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3rd August 2015, 08:31 AM | #241 |
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3rd August 2015, 10:17 AM | #242 |
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In other words, Basile's donors still don't even have an excuse. Ziggi says that "encountering some 'friction' was not unexpected" by most of them, but I should think that all of them expected some progress by now on a completely straight-forward process, but they don't even get an excuse why there's been none? What kind of "friction" prevents sending the stuff to a lab and asking them to identify it, Ziggi?
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3rd August 2015, 12:33 PM | #243 |
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I'm a bit confused. What is he testing? According to the original study he was only going to select chips and send them out to be identified, emphasis on independent verification of the material. Basiles' job was only to make sure they had the right chips. If he needs to do lots of testing to make sure they get the right chips, that's an admission that the original papers selection criterion is woefully lacking.
Naturally "truthers" wouldn't notice but, this "update" makes no sense. Sorry Ziggy, try again........ |
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4th August 2015, 12:34 AM | #244 |
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When this project was first proposed, it sounded like Basile intended to just repeat the Harrit experiments, which would have been a waste of time since that paper failed to prove anything; their conclusions didn't follow from their data. Then, later it sounded like Basile understood that to support those conclusions, the independent labs needed to do probative tests that Harrit didn't do, such as: do the chips contain elemental aluminum; do they ignite in an inert atmosphere; is aluminum oxide produced? Now, Ziggi says Basile intends for the labs to "confirm his own results?" WTF? I guess we have to wait until October to find out what that means, but I'll be waiting with greatly lowered expectations that it was worth waiting for.
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4th August 2015, 06:32 AM | #245 |
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The whole thing is a nonsensical joke. Basile could get results inside 2 weeks if he wanted to. It really is the simplest thing in the world to get done.
What does "encountering some friction" mean? Why would there be any friction in the first place because all you are asking the lab(s) to do is provide quotes for the cost of doing the work to identify the material. Most would probably say they need to look at the sample in the SEM before deciding on further work, but that's not an issue. SEM plus FTIR will do the job thoroughly. It's not even a days work. Why have there been prolonged delays? It's laughable. I suspect they came up against the hard wall of reality when the labs they approached took one look at photographs of the chips and suggested procedures that would readily identify the material as red paint because that's exactly what the labs know the material is. The fact that Ziggi has said they intend to delegate to the labs to confirm Basile's own results shows that they are probably dictating to the labs which tests and procedures they want done rather than tests that will positively identify the material. Remember that they last thing these dishonest people want is the truth to be presented by a lab for all to see. They've invested too much to be shown up for the fools they are, so expect a massive fudge and a new round of fund raising. |
4th August 2015, 06:57 AM | #246 |
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For what it's worth, I approached some two dozen labs before finding Jim Millette. Some refused to deal with me at all because it was connected to 9/11. Some refused because they feared that if there WERE thermite, it would damage their equipment. Some just suggested they do the tests with whatever equipment their lab happened to have. I found it to be very challenging. Sunstealer you might have been able to easily find a competent tester but it was not so easy for me. I too experienced "friction" along the way.
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4th August 2015, 09:45 AM | #247 |
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4th August 2015, 11:19 AM | #248 |
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Mark is a chemical engineer and works at (or perhaps used to work at) Waters, company that offers products and solutions for chemical analysis. Within his work environment, Mark has (or had) personal access to some of the analytical machinery we are talking about here. No doubt, Waters, and quite probably Mark himself, already have frequent contact to other professional analytical labs, so it should be relatively easy for Mark to find a suitable lab.
Perhaps some of the labs he contacted did a quick google seacht and determined that they have been contacted by a nutjob representing a weird fringe of irrational people, aiming to abuse their reputation for a wild goose chase with a foregone conclusion. |
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4th August 2015, 01:45 PM | #249 |
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4th August 2015, 03:39 PM | #250 |
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4th August 2015, 03:55 PM | #251 |
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4th August 2015, 04:17 PM | #252 |
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That's nonsense, IMO. The specimens are so tiny, the Al-content so low, the expected maximum energy yield from a hypothetical thermite reaction therefor so miniscule, that it would at most scratch a sample holder - not explode the chamber and machine. Don't know what such mounts cost, but can't be the world. Just bill it to the customer if they need to exchange such a spare part.
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4th August 2015, 04:32 PM | #253 |
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The only "friction" I can see is the lab not wanting to get into a patent fight. It would be like bringing a caramel colored liquid in and saying "What are the ingredients?".
You brought them a paint chip and you want the formula, It's that simple. |
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4th August 2015, 08:59 PM | #254 |
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I did ask them to test for thermite rather than ask, what is this? And Oystein, at least two labs said they won't touch anything that might be thermite because of the damage it could cause.
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4th August 2015, 11:51 PM | #255 |
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5th August 2015, 09:26 PM | #256 |
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It was nonsense, I agree, but for me it was definitely "friction" as well!
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11th August 2015, 10:37 AM | #257 |
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11th August 2015, 06:14 PM | #258 |
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In Your Guts You Know They're Nuts. "There are two ways to be fooled. One is to believe what isn't true; the other is to refuse to believe what is true." -Kierkegaard . "The object of life is not to be on the side of the majority, but to escape finding oneself in the ranks of the insane. "- Marcus Aurelius A Truther is a True Believer convinced by lies. You can't reason someone out of a thing they weren't reasoned into.There's a sucker born every minute-Barnum |
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25th September 2015, 06:37 PM | #259 |
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It seems that Basile's website is "unavailable". (http://markbasile.org)
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25th September 2015, 06:39 PM | #260 |
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25th September 2015, 06:51 PM | #261 |
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8th October 2015, 07:14 PM | #262 |
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Bump:
I'm surprised how long it takes to send a sample to a competent lab. |
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8th October 2015, 11:53 PM | #263 |
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Perhaps Criteria, when (s)he reads this, can contact Ziggi and inquire about a new status report. After all, Ziggi blogged two months ago:
Originally Posted by Ziggi Zugam
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9th October 2015, 02:17 AM | #264 |
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9th October 2015, 09:00 PM | #265 |
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9th October 2015, 11:29 PM | #266 |
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10th October 2015, 11:48 AM | #267 |
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I don't think Mark Basile's study will ever get done. They know the results from an independent lab would make them all look very silly.
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13th October 2015, 03:45 PM | #268 |
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My prediction. As they have already changed the study to "confirming" Basiles finding instead of doing the actual work(*). They will claim the lab was wrong/ sold out and carry on as usual (until the need more money to do it again).
"Truthers" won't question this. They have never questioned the word of their leaders. (*) a point no "truther" has dared to point out. |
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13th October 2015, 03:56 PM | #269 |
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Then: What was going to be done by an independent lab.
Quote:
Quote:
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15th October 2015, 09:31 AM | #270 |
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It's now officially mid-October and no progress report. You'd think Ziggi would at least post an new excuse.
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15th October 2015, 10:40 PM | #271 |
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How *********** difficult is it to get a simple study done?
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16th October 2015, 03:30 AM | #272 |
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Not difficult at all. It would take a couple of weeks at the most to arrange, agree fees, carry out and then report. Just ask a lab to find out what the material is as cheaply as possible.
A lab would do a quick visual study, then straight into the SEM to have a closer look. Then use EDX on the layers and the particles in the red layer. That would tell them the material is paint adhered to steel. Wouldn't take a day, someone getting a move on could do it in half a day for one chip. Then they'd probably contact the submitter with a brief email giving details and then ask if they wanted to fund further study (FTIR) to identify the carbon based matrix and whether they want further conformation of particle type using other methods. I think Basile fears being found out. |
16th October 2015, 06:11 AM | #273 |
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17th October 2015, 06:41 AM | #274 |
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18th October 2015, 08:59 PM | #275 |
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Seriously? Nothing yet? this is embarrassing for all his supporters.
It's almost as lame as the nonexistent followup from Jones et al., which they promised waaaay back in 2009!! |
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19th October 2015, 11:07 PM | #276 |
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20th October 2015, 02:54 AM | #277 |
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4th November 2015, 06:45 AM | #278 |
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[long email conversation deleted]
And just as I had concluded that there would not come a response from Mark Basile, here it is, fresh in my inbox as I was writing the original version of this post:
Originally Posted by Mark Basile
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4th November 2015, 07:27 AM | #279 |
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Why would someone working so slow it's like watching a dead snail race, try anyone's patience?
The Basile study is over, before it began either that or they will try to sneek in some paint Chips they modified, I know longer trust Basile too little to late and no real reason for it. |
4th November 2015, 07:50 AM | #280 |
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Quote:
Basile IS damaging his reputation by being so slow. |
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