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Old 23rd November 2018, 07:19 PM   #321
Babbylonian
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Originally Posted by p0lka View Post
It's private property, if the owner does not want someone on their property then I suppose the police just told him he had to leave.

It's not really the polices' job to question why, it's a clear case of someone on private property when the owner wants them off their private property.
The owner might be doing it for racist reasons, but the police don't need a reason other than it's private property and the owner wants them off it. It's part of their job.

The police shouldn't have been called though unless the owner told the guy to leave and he refused, then it might become a police issue.
It's the police's responsibility to protect people and their rights, as well as to keep the peace. They are under no obligation to obey the whims of a property owner (or their representative[s]) without due consideration and rational thought. As I said, it would have been very easy to make a suggestion that, given the totality of the situation, the yogurt-mongers should apologize and let the people stay until they're done.

I don't get why this is so hard for some to understand. Do you want police officers to cater without question or comment to the unreasonable whims of property owners?
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Old 23rd November 2018, 07:33 PM   #322
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Originally Posted by Babbylonian View Post

I don't get why this is so hard for some to understand. Do you want police officers to cater without question or comment to the unreasonable whims of property owners?
Spot on.
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Old 23rd November 2018, 08:20 PM   #323
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Originally Posted by varwoche View Post
True, thanks for the correction.


Lived here for decades. Had an office in Kirkland for several years. Stayed in a hotel down the street from the yogurt shop for several months. You?
I
Why? Your credibility is already running a deficit, and this doesn't help.

Speaking of which: You've been busted making stuff up out of whole cloth twice now. I'd appreciate an acknowledgement/retraction. Otherwise the discussion starts to feel like a game of whack-a-mole, moving from one Mr Salk falsehood to the next without correcting the record.

Non sequitur.

I admit to presenting Schrodinger's gun. I assume I conflated the detail after reading reams of Menchi's robberies.

This is the first thread I've followed, and it seems the forum MO is to breakdown into local skirmishes between individuals. I hope I'm not locked into being your foil in every thread. At least until I vet you to ensure we're properly misaligned.
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Old 23rd November 2018, 08:23 PM   #324
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Originally Posted by Babbylonian View Post
I don't get why this is so hard for some to understand. Do you want police officers to cater without question or comment to the unreasonable whims of property owners?
Yes. If I want some non-customer out of my business for some reason, cops PLEASE don't send them back in and drive away.
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Old 23rd November 2018, 08:25 PM   #325
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Originally Posted by Babbylonian View Post
Oh, please. People behave in manners I consider odd all the time. Here's what I assume about those people: That they're behaving in manners I consider odd. Full stop.
Let me take a wild guess: you're a guy? Reasonably confident you can handle yourself, and consequently not too worried about weird behaviors by others? Yeah, me too. You think if you were a young woman, you might take odd behaviors by larger men a little more seriously?

In fairness, I am extremely sympathetic to women feeling threatened by men. I read somewhere that the experience of being a woman is analogous to being an average guy surrounded by NFL linemen, who all want to **** you. It has nothing to do with race; it has to do with feeling and being in a less powerful position. A larger man behaving oddly can be intimidating in a way that you or I might find hard to relate to.

Quote:
The one time I had someone openly steal from me when I worked in a convenience store, he didn't act odd at all, probably because criminals don't want to appear suspicious before they commit a crime and make efforts to appear entirely normal.
True. That's exactly what is unnerving about someone behaving oddly, though. They don't even seem to know what normal looks like. That's a red flag.

Quote:
And, again, all the guy was doing was sitting there, apparently looking around. How the **** is that suspicious? There's even a name for the perfectly normal activity: People-watching. It's something normal people do when they don't have something else to occupy their time, or because they just enjoy it for it's own sake.
Seriously? Pretty restricted group he was 'people watching', don'tcha think?

Quote:
Nice try, but I'm not the one advocating for calling the police on someone who is doing absolutely nothing wrong.

There isn't a police force on the planet that could handle responding to calls from every person who sees someone else acting oddly.
You say he was doing nothing wrong. Agreed, completely. But it looks odd to sit for over a half hour by yourself in a yogurt shop, not ordering and staring at employees. It's a shame that police were called, as it is a little over the top, but I'm not sure what else they could have prudently done, knowing only what they knew at the time.
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Old 23rd November 2018, 08:33 PM   #326
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
You say he was doing nothing wrong. Agreed, completely. But it looks odd to sit for over a half hour by yourself in a yogurt shop, not ordering and staring at employees. It's a shame that police were called, as it is a little over the top, but I'm not sure what else they could have prudently done, knowing only what they knew at the time.
THEY COULD HAVE TALKED TO HIM!

By Zombie Raptor Jesus, this **** is not that ******* hard.
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Old 23rd November 2018, 08:41 PM   #327
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Originally Posted by pgwenthold View Post
It is beyond disgusting.
Perhaps we can fit on a handle to your pearls for easier clutching.

Quote:
We have those so desperate to prove that it wasn't racism that they are arguing that it is appropriate to "call the Calvary" on a court-appointed child advocate supervising a visit between a child who has been taken by their parent by the Department of Child Services and their parent, toward the goal of reunification.

Race aside, that is sick. The guy should be praised for his work (voluntary, by the way), and encouraged, not treated like a criminal.
Who said his work wasn't praiseworthy, or said he should be treated like a criminal? You're just making things up.

But I'll bite, for the hell of it: how do you know Ragland wasn't doing this job for purely selfish reasons, say to pepper up his resume to fool people like you? When I trained in PAL kickboxing years ago, the instructors there were unpaid. I'll bet you would praise their altruism too, right? I knew one personally. He was doing community service hours teaching there after having committed a violent crime. Things are not always what they seem.

Quote:
And if you have a system that turns him into a suspect, then your system is totally ****** up.

And before you object that, "They didn't know he was supervising a visit!" I will just note that they didn't know he was a criminal, either, but that didn't stop them from treating him that way.
They didn't treat him like a criminal. Criminals are arrested without discussion. Shot in the States all too frequently, too. They requested he move along, per the owner's request, and he voluntarily did. They did not verify his court appointment until later, according to the report. It is a shame that sometimes innocent people will receive treatment like this. If Ragland is as altruistic as you say, he would likely sympathize with why the young women were nervous. I hope he is more forgiving and understanding than some posters here.
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Old 23rd November 2018, 08:43 PM   #328
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
Let me take a wild guess: you're a guy? Reasonably confident you can handle yourself, and consequently not too worried about weird behaviors by others? Yeah, me too. You think if you were a young woman, you might take odd behaviors by larger men a little more seriously?

In fairness, I am extremely sympathetic to women feeling threatened by men. I read somewhere that the experience of being a woman is analogous to being an average guy surrounded by NFL linemen, who all want to **** you. It has nothing to do with race; it has to do with feeling and being in a less powerful position. A larger man behaving oddly can be intimidating in a way that you or I might find hard to relate to.
Also, quit projecting your patronizing ******** onto women. Most women can handle being in the presence of someone acting "oddly" (AND, AGAIN, HE WAS NOT ACTING ODDLY) without freaking out and calling the cops. They can also often generate enough sympathy to deal with the truly odd people as if they were ******* human beings instead of objects to be pushed out of sight and mind.
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Old 23rd November 2018, 08:49 PM   #329
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Ragland talks about himself in the third person? He had my sympathy before he mouthed off to Yahoo, or whoever Yahoo got this from.

As a female ... I'm beginning to think that his being young(ish), male and seemingly alone factored into the staff's feeling of discomfort. Doesn't excuse the cops though.
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Old 23rd November 2018, 08:53 PM   #330
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Originally Posted by Babbylonian View Post
THEY COULD HAVE TALKED TO HIM!

By Zombie Raptor Jesus, this **** is not that ******* hard.
Sure they could have. In fact, any young woman could just go talk to any big guy who has been staring at them for over a half hour, right? No need to eeeeeevvvveeeerrr feel threatened. Why, you can just talk it out!

Jesus H Tapdancing Christ. Quite an outlook you have.

eta: I have had people call police on me for being on vacant properties more times than I can count. I don't blame the people who call at all, because I get that I look suspicious. Every once in a while, I get some suburban mommy who comes over to confront me or 'just talk to me'. It's the most mind-numbingly stupid thing I can imagine someone doing. Walking up to 'talk it out' with someone you think may be a bad guy. They think exactly like you do.
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Last edited by Thermal; 23rd November 2018 at 08:58 PM.
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Old 23rd November 2018, 08:53 PM   #331
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
If Ragland is as altruistic as you say, he would likely sympathize with why the young women were nervous. I hope he is more forgiving and understanding than some posters here.
Unfortunately, Ragland is actually a frigging weirdo. He's publicly called for Cruz's license to be revoked, and asked to take over his three businesses personally. And no, he doesn't seem to be joking.
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Old 23rd November 2018, 09:00 PM   #332
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
Sure they could have. In fact, any young woman could just go talk to any big guy who has been staring at them for over a half hour, right? No need to eeeeeevvvveeeerrr feel threatened. Why, you can just talk it out!

Jesus H Tapdancing Christ. Quite an outlook you have.
1. I do not believe that he was "staring at them for over a half hour." The reason I don't believe this is that he was there for a purpose, he was there as a volunteer trying to do something good in his community, and he thus earns the presumption that he's not a ******* creep, at least from those of us who have actually found out the truth of the situation.

2. Yes, unless they are working at the store underage, they should be able to engage a human being who is not being actually threatening in their store.

3. As for feeeeeeeeling threatened, he had not done anything to make them feel that way. Anyone who felt threatened by him was being completely irrational, almost certainly because of an irrational fear/distrust/hatred of black men. In other words, it's a ****** excuse for ****** behavior.
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Old 23rd November 2018, 09:04 PM   #333
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Originally Posted by Babbylonian View Post
Also, quit projecting your patronizing ******** onto women. Most women can handle being in the presence of someone acting "oddly" (AND, AGAIN, HE WAS NOT ACTING ODDLY) without freaking out and calling the cops. They can also often generate enough sympathy to deal with the truly odd people as if they were ******* human beings instead of objects to be pushed out of sight and mind.
You are comically off the mark yet again. He was acting oddly, by any definition. Normal people don't sit in a yogurt shop for over a half hour, repeatedly staring at the workers and not ordering anything. That...is...ODD. And also exactly like a predator would behave. And had you troubled yourself to read the OP, the women didn't call the cops.

If you think it is patronizing to respect a woman's right to feel secure, even when weighed against a larger man's rights, then I hope we can agree to disagree. I go out of my way to make others feel at ease. Obviously not a concern of yours.
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Old 23rd November 2018, 09:07 PM   #334
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Originally Posted by Mr Salk View Post
Unfortunately, Ragland is actually a frigging weirdo. He's publicly called for Cruz's license to be revoked, and asked to take over his three businesses personally. And no, he doesn't seem to be joking.
I hadn't seen that. If true, then yeah, I guess I see why he misted up his eyes while weeping 'it's just another Wednesday to poor me'. A shakedown is in the works, is it?
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Old 23rd November 2018, 09:17 PM   #335
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Originally Posted by Babbylonian View Post
1. I do not believe that he was "staring at them for over a half hour." The reason I don't believe this is that he was there for a purpose, he was there as a volunteer trying to do something good in his community, and he thus earns the presumption that he's not a ******* creep, at least from those of us who have actually found out the truth of the situation.
Can't believe this has to be explained to you, but: the women did not know that at the time. We are discussing how reasonable their actions were at the time, knowing only what they knew. Not what we all know now.

Quote:
2. Yes, unless they are working at the store underage, they should be able to engage a human being who is not being actually threatening in their store.
What is wrong with you? Sitting for over a half hour...play with the phone...stare at the workers...play with the phone...stare at the workers...

That's a ******* creepshow, dude.

Quote:
3. As for feeeeeeeeling threatened, he had not done anything to make them feel that way. Anyone who felt threatened by him was being completely irrational, almost certainly because of an irrational fear/distrust/hatred of black men. In other words, it's a ****** excuse for ****** behavior.
It might not feel threatening to you or I. It might to them, if they felt like they could not handle themselves against a threat. Have at least a little compassion for those who are afraid of being assaulted by some weirdo.

Before you foolishly say it: we know he was not a weirdo now. Their only intel at the time was his weird behavior.
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Old 23rd November 2018, 10:51 PM   #336
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
I hadn't seen that. If true, then yeah, I guess I see why he misted up his eyes while weeping 'it's just another Wednesday to poor me'. A shakedown is in the works, is it?
The juicy part:
"I think we need to make sure Ramon Cruz is unable to renew his business license here," said Ragland, to applause. "And when the lease to this store is up, we need to make sure Byron Ragland has the capital and the resources to purchase this Menchie's and the two other restaurants he owns in the community."

Maybe the yogurt girls are actually excellent judges of character.
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Old 23rd November 2018, 10:55 PM   #337
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Originally Posted by Mr Salk View Post
The juicy part:
"I think we need to make sure Ramon Cruz is unable to renew his business license here," said Ragland, to applause. "And when the lease to this store is up, we need to make sure Byron Ragland has the capital and the resources to purchase this Menchie's and the two other restaurants he owns in the community."

Maybe the yogurt girls are actually excellent judges of character.
Here's a link in case I missed it upthread. Ragland says he doesn't even want to hear from Cruz. He just wants to take over the stores. Flipping surreal.

http://mynorthwest.com/1191647/kirkl...ogurt-protest/
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Old 23rd November 2018, 11:37 PM   #338
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Originally Posted by bluesjnr View Post
No, that question wasn't what made the imaginary 7 year old antagonistic and obnoxious. You seem to be making a habit of missing the mark.

Hint, body of work......
Indeed.
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Old 23rd November 2018, 11:41 PM   #339
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Originally Posted by My Northwest
Cruz says that when his employee texted him with concerns about a man in the store, there was no mention of race. That information was only brought up when the 911 dispatcher asked for it and Cruz said he appeared to be African-American on security video.
Link is in the above post.
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Old 24th November 2018, 01:46 AM   #340
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Originally Posted by William Parcher View Post
There are some headlines now saying that police have apologized and others saying that Kirkland city employees will undergo bias training.

There is also a story with Ragland saying that apologies from the police and the shop aren't enough. He seems to want Cruz to be put out of business and for himself to be given enough money to buy the yogurt shop and two other restaurants that Cruz owns. Or something like that.



https://www.google.com/url?sa=i&sour...43109971423556
Well if true he crossed multiple lines from victim to victim being an unreasonable jerk. He forgot to mention flaying followed by drawing and quartering. Also were the empliyees and the girls really white supremicists. Racist or tainted with racist perception I can see, but not full on white supremicists.
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Old 24th November 2018, 02:05 AM   #341
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Originally Posted by Lambchops View Post
Indeed.
I realise it's never easy when you look in the mirror and see a poor reflection, so well done for the soul searching and admission. You've learned from this interaction and will only grow as a person.

You don't have to thank me, I'll sit in the wings and watch you fly....

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Old 24th November 2018, 02:08 AM   #342
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Originally Posted by Hungry81 View Post
Well if true he crossed multiple lines from victim to victim being an unreasonable jerk. He forgot to mention flaying followed by drawing and quartering. Also were the empliyees and the girls really white supremicists. Racist or tainted with racist perception I can see, but not full on white supremicists.
That's veterans for you, particularly air force vets and especially those with 9 years in service.
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Old 24th November 2018, 03:43 AM   #343
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Originally Posted by rdwight View Post
Why after the officers were informed of the situation did they still instruct the gentleman to leave is confusing.
Yeah, this is the part that I don't understand either.

If someone comes into your business and takes up a seat but doesn't buy anything I think it's entirely reasonable to ask them to leave, but if he's with other paying customers that's a completely different situation.
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Old 24th November 2018, 04:16 AM   #344
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
You are comically off the mark yet again. He was acting oddly, by any definition. Normal people don't sit in a yogurt shop for over a half hour, repeatedly staring at the workers and not ordering anything. That...is...ODD. And also exactly like a predator would behave. And had you troubled yourself to read the OP, the women didn't call the cops.

If you think it is patronizing to respect a woman's right to feel secure, even when weighed against a larger man's rights, then I hope we can agree to disagree. I go out of my way to make others feel at ease. Obviously not a concern of yours.
To be fair they probably should have approached him before it came to that. Fairly soon after he sat down, or at least within the first 10 minutes and asked him if he wanted to purchase some youghurt at the counter. If he said no they could politely explain that the seats are for paying customers only. Then he could tell them what he is doing there, they could verify with the mother, and continue on with their duties. (In a parallel universe If he became hostile then they could freely contact the manager or police) It's shop sales person 101.
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Old 24th November 2018, 06:48 AM   #345
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Originally Posted by Mr Salk View Post
Unfortunately, Ragland is actually a frigging weirdo. He's publicly called for Cruz's license to be revoked, and asked to take over his three businesses personally. And no, he doesn't seem to be joking.
Before you get too giddy with this post hoc rationalization, why haven't you acknowledged the two "mistakes" you posted?

You added in a gun where there was no gun.

And you justified staff behavior with this odd misrepresentation:
Originally Posted by Mr Salk
The vast majority of the time when a lone man is loitering around a place frequented by children for the sole purpose of watching kids, he is NOT court appointed.
Look, we all mistakes. I made a mistake. You pointed it out. I owned it. No big deal. But when a person says something that is proven false, and refuses to acknowledge, and refuses to correct the record, I consider such people abject liars.
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Old 24th November 2018, 07:20 AM   #346
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Originally Posted by Checkmite View Post
Human. There's a thing called the "reasonable person standard", which is commonly used when we judge the actions of others and as much as you might complain that it is a subjective measure, it nonetheless finds acceptable use even in a setting as demanding as court. When a person claims as a defense of their choice that they found a particular other person's behavior suspicious enough to act on in a way that harmed that other person, we really are allowed to judge whether that suspicion was reasonable even though "we weren't there".

The employees' own description of the man's actions is ridiculously banal and doesn't seem to suggest a crime of any sort is imminent. Calling the police was idiotic.
There you go, now we agree. It was idiotic. Not racist but simply idiotic. Somewhere in the US exist two idiotic yogurt sellers.
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Old 24th November 2018, 10:32 AM   #347
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Originally Posted by Hungry81 View Post
To be fair they probably should have approached him before it came to that. Fairly soon after he sat down, or at least within the first 10 minutes and asked him if he wanted to purchase some youghurt at the counter. If he said no they could politely explain that the seats are for paying customers only. Then he could tell them what he is doing there, they could verify with the mother, and continue on with their duties. (In a parallel universe If he became hostile then they could freely contact the manager or police) It's shop sales person 101.
Yeah, I get that. If you are going to work where you interact with the public, you should be prepared to deal with this kind of thing. From what I gather, one of the two women was about to leave, and the remaining one may have been afraid of being alone with him after the other customers left. Since he looked like he was waiting, I can sympathize with that to some degree.

Like many LWB stories, I still don't know why racism has to be viewed as the motivation though. I see this more as a sex issue. If he was a white guy staring at them while sitting by himself for over half an hour, I would think the women's reaction would be the same. Its not like police were called on a black guy and not on a white guy.
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Old 24th November 2018, 11:16 AM   #348
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Originally Posted by baron View Post
There you go, now we agree. It was idiotic. Not racist but simply idiotic. Somewhere in the US exist two idiotic yogurt sellers.
I don't think we'll ever know if there was a racist element at play in the minds of the workers and company owner or not. Maybe if it had been a preppy, 21 year old white kid, they still would have all done the exact same things, maybe not.
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Old 24th November 2018, 11:26 AM   #349
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Originally Posted by varwoche View Post
Before you get too giddy with this post hoc rationalization, why haven't you acknowledged the two "mistakes" you posted?

You added in a gun where there was no gun.

And you justified staff behavior with this odd misrepresentation:

Look, we all mistakes. I made a mistake. You pointed it out. I owned it. No big deal. But when a person says something that is proven false, and refuses to acknowledge, and refuses to correct the record, I consider such people abject liars.
Some skeptic posted their opinion that the previous crimes described by Cruz were probably a lie or overblown because he was in the hot seat. I hunted down an obscure news story about the previous robbery and posted it for all. My summary of my linked-post included a detail (weapon) that I inferred but was not explicitly listed. Touche'!
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Old 24th November 2018, 11:38 AM   #350
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Originally Posted by bluesjnr View Post
That's veterans for you, particularly air force vets and especially those with 9 years in service.
I'm thankful for his service.
"You cannot allow white supremacy to scurry away in the corner and lick its wounds and regroup," Ragland said. "You got to keep your foot on white supremacy's neck. You got to grind your boot into white supremacy's throat until you hear it stop breathing, when it begs you for mercy you shown it now 'cause in last 400 years, it hasn't shown you any."
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Old 24th November 2018, 11:49 AM   #351
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Originally Posted by kellyb View Post
I don't think we'll ever know if there was a racist element at play in the minds of the workers and company owner or not. Maybe if it had been a preppy, 21 year old white kid, they still would have all done the exact same things, maybe not.
There's one thing we know with certainty: Once the cops arrived and heard the perfectly valid explanation, there was no apology, there was no free yogurt gift card. Those are things that normal, decent merchants would do upon discovering they had treated a customer poorly.

None of us can say with 100% certainty this was due to racism. However I find "idiocy" to be an inadequate explanation. That's a level of idiocy of someone who opened shop yesterday (and who had intellectual challenges to begin with). I suspect that in lily white Kirkland, ******* aren't welcome in this particular shop, regardless if that is a conscious thought on the part of the actors.
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Old 24th November 2018, 11:56 AM   #352
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The surveillance footage is released. Shady dude. I'll let Ragland summarize himself slouching in the corner:
“Just being a fly on the wall type of thing is what I do,” Ragland said. “Sit on back and just watch them visit, you know document the visit.”
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Old 24th November 2018, 11:58 AM   #353
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Originally Posted by Mr Salk View Post
The surveillance footage is released. Shady dude. I'll let Ragland summarize himself slouching in the corner:
“Just being a fly on the wall type of thing is what I do,” Ragland said. “Sit on back and just watch them visit, you know document the visit.”
This is exactly the job of a court-appointed visitation chaperone.

If this kind of behavior seems inappropriate to you, there are steps you can take as a citizen to request that the supervised visitation system be abolished.
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Old 24th November 2018, 12:03 PM   #354
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Originally Posted by varwoche View Post
There's one thing we know with certainty: Once the cops arrived and heard the perfectly valid explanation, there was no apology, there was no free yogurt gift card. Those are things that normal, decent merchants would do upon discovering they had treated a customer poorly.
You sound very sure that the worker was present for the exchange with the police. You sure she hadn't ducked out in the back while it was happening?

Quote:
None of us can say with 100% certainty this was due to racism. However I find "idiocy" to be an inadequate explanation. That's a level of idiocy of someone who opened shop yesterday (and who had intellectual challenges to begin with). I suspect that in lily white Kirkland, ******* aren't welcome in this particular shop, regardless if that is a conscious thought on the part of the actors.
Is fear or timidity out of the realm of possibility, or even likelihood? Must it be idiocy or racism?

Have you ever been scared, rationally or not? Did you use your best judgment?
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Old 24th November 2018, 12:10 PM   #355
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Originally Posted by Mr Salk View Post
The surveillance footage is released. Shady dude. I'll let Ragland summarize himself slouching in the corner:
“Just being a fly on the wall type of thing is what I do,” Ragland said. “Sit on back and just watch them visit, you know document the visit.”
OMFG. Do you really expect your interpretation to be taken seriously, given the fiction you wrote about his appearance/behavior even before this video?

Attentive readers aren't going to swallow this sort of musing, particularly when sourced from you, a documented liar.
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Old 24th November 2018, 12:34 PM   #356
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Originally Posted by Mr Salk View Post
The surveillance footage is released. Shady dude. I'll let Ragland summarize himself slouching in the corner:
“Just being a fly on the wall type of thing is what I do,” Ragland said. “Sit on back and just watch them visit, you know document the visit.”
I looked for the video. All I can find are snippets.

I've been hard on you, and I want to make a concession if you can help me out a little. Can you please post a link to the video where it shows Ragland slouching? And please indicate when on the timer that the slouching is most prominent.

This slouching is very serious business. Pervs, junkies, and robbers are the worst slouchers of all. The upstanding citizens of Kirkland will not tolerate it!
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Old 24th November 2018, 12:45 PM   #357
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
You sound very sure that the worker was present for the exchange with the police. You sure she hadn't ducked out in the back while it was happening?
It seems unlikely. It also seems unlikely that the owner stopped observing remotely. Usually in a crisis situation such as this people are keenly interested in how it plays out.

However this does get me interested in seeing the surveillance video to confirm.

Quote:
Is fear or timidity out of the realm of possibility, or even likelihood? Must it be idiocy or racism?
I was responding to posters who think idiocy explains things.

Anyway, of course fear could be a factor. The question is, is that fear rational? And what prompts it?

Quote:
Have you ever been scared, rationally or not? Did you use your best judgment?
I'm searching the memory banks. If I think of a pertinent example, I'll get back to you.
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Old 24th November 2018, 12:52 PM   #358
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Originally Posted by varwoche View Post
There's one thing we know with certainty: Once the cops arrived and heard the perfectly valid explanation, there was no apology, there was no free yogurt gift card. Those are things that normal, decent merchants would do upon discovering they had treated a customer poorly.

None of us can say with 100% certainty this was due to racism. However I find "idiocy" to be an inadequate explanation. That's a level of idiocy of someone who opened shop yesterday (and who had intellectual challenges to begin with). I suspect that in lily white Kirkland, ******* aren't welcome in this particular shop, regardless if that is a conscious thought on the part of the actors.
Is that the Kirkland that's under 80% white? I don't know how it works in the US but in the UK that would be decidedly multicultural. I don't image that whites, or even these two servers, call the cops on one in five of their customers on account of their different skin colour.
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Old 24th November 2018, 12:59 PM   #359
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Originally Posted by baron View Post
Is that the Kirkland that's under 80% white? I don't know how it works in the US but in the UK that would be decidedly multicultural. I don't image that whites, or even these two servers, call the cops on one in five of their customers on account of their different skin colour.
As I posted upthread, there's a significant Asian population. The black population is 1.2%.

I humbly apologize to any offended parties that I included Asians in the white population, and will discontinue using "lily white" to describe Kirkland.
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Old 24th November 2018, 01:21 PM   #360
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Originally Posted by varwoche View Post
As I posted upthread, there's a significant Asian population. The black population is 1.2%.

I humbly apologize to any offended parties that I included Asians in the white population, and will discontinue using "lily white" to describe Kirkland.
So the servers aren't your run of the mill white supremacist racists, they're white and Asian supremacist racists, kind of like female, yogurt dispensing Jared Taylors?
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