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Tags michael jackson , sex scandals

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Old 11th March 2019, 09:15 AM   #761
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There's been an icky suggestion in the subtext of a lot of discussion of the Michael Jackson allegations that he couldn't have molested anyone because he was asexual/non-sexual/didn't have a valid understanding of sex or some other variation.
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Old 11th March 2019, 09:17 AM   #762
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Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
There's been an icky suggestion in the subtext of a lot of discussion of the Michael Jackson allegations that he couldn't have molested anyone because he was asexual/non-sexual/didn't have a valid understanding of sex or some other variation.
Not my Michael!

Personally I don't know if he molested those children. Maybe he didn't. Maybe he was just very weird on account of essentially not having a childhood of his own. Maybe he did. One way or another his behaviour was NOT giving him any favours.
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Old 11th March 2019, 09:24 AM   #763
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Originally Posted by Arcade22 View Post
Thanks! That's what I was looking for earlier. I grant you he said dumb things, and did irreparable damage to his reputation doing it.
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Old 11th March 2019, 09:34 AM   #764
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Originally Posted by Belz... View Post
Not my Michael!

Personally I don't know if he molested those children. Maybe he didn't. Maybe he was just very weird on account of essentially not having a childhood of his own. Maybe he did. One way or another his behaviour was NOT giving him any favours.
You'd probably be hard pressed to find anyone that could argue Jackson was a particularly well rounded adult. If anyone is still arguing that he didn't have, at the absolute very least, some problematic boundary issues I don't know what to tell them.
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Old 11th March 2019, 09:39 AM   #765
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Originally Posted by Belz... View Post
Not my Michael!

Personally I don't know if he molested those children. Maybe he didn't. Maybe he was just very weird on account of essentially not having a childhood of his own. Maybe he did. One way or another his behaviour was NOT giving him any favours.
After watching Leaving Neverland, I have to say that those 2 came off as brutally honest. Will we ever know beyond a shadow of doubt? Probably nor. But that was some damning stuff. Really hard to watch.
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Old 11th March 2019, 09:40 AM   #766
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I made a long-o post but lost it. Anyway, the interview reminds me of this: https://www.apnews.com/9491a99333a035c1fdd0237df5aa3a35

Sometimes people do things that are quite innocent, but then hang themselves when they try to talk about it.

MJ certainly needed more boundaries, and I suppose we can speculate for years about why he didn't have them.

Personally I think it was just because he was so wealthy no one ever wanted to say "No" to him.
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Old 11th March 2019, 09:43 AM   #767
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Originally Posted by DragonLady View Post
I made a long-o post but lost it. Anyway, the interview reminds me of this: https://www.apnews.com/9491a99333a035c1fdd0237df5aa3a35

Sometimes people do things that are quite innocent, but then hang themselves when they try to talk about it.

MJ certainly needed more boundaries, and I suppose we can speculate for years about why he didn't have them.

Personally I think it was just because he was so wealthy no one ever wanted to say "No" to him.
Abusers frequently are in that position, power.
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Old 11th March 2019, 09:51 AM   #768
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Originally Posted by p0lka View Post
Abusers frequently are in that position, power.
Yes; I agree. I don't know which comes first -the power, or the abusive nature, but they do often go hand-in-hand.

However, I do have enough faith in humanity to believe it's a fairly rare aberration for someone to be artistically talented, childish and socially disconnected, financially powerful, and sexually deviant all in one package.
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Old 11th March 2019, 11:12 AM   #769
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Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
There's been an icky suggestion in the subtext of a lot of discussion of the Michael Jackson allegations that he couldn't have molested anyone because he was asexual/non-sexual/didn't have a valid understanding of sex or some other variation.
But if he really was asexual, he wouldn't have had any pornography in his house, would he? But he had loads - I know there was no child pornography, but there was enough adult pornography to a least conclude that he was either using it himself, or, as is alleged, showing it to the children he was sleeping with.
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Old 11th March 2019, 12:14 PM   #770
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Originally Posted by alfaniner View Post
Wow, just look at this.
I repeat what I said here when Jackson Died: The Entertainer who I enormously enjoyed in the 80's and whose music I still enjoyed was replaced by an Alien Life Form.
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Old 11th March 2019, 12:30 PM   #771
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Originally Posted by Sideroxylon View Post
And his alleged victims? They should have the grace to move on too?
I am a firm believer in "Let Justice Be Done, Even If The Skies Fall".
We need to know the truth about what happened.
I do note, thought, that least one of the Jackson fanboys here has moved from "He Is As Pure As The Fallen SNow" to "He's dead, so let's forget about it".
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Old 11th March 2019, 12:31 PM   #772
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And people still have trouble dealing with idea that somebody who is a really talented artist can be a horrible human being. A lot of the great artists, writers, composere, etc were people you probably would not like if they were your next door neighbors.
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Old 11th March 2019, 12:50 PM   #773
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Originally Posted by DragonLady View Post
I made a long-o post but lost it. Anyway, the interview reminds me of this: https://www.apnews.com/9491a99333a035c1fdd0237df5aa3a35

Sometimes people do things that are quite innocent, but then hang themselves when they try to talk about it.
That's pretty messed up. I find breast feeding for that long to be weird, but I would never want to make it criminal. That's just straight up abuse of government power.

On a lighter note:
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Old 11th March 2019, 03:15 PM   #774
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Originally Posted by Matthew Best View Post
But if he really was asexual, he wouldn't have had any pornography in his house, would he? But he had loads - I know there was no child pornography, but there was enough adult pornography to a least conclude that he was either using it himself, or, as is alleged, showing it to the children he was sleeping with.
How dare you. MJ was an angel sent to earth to protect children. Or at least pre-teen males.
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Old 11th March 2019, 03:34 PM   #775
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Originally Posted by trustbutverify View Post
How dare you. MJ was an angel sent to earth to protect children. Or at least pre-teen males.
And dangle babies from balconies.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg mj.jpg (9.9 KB, 139 views)
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Old 11th March 2019, 03:36 PM   #776
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Originally Posted by GlennB View Post
And dangle babies from balconies.
That alone would make me question MJ's fitness to be a parent.
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Old 11th March 2019, 03:45 PM   #777
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I remember one scene from the Bashir documentary (or maybe Oprah's) -- MJ and his young guests are in his amusement park and he's trying to generate glee -- "Whee! Let's ride the merry-go-round and the Ferris Wheel!", and a couple of the older kids are just like "Yeah, whatever... Let's just get to the free ice cream and candy."
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Old 11th March 2019, 03:53 PM   #778
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Originally Posted by GlennB View Post
And dangle babies from balconies.
Ya Know, you witch-hunters really burn my britches. Sure, anyone else putting an infant at such lethal risk for entertainment purposes would have been locked in a cell, but MJ was exceptional. Stop the lynching!
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Old 11th March 2019, 03:55 PM   #779
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Even if poor MJ had a hard life etc, does that make it ok?
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Old 11th March 2019, 04:01 PM   #780
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Originally Posted by p0lka View Post
Even if poor MJ had a hard life etc, does that make it ok?
Bill Maher gave a monologue several years ago with something like,
"OK, Michael. You had a tough childhood. I can understand trying to recover or experience that. Since you've been extremely successful so you should be allowed an extra, 10 years maybe to do it how you want. That would take you to 30 years old. You're 50 now. Grow the **** up."
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Old 11th March 2019, 04:01 PM   #781
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Originally Posted by trustbutverify View Post
How dare you. MJ was an angel sent to earth to protect children. Or at least pre-teen males.
Why was Michael Jackson interested in twenty-eight year olds?

Because there were twenty of them!
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Old 11th March 2019, 04:13 PM   #782
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Originally Posted by DragonLady View Post
I agree. At this point, the real facts are gone and buried, and the ones left -especially his children- need to be allowed to let go and move on.
The real facts are known to people who are still alive.
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Old 11th March 2019, 04:18 PM   #783
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Originally Posted by p0lka View Post
Abusers frequently are in that position, power.
Someone mentioned Jimmy Saville. He even abused a child on camera and got away with it. Trump is famous for boasting on camera about sexually assaulting women.
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Old 11th March 2019, 05:12 PM   #784
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Originally Posted by a_unique_person View Post
Someone mentioned Jimmy Saville. He even abused a child on camera and got away with it. Trump is famous for boasting on camera about sexually assaulting women.
Is it assault if it's consensual?
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Old 11th March 2019, 05:24 PM   #785
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Is it assault if it's consensual?
“If you are famous you need not seek consent.” - Abe Lincoln.
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Old 11th March 2019, 05:31 PM   #786
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Originally Posted by Sideroxylon View Post
“If you are famous you need not seek consent.” - Abe Lincoln.
"If you are famous, consent seeks you." - Donald Trump.
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Old 11th March 2019, 05:33 PM   #787
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Originally Posted by alfaniner View Post
Bill Maher gave a monologue several years ago with something like,
"OK, Michael. You had a tough childhood. I can understand trying to recover or experience that. Since you've been extremely successful so you should be allowed an extra, 10 years maybe to do it how you want. That would take you to 30 years old. You're 50 now. Grow the **** up."
Given his history of comments about adults sleeping with kids, Maher is the last person anyone should listen to on the topic
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Old 11th March 2019, 06:11 PM   #788
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Is it assault if it's consensual?
It was a minor, It's a totp episode, check it out.
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Old 11th March 2019, 06:18 PM   #789
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Originally Posted by p0lka View Post
It was a minor, It's a totp episode, check it out.
Check what out? You're claiming a video confession of sexual assault of a minor. But I have to search the evidence?
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Old 11th March 2019, 06:58 PM   #790
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Is it assault if it's consensual?
Originally Posted by p0lka View Post
It was a minor, It's a totp episode, check it out.
Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Check what out? You're claiming a video confession of sexual assault of a minor. But I have to search the evidence?
No, a minor is incapable of informed consent. It is an easy, well explored concept with no need to check out evidence.
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Old 11th March 2019, 08:00 PM   #791
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Originally Posted by Matthew Best View Post
But if he really was asexual, he wouldn't have had any pornography in his house, would he? But he had loads - I know there was no child pornography, but there was enough adult pornography to a least conclude that he was either using it himself, or, as is alleged, showing it to the children he was sleeping with.

???? I'm not sure which is worse -that you made that claim, or that every person here with 10 gigs of porn hasn't called you on it. Some people collect warehouses of adult materials without ever allowing a child to see any of it under any circumstances.
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Old 11th March 2019, 08:03 PM   #792
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Check what out? You're claiming a video confession of sexual assault of a minor. But I have to search the evidence?
https://vimeo.com/162907735 Goto 43:08 NSFW
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Old 11th March 2019, 08:05 PM   #793
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Originally Posted by dudalb View Post
I am a firm believer in "Let Justice Be Done, Even If The Skies Fall".
We need to know the truth about what happened.
I do note, thought, that least one of the Jackson fanboys here has moved from "He Is As Pure As The Fallen SNow" to "He's dead, so let's forget about it".
Are you referring to me?

I never claimed he was pure in any form; only that the evidence he molested children was scant at best -and he was ACQUITTED in court.

So far as "He's dead, so let's forget about it" I'm saying that because He is NO LONGER ABLE TO DEFEND HIMSELF.
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Old 11th March 2019, 08:06 PM   #794
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Originally Posted by GlennB View Post
And dangle babies from balconies.

Yeah; that was a terrible thing to do.
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Old 11th March 2019, 08:08 PM   #795
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I don’t think it’s an incredible stretch to imagine he was just that much of a weirdo without also being a kiddie sex weirdo. And yet...

Even the most Mike-Didn’t-Mean-Anything-Weird-By-That reading still leaves him responsible for a lot of damage to the kids he hung out with. For example, any kid’s developing sense of healthy boundaries will get completely jacked up with that kind of stuff going on.

That the non-Michael adults involved generally just went eeehhhhh ok is pretty ridiculous.
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Old 11th March 2019, 08:49 PM   #796
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Originally Posted by DragonLady View Post
Are you referring to me?

I never claimed he was pure in any form; only that the evidence he molested children was scant at best -and he was ACQUITTED in court.

So far as "He's dead, so let's forget about it" I'm saying that because He is NO LONGER ABLE TO DEFEND HIMSELF.
Him being dead and therefore unable to defend himself doesn’t necessitate any victims being silent. It is easy to see how him being dead and the power structures built around him being dismantled can make for a more free environment to speak out.
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Old 11th March 2019, 08:58 PM   #797
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Originally Posted by Elagabalus View Post
https://vimeo.com/162907735 Goto 43:08 NSFW
Thanks. On a phone so can't get to link.
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Old 11th March 2019, 09:11 PM   #798
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Originally Posted by Sideroxylon View Post
Him being dead and therefore unable to defend himself doesn’t necessitate any victims being silent. It is easy to see how him being dead and the power structures built around him being dismantled can make for a more free environment to speak out.
They've been speaking out for years. Has there been any new EVIDENCE brought forth at all?
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Old 11th March 2019, 09:49 PM   #799
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Originally Posted by chrispy View Post
After watching Leaving Neverland, I have to say that those 2 came off as brutally honest. Will we ever know beyond a shadow of doubt? Probably nor. But that was some damning stuff. Really hard to watch.
The problem is that both of them testified twice under oath in court that no abuse ever happened, and now are saying different for documentary where there is no consequences for not telling the truth.

So either they committed perjury, twice, or they are lying now. Either way it's not helpful for their credibility.

We also have to remember that a documentary crew can film and edit the testimony as much as they want to make sure it is convincing. Harder to do in a court of law with a lawyer questioning you.
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Old 11th March 2019, 09:59 PM   #800
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Originally Posted by DragonLady View Post
They've been speaking out for years. Has there been any new EVIDENCE brought forth at all?
Irrelevant. If they have been abused they can keep telling their story.
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