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Old 17th May 2018, 05:51 AM   #201
LTC8K6
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Originally Posted by Jodie View Post
Not really, the dishes were still on the table and hadn't been cleared yet when it happened.
Seems odd that the dishes were still on the table.

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Anyway, the waitress left and we were discussing where to go to get a Daith piercing, then the conversation drifted off to other topics. We were there for a couple of hours, the lunch crowd had dwindled down, and we had the room to ourselves. As we were talking and gossiping we heard something fall, hit the tile floor behind Becky, who was sitting directly across from me.
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Old 17th May 2018, 08:25 AM   #202
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Did you see the perfectly rational, non-woo explanation i gave you on the last page?

Why would continue with the bizarre connection of finding the earings, to what you were talking about?

Why are you continuing this ?

Do you understand that no one thinks there is any woo connection here? Do you think you will change anyone's mind? What is your end game? What would convince you that this has no supernatural connection?
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Old 17th May 2018, 07:34 PM   #203
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I saw it, but my coworkers say no one could have tossed earrings at us. We were at a far table, ( two that had been pushed together). There were empty booths along two walls, the other wall had the cash register, behind that was the kitchen. The bathrooms were to my left past Gena. There wasn't anyway anyone could pitch anything without being seen by one of us. My end game? I don't think I have one other than not everything has an explanation, none given so far work for this particular situation.
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Old 17th May 2018, 10:17 PM   #204
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Everything that happens has an explanation. Just because you don't always know what it is does not mean there isn't one.
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Old 18th May 2018, 01:27 AM   #205
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Originally Posted by Jodie View Post
I don't think I have one other than not everything has an explanation, none given so far work for this particular situation.
I have one:

You said that you thought the first object made too much noise to be the earring you found. This is because it was. You heard something else fall (perhaps a coin out of a purse, as you at first supposed), and that rolled or bounced out of the way so it wasn't found. The earring you found had been on the floor the whole time.

You said that at first you thought the thing that fell on your colleague's arm was an insect of some kind. That's because it was. The different earring that you found on her arm is one she'd inadvertently picked up somewhere else when she rested her arm on something or brushed up against something and it became caught up in her clothing. The insect had already flown off again by the time you looked at her sleeve.

Is that the correct explanation? Who knows? But it's 100% plausible, entirely mundane, and explains all the available data.
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Old 18th May 2018, 02:17 AM   #206
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Originally Posted by Jodie View Post
I saw it, but my coworkers say no one could have tossed earrings at us. We were at a far table, ( two that had been pushed together). There were empty booths along two walls, the other wall had the cash register, behind that was the kitchen. The bathrooms were to my left past Gena. There wasn't anyway anyone could pitch anything without being seen by one of us. My end game? I don't think I have one other than not everything has an explanation, none given so far work for this particular situation.
People aren't perfect surveillance robots... Even if two people were facing the direction the earring came from, they might not have been paying attention.
They might have been looking at you, their glass, the window, anything.
In fact, a waiter who's planning on throwing something to a customer will probably wait for an opportune moment when they're not being watched.
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Old 18th May 2018, 05:01 AM   #207
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Originally Posted by Jodie View Post
I saw it, but my coworkers say no one could have tossed earrings at us. We were at a far table, ( two that had been pushed together). There were empty booths along two walls, the other wall had the cash register, behind that was the kitchen. The bathrooms were to my left past Gena. There wasn't anyway anyone could pitch anything without being seen by one of us. My end game? I don't think I have one other than not everything has an explanation, none given so far work for this particular situation.
Well of course no one tossed earrings at you, and that has nothing to do with my perfectly rational explanation.

Quote:
A bug fell off the ceiling hitting your friend in the arm.
When you looked to see what it was, the bug had scurried away, and there were already two earrings on the floor.
This restaurant doesn't vaccuum often, or missed it.

Your brain assumed the earrings sitting on the floor were what had fallen, because there was no longer a bug in the logical landing area.
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Old 18th May 2018, 05:46 PM   #208
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Originally Posted by Pixel42 View Post
Everything that happens has an explanation. Just because you don't always know what it is does not mean there isn't one.
True, but forcing an explanation that doesn't match the circumstances that was witnessed is equally unscientific and biased IMO. I don't know how it happened but I do know that no one threw earrings at us and squirrels and lizards didn't do it.
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Old 18th May 2018, 06:00 PM   #209
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Originally Posted by Squeegee Beckenheim View Post
I have one:

You said that you thought the first object made too much noise to be the earring you found. This is because it was. You heard something else fall (perhaps a coin out of a purse, as you at first supposed), and that rolled or bounced out of the way so it wasn't found. The earring you found had been on the floor the whole time.
Totally plausible.

Quote:
You said that at first you thought the thing that fell on your colleague's arm was an insect of some kind. That's because it was. The different earring that you found on her arm is one she'd inadvertently picked up somewhere else when she rested her arm on something or brushed up against something and it became caught up in her clothing. The insect had already flown off again by the time you looked at her sleeve.
That could happen except I was looking straight at her the entire time and no insect flew away or crawled away.

Quote:
Is that the correct explanation? Who knows? But it's 100% plausible, entirely mundane, and explains all the available data.
Close enough, it was just coincidence that we happened to be talking about Daith earrings with the waitress. The conversation wasn't necessarily connected to what appeared to be a falling earring from nowhere. The first earring found on the floor had nothing to do with the second earring that fell on my coworker.
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Old 18th May 2018, 06:04 PM   #210
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Originally Posted by Porpoise of Life View Post
People aren't perfect surveillance robots... Even if two people were facing the direction the earring came from, they might not have been paying attention.
They might have been looking at you, their glass, the window, anything.
In fact, a waiter who's planning on throwing something to a customer will probably wait for an opportune moment when they're not being watched.
No they aren't but the person tossing earrings would have to have excellent aim from around a corner. I'm more inclined to think the earring was snagged on Becky's clothing some kind of way.
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Old 18th May 2018, 09:03 PM   #211
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Originally Posted by Jodie View Post
True, but forcing an explanation that doesn't match the circumstances that was witnessed is equally unscientific and biased IMO. I don't know how it happened but I do know that no one threw earrings at us and squirrels and lizards didn't do it.

The only problem and this was pointed out a long while ago, This can all boil down to a made up story your telling so you can hold onto the "ohh isn't the world mysterious and maybe ghosts!" mindset.

As far as I'm concerned this event never happened and if it did it was a 10th-dimensional bigfoot of which you need to disprove should you disagree with that notion.
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Old 18th May 2018, 10:00 PM   #212
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Originally Posted by Jodie View Post
True, but forcing an explanation that doesn't match the circumstances that was witnessed is equally unscientific and biased IMO.
We don't know the circumstances, we can only speculate as to what they were based on the limited information you noticed and of which you have a reliable memory.

Quote:
I don't know how it happened but I do know that no one threw earrings at us and squirrels and lizards didn't do it.
You don't know that. You may think it unlikely, but you don't know it.

Originally Posted by Jodie View Post
That could happen except I was looking straight at her the entire time and no insect flew away or crawled away.
You clearly have very little understanding of how perception works. Only a tiny fraction of the information that enters your senses is brought to the attention of your conscious awareness. Your brain filters out what it considers noise, and let's through only what seems relevant. I can look out my window at my bird table and fail to notice the sight and sound of cars going by, let alone the insects buzzing around, even though both are also in my field of view.
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Old 18th May 2018, 10:58 PM   #213
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Originally Posted by Jodie View Post
True, but forcing an explanation that doesn't match the circumstances that was witnessed is equally unscientific and biased IMO.
That's not what people have been doing in this thread. All we have been doing is offering possible rational alternatives to the idea that they just fell from nowhere.
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Old 19th May 2018, 03:10 AM   #214
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Originally Posted by Jodie View Post
That could happen except I was looking straight at her the entire time and no insect flew away or crawled away.
How do you know? You say that "we ruled out a falling insect". How did you do that? You say "we saw it wasn't a bug". How did you, as a group, establish that?

Quote:
Close enough, it was just coincidence that we happened to be talking about Daith earrings with the waitress.
Yes.

Quote:
The conversation wasn't necessarily connected to what appeared to be a falling earring from nowhere.
In what way do you suppose it might be?

Quote:
The first earring found on the floor had nothing to do with the second earring that fell on my coworker.
I don't see how or why it could.
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Old 19th May 2018, 08:17 PM   #215
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We saw no insect, just the earring when it fell on Becky's arm. I had the best view since I was sitting directly across from Becky.
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Old 19th May 2018, 11:22 PM   #216
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Originally Posted by Jodie View Post
We saw no insect, just the earring when it fell on Becky's arm. I had the best view since I was sitting directly across from Becky.
https://www.smithsonianmag.com/scien...ness-17339778/

Quote:
For more than a decade, my colleagues and I have been studying a form of invisibility known as inattentional blindness. In our best-known demonstration, we showed people a video and asked them to count how many times three basketball players wearing white shirts passed a ball. After about 30 seconds, a woman in a gorilla suit sauntered into the scene, faced the camera, thumped her chest and walked away. Half the viewers missed her. In fact, some people looked right at the gorilla and did not see it.

That video was an Internet sensation. So, in 2010, I decided to make a sequel. This time viewers were expecting the gorilla to make an appearance. And it did. But the viewers were so focused on watching for the gorilla that they overlooked other unexpected events, such as the curtain in the background changing color.

How could they miss something right before their eyes? This form of invisibility depends not on the limits of the eye, but on the limits of the mind. We consciously see only a small subset of our visual world, and when our attention is focused on one thing, we fail to notice other, unexpected things around us—including those we might want to see.
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Old 20th May 2018, 02:40 AM   #217
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Originally Posted by Jodie View Post
We saw no insect, just the earring when it fell on Becky's arm. I had the best view since I was sitting directly across from Becky.
I didn't say you saw an insect. You're making an assumption that what you saw fall was the earring - or at least it seems like an assumption from the scarce information you've given. You didn't answer any of my questions. Could you do so, please?
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Old 23rd May 2018, 01:11 PM   #218
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Originally Posted by Jodie View Post
We saw no insect, just the earring when it fell on Becky's arm. I had the best view since I was sitting directly across from Becky.
Ok fine, it must have been magic then I guess.
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Old 23rd May 2018, 01:37 PM   #219
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This is still going on? There have already been multiple plausible answers to this. Here is mine, again.

Originally Posted by mgidm86 View Post
Throwing earrings to get customers to leave would be very odd, especially if nobody had first tried asking them to leave soon so they could setup dinner. It's possible though, but it depends on how far away the table was from the staff at the time. If it seemed to drop vertically then it was not the staff (or it didn't drop vertically).

Simple explanation:

I'd say it was someone else in the group playing around.

Look, the group is discussing earrings and woo and earrings appear. Coincidence? Probably not. The fact that anyone would believe in any way that earrings can help migraines is a sign of woo, and someone at the table probably knows it.

Therefore, someone(s) in the group gathered a few cheap earrings from purses and threw one and it hit the floor. Bad shot. Maybe it was even tossed to the person not as a joke but some other reason.

Maybe it took 10 minutes to find because it slid far from the table due to it being thrown laterally rather than falling vertically. Perhaps it rolled.

So the first earring misses and a second is tossed, this time maybe (maybe not) tossed up toward the ceiling. It's a group of five people so one could pull this off unnoticed.

The earring(s) could have been flipped like a coin which would require no arm movement and send them straight up.

The earring lands, mystery is afoot, then after ten minutes of looking, the other earring is found, possibly by the person who threw it.

The earrings don't match, and since ghosts don't wear mismatched earrings, it would lead me to believe that two women were involved, though possibly only one.
Sure, maybe it was the staff, it is remotely possible. What is not remotely possible is that they fell from the ceiling or that a ghost did it.

It was either a friend or the staff. Case closed. What's the big mystery?

I played a practical joke on someone at work for months and I never told him. I fixed it so I could control his mouse from my own workstation using my foot with a spare mouse on the floor. I got good with it. Every so often I would do it and mess with him.

After some time he began thinking there was a "force" in his right hand, as the only time the mouse acted erratically was when he used his right hand. I actually trained him to use his left hand quite well.

People play pranks. It happens a lot, and it happened here at this restaurant. Obviously.
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Old 23rd May 2018, 01:40 PM   #220
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Originally Posted by Pterodactyl View Post
Ok fine, it must have been magic then I guess.
Yep, you see even in the face of perfectly rational explanations the doubts keep coming four pages later. The OP isn't looking for a rational answer, they want to convince us to convince them it is magic. I guess.

The diners knew they were dealing with someone with an inclination to believe woo. They heard the whole story of the healing earrings. It's very obvious to someone not involved like myself.

ETA:
In my above post I mentioned a joke I played on a coworker for months. When he asked me a few times if I was messing with him I flat out denied it and I never admitted it even to this day. Just because the friends say they had nothing to do with it doesn't mean they didn't.
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Old 24th May 2018, 06:20 AM   #221
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I don't know, It seems more likely that Jodie flipped the earrings, trying to create some woo woo talk among her friends.

"Nooo Cheryl, I was looking right at the spot, those earrings came from no where."

Jodie seems like the person who asks if anyone wants to try the Ouija board, then pretends like she's never used it before, but is the one controlling the movement to create the ghostly answers.
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Old 24th May 2018, 09:22 AM   #222
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Originally Posted by Pixel42 View Post
Great link, thanks! Another factor that's related to (but a bit separate from) that is our ability to convince ourselves that our perception and recall is perfect so we can dismiss explanations.

I used to work in a store that sold, among other things, some magic tricks. One was a trick that made it look like you were causing a glowing red ball to appear and disappear and we had a very strict rule - don't let the customer look in the box before they've seen you demonstrate it.

The reason for this is that if someone saw you perform the trick they were always impressed and never figured out how it worked. They loved it. But if they looked in the box, they would snort in disgust and insist that they would never in a billion years fall for that. In fact even if they had seen and fallen for it first they would sometimes insist that the trick in the box couldn't possibly be the thing they had been shown.

If you must spoil the trick... it was a fake thumb. A big, ugly, cheaply made and unconvincing fake thumb. It was the wrong size and skin tone for most people, and our demo one had had "DEMO" written on it in marker that had bled into the rubber and stained the whole thing PURPLE and people still couldn't see it because they weren't looking for a big fake thumb, they were looking for a glowing red ball (there's an LED inside the thumb, putting pressure on the tip as if grabbing something made it light up.
I'm not joking about how obvious this thing is, and nobody EVER realized what it was when we demonstrated it. We demo'd it constantly and had it in stock for a very long time, so if you're thinking to yourself that you couldn't possibly be fooled by something like that then you're fooling yourself RIGHT NOW.


Likewise, with paranormal stuff if they don't know the "trick" they don't even really perceive it, and then they insist that it couldn't possibly have been any of the explanations given because they totally would have noticed that.
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Old 24th May 2018, 11:10 AM   #223
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Originally Posted by mgidm86 View Post
Yep, you see even in the face of perfectly rational explanations the doubts keep coming four pages later. The OP isn't looking for a rational answer, they want to convince us to convince them it is magic. I guess.

The diners knew they were dealing with someone with an inclination to believe woo. They heard the whole story of the healing earrings. It's very obvious to someone not involved like myself.
I had almost forgotten this small detail in the OP - "daith piercing" were claimed to be helping someone's migraines. Geez.
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Old 24th May 2018, 02:50 PM   #224
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Originally Posted by SOdhner View Post
Great link, thanks! Another factor that's related to (but a bit separate from) that is our ability to convince ourselves that our perception and recall is perfect so we can dismiss explanations.

I used to work in a store that sold, among other things, some magic tricks. One was a trick that made it look like you were causing a glowing red ball to appear and disappear and we had a very strict rule - don't let the customer look in the box before they've seen you demonstrate it.

The reason for this is that if someone saw you perform the trick they were always impressed and never figured out how it worked. They loved it. But if they looked in the box, they would snort in disgust and insist that they would never in a billion years fall for that. In fact even if they had seen and fallen for it first they would sometimes insist that the trick in the box couldn't possibly be the thing they had been shown.

If you must spoil the trick... it was a fake thumb. A big, ugly, cheaply made and unconvincing fake thumb. It was the wrong size and skin tone for most people, and our demo one had had "DEMO" written on it in marker that had bled into the rubber and stained the whole thing PURPLE and people still couldn't see it because they weren't looking for a big fake thumb, they were looking for a glowing red ball (there's an LED inside the thumb, putting pressure on the tip as if grabbing something made it light up.
I'm not joking about how obvious this thing is, and nobody EVER realized what it was when we demonstrated it. We demo'd it constantly and had it in stock for a very long time, so if you're thinking to yourself that you couldn't possibly be fooled by something like that then you're fooling yourself RIGHT NOW.


Likewise, with paranormal stuff if they don't know the "trick" they don't even really perceive it, and then they insist that it couldn't possibly have been any of the explanations given because they totally would have noticed that.
I have my own version of something like that.

Way back in 1990 I was watching the Penn & Teller special "Don't Try This At Home" and the big trick at the end was that Penn drove an articulated lorry over Teller's chest. Beforehand they gave you three possible solutions to how the trick was done, but when I watched the trick (including the slow-motion replay) it obviously wasn't any of the three.

Then they showed you how it was done (the lorry was counterbalanced, and all the tyres that ran over Teller were actually foam rubber) and I re-watched the video recording I'd made of it I simply could not imagine how I'd not seen how much the tyres were bending out of shape. It was really obvious. Once I'd been told what to look for. Before that, my brain just accepted that what I was seeing was as it should be, even though it blatantly wasn't and I was watching out for trickery.

People think they can't be fooled. But human perception is a very strange thing, and it's a lot worse than people believe it to be. The same is true of memory.
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Old 24th May 2018, 04:20 PM   #225
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Originally Posted by SOdhner View Post
Great link, thanks! Another factor that's related to (but a bit separate from) that is our ability to convince ourselves that our perception and recall is perfect so we can dismiss explanations.

I used to work in a store that sold, among other things, some magic tricks. One was a trick that made it look like you were causing a glowing red ball to appear and disappear and we had a very strict rule - don't let the customer look in the box before they've seen you demonstrate it.

The reason for this is that if someone saw you perform the trick they were always impressed and never figured out how it worked. They loved it. But if they looked in the box, they would snort in disgust and insist that they would never in a billion years fall for that. In fact even if they had seen and fallen for it first they would sometimes insist that the trick in the box couldn't possibly be the thing they had been shown.

If you must spoil the trick... it was a fake thumb. A big, ugly, cheaply made and unconvincing fake thumb. It was the wrong size and skin tone for most people, and our demo one had had "DEMO" written on it in marker that had bled into the rubber and stained the whole thing PURPLE and people still couldn't see it because they weren't looking for a big fake thumb, they were looking for a glowing red ball (there's an LED inside the thumb, putting pressure on the tip as if grabbing something made it light up.
I'm not joking about how obvious this thing is, and nobody EVER realized what it was when we demonstrated it. We demo'd it constantly and had it in stock for a very long time, so if you're thinking to yourself that you couldn't possibly be fooled by something like that then you're fooling yourself RIGHT NOW.


Likewise, with paranormal stuff if they don't know the "trick" they don't even really perceive it, and then they insist that it couldn't possibly have been any of the explanations given because they totally would have noticed that.
Regarding your Spoiler Box, it's an excellent example. That method is the precise method of what was a very popular effect for several years not very long ago. Take away the lights, and it is the method for some very baffling effects, and this is regardless that the gimmick is so unmatched to the performer and so obvious to the audience, or at least seems like it should be so obvious to the audience.


Originally Posted by Squeegee Beckenheim View Post
I have my own version of something like that.

Way back in 1990 I was watching the Penn & Teller special "Don't Try This At Home" and the big trick at the end was that Penn drove an articulated lorry over Teller's chest. Beforehand they gave you three possible solutions to how the trick was done, but when I watched the trick (including the slow-motion replay) it obviously wasn't any of the three.

Then they showed you how it was done (the lorry was counterbalanced, and all the tyres that ran over Teller were actually foam rubber) and I re-watched the video recording I'd made of it I simply could not imagine how I'd not seen how much the tyres were bending out of shape. It was really obvious. Once I'd been told what to look for. Before that, my brain just accepted that what I was seeing was as it should be, even though it blatantly wasn't and I was watching out for trickery.

People think they can't be fooled. But human perception is a very strange thing, and it's a lot worse than people believe it to be. The same is true of memory.
Yes, but the rationalizations get worse when some believers learn how easy to fool themselves. I can't count the number of times I've discussed this topic with believers and received a reply that basically says "Since I realize I am very easy to fool, I can't be fooled."
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Old 24th May 2018, 04:26 PM   #226
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Originally Posted by SOdhner View Post
Great link, thanks! Another factor that's related to (but a bit separate from) that is our ability to convince ourselves that our perception and recall is perfect so we can dismiss explanations.

I used to work in a store that sold, among other things, some magic tricks. One was a trick that made it look like you were causing a glowing red ball to appear and disappear .......
A video of the trick

https://youtu.be/tHFXM_FsNrc
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Old 25th May 2018, 12:16 AM   #227
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Originally Posted by SOdhner View Post
Great link, thanks! Another factor that's related to (but a bit separate from) that is our ability to convince ourselves that our perception and recall is perfect so we can dismiss explanations.

I used to work in a store that sold, among other things, some magic tricks. One was a trick that made it look like you were causing a glowing red ball to appear and disappear and we had a very strict rule - don't let the customer look in the box before they've seen you demonstrate it.

The reason for this is that if someone saw you perform the trick they were always impressed and never figured out how it worked. They loved it. But if they looked in the box, they would snort in disgust and insist that they would never in a billion years fall for that. In fact even if they had seen and fallen for it first they would sometimes insist that the trick in the box couldn't possibly be the thing they had been shown.

If you must spoil the trick... it was a fake thumb. A big, ugly, cheaply made and unconvincing fake thumb. It was the wrong size and skin tone for most people, and our demo one had had "DEMO" written on it in marker that had bled into the rubber and stained the whole thing PURPLE and people still couldn't see it because they weren't looking for a big fake thumb, they were looking for a glowing red ball (there's an LED inside the thumb, putting pressure on the tip as if grabbing something made it light up.
I'm not joking about how obvious this thing is, and nobody EVER realized what it was when we demonstrated it. We demo'd it constantly and had it in stock for a very long time, so if you're thinking to yourself that you couldn't possibly be fooled by something like that then you're fooling yourself RIGHT NOW.


Likewise, with paranormal stuff if they don't know the "trick" they don't even really perceive it, and then they insist that it couldn't possibly have been any of the explanations given because they totally would have noticed that.
I think the answer is rather obvious, but it was the basketball playing gorilla that walked past the table!
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Old 25th May 2018, 03:45 AM   #228
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I don't know how Jodie got off my ignore list.

But it adds credence to the possibility of magic. One isolated event - not evidence. But you start adding up all these incidents together and there's a pattern.
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Old 25th May 2018, 08:44 PM   #229
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Originally Posted by AlaskaBushPilot View Post
I don't know how Jodie got off my ignore list.

But it adds credence to the possibility of magic. One isolated event - not evidence. But you start adding up all these incidents together and there's a pattern.
No, multiple isolated incidents are not a pattern. If the same thing continued to happen over and over again, that might be a pattern. But if one day an earring appears from nowhere and the next day something seems to move from where it was when you last saw it, and the next day you hear a voice calling your name, those are just three isolated incidents. You can't infer a pattern from that.
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Old 26th May 2018, 03:02 AM   #230
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Originally Posted by arthwollipot View Post
No, multiple isolated incidents are not a pattern. If the same thing continued to happen over and over again, that might be a pattern. But if one day an earring appears from nowhere and the next day something seems to move from where it was when you last saw it, and the next day you hear a voice calling your name, those are just three isolated incidents. You can't infer a pattern from that.
I disagree, there's definitely a pattern, not to the events and not suggesting magic, but there's definitely a pattern...
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Old 29th May 2018, 09:49 AM   #231
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Here's a falsifiable explanation - you went to the restaurant with your coworkers, talked to the waitress about her piercing, and it made such an impression, that later that night (or the next), you trivially dreamt about being in the restaurant and earrings dropping out of nowhere. You've blended the dream memory with the restaurant memory.

Alternatively, maybe you dreamt the whole thing.

You can falsify it by asking your coworkers if they remember the weird thing that happened in the restaurant that time (you may think you have already done this, but that too could have been a dream ).

Of course, if they don't remember it, that doesn't mean it didn't happen - they may have just forgotten; and if they do remember it, it doesn't mean it did happen - you may have inadvertently engendered false memories in them

There are no certainties in life (except taxes & death).
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Old 30th May 2018, 09:18 AM   #232
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Originally Posted by SOdhner View Post
Likewise, with paranormal stuff if they don't know the "trick" they don't even really perceive it, and then they insist that it couldn't possibly have been any of the explanations given because they totally would have noticed that.
One of the most common reasons in my neck of the woods for reporting a UFO is a flock of seagulls. No, really. Our state bird is the California seagull, Larus californicus. These birds flock in large numbers near the large smelly puddle of brine we call the Great Salt Lake, and also in the parking lots of fast-food restaurants in town. L. californicus is gray on its back and the top/outside surfaces of its wings, and white on its breast and the underside of its wings.

Most Utahns will easy say, "I know a flock of seagulls when I see one. For Moroni's sake, they're everywhere." Yes, up close any flock of birds looks like a flock of birds. But from a distance -- especially with very dense flocks -- a flock of birds looks more like an amorphous, shifting blob in flight. Now when seen against a mountain backgroud, especially the grayish-brown mountain of the lake's central promontory, the gray of the seagull as seen from above blends in with the mountains. It's only when the gulls turn, as they do en masse while flying as a flock, that you see the aggregate bright white undersides contrasted against the mountain. The flock of birds suddenly appears as a large white object, then disappears if they should turn again to show their topsides and blend in with the background.

But it can't possibly have been a flock of seagulls, because they totally would have been able to see it for what it was.
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Old 30th May 2018, 07:03 PM   #233
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Originally Posted by Pixel42 View Post
We weren't moving, nothing else was moving, we were just sitting there. The falling object looked like a bug at first until it rolled down onto the table, it was an earring.
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Old 30th May 2018, 07:04 PM   #234
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Originally Posted by Drewbot View Post
I don't know, It seems more likely that Jodie flipped the earrings, trying to create some woo woo talk among her friends.

"Nooo Cheryl, I was looking right at the spot, those earrings came from no where."

Jodie seems like the person who asks if anyone wants to try the Ouija board, then pretends like she's never used it before, but is the one controlling the movement to create the ghostly answers.
Oh please, I'm 56 years old.
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Old 30th May 2018, 07:07 PM   #235
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Originally Posted by Jodie View Post
We weren't moving, nothing else was moving, we were just sitting there. The falling object looked like a bug at first until it rolled down onto the table, it was an earring.
False, None of this happened.
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Old 30th May 2018, 07:11 PM   #236
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Originally Posted by dlorde View Post
Here's a falsifiable explanation - you went to the restaurant with your coworkers, talked to the waitress about her piercing, and it made such an impression, that later that night (or the next), you trivially dreamt about being in the restaurant and earrings dropping out of nowhere. You've blended the dream memory with the restaurant memory.

Alternatively, maybe you dreamt the whole thing.

You can falsify it by asking your coworkers if they remember the weird thing that happened in the restaurant that time (you may think you have already done this, but that too could have been a dream ).

Of course, if they don't remember it, that doesn't mean it didn't happen - they may have just forgotten; and if they do remember it, it doesn't mean it did happen - you may have inadvertently engendered false memories in them

There are no certainties in life (except taxes & death).
Honestly, when it happened I didn't really comment on it one way or the other. I didn't make the connection between the conversation about the Daith earring with the waitress and the earring that fell on Becky until Annie Ruth said something about it, I never would have thought of looking on the floor for the other unmatched earring.
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Old 30th May 2018, 09:57 PM   #237
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Originally Posted by Jodie View Post
We weren't moving, nothing else was moving, we were just sitting there. The falling object looked like a bug at first until it rolled down onto the table, it was an earring.
What on Earth has whether anything was moving got to do with it? You appear to have completely misunderstood that link. It's explaining that your brain does not bring everything that's in your field of view to the attention of your conscious awareness.

People have recently been posting excellent examples in this thread:

http://www.internationalskeptics.com...d.php?t=329616
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Old 31st May 2018, 04:41 AM   #238
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Originally Posted by Jodie View Post
We weren't moving, nothing else was moving, we were just sitting there. The falling object looked like a bug at first until it rolled down onto the table, it was an earring.
A little earlier in the thread you said:

Originally Posted by Jodie View Post
I'm more inclined to think the earring was snagged on Becky's clothing some kind of way.
Now you're saying that it fell on her arm and rolled off. Your story appears to have changed.

You've also neglected, twice, to answer my questions. If you're truly interested in working out what happened, then you should answer them, as nobody can offer any real insight if they don't have all the relevant information.

Here they are again:

Originally Posted by Squeegee Beckenheim View Post
How do you know? You say that "we ruled out a falling insect". How did you do that? You say "we saw it wasn't a bug". How did you, as a group, establish that?
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Old 31st May 2018, 06:10 AM   #239
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Originally Posted by Jodie View Post
Honestly, when it happened I didn't really comment on it one way or the other. I didn't make the connection between the conversation about the Daith earring with the waitress and the earring that fell on Becky until Annie Ruth said something about it, I never would have thought of looking on the floor for the other unmatched earring.
An honest answer does not require 'honestly' at the beginning.
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Old 31st May 2018, 08:24 AM   #240
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Originally Posted by Jodie View Post
Honestly, when it happened I didn't really comment on it one way or the other. I didn't make the connection between the conversation about the Daith earring with the waitress and the earring that fell on Becky until Annie Ruth said something about it, I never would have thought of looking on the floor for the other unmatched earring.
That really doesn't address any part of my comment...
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