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Old 29th August 2016, 05:59 AM   #521
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Here is why Mark is having an issue. Here is a section of his proposal to the independent labs:

Quote:
2 samples each of red chips of suspected primer from WTC dust

5 sample each of red/gray chips or red layer only from red/gray chips
He's finding that the red/gray chips ARE paint and can't differentiate between the two.
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Old 29th August 2016, 06:14 AM   #522
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I found this, posted by SnowCrash, on 911Blogger.
http://911blogger.com/news/2009-08-2...s-911-wtc-dust

Quote:
It's important to note that not all red/gray chips found in the dust actually ignite, and some dust samples only contain "inactive" material. It has been stated before by prof. Harrit that the quality of the red/gray chips apparently deteriorates over time. Furthermore, it is becoming increasingly difficult for these researchers to obtain WTC dust samples.
I though ignition of chips was a priority in determining if chips where thermite or not? What criteria was used to determine that there were DEAD/INACTIVE thermitic chips?
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Old 29th August 2016, 06:43 AM   #523
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Originally Posted by skyeagle409 View Post
Once again, you have proven that you are not up-to-speed on the facts. You can find microsperes in a few places that have nothing to do with thermite and in fact, microspheres can be created in the kitchen using a lighter and steel wool and even produced by burning wood in a barrel of steel beams.

https://www.metabunk.org/debunked-ir...hermite.t2523/
No. Those particles are neither iron nor spheres. Those were iron-oxide and had at least two pointed ends stemming from the wool material. Even if that was true, what on earth was that much steel wool doing in the WTC? We have to account for 10 tons worth, the equivalent of one of the less larger beams. Remember that we must account for the fact that many of these spheres are chemically similar to to iron spheres produced by common thermitic materials.

Quote:
Just to let you know you can also find microspheres in fly ash from coal-fired power plants.

https://books.google.com/books?id=nP...rnaces&f=false
First, read above. Also, I think only a fraction of the spheres in the WTC dust are hollow, in which case Steven Jones reported that he found a pore of sulfur. These are not the stuffs you find from mostly cold building collapses.

I also notice you didn't acknowledge the existence of other particles in the dust which require unnaturally high temperatures, like previously molten Molybdenum droplets and vaporized lead.
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Old 29th August 2016, 08:45 AM   #524
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Originally Posted by MicahJava View Post
No. Those particles are neither iron nor spheres..

Of course they are and that means you have no case and lost the game.
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Old 29th August 2016, 08:48 AM   #525
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Originally Posted by Crazy Chainsaw View Post
Fly ash would not have been a valid source, grinding sparks, welding sparks, disc brakes,
Engine clutches, and people would be.

I wanted to show him that microspheres can be created without thermite.
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Old 29th August 2016, 08:52 AM   #526
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Originally Posted by Gamolon View Post
Here is why Mark is having an issue. Here is a section of his proposal to the independent labs:

He's finding that the red/gray chips ARE paint and can't differentiate between the two.

I am not surprised at all. He could have saved himself a lot of time, money and effort if he had done his own reserch homework and used common sense.
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Old 29th August 2016, 11:35 AM   #527
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Originally Posted by skyeagle409 View Post
I wanted to show him that microspheres can be created without thermite.
Several hundred tons of steel structural components bashing against each other creates a few sparks, which in turn then cool and are..... spherical.

MJ complains that they are iron oxide, not elemental (I assume) iron.

ANY elemental iron sphere will very soon have a layer of iron oxide after being doused with water or simply left in the elements for a few days. If its a "microsphere" then that iron oxide layer could very well extend to take up a sizable % of the entire volume of the sphere.

just my humble opinion, I don't recall the palaver that was had on this subject several years ago.
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Old 29th August 2016, 11:39 AM   #528
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Originally Posted by MicahJava View Post
......
I also notice you didn't acknowledge the existence of other particles in the dust which require unnaturally high temperatures, like previously molten Molybdenum droplets and vaporized lead.
Find a power grinder Mich, then take a steel kitchen knife and apply it to the powered grinder. describe the effect.

Its a shower of bright sparks. Now venture a guess at the temperature and composition of those glowing sparks, and where the energy for that came from.

skip to:
a large number of steel objects falling and bashing and skidding against each other.

Now skip ahead skip ahead and take a look at the photos of the clean up and note the number of metal saws, grinders and torches being used to cut steel components up.

No try again to tell me that iron spheres are somehow unusual.


,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, and then once that is settled, as it was here years ago,,,, let's get back to today and discuss the actual thread topic and why Mark Basile has thus far utterly failed to carry out the promised actions.

Last edited by jaydeehess; 29th August 2016 at 11:42 AM.
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Old 29th August 2016, 01:33 PM   #529
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evidence free forever, the truth movement lies about thermite

Originally Posted by MicahJava View Post
...
I also notice you didn't acknowledge the existence of other particles in the dust which require unnaturally high temperatures, like previously molten Molybdenum droplets and vaporized lead.
Do you know what molybdenum is used for? Why would office fires not create this? You don't understand fire science, and have fallen for the delusional lie of thermite. What is the vapor pressure of lead and moly? Why do you post BS without references? Do you look up stuff before believing the fantasy of thermite? no
Moly? From what? There were office fires and 1000C is a high temperature, and there were no unnaturally high temperatures due to to Jones fantasy thermite which only exists in his delusional mind which got him fired for being a nut on 9/11.

Vaporized lead? Are you spreading lies, in a normal office fire temperatures are high enough to create dangerous levels of lead vapors - did you look up this stuff before spreading lies?

You cherry pick stuff you don't understand and make no conclusions. Big failure for thermite fantasy.

Show some steel with thermite damage, or melted steel. You offer opinion, you need evidence. You will never have evidence for thermite, you will post old nonsense from failed 9/11 truth fired guys who lie about 9/11. Copy and paste, no research, 9/11 truth believers refuse to think for themselves. 15 years of failure.
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Last edited by beachnut; 29th August 2016 at 02:09 PM.
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Old 29th August 2016, 08:51 PM   #530
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Iron spheres already stomped on, kicked around, buried, dug back up, and hacked to pieces on another thread (link). Please do not weary us with it on a totally unrelated thread.
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Old 30th August 2016, 03:55 AM   #531
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Originally Posted by MicahJava View Post
No. Those particles are neither iron nor spheres. Those were iron-oxide and had at least two pointed ends stemming from the wool material. Even if that was true, what on earth was that much steel wool doing in the WTC? We have to account for 10 tons worth, the equivalent of one of the less larger beams. Remember that we must account for the fact that many of these spheres are chemically similar to to iron spheres produced by common thermitic materials.



First, read above. Also, I think only a fraction of the spheres in the WTC dust are hollow, in which case Steven Jones reported that he found a pore of sulfur. These are not the stuffs you find from mostly cold building collapses.

I also notice you didn't acknowledge the existence of other particles in the dust which require unnaturally high temperatures, like previously molten Molybdenum droplets and vaporized lead.
Glass microspheres are not iron microspheres, and fly ash as I have said is not a likely source, for microspheres, years of smokers lighting zippo lighters in the buildings would be lighters themselves produce microspheres.
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Old 30th August 2016, 06:32 AM   #532
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Originally Posted by Crazy Chainsaw View Post
Glass microspheres are not iron microspheres, and fly ash as I have said is not a likely source, for microspheres, years of smokers lighting zippo lighters in the buildings would be lighters themselves produce microspheres.
I suggest you take the time to learn the difference between oxidation and reduction.
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Old 30th August 2016, 07:24 AM   #533
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Originally Posted by Criteria View Post
You make such a fuss about how difficult it would be to reproduce the work of Dr. Harrit et al.

It is really quite easy.

1. Place a legitimate sample of 9/11 WTC dust into a plastic bag.
2. Draw a magnetic slowly across the outside of the bag and collect the attracted chips into a small pile.
3. Separate visible red/gray chips from the pile.
*4. Take a multimeter and obtain a rough resistance reading across the red layer of any chips suitable for this purpose. Any chips that produce a low reading ~10 ohms or less should be kept as POTENTIAL candidate chips. Any chips with high resistance readings ~100 ohms or higher should be rejected.
5. At this point you need to be a legitimate scientist with the necessary apparatus to not only do an appropriate heat test but also evaluated the results.
Originally Posted by Criteria View Post
Candidate chips are selected chips which ignite at ~430C and among other things, produce iron-rich microspheroids in the resulting residue.
Originally Posted by Criteria View Post
that the red material would ignite at around 430C,
Criteria,

Based on all your quotes above regarding the importance of the DSC ignition tests being important in determining a chip as being thermitic, can you tell us about this quote?

Quote:
It's important to note that not all red/gray chips found in the dust actually ignite, and some dust samples only contain "inactive" material. It has been stated before by prof. Harrit that the quality of the red/gray chips apparently deteriorates over time
http://911blogger.com/news/2009-08-2...s-911-wtc-dust

How did Harrit determine a chip as "inactive thermite" if it didn't ignite? I thought that was important characteristic?

I have an email from Harrit where he states that they couldn't find active chips in some samples and that they may have been stored under unfavorable conditions. He also states that stability of nanoaluminum has been studied and it definitely deteriorates.

How does one determine a red/gray chip as deteriorated thermite if it didn't ignite? I guess bullet point 5 in your first quote above is not needed to determine that a red/gray chip is thermite?
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Old 30th August 2016, 09:18 AM   #534
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Originally Posted by Gamolon View Post
”How does one determine a red/gray chip as deteriorated thermite if it didn't ignite?”
This has been explained before, but for those firmly entrenched in their beliefs, people like yourself, no explanation is good enough.

Scientists, having microscopically studied the red chips over a long period of time became so familiar with the appearance of “candidate chips” that it became easy to visually recognize them amongst other red chips.

For those researchers with no such familiarity and starting from scratch, I described the procedure required to find “candidate chips”.

I really do not see any problem. If, say, ten “candidate” chips are selected and maybe 2 of them fail to ignite. That does not detract from the findings made from the 8 that did ignite.
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Old 30th August 2016, 09:25 AM   #535
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Originally Posted by Criteria View Post
This has been explained before, but for those firmly entrenched in their beliefs, people like yourself, no explanation is good enough.

Scientists, having microscopically studied the red chips over a long period of time became so familiar with the appearance of “candidate chips” that it became easy to visually recognize them amongst other red chips.

For those researchers with no such familiarity and starting from scratch, I described the procedure required to find “candidate chips”.

I really do not see any problem. If, say, ten “candidate” chips are selected and maybe 2 of them fail to ignite. That does not detract from the findings made from the 8 that did ignite.
And the visual cues that prompt these scientists who are familiar with the appearance of “candidate chips” to recognize them cannot be reduced to words because... ?
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Old 30th August 2016, 10:13 AM   #536
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Originally Posted by Criteria View Post
I really do not see any problem. If, say, ten “candidate” chips are selected and maybe 2 of them fail to ignite. That does not detract from the findings made from the 8 that did ignite.
You clearly are not comprehending the problem here. Read the highlighted part again. Harrit is saying, per your example, that the 2 chips that didn't ignite and the 8 chips that did ignite ARE ALL THERMITE! The 2 that didn't ignite are dead/inactive/deteriorated THERMITE chips. The 8 that did ignite are active THERMITE chips.

According to you and how you interpret Harrit's thermite paper, CANDIDATE chips (being put through all the other testing) are not yet determined as being thermite until they have ignited and the remnants looked at for microspheres.

My question to you is, if ignition of a chip and resultant microspheres seals the deal and turns a red/gray CANDIDATE chip into a THERMITE chip, how in the hell did Harrit determine that there were DEAD/INACTIVE thermitic chips that supposedly deteriorated over time?

He made the determination that the chips that didn't ignite (therefore, no ashes/residue/leftovers to examine) were DEAD THERMITE CHIPS. What criteria did he use to determine that?. He didn't use the DSC ignition test to make that determination because the chip DIDN'T ignite.

The bottom line here is that, based on you are saying, the DSC test is not needed because the other tests are enough to determine if a chip is thermite or not.

What is that criteria?

Last edited by Gamolon; 30th August 2016 at 10:16 AM.
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Old 30th August 2016, 10:15 AM   #537
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Originally Posted by Criteria View Post
Scientists, having microscopically studied the red chips over a long period of time became so familiar with the appearance of “candidate chips” that it became easy to visually recognize them amongst other red chips.
The main question that you keep missing is:

What criteria or test result pushes a CANDIDATE CHIP over the threshold to become a THERMITE chip?
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Old 30th August 2016, 10:22 AM   #538
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Originally Posted by Criteria View Post
I suggest you take the time to learn the difference between oxidation and reduction.
I suggest you learn the difference between candidate chip and thermite chip and tell us what test result is used to make a candidate chip into thermite chip.
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Old 30th August 2016, 10:41 AM   #539
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Originally Posted by Criteria View Post
This has been explained before,
Explain this Criteria...

Originally Posted by Criteria View Post
So in summation, I have yet to see anyone on the other side (pro Millette’s findings), explain why Dr. Harrit et al’s proof of iron-rich microspheres found in the red chip post ignition residue should not trump the fact Millette must have tested false candidate red chips, because it is well known, that primer paint exposed to a temperature of ~430 °C will not produce iron-rich microspheres.

The fact that this subject is repeatedly ignored, acts as proof by silence, that there is no effective rebuttal to be offered!
Are you suggesting that Harrit made a huge mistake when he claimed unignited/false candidate chips were in fact thermite?!
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Old 30th August 2016, 02:25 PM   #540
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Originally Posted by Criteria View Post
This has been expl ...
There is no damage to WTC steel from thermite. 15 years and 9/11 truth continues to fool those who can't think for themselves.



This has to be BS, to see how many replies the fantasy claims get, some fraternity internet drinking game
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Old 30th August 2016, 07:15 PM   #541
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Originally Posted by beachnut View Post
There is no damage to WTC steel from thermite. 15 years and 9/11 truth continues to fool those who can't think for themselves.



This has to be BS, to see how many replies the fantasy claims get, some fraternity internet drinking game
Back. Wow, suggestions for how iron-rich spheres (and other particles) could be produced are through the roof, and with no citation at all referencing them being found in building rubble dust in such quantities and chemistry.

Why would you necessarily be expecting thermite damage on steel if thermite was somehow used in a demolition?

Last edited by MicahJava; 30th August 2016 at 07:16 PM.
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Old 30th August 2016, 07:36 PM   #542
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Originally Posted by MicahJava View Post
... suggestions for how iron-rich spheres (and other particles) could be produced are through the roof, and with no citation at all referencing them being found in building rubble dust in such quantities and chemistry.

Why would you necessarily be expecting thermite damage on steel if thermite was somehow used in a demolition?
Thermite would leave iron fused to the steel, it is a fact 9/11 truth ignores due to overwhelming ignorance.
911 truth lies about thermite, a fantasy born in some insane dream by Jones.

Iron is in the WTC dust at 6 percent, wow, which is the same as it is in the earth on the east coast. It is not a lot of iron, it is at the same as we would find in our yards. Iron spheres occur in fires, thus 911 truth followers/believers have been fooled by liars.

911 truth fantasy believers never ran a magnet though the dust in their backyard? Why are they so gullible?

The USGS did a dust study, 9/11 truth ignores it, or cherry picks it to support the fantasy and lies.
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Old 30th August 2016, 08:28 PM   #543
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Originally Posted by MicahJava View Post
Back. Wow, suggestions for how iron-rich spheres (and other particles) could be produced are through the roof, and with no citation at all referencing them being found in building rubble dust in such quantities and chemistry.

Apparently, you've overlooked the references that I have provided, which would have given you a clue as to why you are incorrect.


Debunked: Iron Microspheres in 9/11 WTC Dust as Evidence for Thermite


The iron is heated red hot or hotter and subjected to hurricane force blast furnace like wind. The iron flakes are liberated as small particles and some iron is vaporized. Like drops of water, the iron flakes form molten spheres that solidify and the fume also condenses into spheres, the most efficient geometrical form. … The formation of iron and other type spheres at temperatures obtainable by the combustion of petroleum or coal based fuels is not a new or unique process. These spheres are the same as iron and alumino-silicate spheres in the well-studied fly ash formed from contaminants in coal as it is burned in furnaces. – Rich Lee"

https://www.metabunk.org/debunked-ir...hermite.t2523/


Quote:
Why would you necessarily be expecting thermite damage on steel if thermite was somehow used in a demolition?

Thermite would not have been effective in taking down the WTC buildngs, which explains why demolition companies do not use thermite during their demolition implosion operations. Do you know what RDX is used for?
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Old 30th August 2016, 08:43 PM   #544
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Originally Posted by beachnut View Post
There is no damage to WTC steel from thermite. 15 years and 9/11 truth continues to fool those who can't think for themselves.

You are correct. Truthers have claimed these photos were evidence that thermite was used to bring down the WTC buildings.


Photo 1

http://www.debunking911.com/cut3.jpg

Photo 2

http://www.debunking911.com/anglecut2.jpg


Now, for the rest of the story.


WTC Angle Cut Columns during cleanup

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LJyBuANVkQ4


After almost 15 years, not one dust sample depicted evidence of thermite.
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Old 30th August 2016, 08:48 PM   #545
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Rehashing the microsphere nonsense really is off-topic. I keep clicking this thread hoping to see some update on Mark Basile's study.
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Old 30th August 2016, 09:00 PM   #546
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Originally Posted by WilliamSeger View Post
Rehashing the microsphere nonsense really is off-topic. I keep clicking this thread hoping to see some update on Mark Basile's study.
Is Mark Basile a recluse these days or what?
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Old 30th August 2016, 11:46 PM   #547
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Originally Posted by MicahJava View Post
Why would you necessarily be expecting thermite damage on steel if thermite was somehow used in a demolition?
What an astonishing question.

Would you expect bullet wounds in the victim if a gun was used to kill a person?
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Old 31st August 2016, 02:54 AM   #548
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Originally Posted by Criteria View Post
I suggest you take the time to learn the difference between oxidation and reduction.
I know perfectly well what reduction and oxidation are, I also know the most hollow microspheres in the world trade center were glass, as the used magnetic separation on the fly ash.

I also Created micro and macro spheres in a 3 story chimney effect, some from oxidation some from reduction.
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Old 31st August 2016, 08:15 PM   #549
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Originally Posted by Criteria View Post
With that statement you only serve notice that you have no idea what you are talking about.
LOLOL
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Old 31st August 2016, 08:52 PM   #550
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Originally Posted by MicahJava View Post
Is Mark Basile a recluse these days or what?
Good question. Pretty much what we are wondering about ourselves.

If only there was someone who posted on this forum who is or has been in contact with MB and could tell us. Perhaps he has entered a Buddist monastic order and has eschewed all outside concerns.
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Old 31st August 2016, 08:54 PM   #551
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Originally Posted by HotRodDeluxe View Post
LOLOL
Ditto
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Old 31st August 2016, 08:56 PM   #552
jaydeehess
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Originally Posted by GlennB View Post
What an astonishing question.

Would you expect bullet wounds in the victim if a gun was used to kill a person?
Oddly enough I expect ax cut indications on trees cut down with an ax, and chain saw oil on trees cut down with a chain saw.
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Old 31st August 2016, 09:23 PM   #553
Crazy Chainsaw
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Originally Posted by jaydeehess View Post
Oddly enough I expect ax cut indications on trees cut down with an ax, and chain saw oil on trees cut down with a chain saw.
You forgot beaver tooth marks on trees cut by an beaver, and larger round tracks, and round on trees shoved over by an elephant.
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Old 1st September 2016, 04:41 AM   #554
Crazy Chainsaw
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Originally Posted by GlennB View Post
What an astonishing question.

Would you expect bullet wounds in the victim if a gun was used to kill a person?
Or tooth marks from T Rex 66 million years old.

https://www.theguardian.com/science/...-prey-dinosaur
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Old 1st September 2016, 05:39 AM   #555
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In short if one claims a violent action on something that causes that something great damage then there is going to be signs that this specific violent action was what caused the damage.

The grade 4 level specific discription:
Thermite melts steel, therefore if thermite caused the failure of a structural component then that structural component will display signs of having been melted.

If said signs of having been melted are not to be found then there is NO evidence that anything was melted.

easy-peasy unless you have a political world view that requires the existence of a vast extra-governmental organization bent on directing events in the world towards non-specified goals and that in order to accomplish said unspecified goals they regularily conduct operations designed to strike fear in the world populace by killing dozens, hundreds or, in this case, thousands of innocent persons. If that is where you begin looking at the world then damn the evidence, full loon ahead!
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Old 1st September 2016, 05:43 AM   #556
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Originally Posted by Crazy Chainsaw View Post
Or tooth marks from T Rex 66 million years old.

https://www.theguardian.com/science/...-prey-dinosaur
Brilliant, but probably a false flag operation
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Old 1st September 2016, 09:53 AM   #557
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gamolon
”How does one determine a red/gray chip as deteriorated thermite if it didn't ignite?”
Quote:
Criteria This has been explained before, but for those firmly entrenched in their beliefs, people like yourself, no explanation is good enough.

Scientists, having microscopically studied the red chips over a long period of time became so familiar with the appearance of “candidate chips” that it became easy to visually recognize them amongst other red chips.

For those researchers with no such familiarity and starting from scratch, I described the procedure required to find “candidate chips”.


I really do not see any problem. If, say, ten “candidate” chips are selected and maybe 2 of them fail to ignite. That does not detract from the findings made from the 8 that did ignite.
Can you give Mark Basile a hand with this?
Thanks
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Old 5th September 2016, 09:54 PM   #558
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Originally Posted by MicahJava View Post
I also notice you didn't acknowledge the existence of other particles in the dust which require unnaturally high temperatures, like previously molten Molybdenum droplets and vaporized lead.


This is a cement kiln. It makes portland cement.


YouTube Video This video is not hosted by the ISF. The ISF can not be held responsible for the suitability or legality of this material. By clicking the link below you agree to view content from an external website.
I AGREE


This is fire proofing. It is a mixture of mineral wool and portland cement.



Before the collapse almost all of the steel was covered with fire proofing. After the collapse almost none of the steel was covered with fire proofing. Most of it pretty much turned to dust.

All of the things Jones mentions in his "High temp at WTC" paper is a byproduct of a cement kiln. The Molybdenum would come from the steel belted tires they fed into the kiln for fuel. They tossed in tires and the steel belting would just melt and become part of the clinker. The vaporised lead would come from the car batteries they disposed of in the kiln. The kiln temperatures are high enough to accomplish everything mentioned in the paper. If you want iron micro spheres this is the perfect machine for making them. The iron falls through the flame becomes molten and solidifies into a sphere.

Dusty, one of the truthers from the past, had a chunk of fireproofing from the Trade Centers. She hung it on a ribbon and held a magnet next to it. (she was trying to prove it was dustified steel). It defiantly had iron in it.


The iron spheres and all the other crap mentioned in the paper was imbedded in the fire proofing. When the fireproofing turned to dust it released the them.

After all the mineral wool from the fire proofing was mentioned in the report, was it not? Why shouldn't the other stuff imbedded in the fire proofing also be there.
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Old 7th September 2016, 04:47 PM   #559
MicahJava
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Originally Posted by waypastvne View Post
This is a cement kiln. It makes portland cement.


YouTube Video This video is not hosted by the ISF. The ISF can not be held responsible for the suitability or legality of this material. By clicking the link below you agree to view content from an external website.
I AGREE


This is fire proofing. It is a mixture of mineral wool and portland cement.

http://i995.photobucket.com/albums/a...insulation.jpg

Before the collapse almost all of the steel was covered with fire proofing. After the collapse almost none of the steel was covered with fire proofing. Most of it pretty much turned to dust.

All of the things Jones mentions in his "High temp at WTC" paper is a byproduct of a cement kiln. The Molybdenum would come from the steel belted tires they fed into the kiln for fuel. They tossed in tires and the steel belting would just melt and become part of the clinker. The vaporised lead would come from the car batteries they disposed of in the kiln. The kiln temperatures are high enough to accomplish everything mentioned in the paper. If you want iron micro spheres this is the perfect machine for making them. The iron falls through the flame becomes molten and solidifies into a sphere.

Dusty, one of the truthers from the past, had a chunk of fireproofing from the Trade Centers. She hung it on a ribbon and held a magnet next to it. (she was trying to prove it was dustified steel). It defiantly had iron in it.


The iron spheres and all the other crap mentioned in the paper was imbedded in the fire proofing. When the fireproofing turned to dust it released the them.

After all the mineral wool from the fire proofing was mentioned in the report, was it not? Why shouldn't the other stuff imbedded in the fire proofing also be there.
There are many hypothetical ways that particles like that could be found somewhere in the dust. I just thought it was worth mentioning. Ultimately, I can't help but trust Astaneh's expert opinion. "I saw melting of girders at World Trade Center".
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Old 7th September 2016, 04:56 PM   #560
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Originally Posted by MicahJava View Post
There are many hypothetical ways that particles like that could be found somewhere in the dust. I just thought it was worth mentioning. Ultimately, I can't help but trust Astaneh's expert opinion. "I saw melting of girders at World Trade Center".

How many Truthers were duped with the following photo?

http://www.debunking911.com/cut3.jpg
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