Multiculturalism, does it work ? - Page 3

Distracted1 · 18th February 2021, 08:28 AM

Originally Posted by TragicMonkey

"Assimilation" needs to be defined as well. Is a Hasidic Jew living in New York City assimilated or not?

Not likely. Nor is a Polygamist Mormon in Utah. Or a voodoo practitioner from down in the Luisiana Bayou.

Their Grandchildren have tended to be though.

Lplus · 18th February 2021, 08:40 AM

Originally Posted by Vixen

Help us out, LPlus, CaveMonster and Airfix:

DAILY MAIL

Tommy Robinson of 'England First' is Irish.

What happened?

History happened - sometimes with violence. Make that almost always with violence.

Darat · 18th February 2021, 08:41 AM

Originally Posted by Distracted1

Not likely. Nor is a Polygamist Mormon in Utah. Or a voodoo practitioner from down in the Luisiana Bayou.

Their Grandchildren have tended to be though.

Now this is interesting. Can you define which culture you think should “assimilate” these three other cultures? And of course will you?

JoeMorgue · 18th February 2021, 08:55 AM

And this problem.

People treat "cultures" as singular things when they aren't.

If a bunch of Klingons move to New York I don't care if they keep eating Gahg and sinking Klingon Opera, but I'm going to have to insist they stop having Bat'Leth duels in the street. It's not an all or nothing thing.

Cavemonster · 18th February 2021, 08:59 AM

Originally Posted by JoeMorgue

And this problem.

People treat "cultures" as singular things when they aren't.

If a bunch of Klingons move to New York I don't care if they keep eating Gahg and sinking Klingon Opera, but I'm going to have to insist they stop having Bat'Leth duels in the street. It's not an all or nothing thing.

I'm not sure if even the dogwhistler's think that. They certainly don't seem to mind having falafel shops on the corner. They just have it in their heads that the people who make the falafel will rape their white women and install sharia law.

TragicMonkey · 18th February 2021, 09:02 AM

Originally Posted by ponderingturtle

Clearly culture is uniquely identifiable types of pottery, everyone knows that.

Spoken like a holdover from the red-figures-on-black-pottery period. As a sophisticated black-figures-on-red-pottery person, I scoff at you. *scoff scoff*

ponderingturtle · 18th February 2021, 09:30 AM

Originally Posted by TragicMonkey

Spoken like a holdover from the red-figures-on-black-pottery period. As a sophisticated black-figures-on-red-pottery person, I scoff at you. *scoff scoff*

Your rims are so inelegantly shaped! And the geometry of your black figures!!!! Pah!!!

Darat · 18th February 2021, 12:05 PM

Originally Posted by JoeMorgue

And this problem.

People treat "cultures" as singular things when they aren't.

If a bunch of Klingons move to New York I don't care if they keep eating Gahg and sinking Klingon Opera, but I'm going to have to insist they stop having Bat'Leth duels in the street. It's not an all or nothing thing.

But that opera stuff sounds strange not like my opera!

mgidm86 · 18th February 2021, 10:54 PM

You need to also define "work". Ask a simple question to a room full of skeptics and...

This thread reminds me of my childhood and having dinner at Gramma and Grampa's with all my Italian relatives shouting conversations with the person the furthest away from them at the table. Can't really follow any of it!

Gord_in_Toronto · 19th February 2021, 07:18 PM

Originally Posted by Vixen

Help us out, LPlus, CaveMonster and Airfix:

DAILY MAIL

Tommy Robinson of 'England First' is Irish.

What happened?

My mother was born in Stinchcombe reasonably close to Bledington (at least they are both in Gloucestershire). I guess I'm more multicultural than I thought I was.

Venom · 21st February 2021, 12:24 PM

I think culture and ethnicity or at least the perception of differences there serves as a selection process. Humans have no natural predators other than each other. What better way to control H. sapiens than to have different varieties of humans suppress or war one another? Living in harmony seems to be pretty difficult even with language and the ability to think rationally.

Norman Alexander · 21st February 2021, 12:51 PM

I'm betting the Neanderthals on what is now the British Isles had grunts that meant "Pah! These homo sapiens invaders are surely going to kill off our culture. Bloody foreigners! Why don't they go back where they came from! We really need a Nexit..."

Cavemonster · 21st February 2021, 12:54 PM

Originally Posted by Norman Alexander

I'm betting the Neanderthals on what is now the British Isles had grunts that meant "Pah! These homo sapiens invaders are surely going to kill off our culture. Bloody foreigners! Why don't they go back where they came from! We really need a Nexit..."

They weren't wrong.

Venom · 21st February 2021, 01:28 PM

Originally Posted by Norman Alexander

I'm betting the Neanderthals on what is now the British Isles had grunts that meant "Pah! These homo sapiens invaders are surely going to kill off our culture. Bloody foreigners! Why don't they go back where they came from! We really need a Nexit..."

To be serious, perhaps Neanderthals didn't value culture as much as we did, so they were easily outcompeted/displaced. No art, no cave paintings by them. Neanderthal burial sites feature very little thoughtful construction or organization.

Cavemonster · 21st February 2021, 02:17 PM

Originally Posted by Venom

To be serious, perhaps Neanderthals didn't value culture as much as we did, so they were easily outcompeted/displaced. No art, no cave paintings by them. Neanderthal burial sites feature very little thoughtful construction or organization.

Not so fast.
https://www.sapiens.org/archaeology/...art-discovery/

Norman Alexander · 21st February 2021, 05:54 PM

"Thag" is a culture. Perhaps not a complex one, but a culture nonetheless.

3point14 · 25th February 2021, 09:45 AM

Did the OP ever come back?

ponderingturtle · 25th February 2021, 09:58 AM

Originally Posted by 3point14

Did the OP ever come back?

He has been posting and starting other threads.

Lplus · 27th February 2021, 03:23 AM

Originally Posted by ponderingturtle

He has been posting and starting other threads.

He maybe couldn't be bothered with the emotion based snark and diversions into neanderthal jokes.

18th February 2021, 08:28 AM	#81
Distracted1 Philosopher Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Philadelphia Posts: 5,625	Originally Posted by TragicMonkey "Assimilation" needs to be defined as well. Is a Hasidic Jew living in New York City assimilated or not? Not likely. Nor is a Polygamist Mormon in Utah. Or a voodoo practitioner from down in the Luisiana Bayou. Their Grandchildren have tended to be though.
	__________________ The man with one watch knows what time it is, the man with two watches is never sure.

18th February 2021, 08:40 AM	#82
Lplus Muse Join Date: Jul 2018 Posts: 659	Originally Posted by Vixen Help us out, LPlus, CaveMonster and Airfix: DAILY MAIL Tommy Robinson of 'England First' is Irish. What happened? History happened - sometimes with violence. Make that almost always with violence.
Lplus Muse Join Date: Jul 2018 Posts: 659	__________________ Those who are most fanatical in their condemnation of others are often mortally afraid that, in their deepest subconcious, they agree with those who they are condemning. Communism actively works against the fundamental urge of the human animal to survive and prosper, even at the expense of others, whilst Nazism relies on that urge.

18th February 2021, 08:41 AM	#83
Darat Lackey Administrator Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: South East, UK Posts: 97,862	Originally Posted by Distracted1 Not likely. Nor is a Polygamist Mormon in Utah. Or a voodoo practitioner from down in the Luisiana Bayou. Their Grandchildren have tended to be though. Now this is interesting. Can you define which culture you think should “assimilate” these three other cultures? And of course will you?
	__________________ I wish I knew how to quit you

18th February 2021, 08:55 AM	#84
JoeMorgue Self Employed Remittance Man Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Florida Posts: 31,635	And this problem. People treat "cultures" as singular things when they aren't. If a bunch of Klingons move to New York I don't care if they keep eating Gahg and sinking Klingon Opera, but I'm going to have to insist they stop having Bat'Leth duels in the street. It's not an all or nothing thing.
	__________________ Yahtzee: "You're doing that thing again where when asked a question you just discuss the philosophy of the question instead of answering the bloody question." Gabriel: "Well yeah, you see..." Yahtzee: "No. When you are asked a Yes or No question the first word out of your mouth needs to be Yes or No. Only after that have you earned the right to elaborate."

18th February 2021, 08:59 AM	#85
Cavemonster Philosopher Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 6,663	Originally Posted by JoeMorgue And this problem. People treat "cultures" as singular things when they aren't. If a bunch of Klingons move to New York I don't care if they keep eating Gahg and sinking Klingon Opera, but I'm going to have to insist they stop having Bat'Leth duels in the street. It's not an all or nothing thing. I'm not sure if even the dogwhistler's think that. They certainly don't seem to mind having falafel shops on the corner. They just have it in their heads that the people who make the falafel will rape their white women and install sharia law.
Cavemonster Philosopher Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 6,663	__________________ The weakness of all Utopias is this, ... They first assume that no man will want more than his share, and then are very ingenious in explaining whether his share will be delivered by motorcar or balloon. -G.K. CHESTERTON

18th February 2021, 09:02 AM	#86
TragicMonkey Poisoned Waffles Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Monkey Posts: 59,755	Originally Posted by ponderingturtle Clearly culture is uniquely identifiable types of pottery, everyone knows that. Spoken like a holdover from the red-figures-on-black-pottery period. As a sophisticated black-figures-on-red-pottery person, I scoff at you. scoff scoff
	__________________ You added nothing to that conversation, Barbara.

18th February 2021, 09:30 AM	#87
ponderingturtle Orthogonal Vector Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 50,788	Originally Posted by TragicMonkey Spoken like a holdover from the red-figures-on-black-pottery period. As a sophisticated black-figures-on-red-pottery person, I scoff at you. scoff scoff Your rims are so inelegantly shaped! And the geometry of your black figures!!!! Pah!!!
	__________________ Sufficiently advanced Woo is indistinguishable from Parody "There shall be no poofing in science" Paul C. Anagnostopoulos Force ***** on reasons back" Ben Franklin

18th February 2021, 12:05 PM	#88
Darat Lackey Administrator Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: South East, UK Posts: 97,862	Originally Posted by JoeMorgue And this problem. People treat "cultures" as singular things when they aren't. If a bunch of Klingons move to New York I don't care if they keep eating Gahg and sinking Klingon Opera, but I'm going to have to insist they stop having Bat'Leth duels in the street. It's not an all or nothing thing. But that opera stuff sounds strange not like my opera!
	__________________ I wish I knew how to quit you

18th February 2021, 10:54 PM	#89
mgidm86 Philosopher FLA Winner Jan 21 Join Date: Jan 2003 Posts: 6,094	Multiculturalism, does it work ? You need to also define "work". Ask a simple question to a room full of skeptics and... This thread reminds me of my childhood and having dinner at Gramma and Grampa's with all my Italian relatives shouting conversations with the person the furthest away from them at the table. Can't really follow any of it!
	__________________ I can't do this anymore.

19th February 2021, 07:18 PM	#90
Gord_in_Toronto Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 20,623	Originally Posted by Vixen Help us out, LPlus, CaveMonster and Airfix: DAILY MAIL Tommy Robinson of 'England First' is Irish. What happened? My mother was born in Stinchcombe reasonably close to Bledington (at least they are both in Gloucestershire). I guess I'm more multicultural than I thought I was.
	__________________ "Reality is what's left when you cease to believe." Philip K. Dick Last edited by Gord_in_Toronto; 19th February 2021 at 07:20 PM.

21st February 2021, 12:24 PM	#91
Venom Illuminator Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: United States Posts: 4,978	I think culture and ethnicity or at least the perception of differences there serves as a selection process. Humans have no natural predators other than each other. What better way to control H. sapiens than to have different varieties of humans suppress or war one another? Living in harmony seems to be pretty difficult even with language and the ability to think rationally.

21st February 2021, 12:51 PM	#92
Norman Alexander Philosopher Join Date: Nov 2014 Location: Gundungurra Posts: 9,208	I'm betting the Neanderthals on what is now the British Isles had grunts that meant "Pah! These homo sapiens invaders are surely going to kill off our culture. Bloody foreigners! Why don't they go back where they came from! We really need a Nexit..."
	__________________ _{...our governments are just trying to protect us from terror. In the same way that someone banging a hornets’ nest with a stick is trying to protect us from hornets. Frankie Boyle, Guardian, July 2015}

21st February 2021, 12:54 PM	#93
Cavemonster Philosopher Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 6,663	Originally Posted by Norman Alexander I'm betting the Neanderthals on what is now the British Isles had grunts that meant "Pah! These homo sapiens invaders are surely going to kill off our culture. Bloody foreigners! Why don't they go back where they came from! We really need a Nexit..." They weren't wrong.
Cavemonster Philosopher Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 6,663	__________________ The weakness of all Utopias is this, ... They first assume that no man will want more than his share, and then are very ingenious in explaining whether his share will be delivered by motorcar or balloon. -G.K. CHESTERTON

21st February 2021, 01:28 PM	#94
Venom Illuminator Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: United States Posts: 4,978	Originally Posted by Norman Alexander I'm betting the Neanderthals on what is now the British Isles had grunts that meant "Pah! These homo sapiens invaders are surely going to kill off our culture. Bloody foreigners! Why don't they go back where they came from! We really need a Nexit..." To be serious, perhaps Neanderthals didn't value culture as much as we did, so they were easily outcompeted/displaced. No art, no cave paintings by them. Neanderthal burial sites feature very little thoughtful construction or organization.

21st February 2021, 02:17 PM	#95
Cavemonster Philosopher Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 6,663	Originally Posted by Venom To be serious, perhaps Neanderthals didn't value culture as much as we did, so they were easily outcompeted/displaced. No art, no cave paintings by them. Neanderthal burial sites feature very little thoughtful construction or organization. Not so fast. https://www.sapiens.org/archaeology/...art-discovery/
Cavemonster Philosopher Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 6,663	__________________ The weakness of all Utopias is this, ... They first assume that no man will want more than his share, and then are very ingenious in explaining whether his share will be delivered by motorcar or balloon. -G.K. CHESTERTON

21st February 2021, 05:54 PM	#96
Norman Alexander Philosopher Join Date: Nov 2014 Location: Gundungurra Posts: 9,208	"Thag" is a culture. Perhaps not a complex one, but a culture nonetheless.
	__________________ _{...our governments are just trying to protect us from terror. In the same way that someone banging a hornets’ nest with a stick is trying to protect us from hornets. Frankie Boyle, Guardian, July 2015}

25th February 2021, 09:45 AM	#97
3point14 Pi Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 20,660	Did the OP ever come back?
3point14 Pi Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 20,660	__________________ Up the River! Anyone that wraps themselves in the Union Flag and also lives in tax exile is a [redacted]

25th February 2021, 09:58 AM	#98
ponderingturtle Orthogonal Vector Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 50,788	Originally Posted by 3point14 Did the OP ever come back? He has been posting and starting other threads.
	__________________ Sufficiently advanced Woo is indistinguishable from Parody "There shall be no poofing in science" Paul C. Anagnostopoulos Force ***** on reasons back" Ben Franklin

27th February 2021, 03:23 AM	#99
Lplus Muse Join Date: Jul 2018 Posts: 659	Originally Posted by ponderingturtle He has been posting and starting other threads. He maybe couldn't be bothered with the emotion based snark and diversions into neanderthal jokes.
Lplus Muse Join Date: Jul 2018 Posts: 659	__________________ Those who are most fanatical in their condemnation of others are often mortally afraid that, in their deepest subconcious, they agree with those who they are condemning. Communism actively works against the fundamental urge of the human animal to survive and prosper, even at the expense of others, whilst Nazism relies on that urge.