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11th January 2020, 10:49 AM | #441 |
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I don't think that's always the case. I was thinking, in this case, of a global currency that would complement -- not supplant -- the currencies we already use. Kind of like bitcoin, but I was wondering if, at least in theory, we might have a concept without the glaring shortcomings bitcoin has. Indeed. Belz does has a point, in economies with an excess of savings, especially when concentrated in the hands of relatively few people, inflation can do good. But I don't think that's always true (that inflation necessarily spurs real growth, or that inflation, even in moderation, is necessarily a good thing). But I'm no economist (although I'm not entirely unfamiliar with the basics), and I say this off the cuff, so I guess I'm open to correction.
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That can -- at least in theory -- be achieved without triggering inflation.
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Say what? You're using demurrage in a sense I'm not familiar with. A quick and lazy google search does not point at your particular meaning. Perhaps you mean a charge on unused money, a negative interest rate? I guess inflation can be thought of as demurrage (as the term is commonly used) on money stashed under the mattress. |
11th January 2020, 01:14 PM | #442 |
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11th January 2020, 02:11 PM | #443 |
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For the vast majority of people inflation is not a good thing because it outpaces their wage growth effectively giving them less money over time. In that sense having it higher then like 1% isn't good. But if the ultra rich weren't insane and paid workers properly for the value they provide you could have higher inflation and still be fine
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11th January 2020, 02:39 PM | #444 |
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There was a thread about demurrage a few years back (http://www.internationalskeptics.com...d.php?t=277957). It is indeed a form of negative interest rate on bank accounts (not necessarily all of them). In the case of notes, holders have to buy stamps and affix them at regular intervals in order to keep them valid.
The main difference between demurrage and inflation is that with demurrage, you don't have the endless price/wage cycles and loans don't lose their value to inflation so excessive interest rates are not necessary. Cryptos can easily be designed to implement demurrage on a continuous basis. In fact, one was actually designed - freicoin. It hasn't really taken off in the public imagination even though demurrage replaces transaction fees. |
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11th January 2020, 02:40 PM | #445 |
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"The process by which banks create money is so simple that the mind is repelled. Where something so important is involved, a deeper mystery seems only decent." - Galbraith, 1975 |
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11th January 2020, 02:49 PM | #446 |
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11th January 2020, 06:06 PM | #447 |
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Thanks. That's very interesting! I guess it's kind of ... not unlikely, that some economist, some time, would have tried to think up some 'ideal' currency. Crypto does seem to offer a way. Not bitcoin, but perhaps one of the others, perhaps one yet to be put out there, that, in theory, and if people took to it, might actually work as some kind of global currency that doesn't have the glaring shortcomings of the USD or gold or such other. As for demurrage, surely in such a scenario, the mattress would be the rational place to park one's savings? If, that is, there were no inflation? Although I guess you'd still incur a cost in terms of physical risk, or of physical security to mitigate that risk. But I haven't yet read that thread you've linked. I look forward to doing that, later on. No doubt these basics would've been addressed there. |
11th January 2020, 09:49 PM | #448 |
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Inflation reduces the value of your savings. It transfers wealth from savers to debtors. Is that not obvious to you?
Maybe you think that it is not like a tax unless you are physically handing dollars to another person. Or maybe it is that you have to fill out the necessary forms and submit them to the tax man. This is reminiscent of those who say "it ain't money unless it is a federal reserve note . . . . ." |
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14th January 2020, 09:07 AM | #449 |
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What's obvious is that you're not describing a tax. If your savings don't have interests rates, it isn't the government's fault.
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14th January 2020, 08:03 PM | #450 |
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"The process by which banks create money is so simple that the mind is repelled. Where something so important is involved, a deeper mystery seems only decent." - Galbraith, 1975 |
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15th January 2020, 02:20 PM | #451 |
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This pyramid will stop at about 9200. However I am no longer confident the edifice is going to crumble, interesting, I may change my view. On the other hand if current price is best guide to future price, and bitcoin does as intended, it will flat line in price for a few centuries like standard currencies.
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15th January 2020, 06:41 PM | #452 |
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"The process by which banks create money is so simple that the mind is repelled. Where something so important is involved, a deeper mystery seems only decent." - Galbraith, 1975 |
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19th January 2020, 12:46 PM | #453 |
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9188 stopped it.
However I consider it a great trader's market but for the wicked spread. I think it will all stabilise and flat line during the year, that is my current prediction. The crypto sphere will tend towards a conventional currency range model, and they can all get real jobs. |
20th January 2020, 10:09 AM | #454 |
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That's an amazing coincidence. Bitcoin rose in price as well as your unnamed pyramid.
I hope your pyramid did better though. With a sell order at 9200, bitcoin just missed triggering the sell and plunged back down into the 8600s again. With all hope of a profit gone this time, this prediction would have to go into the "fail" category. |
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20th January 2020, 10:34 AM | #455 |
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Nah, I'd give it to him this time. It's not over yet though. It's never over :-D
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20th January 2020, 09:17 PM | #456 |
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21st January 2020, 01:44 AM | #457 |
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21st January 2020, 02:40 AM | #458 |
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28th January 2020, 09:14 PM | #459 |
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Bitcoin topped the 9200 barrier this morning (currently about 9360).
It's a pity that Samson chickened out at 9188 - or did the pyramid fail to rise also? |
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29th January 2020, 02:22 AM | #460 |
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29th January 2020, 11:40 AM | #461 |
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30th January 2020, 04:06 AM | #462 |
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30th January 2020, 05:05 AM | #463 |
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30th January 2020, 03:43 PM | #464 |
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30th January 2020, 03:45 PM | #465 |
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30th January 2020, 08:13 PM | #466 |
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"The process by which banks create money is so simple that the mind is repelled. Where something so important is involved, a deeper mystery seems only decent." - Galbraith, 1975 |
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2nd February 2020, 03:08 PM | #467 |
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2nd February 2020, 03:15 PM | #468 |
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2nd February 2020, 03:21 PM | #469 |
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2nd February 2020, 03:47 PM | #470 |
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2nd February 2020, 11:37 PM | #471 |
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3rd February 2020, 01:14 AM | #472 |
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3rd February 2020, 01:23 AM | #473 |
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If we are not interested in Samson's fortune telling then what makes you think that we would be interested in yours? Tell us when the prices has dropped to zero.
Here's a radical thought. End the war on drugs. That should see the demand for secret money drop to the floor. |
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6th February 2020, 01:29 PM | #474 |
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Anyone familiar with Chainlink? Sorry the thread seems longish and I didn't want to pour back through it.
I have done some random googling, and it seems like it's getting a bit more attention recently. It should be noted I'm extremely dumb when it comes to this stuff. I'm invested to the tune of about $138 which has been as low as $98 and as high as $200. Mostly invested in Ripple, but I'm thinking about buying a bit of this coin to see how it does. |
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9th February 2020, 08:18 PM | #475 |
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10th February 2020, 01:04 AM | #476 |
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13th February 2020, 11:58 PM | #477 |
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Inflation, or more accurately, money creation, transfers wealth from savers to the (more likely than not) parasitical recipients of the newly created money or credit. While it's true that the real value of debts are worth less as money is debased, unless the debtor is a direct beneficiary of the money creation, it's just a second order effect.
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14th February 2020, 01:48 AM | #478 |
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This is not the thread for such a discussion but I think it is unfair to label people who borrow money from banks "parasitical recipients". There are plenty of legitimate reasons to borrow money (eg to build up a business).
To respond to what you posted in the silver thread, yes, a lot of bitcoin trading takes place "off block". That is why it is simplistic to examine the blockchain and scream "price manipulation" (although the price is likely manipulated). |
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14th February 2020, 08:06 AM | #479 |
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14th February 2020, 09:48 AM | #480 |
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