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15th May 2017, 08:59 PM | #241 |
Penultimate Amazing
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15th May 2017, 09:00 PM | #242 |
Penultimate Amazing
Join Date: Aug 2008
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Yes, the real problem worth criticizing isn't Trump doing something stupid and damaging to US interests, it's people complaining about it.
Is this what you've become? Just another conservative that cares more about attacking progressives than anything else in politics? |
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Circled nothing is still nothing. "Nothing will stop the U.S. from being a world leader, not even a handful of adults who want their kids to take science lessons from a book that mentions unicorns six times." -UNLoVedRebel Mumpsimus: a stubborn person who insists on making an error in spite of being shown that it is wrong |
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15th May 2017, 09:01 PM | #243 |
Philosopher
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15th May 2017, 09:05 PM | #244 |
Penultimate Amazing
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It's a poor sort of memory that only works backward - Lewis Carroll (1832-1898) God can make a cow out of a tree, but has He ever done so? Therefore show some reason why a thing is so, or cease to hold that it is so - William of Conches, c1150 |
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15th May 2017, 09:14 PM | #245 |
Philosopher
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15th May 2017, 09:20 PM | #246 |
Illuminator
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True; we haven't had such an actively damaging individual become President before.
You're absolutely correct; once again, we've trashed our relationship with our allies so that Trump can do tricks for his Russian paymasters. But, hey, at least they get to have a laugh. |
15th May 2017, 09:21 PM | #247 |
Philosopher
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15th May 2017, 09:52 PM | #248 |
Nasty Woman
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15th May 2017, 09:54 PM | #249 |
Penultimate Amazing
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1. He'd never do that. 2. Okay but he's not currently doing it. 3. Okay but he's not currently technically doing it. 4. Okay but everyone does it. 5. He's doing it, we can't stop him, no point in complaining about it. 6. We all knew he was going to do it which... makes it okay somehow. 7. It's perfectly fine that's he's doing it. |
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15th May 2017, 09:55 PM | #250 |
Philosopher
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15th May 2017, 09:59 PM | #251 |
Penultimate Amazing
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1. He'd never do that. 2. Okay but he's not currently doing it. 3. Okay but he's not currently technically doing it. 4. Okay but everyone does it. 5. He's doing it, we can't stop him, no point in complaining about it. 6. We all knew he was going to do it which... makes it okay somehow. 7. It's perfectly fine that's he's doing it. |
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15th May 2017, 10:01 PM | #252 |
Penultimate Amazing
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 17,646
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My God: even Fox News just ran an article fairly critical of Trump and skeptical of the denials!
This has all the feel of something that will only gain traction over the next days and weeks. I respectively urge the Trump supporters here to not assume this is a fake story. The ability of Trump to lie to and embarrass his strongest supporters is well established. Trump has hired people who are well respected to enhance the credibility of his administration. But they only quickly lose their own credibility, as the current topic suggests will be true once again. |
15th May 2017, 10:08 PM | #253 |
Penultimate Amazing
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"So, I just told the Big Bad Wolf 'I know where the Three Little Pigs are'! And their real names! And he said, 'I don't believe it'. And I said, 'Yes, really. One is in Afghanistan, one is in Yemen, and the third one, don't tell anyone, is in Moscow.'"
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15th May 2017, 10:12 PM | #254 |
Maledictorian
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“Don’t blame me. I voted for Kodos.” |
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15th May 2017, 10:16 PM | #255 |
Philosopher
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I'm actually uncomfortable with that situation for the simple fact that it would certainly be sneered at and spit upon as an entirely left-driven action. While being the correct course of action in my opinion, it would only give certain individuals on the right even more reason to pull away. There would either need to be significant support from high profile Republicans if the Democrats are the majority, or the Republicans themselves would have to be the ones to bring any action (soon, or if they maintain power). Trump's staff is at least semi-intelligent. Give it another day or two and Trump himself will explicitly deny having ever said anything. Yeah. I don't know the EO that allows this, but I can't imagine that it allows for declassification without any kind of formal process or declaration. |
15th May 2017, 10:24 PM | #256 |
Non credunt, semper verificare
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15th May 2017, 10:32 PM | #257 |
Non credunt, semper verificare
Join Date: Aug 2003
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Bob, you need to get out of your hole. Come to the world. Come where all of us live. And accept this fundamental problem with politic.
Like it or not, EVERY SINGLE TIME you support something to be legal in this forum, without added disclaimer that this is morally repugnant and should be properly made illegal or unconstitutional, you are EFFECTIVELY telling everybody it is OK to do it. Sure I understand you think those are two different things. Legality and morality. But the real world is unfortunately more black and white when it comes to such argument. That battle was lost long ago. Every. Single. Time. You. Say. Something. Is. Legal. But. Do. Not. Condemn. It. You. Are. Effectively. Telling. Us. You. Are. OK. With. It. Clear ? ETA: This is not a personal attack or at least not written as such. it is a simple statement that most people will simply jump to that conclusion. If you don't believe me go to the average person in the street, and tell them torture is fairly legal. present them the same argument you presented here. |
15th May 2017, 10:33 PM | #258 |
Non credunt, semper verificare
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15th May 2017, 10:43 PM | #259 |
Grammar Resistance Leader
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It's not careless, at all. It's a planned-out strategy. Belittle the people who are criticizing Trump rather than defend Trump. It affords plausible deniability that their position is enabling and supporting Trump. "Hey, I never said I like the guy. I'm just pointing out what flaming ********** you lefties are!"
This has been the ploy since last summer. They know he's a pitiful excuse for a human and completely ill-suited for the office, but he's who they got stuck with on the right, so they'll put up with his minor peccadillos (cough) rather than vote for or support moderate (yet true) conservatives like Clinton and Obama. So they'll attack the Straw Liberal rather than support the actual miscreant. |
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Ha! Foolmewunz has just been added to the list of people who aren't complete idiots. Hokulele It's not that liberals have become less tolerant. It's that conservatives have become more intolerable. |
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15th May 2017, 10:51 PM | #260 |
Graduate Poster
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Trump quotes
"Crooked Hillary Clinton and her team 'were extremely careless in their handling of very sensitive, highly classified information.' Not fit!" -July 6, 2016 "The real scandal here is that classified information is illegally given out by 'intelligence' like candy. Very un-American!" -Feb 15 2017 "Are you allowed to impeach a president for gross incompetence?" |
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There is nothing as deceptive as an obvious fact. |
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15th May 2017, 11:43 PM | #261 |
Penultimate Amazing
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I disagree.
Remember in the dim, distant, past of last week when the firing of Comey was headline news ? A significant proportion of the US electorate don't. Remember even longer ago when President Trump claimed that his predecessor had bugged him and his campaign ? Well that puts you in the top 10%. Remember when the Attorney General committed perjury during his confirmation hearing ? Congratulations, you could get a job as political correspondent on any paper in the country. This will go the way of all other Trump scandals and gaffes. The GOP will drag its heels and do nothing for fear of damaging its own reputation and the press and most importantly, the Great American Public, will lose interest in the next few days when the next shiny titbit comes along. I think President Trump understands this. If you keep swirling the pond water around, no-one can see anything. It's only if you let it settle for a little while that people can tell what's going on. |
16th May 2017, 12:13 AM | #262 |
Optical Allusion
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You are probably right about the public in general (with its legendary 'memory of a goldfish') and the press but, like others have previously alluded to in this thread, members of allied intelligence departments will definitely not forget this gaffe. Damage is done. And they have an excellent memory (they're paid for having one). |
16th May 2017, 12:17 AM | #263 |
Straussian
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But Clinton's e-mail server...
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Cain: Don't be a homo. Diablo: What's that supposed to mean? Cain: It's a heteronormative remark meant to be taken at face-value. |
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16th May 2017, 12:24 AM | #264 |
Penultimate Amazing
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Just in case anyone is unclear on the nature of the Trump, Putin relationship.
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16th May 2017, 12:26 AM | #265 |
Penultimate Amazing
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Excellent point, but unless the GOP is prepared to do something then the international intelligence community can do what they like. If they stop providing the US with intelligence then worst case there is an attack on US interests and the US blames the foreign powers for not sharing their intelligence.
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16th May 2017, 12:34 AM | #266 |
Master Poster
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16th May 2017, 12:46 AM | #267 |
Lackey
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“If only it were all so simple! If only there were evil people somewhere insidiously committing evil deeds, and it were necessary only to separate them from the rest of us and destroy them. But the line dividing good and evil cuts through the heart of every human being. And who is willing to destroy a piece of his own heart?” Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn, The Gulag Archipelago |
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16th May 2017, 12:49 AM | #268 |
Lackey
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“If only it were all so simple! If only there were evil people somewhere insidiously committing evil deeds, and it were necessary only to separate them from the rest of us and destroy them. But the line dividing good and evil cuts through the heart of every human being. And who is willing to destroy a piece of his own heart?” Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn, The Gulag Archipelago |
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16th May 2017, 12:51 AM | #269 |
Master Poster
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16th May 2017, 01:05 AM | #270 |
Master Poster
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16th May 2017, 01:11 AM | #271 |
Master Poster
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16th May 2017, 01:18 AM | #272 |
Optical Allusion
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16th May 2017, 01:35 AM | #273 |
Penultimate Amazing
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They couldn't take the blame themselves so they would blame others. I suspect that it would be *known* within the intelligence services that information had been known but not shared. Foreign intelligence services would be a convenient scapegoat if US interests overseas are damaged or if there is any foreign link to an attack on US soil.
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16th May 2017, 01:39 AM | #274 |
Penultimate Amazing
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16th May 2017, 02:03 AM | #275 |
post-pre-born
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There's technology that makes for a better solution. We put Trump in one of those plastic bubbles that some kids have to live in because they are so sensitive. Then we install an electronic communication system with the outside world that has a 7 second delay. The heads of the various security and military agencies take turns monitoring the tape delay.
Solved!! |
16th May 2017, 02:22 AM | #276 |
post-pre-born
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16th May 2017, 03:24 AM | #277 |
Illuminator
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 3,158
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brace yourself for what your first clue is.
Trump: “I see NATO as a good thing.” (Washington Post, March 21, 2016) “I think NATO is obsolete.” (ABC News, March 27, 2016) In favor of invading Iraq? “Yeah, I guess so.” (The Howard Stern Show, September 11, 2002) “It looks like a tremendous success from a military standpoint.” (Fox Business, March 21, 2003) “The war’s a mess.” (Washington Post, March 25, 2003) Barack Obama is “a strong guy who really knows what he wants.” (Fox News, February 9, 2009) “Here’s a man that not only got elected, I think he’s doing a really good job.” (CNN, April 15, 2009) “He’s been a horrible president.” (Fox News, April 14, 2011) “Barack Obama has been the worst president ever.” (Fox News, April 14, 2011) Do you think there would ever be any benefit in pointing out to Trump how completely and frequently he contradicts himself? |
16th May 2017, 03:28 AM | #278 |
Penultimate Amazing
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 10,837
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That's Trump's kettle logic, "The story is a lie and the people who leaked it broke the law." It works on his dedicated believers.
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16th May 2017, 03:29 AM | #279 |
Orthogonal Vector
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In this case it is true, the president can not commit treason in this regard. Anyone else and they would be going away for a very long time.
It is like with conflicts of interest and all kinds of ethical rules that apply to everyone in the administration but the president. |
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Sufficiently advanced Woo is indistinguishable from Parody "There shall be no *poofing* in science" Paul C. Anagnostopoulos Force ***** on reasons back" Ben Franklin |
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16th May 2017, 03:46 AM | #280 |
Penultimate Amazing
Join Date: Sep 2007
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If not for the Washington Post story, the Russians would have devastating kompromat on the president. He lacks the cognitive faculties to execute the duties of his office. He should resign but he won't. The cabinet should be considering the using the 25th Amendment but they won't.
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