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Tags Chicago incidents , Chicago issues , crime statistics , racial issues

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Old 3rd June 2018, 10:12 AM   #41
The Big Dog
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Originally Posted by kellyb View Post
Yes, 4 or 5 young men pushing a few people in a lake is definitely my idea of a criminal orgy.

Uh huh.
Did you just read the one article then?

Huh.

http://chicago.cbslocal.com/2018/05/...aturday-night/
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Old 3rd June 2018, 10:19 AM   #42
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More stories, different weekend. Video too.

http://chicago.cbslocal.com/2018/05/...ling-teen-mob/
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Old 3rd June 2018, 10:24 AM   #43
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been going on for a long while

https://www.nbcchicago.com/news/loca...200755191.html

300-400 that time.
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Old 3rd June 2018, 10:33 AM   #44
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Here is a summary, shots fired, and look at that vicious stomp, lots more news articles about the disadvantaged youths committing actual crimes.

http://www.cwbchicago.com/2018/05/do...tling-mag.html
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Old 3rd June 2018, 11:58 AM   #45
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Thread started so OP could be called racist, thus furthering persecution complex. In shocking turn of events, nobody calls him racist - mainly because there's no need to.
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Old 3rd June 2018, 12:43 PM   #46
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Originally Posted by uke2se View Post
Thread started so OP could be called racist, thus furthering persecution complex. In shocking turn of events, nobody calls him racist - mainly because there's no need to.
While I of course disagree with the first sentence, I fully agree that there is no need, reason or basis to accuse me of being a racist, so thanks for that.

(I actually started the thread because I had an unfortunate (albeit minor) encounter with some of the disadvantaged youths the other evening)
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Old 3rd June 2018, 12:46 PM   #47
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Originally Posted by dann View Post
"Do you know how deep the water is in the lakes we're talking about?" (I'm not asking about the depth as such, but the depth near the shore where people were pushed into the lake.)

TBD won't answer my question. Does anybody else know?
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Old 3rd June 2018, 12:55 PM   #48
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Originally Posted by dann View Post
TBD won't answer my question. Does anybody else know?
well, it seems to be a bit of an odd thing to focus on.

In the area, it is a concrete shelf that depending on the wind and waves (and the waves were big that day) from 5-7 feet deep.

here is a photo on a flat day

http://laurabethkoch.blogspot.com/20...te-jungle.html
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Old 3rd June 2018, 01:48 PM   #49
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An old, obvious point

Originally Posted by dann View Post
...The problem is class, the problem is poverty....
Yes, an old point, well established and certainly always understood by members of the lower classes -- and I would say that the lower your class origin, the more painfully obvious it all is.

Hell, a cur dog should be able to understand it.
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Old 3rd June 2018, 02:07 PM   #50
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Originally Posted by sackett View Post
Yes, an old point, well established and certainly always understood by members of the lower classes -- and I would say that the lower your class origin, the more painfully obvious it all is.

Hell, a cur dog should be able to understand it.
Golly, when you put it that way, that guy who was stomping someone lying in the gutter is practically innocent.

Stomp on disadvantaged youths, it is a class thing donchaknow.
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Old 3rd June 2018, 02:59 PM   #51
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
well, it seems to be a bit of an odd thing to focus on.

The question is relevant because, depending on the depth, pushing somebody into a lake may be considered to be a fairly innocent prank or, as in the case of the 19-year-old Dane, life-threatening.

Quote:
In the area, it is a concrete shelf that depending on the wind and waves (and the waves were big that day) from 5-7 feet deep.

Even if I couldn't swim, personally I wouldn't have a problem with 5 feet, but I would with 7, and of course people who are less than 6 feet tall would have problems even without waves.

Quote:

Looks nice, but it's hard to tell from the photo how deep (and dangerous) it is.

Since Denmark isn't very big and is surrounded by water on all sides, you can usually get to a beach in less than 30 minutes, which tends to make most people comfortable with playing in the water and even being thrown into the water - at least when it's hot.
Of course, if you're fully dressed and on your way somewhere, it might be extremely inconvenient and also perceived as threatening if strangers do that to you, but there are too many things about the specific situation that aren't clear to me.
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Old 3rd June 2018, 03:12 PM   #52
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
Golly, when you put it that way, that guy who was stomping someone lying in the gutter is practically innocent.

Did anybody say so?!

Quote:
Stomp on disadvantaged youths, it is a class thing donchaknow.

I think you forgot a couple of commas, but I get your point.

My point: If people are treated like ****, they tend to misbehave, and a few of them will go to extremes. That's no excuse, it's an explanation for what's happening. If you actually appreciate the inequality that the poor are subjected to, you'll tend to condemn rather than explain, and it also provides you with a good Christian conscience that turns the relationship of cause and effect upside down: These people obviously deserve to be treated in the way that has turned them into the kind of people that stomp on "someone lying in the gutter," right?!
And there's also no reason to distinguish between them. They're all that kind of people!
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"Stupidity renders itself invisible by assuming very large proportions. Completely unreasonable claims are irrefutable. Ni-en-leh pointed out that a philosopher might get into trouble by claiming that two times two makes five, but he does not risk much by claiming that two times two makes shoe polish." B. Brecht
"The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is required for their real happiness. The demand to give up the illusion about its condition is the demand to give up a condition which needs illusions." K. Marx
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Old 3rd June 2018, 04:00 PM   #53
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Quote:
It's getting late have you seen my mates
Ma tell me when the boys get here
It's seven o'clock and I want to rock
Want to get a belly full of beer
My old man's drunker than a barrel full of monkeys
And my old lady she don't care
My sister looks cute in her braces and boots
A handful of grease in her hair
Oh, don't give us none of your aggravation
We had it with your discipline
Oh, Saturday night's alright for fighting
Get a little action in
Get about as oiled as a diesel train
Gonna set this dance alight
'Cause Saturday night's the night I like
Saturday night's alright alright alright, ooh
Well they're packed pretty tight in here tonight
I'm looking for a dolly who'll see me right
I may use a little muscle to get what I need
I may sink a little drink and shout out she's with me ...
Elton John, Bernie Taupin

Yeah, a culture of brawling, can't say it's not a problem because it is - but I also know young people put on these displays sometimes. At every high school I've been at administrators have to take over lunch duty keeping a close eye on students who are basically fenced in, in scenes unfortunately reminiscent of a jailyard, because the more "eyes on" the more peaceful things stay, and I have seen students stage fights - racially motivated fights - just to provoke a reaction from adults and to make sure it gets onto someone's iPhone for uploading on to the P (for Punk) Network. It's a form of tribalized trolling and certainly there is the potential for serious injury. And yeah I'd steer clear of these folks no matter what race, don't engage, "mobs" do stupid things.
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Old 5th June 2018, 11:18 AM   #54
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I don't know any poor people who do things like this (what makes people think they are poor anyways?):

http://www.thestate.com/news/local/c...212490534.html

100s of "teens" gather to watch fights at a local business, all arranged on Facebook, complete with a gun shot. Gang stuff, but who gets in trouble? The cop for calling them thugs and animals which is exactly - exactly - what the people who did this are acting like.

Quote:
"Going to the Village at Sandhill's (sic) to watch fights, that is gang and thug mentality," commented Tessier, who's been with the sheriff's department for nearly 20 years.
Let's not hurt the poor tykes feelings! Oh noooo! F that.

And no arrests? I'm not surprised, my friend was jumped by a gang of six "teens" and hurt pretty badly. The cops let the one attacker go that they'd held at the scene. My friend is a 105 pound white girl and she was beat up by black men and women just for her phone and purse. Kicked in the head until unconscious. That's sick. If they hadn't been stopped by someone?

She had a concussion and was x-rayed for fear of a broken jaw (wasn't broken). Kicked in the head by grown men. What do you call that? Aw he's just poor, and don't you dare call him a thug!

Idiots.

A SFPD cop friend tells me "we get too much heat if we arrest too many of the wrong people these days." Gotta bring down those numbers so the federal funds keep coming in. I mean they let this person go after beating and robbing my friend and she was caught red-handed. Sounds plausible considering everything I've seen lately. Politics.

No wonder these teens seem so bold these days. Keep making excuses and we'll keep seeing this stuff. This is why a lot of people have had enough. It isn't because Trump, it's because there really is a big problem here and people are fed up with the PC kid-gloves bullcrap.

I think I'm more angry sometimes with people's reactions to all of this than I am for the people committing the crimes, because it's actually making it worse. They know they won't get arrested.

In fact it's white people who are the problem! Starbucks, Yale, BBQ....give me a gawdamn break people.

This is a great example of political correctness gone haywire.

We'll keep getting angry at Starbucks employees and making every excuse we can while this stuff gets worse.

We will feel sympathy for the gunmen and try and figure out what the rest of us are doing wrong. What we are doing wrong?
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Old 5th June 2018, 01:09 PM   #55
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Originally Posted by mgidm86 View Post
Kicked in the head by grown men. What do you call that? Aw he's just poor, and don't you dare call him a thug!
(...)
This is a great example of political correctness gone haywire.

Yes, that is a great example of political correctness gone haywire, but it's your own made-up example, isn't it?!
Did anybody actually say about a grown man kicking a 105-pound girl that "he's just poor"?!
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"Stupidity renders itself invisible by assuming very large proportions. Completely unreasonable claims are irrefutable. Ni-en-leh pointed out that a philosopher might get into trouble by claiming that two times two makes five, but he does not risk much by claiming that two times two makes shoe polish." B. Brecht
"The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is required for their real happiness. The demand to give up the illusion about its condition is the demand to give up a condition which needs illusions." K. Marx
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Old 5th June 2018, 01:47 PM   #56
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Originally Posted by dann View Post
Yes, that is a great example of political correctness gone haywire, but it's your own made-up example, isn't it?!
Did anybody actually say about a grown man kicking a 105-pound girl that "he's just poor"?!
I bet we wouldn't have to look very far, to find someone wiling to argue that poverty causes violence, and that his poverty is to blame for his violent behavior.
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Old 30th August 2018, 01:33 PM   #57
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Time for an update, the other crime wave has been going on all summer (the original crime wave has been racking up an impressive body count too, however)

Yesterday in WrigleyVille right after a Cub's game.

http://www.cwbchicago.com/2018/08/ne...ttacks-in.html

In other news, the reverends are marching to close the streets near O'Hare because of course they are.
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Old 30th August 2018, 01:48 PM   #58
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Originally Posted by uke2se View Post
Thread started so OP could be called racist, thus furthering persecution complex. In shocking turn of events, nobody calls him racist - mainly because there's no need to.
It does seem fairly self evident.

My first thought on reading the op is that this is one of those BS moral panics that the media get into occasionally, "You wan't believe what teens are up to these days, the story after this break!"

I'm still not convinced this is a serious story and not just a few scattered events.
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Old 30th August 2018, 01:56 PM   #59
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Originally Posted by ahhell View Post
It does seem fairly self evident.

My first thought on reading the op is that this is one of those BS moral panics that the media get into occasionally, "You wan't believe what teens are up to these days, the story after this break!"

I'm still not convinced this is a serious story and not just a few scattered events.
Y'all up in Wrigley yesterday?

My nephew was after the game.

He's convinced, look at the videos in the links.
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Old 30th August 2018, 04:24 PM   #60
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rdwight pretty much nailed it.


This is about two things.

Population increase & poverty.

No matter how much the conservatives want it to be this is not about race.

And no matter how much the people in nanny states like England and Australia want it to be this is not about guns.
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Old 30th August 2018, 05:05 PM   #61
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And gang violence in Chicago is not exactly new:


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Old 30th August 2018, 06:02 PM   #62
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Originally Posted by This is The End View Post
rdwight pretty much nailed it.


This is about two things.

Population increase & poverty.

No matter how much the conservatives want it to be this is not about race.

And no matter how much the people in nanny states like England and Australia want it to be this is not about guns.
astute analysis! Except for the fact that the population in Chicago is plummeting and this is one of the richest areas in Chicago. So, yeah.

their older brothers are racking up historic body counts. But it was about "poverty" when that kid sucker punched a woman in the head.

k' thx!
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Old 30th August 2018, 06:50 PM   #63
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Originally Posted by dudalb View Post
And gang violence in Chicago is not exactly new:


http://www.internationalskeptics.com...837a8347ac.jpg
Yeah, but he was a white guy.
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Old 30th August 2018, 07:48 PM   #64
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Originally Posted by LSSBB View Post
Yeah, but he was a white guy.
http://www.itsabouttimebpp.com/Photo...byhuey_11.html

Wait until you see the Gangster Disciples, Folks, Vice Lords pictures from last weekend.

https://unitedgangs.com/black-gangst...ciples-nation/

Odd how they hold those guns with all that arthritis.
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Old 30th August 2018, 08:04 PM   #65
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
http://www.itsabouttimebpp.com/Photo...byhuey_11.html

Wait until you see the Gangster Disciples, Folks, Vice Lords pictures from last weekend.

https://unitedgangs.com/black-gangst...ciples-nation/

Odd how they hold those guns with all that arthritis.
Point being...?
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Old 30th August 2018, 08:10 PM   #66
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Originally Posted by This is The End View Post
rdwight pretty much nailed it.


This is about two things.

Population increase & poverty.

No matter how much the conservatives want it to be this is not about race.

And no matter how much the people in nanny states like England and Australia want it to be this is not about guns.
Sure. We don't have similar problems of drunken violence at all! Everything is just hunky-dory down here!

https://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/in...a9a19e28ac2fd5

https://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/ne...d782ab7783fee2



And it's not like it's a recent thing.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rocks_Push

https://www.buzzfeed.com/jemimaskell...6Rl#.tx8N4d1ek
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Old 30th August 2018, 08:12 PM   #67
The Big Dog
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Originally Posted by LSSBB View Post
Point being...?
Point being that I was just educating our readers on the major gangs in Chicago TODAY.

This forum is called current events.

Say, regale us with tales on the point y’all were making with “yeah, but he was a white guy.”

Waiting expectantly to be regaled with an explanation!
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Old 30th August 2018, 08:23 PM   #68
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
astute analysis! Except for the fact that the population in Chicago is plummeting and this is one of the richest areas in Chicago.

Wrong and wrong. The population density in the neighborhood the offenders live in is increasing. And they are commuting as per your OP.

Try again.
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Old 30th August 2018, 08:24 PM   #69
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Originally Posted by Norman Alexander View Post
Sure. We don't have similar problems of drunken violence at all! Everything is just hunky-dory down here!

That has nothing to do with what I said. In fact, in the only favorable way it could have something to do with what I said it would prove my point.
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Old 30th August 2018, 08:26 PM   #70
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
Point being that I was just educating our readers on the major gangs in Chicago TODAY.

This forum is called current events.

Say, regale us with tales on the point y’all were making with “yeah, but he was a white guy.”

Waiting expectantly to be regaled with an explanation!
Wow, your educating! Did you bring up the Simon City Royals?
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Old 30th August 2018, 08:29 PM   #71
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Originally Posted by This is The End View Post
Wrong and wrong. The population density in the neighborhood the offenders live in is increasing. And they are commuting as per your OP.

Try again.
The population density is increasing in the neighborhood where the offenders live is “increasing.” Well that is certainly news!

Tell me where the offenders live, enquiring minds and all!

Fascinated, because they have, you know not actually released where they were from, and the population of Chicago has been shrinking for decades.

I thirst for knowledge, except the totally made up bull **** kind, but we can be sure that this is not that, right.

Excited!
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Old 30th August 2018, 08:31 PM   #72
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Originally Posted by LSSBB View Post
Wow, your educating! Did you bring up the Simon City Royals?
No. Nor the jets or sharks, nor the Latin Kings (their use of gunners illegally smuggled up from the Mexican cartels is an interesting subject tho!)

Say, how y’all doing with the tales about he was a “White guy” explanation?

Tick tick.
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Last edited by The Big Dog; 30th August 2018 at 08:44 PM.
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Old 31st August 2018, 06:20 AM   #73
LSSBB
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
No. Nor the jets or sharks, nor the Latin Kings (their use of gunners illegally smuggled up from the Mexican cartels is an interesting subject tho!)

Say, how y’all doing with the tales about he was a “White guy” explanation?

Tick tick.
What about it? Wasn't he a white guy? Why do you think a bit of a rumble by punks in Wrigleyville draws so much outrage? If they were Simon City Royals, and it was on WGN like this was last night, would this be a second crime wave, or a third one? I didn't see anyone flashing their gang identification cards, so how do we know if anyone involved was in a gang?

Well, enjoy your little pond of outrage here. If your really care, maybe you could do something about the violence in Chicago, something neither Obama nor Pfleger nor Rahm ever really did. Bring some jobs to Chicago's poorest neighborhoods, or work on lead abatement - since lead in the environment has been linked to crime.
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Old 31st August 2018, 07:17 AM   #74
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Originally Posted by LSSBB View Post
Yeah, but he was a white guy.
Sure, now we think of Italians as white but not back in the day.
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Old 31st August 2018, 07:47 AM   #75
The Big Dog
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
P
Say, regale us with tales on the point y’all were making with “yeah, but he was a white guy.”

Waiting expectantly to be regaled with an explanation!
FRONTILNE NARRATOR: Posters wait expectantly for a reply.

Originally Posted by LSSBB View Post
What about it? Wasn't he a white guy?
FRONTILNE NARRATOR: It was not not very compelling...

I asked you what your point was when you posted that and your response is "wasn't he a white guy?" That is fantastic.

FRONTILNE NARRATOR: It was fantastic.

But people are no doubt clamoring for an explanation about the Simon City Royal. They are a link you get when you type in "white gangs" into Google. Do they have anything to do with this thread?

FRONTILNE NARRATOR: They do not

Are they a huge powerful gang in Chicago?

FRONTILNE NARRATOR: They are not

Let me give you a protip using a basketball analogy: If the gangster disciples are the Golden State warriors, the Simon City Royals are your uncles arguing over a spirited game of HORSE. You dig?

FRONTILNE NARRATOR: We dig.

I get that we all enjoy a good Whataboutism sometimes, but at least put some effort into it.
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Old 31st August 2018, 08:03 AM   #76
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My suspicion is that wherever the report is of 'black men' or 'black youths' the word 'black' can nearly always be replaced with the word 'poor'.

I suspect it's just easier to identify people by race rather than identifying them by the actual reason they're acting as they are.


Young men with money and prospects don't tent to rampage the streets.

Young men with no money and no prospects, well, what do they have to lose?
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Old 31st August 2018, 08:13 AM   #77
The Big Dog
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Originally Posted by 3point14 View Post
My suspicion is that wherever the report is of 'black men' or 'black youths' the word 'black' can nearly always be replaced with the word 'poor'.

I suspect it's just easier to identify people by race rather than identifying them by the actual reason they're acting as they are.


Young men with money and prospects don't tent to rampage the streets.

Young men with no money and no prospects, well, what do they have to lose?
You think that kid punched the lady in the face because he was "poor."

Ok..
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Old 31st August 2018, 08:15 AM   #78
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
You think that kid punched the lady in the face because he was "poor."

Ok..

No, that's not what I think. What I think is much more complicated than that and requires a little introspection and some compassion.


I shan't try to explain it to you.
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Old 31st August 2018, 08:18 AM   #79
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Originally Posted by 3point14 View Post
No, that's not what I think. What I think is much more complicated than that and requires a little introspection and some compassion.

I shan't try to explain it to you.
Compassion for the kid who punched the lady in the face?

Seriously, explain that to me, I should feel compassionate for a mob of kids that steal, attack passerby, swarm into a bar attacking patrons, etc etc.

Gonna need an explanation, because based on first hand experience they are nasty violent criminals.
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Old 31st August 2018, 08:22 AM   #80
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
Gonna need an explanation, because based on first hand experience they are nasty violent criminals.
They just need a hug.
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