "illegal for private citizens to meddle in foreign affairs" is probably not an accurate claim.

Now I need to recalibrate, and make sure I'm sooper XXtra specific. I suppose I just won't assume that you understand anything.
You do it often. " I'm surprised by how often things like this are taken seriously". Throwing out half-arguments based on half-complete information.
So let me save you some time as well and tell you not to trouble yourself with explaining at length since I won't be wasting time on them again.
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Old Today, 08:32 AM   #1022
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Originally Posted by plague311 View Post
Does the phrase, "I'm going to drain the swamp and fix all of the corruption in Washington", or something loosely close to that, ring a bell? How about do an extremely simplistic "Trump War on Government" google search? I mean, this is literally the most basic level of research one can do, but trust me it's been implied and even stated multiple times during his election. Him saying, "I know more than the generals" was insulting to the military just in and of itself. Then the derogatory way he treated a gold star family, the comments on McCain. Seriously, beginner level stuff.
Are whistle-blowers declaring war on the government? If a police chief promises to end corruption in the police force, is that a war on police?

Insulting people and being an ass isn't declaring war. People need to stop blowing things out of proportion and spinning up their own inferences as if they are fact.


Originally Posted by plague311 View Post
As stated before, you seem to be confusing "justifies" with "explanation as to why". Then you posted another post where you acted completely oblivious to the fact that the ability to reverse investigate something even exists led me to believe that you just didn't know the difference.

The ends people will go to in order to justify, which is what you're doing, the behavior of Trump is insane to me. I can't even imagine.
Assigning fault isn't "explaining". It's blaming.

I'm not justifying any of Trump's behavior. I'm refusing to accept transparently ridiculous spin and rhetoric as if it were fact.
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Old Today, 08:33 AM   #1023
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Originally Posted by jimbob View Post
The part where the papers disclosed that Trump had revealed this information to the Russians on an impulse but nit what the information was. The fact that it came from Israel seems to have been put into the public domain by the Israelis, presumably because their source had already been compromised and they wanted to make yhe US public aware of how it became compromised.
Evidence?

Also... "presumably" means you're speculating.
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Old Today, 08:40 AM   #1024
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Originally Posted by Emily's Cat View Post
I end up seeing the two highlighted statements as being contradictory. I'm certain that isn't your perspective. How do you reconcile them?
(1) Trump's behavior has increased the willingness to leak.

(2) Nonetheless, Trump's behavior does not justify these leaks.

In this sense, the leaks are Trump's "fault" (i.e., he plays a significant causal role in these leaks), but that doesn't make the leaks alright.
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Old Today, 08:47 AM   #1025
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Originally Posted by Emily's Cat View Post
Are whistle-blowers declaring war on the government? If a police chief promises to end corruption in the police force, is that a war on police?

Insulting people and being an ass isn't declaring war. People need to stop blowing things out of proportion and spinning up their own inferences as if they are fact.

Assigning fault isn't "explaining". It's blaming.

I'm not justifying any of Trump's behavior. I'm refusing to accept transparently ridiculous spin and rhetoric as if it were fact.
You're the one that is spinning. Trump isn't a whistle-blower. He is telling civil service employees that their work is not needed or appreciated. That they are not necessary. That in fact, those employees are stealing from the people they serve and who pay their salaries. And if all possible, Trump will relieve them of their jobs.

If you don't think that the newly elected President is declaring a kind of war when he aims to destroy the life's work and livelihood of dedicated government employees, then you're just being stubbornly obtuse.
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Old Today, 08:55 AM   #1026
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Originally Posted by Emily's Cat View Post
Dahell?

1) How did he "declare war on the government"? That's an amazing absurdity.
By claiming that the Intel Community were against him, that Obama had wiretapped him somehow, that the "Deep State" are aligning against him, by attempting to rule via Exacutive order, by refusing to consult experts on how much of anything runs b efore he did anything - firing Yates, firing Comey, completely failing to give any direction to State, by nominating climate change deniers to head the EPA, Rick Perry to Energy, Devos to Education, and worst of all Sessions to Justice, and white nationalist Bannon to the National Security Council.

Quote:
2) You seem to be implying that the leaks are Trump's fault, as if he and his supporters are doing the leaking...
Want someone to say it flat-out?

He, and his "supporters" have been doing most of the leaking.

The few times someone has leaked otherwise, it's generally been to expose something awful that Trump himself was doing - such as ignoring the advise of DHS in order to rush out the second version of his Muslim Ban (and yes, it is a Muslim Ban), or to warn just about everyone that he just leaked ally-provided intelligence to an autocratic government.

Quote:
Yes, But there seems to be a lot of leaks coming out that are aimed at discrediting Trump.
He discredited himself during his racist birther stunt, and has done nothing at all to show that anyone should take him as anything but a clown since, so it's far too late to worry about any of that.
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Old Today, 09:21 AM   #1027
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Originally Posted by Emily's Cat View Post
The Snopes links weren't meaningless.
Yes. Meaningless. When I read that post I thought "Surely not". Turns out that yes, meaningless posts. I have no clue why you feel any need to defend the clown in chief, but he is dragging the US down with him. Melania went with "do not touch me" Macron outhandshaked him, he is toxic in the intelligence community, the military are scared of him and he is going to bork the United States.

You like this? I don't.
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Old Today, 10:57 AM   #1028
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Originally Posted by abaddon View Post
Yes. Meaningless. When I read that post I thought "Surely not". Turns out that yes, meaningless posts. I have no clue why you feel any need to defend the clown in chief, but he is dragging the US down with him. Melania went with "do not touch me" Macron outhandshaked him, he is toxic in the intelligence community, the military are scared of him and he is going to bork the United States.

You like this? I don't.
He's single-handedly given new life to the Ugly American trope.
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Old Today, 11:25 AM   #1029
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Originally Posted by phiwum View Post
(1) Trump's behavior has increased the willingness to leak.

(2) Nonetheless, Trump's behavior does not justify these leaks.

In this sense, the leaks are Trump's "fault" (i.e., he plays a significant causal role in these leaks), but that doesn't make the leaks alright.
How is he the cause of these leaks? How has his behavior increased the willingness of people to violate protocol and leak classified information?

I'm having a tough time here. It's reading a lot like... "Her short skirt increased the likelihood of being raped. It doesn't justify the raping. In this sense, it's her "fault" (i.e. she plays a significant causal role in her rape), but that doesn't make the rape alright."
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Old Today, 12:00 PM   #1030
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Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
You're the one that is spinning. Trump isn't a whistle-blower.
I don't think Trump is a whistle-blower. Not sure how you got there?
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Old Today, 12:07 PM   #1031
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Originally Posted by Emily's Cat View Post
Are whistle-blowers declaring war on the government?
Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
You're the one that is spinning. Trump isn't a whistle-blower.
Originally Posted by Emily's Cat View Post
I don't think Trump is a whistle-blower. Not sure how you got there?
Really?
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Old Today, 12:12 PM   #1032
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Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
Really?
On reviewing...

You said there've always been leaks, but there are more now because Trump declared war on the government.
I asked how did he declare war on the government... and I said the leaks aren't coming from Trump, they're coming from people trying to discredit Trump.
You said he declared war on the government by saying he was going to drain the swamp, and by being a meanie to some people.
I asked if whistle-blowers are declaring war on the government, and if a police chief saying he's going to end police corruption is declaring war on the police.

I can see that this last bit is where things went off-kilter, and I can see how you landed where you did with your interpretation. Allow me to explain my comment.

Trump saying that he was going to drain the swamp isn't "declaring war on the government", no more than if someone running for sheriff said they were going to end police corruption is declaring war on the police. A campaign promise to end corruption in our government officials (regardless of whether that promise is kept) isn't declaring war on the government - it's declaring war on corruption. Being insulting to people isn't declaring war on the government either. Being mean to a general or a military person isn't declaring war on the government either. None of those things are declaring war on the government.

I'm not claiming that Trump is a whistle-blower. I'm saying that a whistle-blower is also someone who is attempting to end government corruption, and you wouldn't consider them to be declaring war on the government. Why would you view Trump's promise to "drain the swamp" as a war on the government, rather than a war on corruption and gamesmanship and party pandering?

Don't get me wrong - I have no expectation that he'll actually drain the swamp. HE might swap out a few alligators for some crocodiles, maybe introduce a couple of new species of frog and mosquito. Maybe even redirect a couple of waterways. But that swamp is still gonna be a swamp. That makes him a hypocrite. But it doesn't make him someone who declared war on the government. "Declared war on the government"... That's some next level hyperbole right there.
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Old Today, 12:17 PM   #1033
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Originally Posted by abaddon View Post
Yes. Meaningless.
Fact checking is meaningless when it doesn't support the narrative you favor? Good to know, I guess.


Originally Posted by abaddon View Post
When I read that post I thought "Surely not". Turns out that yes, meaningless posts. I have no clue why you feel any need to defend the clown in chief, but he is dragging the US down with him. Melania went with "do not touch me" Macron outhandshaked him, he is toxic in the intelligence community, the military are scared of him and he is going to bork the United States.

You like this? I don't.
I'm not defending him, I'm defending facts and I'm opposing speculation and rhetoric to coerce political change.

Yes, he's dragging the US down. Yes, he's turning the US into a sideshow. No I don't like it.

But I don't support making things up, providing cherry-picked information, and pretending that speculation is fact in order to prompt change.

Originally Posted by marplots View Post
He's single-handedly given new life to the Ugly American trope.
Yes, he has.

That doesn't justify abandoning skepticism and pushing a cherry-picked pile of speculations and hyperbole as if it is fact.
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Old Today, 12:21 PM   #1034
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Originally Posted by marplots View Post
He's single-handedly given new life to the Ugly American trope.
Originally Posted by Emily's Cat View Post
Yes, he has.

That doesn't justify abandoning skepticism and pushing a cherry-picked pile of speculations and hyperbole as if it is fact.
Maybe it is though. Socially constructed truth.
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Old Today, 12:55 PM   #1035
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Originally Posted by Emily's Cat View Post
Dahell?

1) How did he "declare war on the government"? That's an amazing absurdity.

2) You seem to be implying that the leaks are Trump's fault, as if he and his supporters are doing the leaking... But there seems to be a lot of leaks coming out that are aimed at discrediting Trump. The "reason" might be Trump, in that the people doing the leaking don't like him... but I don't think that justifies leaking intelligence and classified or confidential information.
Really? Did you miss this:

https://www.adn.com/nation-world/201...trative-state/

The Trump administration considers itself in a battle to "deconstruct the administrative state". His cabinet picks were chosen to undo the departments they oversee. Who are they "battling" against? The government as it currently exists. Its a very clear statement of their intentions.

An amazing absurdity indeed!
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Old Today, 01:00 PM   #1036
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Originally Posted by marplots View Post
Maybe it is though. Socially constructed truth.
Holy @#%. "Socially constructed truth" as an excuse to completely abandon skepticism? I'm at a loss for words here.

Reality isn't good enough. Objective facts aren't good enough. Let's go ahead and socially construct a truth that works for us.

And here I thought you were against "alternative facts". Guess I was wrong.
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Old Today, 01:03 PM   #1037
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Originally Posted by MuDPhuD View Post
Really? Did you miss this:

https://www.adn.com/nation-world/201...trative-state/

The Trump administration considers itself in a battle to "deconstruct the administrative state". His cabinet picks were chosen to undo the departments they oversee. Who are they "battling" against? The government as it currently exists. Its a very clear statement of their intentions.

An amazing absurdity indeed!
From your link:
Quote:
Bannon framed much of Trump's agenda with the phrase, "deconstruction of the administrative state," meaning the system of taxes, regulations and trade pacts that the president says have stymied economic growth and infringed upon U.S. sovereignty. Bannon says that the post-World War II political and economic consensus is failing and should be replaced with a system that empowers ordinary people over coastal elites and international institutions.
Total war on government there...
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Old Today, 01:04 PM   #1038
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Originally Posted by Emily's Cat View Post
On reviewing...

You said there've always been leaks, but there are more now because Trump declared war on the government.
I asked how did he declare war on the government... and I said the leaks aren't coming from Trump, they're coming from people trying to discredit Trump.
You said he declared war on the government by saying he was going to drain the swamp, and by being a meanie to some people.
I asked if whistle-blowers are declaring war on the government, and if a police chief saying he's going to end police corruption is declaring war on the police.

I can see that this last bit is where things went off-kilter, and I can see how you landed where you did with your interpretation. Allow me to explain my comment.

Trump saying that he was going to drain the swamp isn't "declaring war on the government", no more than if someone running for sheriff said they were going to end police corruption is declaring war on the police. A campaign promise to end corruption in our government officials (regardless of whether that promise is kept) isn't declaring war on the government - it's declaring war on corruption. Being insulting to people isn't declaring war on the government either. Being mean to a general or a military person isn't declaring war on the government either. None of those things are declaring war on the government.

I'm not claiming that Trump is a whistle-blower. I'm saying that a whistle-blower is also someone who is attempting to end government corruption, and you wouldn't consider them to be declaring war on the government. Why would you view Trump's promise to "drain the swamp" as a war on the government, rather than a war on corruption and gamesmanship and party pandering?

Don't get me wrong - I have no expectation that he'll actually drain the swamp. HE might swap out a few alligators for some crocodiles, maybe introduce a couple of new species of frog and mosquito. Maybe even redirect a couple of waterways. But that swamp is still gonna be a swamp. That makes him a hypocrite. But it doesn't make him someone who declared war on the government. "Declared war on the government"... That's some next level hyperbole right there.
Its not hyperbole, its almost a direct quote of the President's chief strategist, Steve Bannon. They are "battling" against the "deep state", that is, in a war with the government as it currently exists.
Clearly, the career government employees are threatened, think this "deconstruction" is a bad idea, and feel that they are sounding an alarm to the public through the leaks they are responsible for. Just like Edward Snowden.
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Old Today, 01:15 PM   #1039
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Originally Posted by Emily's Cat View Post
From your link:


Total war on government there...
Yes I agree. Glad you can see it now.
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