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Old 24th January 2023, 10:00 AM   #161
Bob001
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
If mom left the gun laying around already chambered and ready to fire (self defense ready), then the only issue for the kid would be the safety. Whether he knew how to flip it, or whether it was already open is still an interesting point.

Has it been posted what kind of gun it was? If a semi 9mm, I'm surprised a little 6yo could handle it at all, or deal with the kick.

Revolvers and some pistols (Glocks, for one) don't have manual safeties. All he needed to do is pull the trigger. And there's no kick until after the first shot. As I understand the reports, he only shot the teacher once.
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Old 24th January 2023, 10:08 AM   #162
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Originally Posted by Bob001 View Post
Revolvers and some pistols (Glocks, for one) don't have manual safeties. All he needed to do is pull the trigger. And there's no kick until after the first shot. As I understand the reports, he only shot the teacher once.
I beg to differ on the kick. Everything I ever fired kicks on the first shot. Why wouldn't it?
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Old 24th January 2023, 10:11 AM   #163
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
I beg to differ on the kick. Everything I ever fired kicks on the first shot. Why wouldn't it?
Does the kick happen before or after the trigger is pulled?
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Old 24th January 2023, 10:14 AM   #164
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
I beg to differ on the kick. Everything I ever fired kicks on the first shot. Why wouldn't it?
What do you mean? Of course it kicks on the first shot, after the trigger is pulled. That wouldn't keep the kid from aiming at the teacher -- at close range -- and firing. After that, it doesn't matter if the gun fell out of his hand. She's hit. Is this a semantic question? How would the subsequent kick interfere with his first shot?
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Old 24th January 2023, 10:15 AM   #165
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Originally Posted by The Don View Post
Does the kick happen before or after the trigger is pulled?
After, of course, and so instantaneously that an inexperienced shooter would likely hit nowhere near what they aimed at. Although the teacher was hit in the shoulder, so if it was close range, it may have kicked the barrel high and hit her there instead of the aimed target.
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Old 24th January 2023, 10:19 AM   #166
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Originally Posted by Bob001 View Post
What do you mean? Of course it kicks on the first shot, after the trigger is pulled. That wouldn't keep the kid from aiming at the teacher -- at close range -- and firing. After that, it doesn't matter if the gun fell out of his hand. She's hit. Is this a semantic question? How would the subsequent kick interfere with his first shot?
Fire a gun sometime. The kick is instantaneous with the shot, and will move the barrel before the bullet is out.

What makes you think firing a second shot would have kick, but the first wouldn't? That makes no sense at all.

ETA: are you seriously arguing that the shot is fired, the bullet travels down the barrel to the intended target, and only then does the weapon kick, or move? I don't believe that you could seriously be arguing this.
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Last edited by Thermal; 24th January 2023 at 10:24 AM.
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Old 24th January 2023, 10:27 AM   #167
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
Fire a gun sometime. The kick is instantaneous with the shot, and will move the barrel before the bullet is out.

What makes you think firing a second shot would have kick, but the first wouldn't? That makes no sense at all.
We're talking past each other. Of course the gun kicks when it's fired. What's instantaneous is the bullet leaving the barrel when the cartridge ignites. The kick doesn't prevent the bullet from reaching its target. Even if the barrel moves slightly, it wouldn't keep the teacher from being shot at close range. This wasn't target practice at 15 yards. You think the bullet would have gone through the ceiling, or what?
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Old 24th January 2023, 10:34 AM   #168
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
If mom left the gun laying around already chambered and ready to fire (self defense ready), then the only issue for the kid would be the safety. Whether he knew how to flip it, or whether it was already open is still an interesting point.

Has it been posted what kind of gun it was? If a semi 9mm, I'm surprised a little 6yo could handle it at all, or deal with the kick.
The first report says a taurus not sure that is much help as they appear to make a range of pistols. Most seem to use something called Luger ammunition or 9mm S&W. The mother also claimed it had a trigger lock, although I find it unlikely that a 6yr old could defeat a trigger lock so this might not have been engaged, or the key left with it.
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Old 24th January 2023, 10:39 AM   #169
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Originally Posted by Bob001 View Post
We're talking past each other. Of course the gun kicks when it's fired. What's instantaneous is the bullet leaving the barrel when the cartridge ignites. The kick doesn't prevent the bullet from reaching its target. Even if the barrel moves slightly, it wouldn't keep the teacher from being shot at close range. This wasn't target practice at 15 yards. You think the bullet would have gone through the ceiling, or what?
You are still seriously arguing that the kick from the first shot wouldn't affect the bullet's tragectory....with a first time shooting 6yo firing it??? I d have expected his fingers to be broken, and yes, at the very least for the barell to have jerked feet away from his intended target. I don't know if the kid was at point blank, or several rows away from the teacher. But I would not expect a toddler firing at a slim teacher to actually hit her the first time he drew and shot, no.
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Old 24th January 2023, 10:41 AM   #170
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Originally Posted by Planigale View Post
The first report says a taurus not sure that is much help as they appear to make a range of pistols. Most seem to use something called Luger ammunition or 9mm S&W. The mother also claimed it had a trigger lock, although I find it unlikely that a 6yr old could defeat a trigger lock so this might not have been engaged, or the key left with it.
Some trigger locks use a combination. The kid could have figured out the numbers or found the key. The thing is that they are only supposed to be installed on an unloaded gun. The peg fits in front of the trigger. The trigger can still be pressed, accidentally or deliberately, with a trigger lock in place.
https://www.amazon.com/Master-Lock-9...11&sr=8-5&th=1
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Old 24th January 2023, 10:51 AM   #171
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
You are still seriously arguing that the kick from the first shot wouldn't affect the bullet's tragectory....with a first time shooting 6yo firing it??? I d have expected his fingers to be broken, and yes, at the very least for the barell to have jerked feet away from his intended target. I don't know if the kid was at point blank, or several rows away from the teacher. But I would not expect a toddler firing at a slim teacher to actually hit her the first time he drew and shot, no.
I've fired a wide range of handguns. The kick just isn't as great as you seem to think, and the bullet leaves the barrel at 1000 feet per second or more the instant the cartridge ignites. According to multiple accounts, the teacher was trying to take the gun away from the kid when she was shot. The distance would have been anywhere from zero to two feet at most. You really think the recoil would have changed the direction that much? How would it have broken his fingers?

This is all a distraction. The kid did in fact shoot his teacher. You think it couldn't have happened, or what?
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Old 24th January 2023, 11:18 AM   #172
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Originally Posted by Bob001 View Post
I've fired a wide range of handguns. The kick just isn't as great as you seem to think, and the bullet leaves the barrel at 1000 feet per second or more the instant the cartridge ignites.
I am not a six year old shooting for the first time with no experience or instruction. Neither, presumably, are you. Do you have experience with 6yo's firing stolen weapons for the first time while struggling, and how their 6yo widdle hands would handle the firing, or are you thinking about a man in a stable firing position?

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ccording to multiple accounts, the teacher was trying to take the gun away from the kid when she was shot. The distance would have been anywhere from zero to two feet at most.
Thanks for that, I missed it, as I've been skimming the thread because it was talking about everything except for the actual incident.

Quote:
You really think the recoil would have changed the direction that much? How would it have broken his fingers?
As I said, I am surprised that it didn't, considering a small child's grip, struggling, and never having fired before.

Quote:
This is all a distraction. The kid did in fact shoot his teacher. You think it couldn't have happened, or what?
Consider rereading the post you responded to. I said I am surprised, not that it didn't happen or that I doubted it. I would have expected reporting of broken fingers or something, yes.
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Old 24th January 2023, 03:14 PM   #173
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
You are still seriously arguing that the kick from the first shot wouldn't affect the bullet's tragectory....with a first time shooting 6yo firing it??? I d have expected his fingers to be broken, and yes, at the very least for the barell to have jerked feet away from his intended target. I don't know if the kid was at point blank, or several rows away from the teacher. But I would not expect a toddler firing at a slim teacher to actually hit her the first time he drew and shot, no.
OK. I've fired a bunch of pistols, and can agree that there is significant 'kick' to pretty much all of them.

But, if it happened before the bullet left the barrel, I would have never hit a target.

If you're talking about a fully automatic, sure, there's a lot of effort required to bringing the firearm back on target, which is why the 'pray and spray' types aim low and to the left, hoping to hit the target at some point while the firearm traverses up and to the right...

But for a pistol, no.

Aim. Bang. Hit target. Aim again.

The rule of thumb, is:

If you're close enough to hit your target with a thrown baseball, you're close enough to hit them with a fired bullet from a pistol.
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Old 24th January 2023, 03:31 PM   #174
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Originally Posted by Bob001 View Post
Some trigger locks use a combination. The kid could have figured out the numbers or found the key. The thing is that they are only supposed to be installed on an unloaded gun. The peg fits in front of the trigger. The trigger can still be pressed, accidentally or deliberately, with a trigger lock in place.
https://www.amazon.com/Master-Lock-9...11&sr=8-5&th=1
Thanks. I know nothing about guns so did not know this. So one shot could be fired if there was a chambered round (is that correct terminology?) by a little finger pressing the trigger even with a trigger lock in place?
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Old 24th January 2023, 03:47 PM   #175
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A quick look online shows that most 'trigger locks' put a bar behind the trigger, but also have plates that prevent any access to the trigger.

But... Maybe it was a crappy trigger lock? Maybe it was just a padlock or similar?

And also...

If the firearm was a revolver, maybe it could be fired by manually pulling back the hammer?

Depending on the mechanism of the trigger lock and the firearm, it may not be possible to 'cock' the firearm with the trigger lock in place, but possible to pull the hammer back against the spring far enough to fire the round.

A child could even have copied 'fanning' from a Western, where gunslingers cock the hammer with their flat left hand while holding the firearm with their right hand.
(Or the opposite allowing for handedness of the user)

Without a lot more details, we're just in the realms of speculation, other than the facts, i.e. the child successfully fired the weapon and wounded the teacher.
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Old 24th January 2023, 03:48 PM   #176
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Originally Posted by Planigale View Post
Thanks. I know nothing about guns so did not know this. So one shot could be fired if there was a chambered round (is that correct terminology?) by a little finger pressing the trigger even with a trigger lock in place?
I have no experience with trigger locks, but that doesn't seem right to me. They are supposed to keep a chambered round from being fired. I also cannot see how they would prevent a round from being chambered; in essence they'd be useless.
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Old 24th January 2023, 03:53 PM   #177
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
You are still seriously arguing that the kick from the first shot wouldn't affect the bullet's tragectory....with a first time shooting 6yo firing it??? I d have expected his fingers to be broken, and yes, at the very least for the barell to have jerked feet away from his intended target. I don't know if the kid was at point blank, or several rows away from the teacher. But I would not expect a toddler firing at a slim teacher to actually hit her the first time he drew and shot, no.
No way. Not from a 9mm, I'm sure it hurt him though. And sure the barrel certainly jerked given that its impossible for the most experienced shooter in the world to control the barrel completely. But do know that a 9mm bullet is out the barrel in probably 2 or 3 ms. You could do the math at 1200fps (roughly) and a 6" barrel (roughly) and come up with a smaller exit time, but that doesn't account for the bullet accelerating. How many angles do you think the barrel could have changed direction in 3 milliseconds?

ETA theres probably a YT video of this experiment somewhere. Hang a pistol on a string and somehow cause it to discharge and it would still hit a target a few feet away.

Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
I am not a six year old shooting for the first time with no experience or instruction. Neither, presumably, are you. Do you have experience with 6yo's firing stolen weapons for the first time while struggling, and how their 6yo widdle hands would handle the firing, or are you thinking about a man in a stable firing position?
5 years old. Thats when my dad had me shooting a .410.

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Old 24th January 2023, 04:00 PM   #178
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Originally Posted by Planigale View Post
The first report says a taurus not sure that is much help as they appear to make a range of pistols. Most seem to use something called Luger ammunition or 9mm S&W. The mother also claimed it had a trigger lock, although I find it unlikely that a 6yr old could defeat a trigger lock so this might not have been engaged, or the key left with it.
Taurus makes both revolvers and semi-auto's so thats not much use. 9mm S&W is something that doesnt exist as a cartridge, though S&W does make 9mm's. 9x19mm is sometimes referred to as 9mm Luger. Without looking it up the German Luger P08 was probably the first, or first mass produced, pistol to use that cartridge.
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Old 24th January 2023, 04:18 PM   #179
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Originally Posted by Ian Osborne View Post
Nor are they fit gun owners, but America doesn't seem to care about that.
And in America’s worst case scenario the parents might, just possibly, have to pinky-swear that they will promise not to have guns anymore, (wink and a nudge.)
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Old 24th January 2023, 04:29 PM   #180
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Originally Posted by Gulliver Foyle View Post
... In fact if anybody is criminally rsponsible for this shooting it is the child's mother.
Hey, why is the father off the hook here?

The more I read about this kid I know more about what's going on. The law which requires kids attend school has led to parents suing saying the school districts are required to manage their damaged offspring during the day. In the school districts I've worked with (they call me when a teacher or aide gets bitten by one of the kids) they typically have one-on-one aides assigned to each kid. Some of these kids have serious mental disabilities and behavioral disorders. And a small percentage of them are violent.
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Old 24th January 2023, 05:00 PM   #181
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Originally Posted by The Don View Post
Those children were considerable older, and presumably larger and stronger than a 6 year-old.

A gun allows a 6 year old to threaten the life of an adult so IMO it's fair to focus on the child's easy access to a loaded firearm as a significant element in this sad episode.

OTOH the press seems to be focusing on how negligent the school was in failing to find the weapon when they were warned about it. IMO schools shouldn't have to worry about armed 6 year olds and if they do, there's something pretty messed up.
The USA is really a ******** country.
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Old 24th January 2023, 05:29 PM   #182
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Originally Posted by Gulliver Foyle View Post
If a parent stores a loaded gun, or gun and ammunition, in such a way to make it accessible to their six year old child, they are clearly unfit to hold parental responsibilities. In fact if anybody is criminally rsponsible for this shooting it is the child's mother.
I'd say that if a parent stores a loaded gun, or gun and ammunition, in such a way to make it accessible to their six year old child, they are clearly unfit to own a gun.
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Old 24th January 2023, 05:56 PM   #183
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Originally Posted by arthwollipot View Post
I'd say that if a parent stores a loaded gun, or gun and ammunition, in such a way to make it accessible to their six year old child, they are clearly unfit to own a gun.
Yes, in a sane country.

Have you ever looked at American concealment furniture?

(Furniture designed to hide firearms for easy access.)

Every piece would be illegal for storing firearms in Australia.
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Old 24th January 2023, 06:02 PM   #184
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I have seen that, yes.
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Old 24th January 2023, 06:47 PM   #185
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I've searched many search results and they all say that recoil does not affect accuracy. It may with repeated shots.

There are a lot of links but I don't know which single one is a reliable source. They all say the same thing. And from point-blank range it most likely wouldn't matter.
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Old 24th January 2023, 09:51 PM   #186
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Originally Posted by novaphile View Post
A quick look online shows that most 'trigger locks' put a bar behind the trigger, but also have plates that prevent any access to the trigger.
.....

Not behind the trigger, in front of it.

Originally Posted by lobosrul5 View Post
I have no experience with trigger locks, but that doesn't seem right to me. They are supposed to keep a chambered round from being fired. I also cannot see how they would prevent a round from being chambered; in essence they'd be useless.
Trigger locks block the trigger. But the lock itself can be pulled or pushed against the trigger, causing the gun to fire. Manufacturers warn that trigger locks should not be mounted on a loaded gun, in part because just installing it could cause the gun to fire.

Quote:
Like the name suggests, a trigger lock is a mechanism that fits over a gun’s trigger guard to prevent the firearm from being fired. It’s usually a two-piece lock where a sturdy cylinder fits in front of the trigger to prevent the gun from being fired.

And since the trigger lock comes in direct contact with the trigger, it’s not designed to be used on loaded guns. In fact, you should unload your firearm before locking it.
https://blog.cheaperthandirt.com/trigger-locks-work/

Quote:
Trigger locks are not designed to be used on loaded guns—which makes them basically useless for preventing negligent discharges. In fact, a trigger lock might actually make a loaded gun more dangerous.

Your basic trigger lock’s locking mechanism involves a small bar or rod that slides through a gun’s trigger guard. That rod comes uncomfortably close to the trigger itself, which isn’t a problem if the gun is unloaded, but which could be a huge problem if it’s not. If you install or remove a trigger lock while your gun is loaded, you risk setting the gun off while you’re messing around near the trigger area. Just as worrisome is the fact that a loaded, trigger-locked gun could discharge if dropped or jostled, or if someone exerted significant pressure on the lock.
[Note the sticker on the lock in the picture.]
https://slate.com/news-and-politics/...ates-love.html

Quote:
“If it is a loaded gun, there isn’t a lock out there that will keep it from being fired,” said Tracy Lang of Master Lock, which manufactures the devices. “If you put a trigger lock on any loaded gun, you are making the gun more dangerous.”
https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-...512-story.html

The parents here were wildly irresponsible, and somebody almost died.

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Old 25th January 2023, 02:47 AM   #187
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Originally Posted by arthwollipot View Post
I'd say that if a parent stores a loaded gun, or gun and ammunition, in such a way to make it accessible to their six year old child, they are clearly unfit to own a gun.
That's certainly my view, but there seems to be a concerted effort to shift blame away from the parents' slapdash gun security and instead make it the school's fault for failing to search the 6 year old properly.

I suppose focusing on the parents would raise uncomfortable questions about how poorly many (most ?) people in the US are about securing their weapons. Only a minority of my US relatives have handguns but those that do don't secure they properly IMO. Instead they are placed for easy access or, if they're suddenly concerned about gun security, in an unlocked drawer.

In the same way that I, as a Brit, don't want to hear that my drinking is problematic, those in the US don't want to hear that their firearm security is poor - especially if they've "got away with it" for years.
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Old 25th January 2023, 03:12 AM   #188
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Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
Hey, why is the father off the hook here?

The more I read about this kid I know more about what's going on. The law which requires kids attend school has led to parents suing saying the school districts are required to manage their damaged offspring during the day. In the school districts I've worked with (they call me when a teacher or aide gets bitten by one of the kids) they typically have one-on-one aides assigned to each kid. Some of these kids have serious mental disabilities and behavioral disorders. And a small percentage of them are violent.
Because the gun legally belonged to the mother. So it was her responsibility.
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Old 25th January 2023, 06:29 AM   #189
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Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
Hey, why is the father off the hook here?

The more I read about this kid I know more about what's going on. The law which requires kids attend school has led to parents suing saying the school districts are required to manage their damaged offspring during the day. In the school districts I've worked with (they call me when a teacher or aide gets bitten by one of the kids) they typically have one-on-one aides assigned to each kid. Some of these kids have serious mental disabilities and behavioral disorders. And a small percentage of them are violent.
From what I've read, the gun's the mother's, hence the criminal responsibility.
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Old 25th January 2023, 08:43 AM   #190
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Originally Posted by jimbob View Post
Because the gun legally belonged to the mother. So it was her responsibility.
Originally Posted by Gulliver Foyle View Post
From what I've read, the gun's the mother's, hence the criminal responsibility.
Well one could confine the liability only to the parent whose name the gun is registered in, or one could look at this as the responsibility of the PARENTS.

Last edited by Skeptic Ginger; 25th January 2023 at 09:00 AM.
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Old 25th January 2023, 09:48 AM   #191
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Originally Posted by Bob001 View Post
Not behind the trigger, in front of it.



Trigger locks block the trigger. But the lock itself can be pulled or pushed against the trigger, causing the gun to fire. Manufacturers warn that trigger locks should not be mounted on a loaded gun, in part because just installing it could cause the gun to fire.


https://blog.cheaperthandirt.com/trigger-locks-work/


[Note the sticker on the lock in the picture.]
https://slate.com/news-and-politics/...ates-love.html


https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-...512-story.html

The parents here were wildly irresponsible, and somebody almost died.
I must say that I am unclear what the point of trigger locks are. If the trigger can still be depressed, and the gun can still be loaded
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Old 25th January 2023, 09:55 AM   #192
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Originally Posted by lobosrul5 View Post
I must say that I am unclear what the point of trigger locks are. If the trigger can still be depressed, and the gun can still be loaded
Faux safety is better than no safety.
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Old 25th January 2023, 01:43 PM   #193
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Originally Posted by Gulliver Foyle View Post
Completely inadequate. Any household with both children and guns should have the guns locked away in a secure location and any ammo stored in a different secure location.

Over here, storing a gun on an open shelf when you've children around will result in revocation of your licence if found.
But how are you supposed to fight off a home invasion if your gun is locked up? Sounds entirely antithetical to the Supreme Court defined second amendment.
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Old 25th January 2023, 01:57 PM   #194
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
Faux safety is better than no safety.
Unless it engenders a false sense of security leading to carelessness.
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Old 25th January 2023, 02:01 PM   #195
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Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
Well one could confine the liability only to the parent whose name the gun is registered in, or one could look at this as the responsibility of the PARENTS.
I think it highly unlikely Virginia registers firearms. The mother bought it.
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Old 25th January 2023, 02:18 PM   #196
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Originally Posted by Bob001 View Post
Not behind the trigger, in front of it.



Trigger locks block the trigger. But the lock itself can be pulled or pushed against the trigger, causing the gun to fire. Manufacturers warn that trigger locks should not be mounted on a loaded gun, in part because just installing it could cause the gun to fire.


https://blog.cheaperthandirt.com/trigger-locks-work/


[Note the sticker on the lock in the picture.]
https://slate.com/news-and-politics/...ates-love.html


https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-...512-story.html

The parents here were wildly irresponsible, and somebody almost died.
In front of the trigger? So that the firearm can be fired by pulling on the lock?

That is just insane.

I'm amazed that they are legal.
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Old 25th January 2023, 02:26 PM   #197
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Originally Posted by novaphile View Post
In front of the trigger? So that the firearm can be fired by pulling on the lock?

That is just insane.

I'm amazed that they are legal.
They just keep the trigger pressed to the back so it can't be pulled when the trigger lock is on it. I'm not sure what "by pulling on the lock" really means.

They're fairly popular in my neck of the woods. It just prevents the gun from being fired but when you put the trigger lock on the trigger has to go back. If you have ammunition in there it would fire the gun.
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Old 25th January 2023, 02:32 PM   #198
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Originally Posted by novaphile View Post
In front of the trigger? So that the firearm can be fired by pulling on the lock?

That is just insane.

I'm amazed that they are legal.

Trigger locks clamp against the trigger guard from either side preventing (mostly) movement unless unlocked and removed.

The one I used when I last had a firearm years ago would have held on tight enough to where most people wouldn't have been able to move it back and have it pull the trigger, but someone exceptionally strong, or with enough time and something to get leverage could possibly do it. Realizing that this is an argument from incredulity, but given the force needed I don't see someone being able to effectively use a trigger-locked firearm offensively against someone else (take too long, hard to aim, etc.). Set it off eventually without caring where it's pointing when it goes off? Yeah, possible. Take it locked to school and be able to hit a chosen target? I don't see how.

But again that was just my individual experience before I got rid of revolver.
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Old 25th January 2023, 03:35 PM   #199
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Originally Posted by novaphile View Post
...
If the firearm was a revolver, maybe it could be fired by manually pulling back the hammer?
*I'm not sure if you're asking with or without the trigger lock being on.

Regardless, since the gun has been reported to be a Taurus, it is almost certain that it would have a "transfer bar safety" where the hammer alone cannot fire the gun. Basically, the transfer bar rises up between the hammer and firing pin, the hammer hits the transfer bar, and the transfer bar hits the pin. The key is the transfer bar can't rise up without the trigger being pulled. A crappy trigger lock could allow this, I guess.

Originally Posted by novaphile View Post
Depending on the mechanism of the trigger lock and the firearm, it may not be possible to 'cock' the firearm with the trigger lock in place, but possible to pull the hammer back against the spring far enough to fire the round.
Same situation as above.

Originally Posted by novaphile View Post
...Without a lot more details, we're just in the realms of speculation, other than the facts, i.e. the child successfully fired the weapon and wounded the teacher.
Agreed. My post is worthless if the gun was not a revolver.

Last edited by Galaxie; 25th January 2023 at 03:38 PM.
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Old 25th January 2023, 03:50 PM   #200
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Originally Posted by plague311 View Post
....
They're fairly popular in my neck of the woods. It just prevents the gun from being fired but when you put the trigger lock on the trigger has to go back. If you have ammunition in there it would fire the gun.
I don't think that's the way they're supposed to work. They are installed with the post through the trigger guard, but without pressing against the trigger. If you locked the trigger back and stored the gun you would stress the springs that operate the trigger, in addition to firing it if you haven't unloaded it properly.

Here's a demonstration:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g6lcB2Oy4Vs

Here's the instruction sheet for a Master Lock trigger lock.
Quote:
INSERT front lock unit (section with key hole) with ratchet
post positioned through trigger guard, behind trigger if
possible.
https://cdn.masterlock.com/masterloc...structions.pdf

The experts recommend a cable lock that fits through the mechanism.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UF7CsFl9Yyo
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