ISF Logo   IS Forum
Forum Index Register Members List Events Mark Forums Read Help

Go Back   International Skeptics Forum » General Topics » Trials and Errors
 

Notices


Welcome to the International Skeptics Forum, where we discuss skepticism, critical thinking, the paranormal and science in a friendly but lively way. You are currently viewing the forum as a guest, which means you are missing out on discussing matters that are of interest to you. Please consider registering so you can gain full use of the forum features and interact with other Members. Registration is simple, fast and free! Click here to register today.
Tags !MOD BOX WARNING! , Amanda Knox , Italy cases , Meredith Kercher , murder cases , Raffaele Sollecito

Closed Thread
Old 13th May 2018, 04:27 PM   #4161
acbytesla
Penultimate Amazing
 
acbytesla's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 17,445
[quote=Stacyhs;12291987][quote=Vixen;12291930]
Originally Posted by Stacyhs View Post

You've done it again. Rather than admit that Marriott (or anyone else) did not charter that fight for Knox, you dance around it by claiming that "There is no anomaly in a scheduled flight being booked as a chartered flight for a whole party of people, therefore the case has not been proven."
This was a freaking 747, not a small charter jet. Once again, as already stated and cited, a BA employee used his or her employee privileges to secure the seats. Or do you now want to argue that those privileges included chartering an entire 747? Stop embarrassing yourself with this stupidity.

As I and everyone else on this thread knows, you simply will not admit you were wrong.
It's dumber than that. This is a scheduled daily flight. Flight 49 flies every day between Heathrow and Seatac. Also flight 553 flies every day between Rome and London. And this is the day after Amanda had been acquitted. Does anyone with a brain thinks they canceled a flight with 400 plus people sometime in the previous 20 hours so 8 people could fly home to Seattle on a massive jet? Oh and a flight out of Rome with a similar number of people. Imagine needlessly inconveniencing 700 people? Why didn't we hear about that? Also, how did the reporters book the flight on their charter?

Vixen's logic on this is embarrassing. Charting an appropriate jet for 10 people to fly from Rome to Seattle would cost about $30,000. Probably a little less. Whereas the airborne operating cost per hour on a 747 is a hair less than that. Flight time between London and Seattle is about 10 hours so figure $280,000. Marriott might be generous with his money but I doubt he is stupid.
__________________
A wise man proportions his belief to the evidence.
― David Hume

Last edited by acbytesla; 13th May 2018 at 05:38 PM.
acbytesla is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 13th May 2018, 04:27 PM   #4162
LondonJohn
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 13,467
[quote=Stacyhs;12291987][quote=Vixen;12291930]
Originally Posted by Stacyhs View Post

You've done it again. Rather than admit that Marriott (or anyone else) did not charter that fight for Knox, you dance around it by claiming that "There is no anomaly in a scheduled flight being booked as a chartered flight for a whole party of people, therefore the case has not been proven."
This was a freaking 747, not a small charter jet. Once again, as already stated and cited, a BA employee used his or her employee privileges to secure the seats. Or do you now want to argue that those privileges included chartering an entire 747? Stop embarrassing yourself with this stupidity.

As I and everyone else on this thread knows, you simply will not admit you were wrong.

Not to mention the fact that Vixen's assertion that "There is no anomaly in a scheduled flight being booked as a chartered flight for a whole party of people" is total and utter bollocks. A scheduled flight is a scheduled flight. If a party of people wishes to effectively occupy the entire aircraft, the only way to do that is to buy every single seat on the (scheduled) aircraft. And even if that happens, it's still not a charter flight. It's a scheduled flight.

And on top of this, Vixen was throwing yet more strawman shade onto the actual issue at hand, which was whether Knox and her family had travelled back from Italy to the US via private charter flight(s). Now, it's proven beyond all doubt that Knox travelled from Rome to London on a scheduled BA flight, and from London to Seattle on another scheduled BA flight (on a wide-body long-haul aircraft). And Knox and her travelling party comprised no more than around 7-8 people. We also know for certain that there were plenty of other (regular, fare-paying) passengers on each flight (including members of the media, who'd either been tipped off, or simply taken an educated guess, as to which flight Knox would be taking from London to Seattle, and there was obviously still seat availability on the flight). So Vixen's (incorrect, fatuous) claim about a scheduled flight becoming a charter if a party books out the entire aircraft is, in itself, a million miles from even applying to the Knox situation - which is, remember, the one about which Vixen had originally made the (incorrect, fatuous) claim about her having taken private charter flights back to Seattle.

It truly is amazing and very instructive that Vixen simply refuses to make a hands-up mea culpa apology when she makes a provably false claim. It's happened so, so many times that it's very far from a chance occurrence. It's always an offhand "soz" or "fair enough", or similar. It's amazing. But very much par for the course, unfortunately.
LondonJohn is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 13th May 2018, 04:42 PM   #4163
LondonJohn
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 13,467
Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
It's dumber than that. This is a scheduled daily flight. Flight 49 flies every day between Heathrow and Seatac. And this is the day after Amanda had been acquitted. Does anyone with a brain thinks they canceled a flight with 400 plus people sometime in the previous 20 hours so 8 people could fly home to Seattle on a massive jet? Oh and a flight out of Rome with a similar number of people. Imagine needlessly inconveniencing 700 people? Why didn't we hear about that? Also, how did the reporters book the flight on their charter?

Vixen's logic on this is embarrassing. Charting an appropriate jet for 10 people to fly from Rome to Seattle would cost about $30,000. Probably a little less. Whereas the airborne operating cost per hour on a 747 is a hair less than that. Flight time between London and Seattle is about 10 hours so figure $280,000. Marriott might be generous with his money but I doubt he is stupid.

Completely correct in all aspects. Vixen is provably wrong - and the very fact that she continues trying to finesse things with ever-increasingly-desperate strawmen is indeed embarrassing (but oh so telling).

As you point out, BA049 flies once daily from London to Seattle. I think there may be only one other daily non-stop flight from LHR to Seattle: a Virgin/Delta (codeshare) flight. So for media organisations seeking to place reporters on the flight taking Knox and her family back to Seattle from London, they only had a choice of two. Plus, since they knew that Knox had flown BA from Rome to London, chances already were that Knox would be taking the BA connection from London to Seattle. And that's even before taking into account the (very real) possibility that certain media organisations might have been tipped off (possibly by members of BA staff) about the flight Knox was taking from LHR to SEA.

All that the media organisations had to do - and exactly what they DID do - was buy tickets for their reporters on that BA flight (and since the flight was clearly not fully-booked several hours before departure, they were indeed able to book seats, albeit probably at a relatively high price). Their hope, clearly, was that they'd be able to approach Knox on board the aircraft mid-flight, with the aim of getting some form of exclusive report (hopefully including some element of direct conversation with Knox herself, and/or her close family). Knox and her family, understandably, simply did not want any harassment from those reporters on the aircraft, and in addition it's very likely that the cabin crew did not want the flight disrupted by reporters trying to get to Knox repeatedly. And that is precisely why the airline decided to place Knox and her family on the upper deck, and then to control access to that top deck: it allowed Knox and her family privacy from those hungry reporters aboard the flight, plus it also afforded the other passengers the maximum peace and quiet.

It's hard to point out how many flavours of wrong Vixen is on this issue, and how many times she's desperately tried to move the goalposts.
LondonJohn is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 13th May 2018, 04:45 PM   #4164
LondonJohn
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 13,467
Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
Are we speaking a different language? What does 'fair enough' mean in US parlance?

In England, it is akin to committing harakiri on national tv.

What on Earth are you talking about? Saying "fair enough" simply is not a frank and fulsome admittance of a mistake in England (or, for that matter, in any English-speaking country). Rather, it's a weasel form of semi-apology. And you know that full well, of course.

In England, Vixen, a proper apology consists of words such as: "Sorry, I was wrong". You know that full well also, of course.
LondonJohn is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 13th May 2018, 04:45 PM   #4165
Stacyhs
Illuminator
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Posts: 3,776
Once again, Vixen provides the entertainment that keeps pulling us all back here.
Stacyhs is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 13th May 2018, 04:58 PM   #4166
acbytesla
Penultimate Amazing
 
acbytesla's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 17,445
Originally Posted by Stacyhs View Post
Once again, Vixen provides the entertainment that keeps pulling us all back here.
Its amazing. Its not like this is even remotely relevant to the case. Just for a moment, imagine if British Airways bumped 700 plus people at the last minute so Amanda could fly home on an empty 747? Public Relations disaster.

Just the fact that Vixen won't admit to this, demonstrates her bizarre thinking in this case.
__________________
A wise man proportions his belief to the evidence.
― David Hume
acbytesla is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 13th May 2018, 05:02 PM   #4167
Stacyhs
Illuminator
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Posts: 3,776
Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
Its amazing. Its not like this is even remotely relevant to the case. Just for a moment, imagine if British Airways bumped 700 plus people at the last minute so Amanda could fly home on an empty 747? Public Relations disaster.

Just the fact that Vixen won't admit to this, demonstrates her bizarre thinking in this case.
I don't think Vixen actually believes (any longer) that it was a chartered flight. She just won't admit it. Nor will she correct...cough...anyone else who makes that false claim.
Stacyhs is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 13th May 2018, 05:14 PM   #4168
acbytesla
Penultimate Amazing
 
acbytesla's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 17,445
Originally Posted by LondonJohn View Post
Completely correct in all aspects. Vixen is provably wrong - and the very fact that she continues trying to finesse things with ever-increasingly-desperate strawmen is indeed embarrassing (but oh so telling).

As you point out, BA049 flies once daily from London to Seattle. I think there may be only one other daily non-stop flight from LHR to Seattle: a Virgin/Delta (codeshare) flight. So for media organisations seeking to place reporters on the flight taking Knox and her family back to Seattle from London, they only had a choice of two. Plus, since they knew that Knox had flown BA from Rome to London, chances already were that Knox would be taking the BA connection from London to Seattle. And that's even before taking into account the (very real) possibility that certain media organisations might have been tipped off (possibly by members of BA staff) about the flight Knox was taking from LHR to SEA.

All that the media organisations had to do - and exactly what they DID do - was buy tickets for their reporters on that BA flight (and since the flight was clearly not fully-booked several hours before departure, they were indeed able to book seats, albeit probably at a relatively high price). Their hope, clearly, was that they'd be able to approach Knox on board the aircraft mid-flight, with the aim of getting some form of exclusive report (hopefully including some element of direct conversation with Knox herself, and/or her close family). Knox and her family, understandably, simply did not want any harassment from those reporters on the aircraft, and in addition it's very likely that the cabin crew did not want the flight disrupted by reporters trying to get to Knox repeatedly. And that is precisely why the airline decided to place Knox and her family on the upper deck, and then to control access to that top deck: it allowed Knox and her family privacy from those hungry reporters aboard the flight, plus it also afforded the other passengers the maximum peace and quiet.

It's hard to point out how many flavours of wrong Vixen is on this issue, and how many times she's desperately tried to move the goalposts.
I loved how almost a dozen reporters were totally shut out. They never got near Amanda on that flight and then didn't get anything here in Seattle. They planned the arrival in Seattle brilliantly. They had 3 white vans leave the airport through a back access road which made it impossible to follow them by car. And believe it or not, the press followed the vans by helicopter and the vans took different routes to West Seattle. And when they showed up in West Seattle, the family was nowhere to be found. I understand that under a freeway overpass they switched cars and that headed to the Vashon Island Ferry.
__________________
A wise man proportions his belief to the evidence.
― David Hume
acbytesla is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 13th May 2018, 05:19 PM   #4169
acbytesla
Penultimate Amazing
 
acbytesla's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 17,445
Originally Posted by Stacyhs View Post
I don't think Vixen actually believes (any longer) that it was a chartered flight. She just won't admit it. Nor will she correct...cough...anyone else who makes that false claim.
I don't think she is that stupid either. I hate being wrong too. But by that, I mean just that, 'being wrong. Not admitting I was wrong. I'd be more embarrassed to have people think I'm stupid and I cant imagine anything that would make people think I'm stupid then for me to cling to something that was obviously wrong.
__________________
A wise man proportions his belief to the evidence.
― David Hume
acbytesla is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 13th May 2018, 05:46 PM   #4170
LondonJohn
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 13,467
Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
I loved how almost a dozen reporters were totally shut out. They never got near Amanda on that flight and then didn't get anything here in Seattle. They planned the arrival in Seattle brilliantly. They had 3 white vans leave the airport through a back access road which made it impossible to follow them by car. And believe it or not, the press followed the vans by helicopter and the vans took different routes to West Seattle. And when they showed up in West Seattle, the family was nowhere to be found. I understand that under a freeway overpass they switched cars and that headed to the Vashon Island Ferry.

Of course some of the more moronic pro-guilt commentators would try to argue something along the lines of "Why was Knox running scared from reporters? What did she have to hide? Was she afraid of being asked awkward questions that she couldn't answer?" Because they see absolutely everything through the jaded lens of a blanket anti-Knox sentiment. But of course the actions of Knox and her family in avoiding the media are entirely compatible with a factually-innocent Knox. It's perfectly understandable that Knox would just have wanted privacy and relaxation in the company of her family. It's also possible that Knox's family (or someone such as Marriott) had fixed up exclusive access with a particular media outlet or outlets once Knox was back in Seattle - and this would obviously preclude Knox or her family engaging with other media organisations. But that too is wholly compatible with a factually-innocent Knox, of course.
LondonJohn is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 13th May 2018, 05:55 PM   #4171
bagels
Master Poster
 
bagels's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Posts: 2,008
Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
I loved how almost a dozen reporters were totally shut out. They never got near Amanda on that flight and then didn't get anything here in Seattle. They planned the arrival in Seattle brilliantly. They had 3 white vans leave the airport through a back access road which made it impossible to follow them by car. And believe it or not, the press followed the vans by helicopter and the vans took different routes to West Seattle. And when they showed up in West Seattle, the family was nowhere to be found. I understand that under a freeway overpass they switched cars and that headed to the Vashon Island Ferry.
In Perugia, Mignini reflects that no human can climb 10 feet, which halfway around the world causes a helicopter to take flight in Seattle. The butter-fly effect
bagels is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 13th May 2018, 06:24 PM   #4172
Stacyhs
Illuminator
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Posts: 3,776
Originally Posted by bagels View Post
In Perugia, Mignini reflects that no human can climb 10 feet, which halfway around the world causes a helicopter to take flight in Seattle. The butter-fly effect
Don't forget that only a woman would cover the body. Sherlock Holmes he ain't no matter how much he fancies himself to be.
Stacyhs is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 13th May 2018, 06:26 PM   #4173
acbytesla
Penultimate Amazing
 
acbytesla's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 17,445
Originally Posted by LondonJohn View Post
Of course some of the more moronic pro-guilt commentators would try to argue something along the lines of "Why was Knox running scared from reporters? What did she have to hide? Was she afraid of being asked awkward questions that she couldn't answer?" Because they see absolutely everything through the jaded lens of a blanket anti-Knox sentiment. But of course the actions of Knox and her family in avoiding the media are entirely compatible with a factually-innocent Knox. It's perfectly understandable that Knox would just have wanted privacy and relaxation in the company of her family. It's also possible that Knox's family (or someone such as Marriott) had fixed up exclusive access with a particular media outlet or outlets once Knox was back in Seattle - and this would obviously preclude Knox or her family engaging with other media organisations. But that too is wholly compatible with a factually-innocent Knox, of course.
That the press followed in helicopters is in itself bizarre. The family knew even better than Amanda the absurd lengths the press would go for a story. But my guess, this escape was all Marriott.
__________________
A wise man proportions his belief to the evidence.
― David Hume
acbytesla is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 13th May 2018, 06:33 PM   #4174
Stacyhs
Illuminator
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Posts: 3,776
Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
That the press followed in helicopters is in itself bizarre. The family knew even better than Amanda the absurd lengths the press would go for a story. But my guess, this escape was all Marriott.
I'm surprised Peggy Ganong wasn't hiding in her bushes.
Stacyhs is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 13th May 2018, 07:29 PM   #4175
Bill Williams
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 13,476
Originally Posted by Stacyhs View Post
I'm surprised Peggy Ganong wasn't hiding in her bushes.
For the sake of clarity.....

Peggy Ganong, moderator of the now defunct PMF.ORG hate site and resident of West Seattle, never hid in the bushes.

She counted shrubs. Drive-by counting of the at the Mellas residence because even as their vicious opponent, she did not want tham spending money on landscaping.

If she'd discovered more, that would be proof of the millions they had to spend.....

Apologies. I'm in that kind of mood.
__________________
In a thread titled "Who Killed Meredith Kercher?", the answer is obvious. Rudy Guede and no one else.
Bill Williams is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 13th May 2018, 07:39 PM   #4176
Stacyhs
Illuminator
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Posts: 3,776
I stand corrected. (Attention Vixen: this is how it's done by someone who isn't insecure.)
But how odd is it that someone would do such a weird thing?

Last edited by Stacyhs; 13th May 2018 at 07:41 PM.
Stacyhs is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 13th May 2018, 09:04 PM   #4177
Bill Williams
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 13,476
Originally Posted by Stacyhs View Post
I stand corrected. (Attention Vixen: this is how it's done by someone who isn't insecure.)
But how odd is it that someone would do such a weird thing?
I'm citing that from memory and do not have a proper citation, so take it for what it is worth with that in mind. I could very well be wrong, and could very well owe Ms. Ganong an apology.

Attn Vixen: that's how it's done, aka. being transparent about one's sources.

But if true, yes, how odd someone would go out and count shrubs.
__________________
In a thread titled "Who Killed Meredith Kercher?", the answer is obvious. Rudy Guede and no one else.
Bill Williams is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 14th May 2018, 01:37 AM   #4178
LondonJohn
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 13,467
Originally Posted by Bill Williams View Post
I'm citing that from memory and do not have a proper citation, so take it for what it is worth with that in mind. I could very well be wrong, and could very well owe Ms. Ganong an apology.

Attn Vixen: that's how it's done, aka. being transparent about one's sources.

But if true, yes, how odd someone would go out and count shrubs.

Haha yes - and so many of the key pro-guilt commentators are unhinged and nasty in that way. Upon my "hold your nose" visit to TJMK the other day to look at the crap being written about the "private charter", I noted disgusting comments from ballerina-botherer Quennell in respect of the demographic of the neighbourhood where Curt Knox now lives. That man (Quennell) truly is a piece of work (and it's a racing certainty that he took himself to Seattle either primarily or purely to check out/harass the Knox and Mellas families). For such a tiny collective, it's quite a collection of nasty, vindictive nutters that the pro-guilt community has amassed.....
LondonJohn is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 14th May 2018, 03:15 AM   #4179
Vixen
Penultimate Amazing
 
Vixen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Moomin Valley
Posts: 13,591
Originally Posted by LondonJohn View Post
What on Earth are you talking about? Saying "fair enough" simply is not a frank and fulsome admittance of a mistake in England (or, for that matter, in any English-speaking country). Rather, it's a weasel form of semi-apology. And you know that full well, of course.

In England, Vixen, a proper apology consists of words such as: "Sorry, I was wrong". You know that full well also, of course.

LOL Anyone would think it was me who was the convicted criminal. It's a pity you don't expect Raff and Knox to apologise to the Kerchers for their heinous and wicked crime against their dearly beloved daughter, sister, niece, cousin, granddaughter, future aunt.

Your morals are all scrambled up.
__________________
If man has no tea in him, he is incapable of understanding truth and beauty. ~ Japanese Proverb
Vixen is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 14th May 2018, 03:17 AM   #4180
Vixen
Penultimate Amazing
 
Vixen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Moomin Valley
Posts: 13,591
Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
I loved how almost a dozen reporters were totally shut out. They never got near Amanda on that flight and then didn't get anything here in Seattle. They planned the arrival in Seattle brilliantly. They had 3 white vans leave the airport through a back access road which made it impossible to follow them by car. And believe it or not, the press followed the vans by helicopter and the vans took different routes to West Seattle. And when they showed up in West Seattle, the family was nowhere to be found. I understand that under a freeway overpass they switched cars and that headed to the Vashon Island Ferry.
Living like a refugee, eh.
__________________
If man has no tea in him, he is incapable of understanding truth and beauty. ~ Japanese Proverb
Vixen is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 14th May 2018, 06:46 AM   #4181
Bill Williams
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 13,476
Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
LOL Anyone would think it was me who was the convicted criminal. It's a pity you don't expect Raff and Knox to apologise to the Kerchers for their heinous and wicked crime against their dearly beloved daughter, sister, niece, cousin, granddaughter, future aunt.

Your morals are all scrambled up.
What crime was that? You may have missed it, but in 2015 the pair were exonerated for the accusations arising from the "amnesiac" investigation of the horrible 2007 crime.

Here's what one Italian court said about the result of that final Cassation verdict:
Quote:
CONSIDERED AS FACTS AND MATTERS OF LAW

The defendant was summoned to trial by the Judge of the Preliminary hearings
with the decree of 20-Mar-2015, for the facts cited in the charges.

The case is a follow-on of a more complex and serious one, regarding the
murder of Meredith Kercher, a young English student, which occurred in Perugia
between 01-Nov and 02-Nov-2007. Those proceedings concluded with the
exoneration of the defendant of murder
, that she was accused of together with her
boyfriend Raffaele Sollecito, and with her conviction for calumny against Patrick
Lumumba, after two Assizes trials in Perugia, with initially a conviction followed by
exoneration, a partial annulment by the Court of Cassation, for the murder, another
appeal trial in Florence, and finally, the definitive annulment of the conviction of the
second level verdict delivered in the referral trial
.
__________________
In a thread titled "Who Killed Meredith Kercher?", the answer is obvious. Rudy Guede and no one else.
Bill Williams is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 14th May 2018, 07:06 AM   #4182
TruthCalls
Graduate Poster
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 1,044
Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
LOL Anyone would think it was me who was the convicted criminal. It's a pity you don't expect Raff and Knox to apologise to the Kerchers for their heinous and wicked crime against their dearly beloved daughter, sister, niece, cousin, granddaughter, future aunt.

Your morals are all scrambled up.
Ah, one of your other talents ... divert the discussion. Right now this is about YOU, and your lie about Amanda returning on a chartered flight, and now your inability to admit you were wrong about it.

As to where you were trying to divert things... IF Amanda and Raffaele had committed a crime against Meredith, as Guede did, then I'm fairly certain everyone here would expect an admission of guilt and an apology. But since they committed no crime, there is nothing to apologize for so why expect it?

So, back to the original topic... you ready to admit you were WRONG about the chartered flight yet?
TruthCalls is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 14th May 2018, 07:09 AM   #4183
sept79
Critical Thinker
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Posts: 310
Originally Posted by Bill Williams View Post
I'm citing that from memory and do not have a proper citation, so take it for what it is worth with that in mind. I could very well be wrong, and could very well owe Ms. Ganong an apology.

Attn Vixen: that's how it's done, aka. being transparent about one's sources.

But if true, yes, how odd someone would go out and count shrubs.

You owe no apology to Ms. Ganong . . . .
sept79 is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 14th May 2018, 07:41 AM   #4184
Bill Williams
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 13,476
Originally Posted by sept79 View Post
You owe no apology to Ms. Ganong . . . .
I dunno. In the heat of undue rhetoric and hyperbole something untoward probably slipped through.
__________________
In a thread titled "Who Killed Meredith Kercher?", the answer is obvious. Rudy Guede and no one else.
Bill Williams is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 14th May 2018, 07:47 AM   #4185
LondonJohn
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 13,467
Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
LOL Anyone would think it was me who was the convicted criminal. It's a pity you don't expect Raff and Knox to apologise to the Kerchers for their heinous and wicked crime against their dearly beloved daughter, sister, niece, cousin, granddaughter, future aunt.

Your morals are all scrambled up.

Hahahaha oh dear.

Others have already addressed this pile of dog poo with sufficient eloquence. But let me also add my voice to those who've correctly pointed out that you're once again attempting here to divert the conversation away from your astonishing inability to admit properly when you are shown to be wrong. Wow.
LondonJohn is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 14th May 2018, 07:49 AM   #4186
LondonJohn
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 13,467
Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
Living like a refugee, eh.

And just like that..... my prediction came true. Never failing to disappoint (or to set the bar ever lower and lower for common decency and intellectual honesty)
LondonJohn is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 14th May 2018, 09:29 AM   #4187
TruthCalls
Graduate Poster
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 1,044
Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
It's wonderful the self-described sluttish Amber Rose is, "Making a powerful statement: 'I am taking the punch for all women'" ~ Amanda Knox.

Not in my name, dearie. What has Amber Rose ever done in her life except parade in extremely scanty clothing in public and lay a variety of rap artists?
So let's see exactly what Rose has done with herself other than "parade in extremely scanty clothing in public and lay a variety of rap artists"

Originally Posted by From Wikipedia
Rose's appearance in Young Jeezy and Kanye West's "Put On" video in 2008 caught the attention of West. Rose then gained more exposure after posing for a Louis Vuitton print advertisement featuring West's sneaker line. Rose walked the runway at New York Fashion Week for "Celestino," Rose has also made cameos in music videos such as Nicki Minaj's "Massive Attack," Young Jeezy's "Vacation," Wiz Khalifa's "No Sleep," Fabolous' "You Be Killin' Em," Ludacris' "What Them Girls Like and Future's "Mask Off." She was signed with modeling agency Ford Models from 2009 to 2010.

In 2010, she appeared in Russell Simmons's reality show about his two assistants, "Running Russell Simmons." She also starred in a PSA by NOH8 Campaign. In 2011, Rose was a guest judge on Season 3 of RuPaul's Drag Race. She was also a judge on Season 2 of Master of the Mix. In November 2011, she became the spokesperson for Smirnoff and appeared in television ads and billboards for the company's new flavors Whipped Cream and Fluffed Marshmallow.

Rose released her debut single "Fame," which features Wiz Khalifa, on January 10, 2012, followed by a second single, titled "Loaded," released on February 6, 2012. She then rapped on the eleventh track of her ex-husband's album O.N.I.F.C., titled "Rise Above," along with rappers Tuki Carter and Pharrell Williams, who produced the song. She was managed by Leticia "Tish" Cyrus, mother of singer Miley Cyrus, who is Rose's and her ex-husband Wiz Khalifa's close friend.

In September 2009, Rose announced plans to launch her own eyewear line. In 2012, Rose opened a clothing line with her friend Priscilla Ono called Rose & Ono.

Rose guest-starred on an episode of Wild 'N Out on MTV2, and had a role as "MaryWanna" in the film School Dance, which was directed by her manager, Nick Cannon in 2014.

Simon & Schuster published her first book, How to Be a Bad Bitch, in which she offers advice and personal anecdotes on everything from finances and career to love and fashion. The cover features an image shot by famed photographer David LaChapelle.

In 2015, Rose filmed "Walk of No Shame with Amber Rose" with Funny or Die. The viral video helped promote Rose's SlutWalk, which took place on October 3, 2015 in Los Angeles, California.

In March 2016, Rose launched an emoji app called MuvaMoji, featuring 900 emoji icons that she curated. Upon release, it shot to No. 1 on the App Store charts. She earned US$4 million from the app.

In May 2016, it was announced that Rose would star in her own talk show entitled The Amber Rose Show on VH1, which debuted on July 8, 2016.

On September 8, 2016, Rose began hosting Loveline.

On August 30, 2016, Rose was announced as one of the celebrities who would compete on the 23rd season of Dancing with the Stars. She was partnered with professional dancer Maksim Chmerkovskiy. They were eliminated on October 17 and finished in 9th place.
It appears to me Rose has been very busy, and quite successful. This is a rather lengthy list of activities and accomplishments for someone only 34 years old.

Originally Posted by Vixen
All I know of Amber Rose is how she chose to present herself in the VICE video. 'Slut' is her own label, and she is filmed walking down a public street in her skimpy lingerie.
You form an opinion of her based on a decision made early in her life to respond to urgent family needs. You reinforce this opinion based on her actions performed as an activist and from this conclude she's nothing more than a slut. An impressive array of lifetime accomplishments are wholly dismissed by you because they contradict with your very shallow initial opinion of her.

As this pertains to Amanda and Raffaele; my guess is you formed an opinion very early on when the facts of the case where unknown and many falsities were being released by the investigation and embellished by the media. You continue to embrace that opinion ten years later despite overwhelming evidence, and a final definitive ruling of the Supreme Court, that shows you are wrong. You did the exact same thing with Ryan Ferguson. You formed an opinion, clearly based on incorrect information, yet even after being shown everything you thought you knew was wrong you continue to believe he is guilty. Even something as simple as Amanda's flight home, you came to believe the flight was chartered and despite overwhelming evidence she was nothing more than a passenger on a scheduled flight, you still think it was a chartered flight.
TruthCalls is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 14th May 2018, 09:50 AM   #4188
Stacyhs
Illuminator
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Posts: 3,776
Originally Posted by TruthCalls View Post
So let's see exactly what Rose has done with herself other than "parade in extremely scanty clothing in public and lay a variety of rap artists"



It appears to me Rose has been very busy, and quite successful. This is a rather lengthy list of activities and accomplishments for someone only 34 years old.



You form an opinion of her based on a decision made early in her life to respond to urgent family needs. You reinforce this opinion based on her actions performed as an activist and from this conclude she's nothing more than a slut. An impressive array of lifetime accomplishments are wholly dismissed by you because they contradict with your very shallow initial opinion of her.

As this pertains to Amanda and Raffaele; my guess is you formed an opinion very early on when the facts of the case where unknown and many falsities were being released by the investigation and embellished by the media. You continue to embrace that opinion ten years later despite overwhelming evidence, and a final definitive ruling of the Supreme Court, that shows you are wrong. You did the exact same thing with Ryan Ferguson. You formed an opinion, clearly based on incorrect information, yet even after being shown everything you thought you knew was wrong you continue to believe he is guilty. Even something as simple as Amanda's flight home, you came to believe the flight was chartered and despite overwhelming evidence she was nothing more than a passenger on a scheduled flight, you still think it was a chartered flight.
I think you've hit the nail on the head. Vixen formed an opinion early on and, being Vixen, was then incapable of changing that opinion no matter what followed. Changing her opinion would be admitting that she'd made a mistake and that would never, ever do.
Stacyhs is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 14th May 2018, 10:14 AM   #4189
Stacyhs
Illuminator
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Posts: 3,776
This is what I could find on Ganong and the infamous l'affaire des shrubs:

Quote:
In addition to her aggressive attacks, Ganong appears to be a compulsive liar. In one example, Ganong bragged on her website that she scoped out the Knox family home. When questioned about driving by the Knox home, Ganong claimed that she just happened to pass by the house on the way to another destination. If that was the case, why did she count their shrubs to see how much the Knox family may or may not have spent on landscaping?
https://www.groundreport.com/ny-time...y-ganong-well/
Stacyhs is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 14th May 2018, 10:50 AM   #4190
Stacyhs
Illuminator
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Posts: 3,776
Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
LOL Anyone would think it was me who was the convicted criminal. It's a pity you don't expect Raff and Knox to apologise to the Kerchers for their heinous and wicked crime against their dearly beloved daughter, sister, niece, cousin, granddaughter, future aunt.

Your morals are all scrambled up.
She won't even be that when the ECHR rules in her favor and Italy corrects that mistake.

It's a pity that Guede hasn't apologized to the Kerchers for his heinous and wicked crime against their dearly beloved daughter, sister, niece, cousin, granddaughter, future aunt. Knox and Sollecito have nothing to apologize for since they had nothing to do with Kercher's death.

Your facts are all scrambled up.
Stacyhs is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 14th May 2018, 11:28 AM   #4191
acbytesla
Penultimate Amazing
 
acbytesla's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 17,445
Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
Living like a refugee, eh.
Not sure what that means.
__________________
A wise man proportions his belief to the evidence.
― David Hume
acbytesla is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 14th May 2018, 12:42 PM   #4192
bagels
Master Poster
 
bagels's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Posts: 2,008
Is that Skeptical Bystander? tbf She took down PMF and I don't think even tweets about the case anymore. Seems to have rightfully moved on unlike someone we know.
bagels is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 14th May 2018, 06:53 PM   #4193
Loss Leader
Do you want to date my Avatar?
Moderator
 
Loss Leader's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Florida
Posts: 25,425
Mod InfoThread closed for length. The continuation thread can be found here. Members are reminded not to discuss the mental health or motivations of any other poster in the continuation thread. Thank you.
Posted By:Loss Leader
__________________
I have the honor to be
Your Obdt. St

L. Leader

Last edited by Loss Leader; 15th May 2018 at 05:55 AM.
Loss Leader is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Closed Thread

International Skeptics Forum » General Topics » Trials and Errors

Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 04:08 PM.
Powered by vBulletin. Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.

This forum began as part of the James Randi Education Foundation (JREF). However, the forum now exists as
an independent entity with no affiliation with or endorsement by the JREF, including the section in reference to "JREF" topics.

Disclaimer: Messages posted in the Forum are solely the opinion of their authors.