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2nd September 2014, 12:59 AM | #41 |
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2nd September 2014, 01:34 AM | #42 |
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2nd September 2014, 01:35 AM | #43 |
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DJ's necking was inevitable once Phil's TV career tanked. The sooner DJ is back at POI where he was brilliant and the plaitster is back in his seat the sooner the world ceases to be upside down.
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2nd September 2014, 02:05 AM | #44 |
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I agree. Not a word of thanks to DJ's efforts over the past few years seems surprising and not well thought out. The JREF seems to be falling apart. How sad. Who's in charge now, if anyone is? James Randi is president, but I doubt he can manage day-to-day operations. Seems to me now that the forum is probably best on its own, as it is going to be. |
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2nd September 2014, 02:18 AM | #45 |
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2nd September 2014, 04:16 AM | #46 |
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It amuses me that the biggest outrage from all this is the brusque wording in the press release. "My god, couldn't they have added some extra meaningless traditional verbiage?" Says a lot about the previous regime.
I think the JREF has little chance of outliving Randi. This might be as good a time as any to let it go. (Not that I think they will.) |
2nd September 2014, 04:28 AM | #47 |
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Here's the thing. This should be the age of skepticism extant. Young people, at least in Western societies are far more questioning. Atheism is increasing.
Yet the JREF, which has been and should continue to be, a uniting voice of skepticism, is floundering. The enemies of skepticism will soon be dancing on Randi's grave. What happened? What will happen next? This forum could have been part of the JREF resurgence. It's been tossed into the trash can. Very sad. |
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2nd September 2014, 04:42 AM | #48 |
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Maybe the time for large national or international skeptic organizations is over? At least in the sense that we've come to know them. It is so easy now to make groups online or find local groups to focus on things meaningful to a specific community. Maybe the only role left for the big groups is to facilitate information sharing among small groups.
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2nd September 2014, 04:49 AM | #49 |
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You may be right, but I have learnt so much from this forum. I think I'm a better person because of it. Despite the gallant efforts to keep it alive, cutting the forum loose from what was a skepticism powerhouse is sad.
And more on topic, that the JREF looks like not being a powerhouse is tragic. |
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2nd September 2014, 04:54 AM | #50 |
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2nd September 2014, 05:03 AM | #51 |
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So the goal of the JREF would be to put on TAM to raise money so the JREF can afford to plan the next TAM? That seems to have been the model for the past couple of years.
But I'm talking about the day-to-day work of skeptical organizations. I suspect we may be at a point where the work is done more effectively at a local level. If so, is there a better role for the JREF than networking and supporting those local groups? (Two months ago I would have said "common information repository" as well, but since they seem disinterested in maintaining this forum, we need to find another place for the JREF to fit.) I think that would be more important than TAM, as fun as previous TAMs have been. |
2nd September 2014, 05:05 AM | #52 |
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2nd September 2014, 05:15 AM | #53 |
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I never equated the goals of sci-fi conventions and TAM. But if that's what the JREF wants to do, it's their call. I didn't get into skepticism so I had an excuse to go to Vegas, but that's just me.
If the big concern about the JREF is what will happen to TAM, then I suspect the JREF's time is already over. |
2nd September 2014, 05:25 AM | #54 |
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2nd September 2014, 05:28 AM | #55 |
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I think Scrut's point is, there are already lots of organizations who exist solely to co-ordinate large conferences that lots of members of various communities all attend. The point is not to attend a conference put on by JREF, the point is to attend a conference where all members of CFI, Skeptics Society, Skepticamp, and X Skeptics of Location Y attend. |
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2nd September 2014, 05:30 AM | #56 |
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So apparently the narrative has been set in place by the SJ wing:
Shermer is a rapist Radford is a harasser and abuser Krauss is just weird DJ is a misogenistic cad Dawkins is a privilaged fool TAM is a refuge for MRAs and chill girls PZ and Watson are the voice of reason What's clearly fact is that: Hitch is dead Stenger is dead Hrab has mostly withdrawn into music because of the drama Swoopy has simply given up Oh the madness. Meanwhile the JREF forums are to be cut loose as surplus to needs.
Quote:
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2nd September 2014, 05:30 AM | #57 |
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2nd September 2014, 05:32 AM | #58 |
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We'll see soon enough. I don't really care much, personally. If the actual work of promoting critical thinking in some useful ways isn't behind it, then it'll seem hollow. We don't need JREF to be party planners -- there are plenty out there already.
But to all of you for whom TAM is the #1 concern -- good luck in this trying time. |
2nd September 2014, 05:34 AM | #59 |
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It's not like there's a lack of skeptic/atheist conferences these days.
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2nd September 2014, 05:34 AM | #60 |
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2nd September 2014, 05:36 AM | #61 |
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2nd September 2014, 05:40 AM | #62 |
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2nd September 2014, 05:42 AM | #63 |
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Isn't it a bit soon to be picking over the bones when the body is still alive?
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2nd September 2014, 05:51 AM | #64 |
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2nd September 2014, 05:52 AM | #65 |
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If I see somebody with a gun on a plane? I'll kill him. Lupus is Lupus tor central scrutineezer |
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2nd September 2014, 05:59 AM | #66 |
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2nd September 2014, 06:01 AM | #67 |
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2nd September 2014, 06:03 AM | #68 |
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Maybe that's because I do not know many young atheist (practically beside a few youtuber like AaronRa and thinkingAtheist) but it feels as the old guard is passing away, and whereas there seems to be more young atheist (as watching the conference keynote), they are as a whole less known.
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2nd September 2014, 06:08 AM | #69 |
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2nd September 2014, 06:11 AM | #70 |
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2nd September 2014, 06:13 AM | #71 |
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2nd September 2014, 06:17 AM | #72 |
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Looking at the 990 for 2013, revenue dropped from around $1.25 million in 2012 to just under $900,000, and they ran a $150,000 loss for the year. That's not sustainable for any length of time when you're a small nonprofit and your major asset (the million dollars) is locked up.
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2nd September 2014, 06:23 AM | #73 |
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From what I can see George Hrab is still active in the skeptical community. He's been on SGU podcast and has been an MC at (I think) TAM in the past year.
My understanding from listening to Skepticality (co-hosted by Derek and Swoopy) is that Swoopy is studying full-time at university and simply does not have the time assist in the production of the podcast. If you have different information, you're welcome to present it. |
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The social illusion reigns to-day upon all the heaped-up ruins of the past, and to it belongs the future. The masses have never thirsted after truth. They turn aside from evidence that is not to their taste, preferring to deify error, if error seduce them. Gustav Le Bon, The Crowd, 1895 (from the French) |
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2nd September 2014, 06:27 AM | #74 |
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2nd September 2014, 06:32 AM | #75 |
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2nd September 2014, 06:33 AM | #76 |
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2nd September 2014, 06:35 AM | #77 |
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The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts.Bertrand Russell Zooterkin is correct Darat Nerd! Hokulele Join the JREF Folders ! Team 13232 Ezekiel 23:20 |
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2nd September 2014, 06:35 AM | #78 |
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2nd September 2014, 06:37 AM | #79 |
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If I see somebody with a gun on a plane? I'll kill him. Lupus is Lupus tor central scrutineezer |
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2nd September 2014, 06:40 AM | #80 |
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LA JREF office closes, D.J. Grothe no longer with the JREF
That doesn't answer my question. Without the expertise of DJ and Thomas, who is left that knows how to line everything up to make a major conference happen? For that matter, why believe that the board still wants TAM to happen? It's difficult to see how it supports training young students. |
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