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3rd December 2005, 09:57 PM | #1 |
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George W. Bush worst president ever?
I was thinking about starting a thread on whether Bush was the worst president in my life (starting with Eisenhower), but before I started the thread I came across this editorial:
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ucrr/2005120...BhBHNlYwM5NjQ- My personal view is that if Bush was right to invade Iraq he is one of the best presidents of my life. I find it very doubtful that most people that might have been elected would have invaded Iraq and so if it works out well it must be seen as a terrific accomplishment for Bush. Of course for similar reasons if it works out poorly he must be seen as one of the worst. If the issue of Iraq is ignored I think Bush is probably the worst president of my life. My list of problems would be similar to the one in the editorial but I would have included the massive run up in agricultural subsidies as one more example of a Bush presidency without out any driving principles except to dole out government funds to any groups that serve Bush partisan political purposes. |
3rd December 2005, 10:53 PM | #2 |
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I think it depends entirely on what you are expecting your president to do!
For example, if you want him to be the perfect daddy's-boy sock-puppet and dumb-ass fall-guy for some neo-con expansionism arranged by some anonymous backroom cadre of self-serving industrialists, then he's been brilliant! If you were wanting a statesman of quality and humanity who spake careful sooth with due consideration, and of whom all the country could be proud, and who was respected in the world, well... |
3rd December 2005, 10:57 PM | #3 |
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Hmmmmmmm.
Dubya is probably one of the worst natural disasters to befall the US. I think he has actually done more damage than the hurricanes, both in money and suffering. But some people find my views to be extreme. |
4th December 2005, 03:35 AM | #4 |
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Richard Reeves is a propagandist for the Democratic Party. Liberals cannot sustain their negative opinions against Bush in the face of intelligent questioning. Stephen Colbert has sat down with a number of Democratic congressmen and all of them endup admitting (including Barney Frank) that Bush is a "Great" president. Look it up.
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4th December 2005, 04:09 AM | #5 |
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Originally Posted by davefoc
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4th December 2005, 04:29 AM | #6 |
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4th December 2005, 04:45 AM | #7 |
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Don't forget that if Iraq fails it will because Bush bravely had to fight a war on two fronts: against Islamo-fascists abroad and the treasonous domestic Democrats who love them.
Kerberos: It's difficult to navigate Colbert's impressive website: http://www.comedycentral.com/shows/t...jhtml?start=17 That's in the right direction. On that page is an interview with a loathesome Democrat from Ohio (lower left-hand corner as of this writing). Yes, the truth hurts. |
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4th December 2005, 05:00 AM | #8 |
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4th December 2005, 06:10 AM | #9 |
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Argument by Stephen Colbert... Gotta love it!
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4th December 2005, 06:21 AM | #10 |
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Gettng back to the OP, while I have no massive love of GWB, the title of Worst President ever has a long list of contenders, among which are:
James Madison--got us involved in a War with Great Britian, got the Capitol building burnt and pretty well bolloxed up the US Economy. James Buchanan--Showed massive lack of skills during the 1856-60 run-up to the Civil War. Ulysess Grant--While personally honest, had no conception of Governing and allowed massive corruption to take place. I'm sure others will have their choices (I think some time ago Shanek gave Lincon an "F" grade as president), so Bush has some stiff competition. Plus it will take time. All of you young people, rushing to judgement. Give Old Lady History some time. That's what she deals in. |
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4th December 2005, 07:24 AM | #11 |
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Maybe we can have the discussion in 100 years or so. I think that is sort of the rule of thumb for historical assessemnt of people and events.
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4th December 2005, 08:25 AM | #12 |
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Bush has maintained that only historians 20 years from now can tell us if he failed. I mean, dinosaurs went extinct a LONG time ago (circa Noah) and we're still not sure about their biological functioning, why they went extinct, how they co-existed with humans etc.
More seriously, it's impossible to judge Bush against previous presidents. He's not even out of office. I will wager 1000 dollars that he will not make any reputable top 10 list in my lifetime.
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4th December 2005, 09:06 AM | #13 |
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George W. Bush inherited a balanced budget and immediately turned it into the worst deficit in U.S. history. What else do you need to know?
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4th December 2005, 09:25 AM | #14 |
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If not the worst, at least in the top 5.
At the present rate, by the end of his term he will be responsible for more unnecessary American deaths than Osama Bin Laden. The damage to our national integrity will take generations to undo in the international community. The bleeding of our treasury to enrich his cronies is another multi-generational disaster. That’s just 3 off the top of my head. |
4th December 2005, 10:01 AM | #15 |
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4th December 2005, 10:09 AM | #16 |
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My heros are Alex Zanardi and Evelyn Glennie. |
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4th December 2005, 11:26 AM | #17 |
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4th December 2005, 11:38 AM | #18 |
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4th December 2005, 11:56 AM | #19 |
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4th December 2005, 11:59 AM | #20 |
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Andrew Jackson was an SOB.
How can you look at Bush wh/o the Iraq war? The war caused a chain reaction through every aspect of govt. |
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4th December 2005, 02:07 PM | #21 |
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That is just sad, pathetic. Every president---including Bush, Clinton, Bush, Sr., and Reagan---have done this, and they all deserve to be vilified for it. But to use it to deny what the Shrub has done to our budget is idiotic at best.
Bush apologists sure are getting desperate lately. |
4th December 2005, 02:27 PM | #22 |
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How about Harding? Or Nixon?
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4th December 2005, 02:39 PM | #23 |
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IMO, Nixon was a thug, but not that bad as a president (although he should have been impeached for his crimes).
Harding was probably not as bad as history has made him out to be...although that is only based on what I have read. Still, you have to give the man credit...based on some of his quotes, he was perfectly well aware that he wasn't the brightest president. That counts for something, in my book. |
4th December 2005, 02:46 PM | #24 |
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4th December 2005, 02:50 PM | #25 |
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4th December 2005, 02:56 PM | #26 |
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I'm surprised nobody's nominated Hoover for worst president ever. It's not his fault the Depression started, but he certainly didn't do anything to try to ameliorate it. In fact, it kinda looks like he tried ignoring it in the hopes it would go away. From what I've read, he surrounded himself with idiots, and let them deal with everything.
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4th December 2005, 03:06 PM | #27 |
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According to Richard Shenkman in "Legends, Lies, and Cherished Myths of American History," that was something of a canard; he provides some documentation for the idea that Hoover was in fact a "whirlwind of activity" when the Crash hit. That he should, in fact, be regarded as the real father of the New Deal.
Hoover's main flaw seemed to be some genuinely idiotic statements he made before the Crash. "We in America today are nearer to the final triumph over poverty than ever before in the history of any land."---Herbert Hoover, 1928 Although after the Crash he did make the extremely dopey comment that many Americans turned to selling apples on the street because it was so "profitable." |
5th December 2005, 10:43 AM | #28 |
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Bush is certainly a poor excuse for a president, but shouldn't don't we deserve the title "Worst Generation Ever" for allowing him to be president, not once, but twice? I didn't pay too much attention to the 2000 election since both candidates seemed equally unappealing, but those who voted for Bush in 2004 really need to be ashamed of themselves. It's easy to find fault in our leaders but when do we ever blame the voters for their stupid decisions?
Those who are familiar with The Colbert Report will realize there is a running gag about how Steven Colbert will make deliberately false statements to support his ultra-nationalist positions. A big part of the show is how his Truth does not depend at all upon Facts. Look it up! |
5th December 2005, 10:53 AM | #29 |
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You're right that we deserve what we wish for (as in voting him in twice). I feel that the voters were sold a "bill of goods". The 2nd campaign was, as in Al Franken's words "a campaign of fear, smear, and queers". It was amazingly effective if you think about the effort to unseat Bush.
Maybe I was asleep during the runup to the election, but I don't recall Bush stumping on changing Social Security. This was his first big effort on "spending his political capital" that the "majority" had presented him in the election. Charlie (vote for me or you'll die) Monoxide PS We all die eventually, so it's a factual statement - Karl Rove |
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5th December 2005, 11:29 AM | #30 |
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Bush is basically a clone of Clinton policy wise. I think some people just get too caught up nitpicking sorta like Limbaugh while Clinton was president. If you tuned into Limbaugh, he had a running list of grievances and gripes and if a person listened to one of those diatribes they might come away wondering who this Clinton clown was and if we was the worst president since Taft. Overall if you look in hindsight at the Clinton presidency though you would see a different picture.
Having an axe to grind certainly can skew your viewpoint. |
5th December 2005, 11:32 AM | #31 |
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5th December 2005, 11:35 AM | #32 |
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Well, if it wasn't for Andrew Johnson and "reconstruction" we wouldn't have a 'W' to deal with.
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5th December 2005, 11:44 AM | #33 |
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5th December 2005, 12:08 PM | #34 |
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I need to know that he came into office as a MASSIVE tech-sector stock market bubble was bursting, and that the economy was already slowing before he even served a full quarter in office. I also need to know that in terms of percentage of GDP, it is not the worst deficit in history.
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5th December 2005, 12:26 PM | #35 |
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5th December 2005, 12:48 PM | #36 |
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Mark, I share your view that the Bush presidency has been bad.
I disagree that everything that counters that view is spin. Bush did come into office just as internet techno bubble was bursting. That is not spin, that is a relevant fact with regards to an evaluation of the efficacy of the Bush presidency. |
5th December 2005, 12:50 PM | #37 |
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The spin part...and the part that drives me crazy is that much of the deficit came from Bush's tax cuts for the very wealthy. Which he promised would be temporary. Republicans want desperately for us to forget that.
Not to mention the billions wasted in Iraq.
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5th December 2005, 01:11 PM | #38 |
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What part of what I said wasn't true? How is it spin? It isn't spin. It is just spending a TINY amount of time to look at the economic conditions of when he took office. Bush did NOT come into office with the same economy in 2001 as we had in, say, 1998.
And tax cuts are not "giveaways". Social programs are. But tax cuts aren't. You can't "give" something you don't own. The government doesn't own my money. I do. When they cut my taxes, I am not being given anything. I am being allowed to keep more of what is rightfully mine anyway. And, I believe (would have to look it up again, to be sure) that the majority of the deficit is due to spending increases and economic changes, not tax cuts. But don't have time at this moment to go look it up right now. |
5th December 2005, 01:22 PM | #39 |
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5th December 2005, 01:28 PM | #40 |
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