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Tags Amy Siskind , bloggers , donald trump , media criticism , Trump controversies

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Old 30th June 2017, 06:07 PM   #41
Cl1mh4224rd
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Originally Posted by Giz View Post
...the USA will survive him just fine.

I agree that the U.S. will survive, but I disagree with the "just fine" part. Hell, I might even be willing to agree with the "just fine" part. But just because the result of an action falls within the potentially broad and subjective category of "just fine" doesn't mean that the result doesn't leave us worse off than before.

And that's kind of the issue.

"Just fine" is a relative judgement. "Just fine" is based on the current state of affairs. And if the current state of affairs is trending downward, "just fine" becomes an extremely dangerous justification for doing nothing to stop a slow slide into obscurity or horror.

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Old 30th June 2017, 06:21 PM   #42
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Originally Posted by uke2se View Post
The "doom porn" is a list of news articles detailing, among other things, how a foreign power influenced, hacked and possibly altered the result of the 2016 election, and how the resulting winner of that election is effectively dismantling oversight and checks and balances.

But yeah, it's just silly.
The hacks were more about the released information. The timing of the releases were a sublime operation, perfectly pitched and timed. They undoubtedly affected the election, but only because there was reason for them to. Clinton was unbelievably stupid in having a private e-mail server. Her own department has an excellent IT department and a generally good record in rebuffing attacks. She basically hung herself out to dry, the risk of revelation was far higher having the private server.
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Old 30th June 2017, 06:25 PM   #43
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Originally Posted by Mikemcc View Post
The hacks were more about the released information. The timing of the releases were a sublime operation, perfectly pitched and timed. They undoubtedly affected the election, but only because there was reason for them to. Clinton was unbelievably stupid in having a private e-mail server. Her own department has an excellent IT department and a generally good record in rebuffing attacks. She basically hung herself out to dry, the risk of revelation was far higher having the private server.
You are conflating two things. Clinton had nothing to do with the IT security in the DNC, and there were no real revelations in the leaked material, just emails between colleagues. The very fact that it was hacked and leaked meant it could be spun into something that people who didn't really pay attention would think was bad. I mean, it was leaked, so it must mean there were bad stuff in there, mustn't it?
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Old 30th June 2017, 06:29 PM   #44
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Originally Posted by ahhell View Post
I can't speak to the daily mail, I don't read. Its entirely possible that its as hysterical as Giz suggests. There is however a lot of breathless reporting on every silly thing trump does as though its a disaster and plenty of things he does that Obama and Bush and others have done that went completely unnoticed.
That is an unsupportable POV.
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Old 30th June 2017, 06:30 PM   #45
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Originally Posted by ahhell View Post
Nonsense, its a picture of an incompetent and ineffectual administration led by an ignoramous.

The blog starts with:
and ends with, trump can't get anything done.

I'm not defending Trump by saying he's not Hitler, I'm attacking the likes of this blogger that desperately wish he was.

ETA: Seriously, its an "authoritarian list" that includes, nothing much happened today and its reported on in the Washington Post(I think, I can't get through the pay wall)... This **** hurts the anti-trump side by making it look like a bunch of hysterical children.
So you are conflating bogs with the mainstream news reporting?
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Old 30th June 2017, 06:33 PM   #46
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Originally Posted by Gilbert Syndrome View Post
.....
We went through this same nonsense when Bush was in office, and no doubt we'll go through it again when some other bellend gets brought in. Same over here in the UK.

Trump is a goon, but I don't see him being this axis of evil-type character from a Captain America comic-book.
No, we didn't. GW Bush had been a successful two-term governor of Texas, and as the son of a President and grandson of a Senator his family had a long history of public service. Bush made some terrible misjudgments, but he made them within the range of normal political debate. Trump's contempt for the judiciary ("so-called judges") and the "fake news" media, his blatant racism, his demeaning our allies while pandering to our enemies, his undisguised corruption and his fundamental stupidity about basic matters of fact are unparalleled. No one could imagine that Bush could launch nuclear war out of pique; with Trump, we can't be sure.
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Old 30th June 2017, 06:33 PM   #47
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Originally Posted by uke2se View Post
You are conflating two things. Clinton had nothing to do with the IT security in the DNC, and there were no real revelations in the leaked material, just emails between colleagues. The very fact that it was hacked and leaked meant it could be spun into something that people who didn't really pay attention would think was bad. I mean, it was leaked, so it must mean there were bad stuff in there, mustn't it?
I agree with that, but the revelations tainted her campaign at a crucial moment and she responded poorly. Looking back it is easy to distance these things. But, at the time, there wasn't the time for reasoned responses to alter voter view points. Many just saw a privileged woman, who's campaign had distain for basic IT security, had presided over a very poor security operation in Libya, and didn't engage well with the core voters (that bit repeated by May in the UK).
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Old 30th June 2017, 06:33 PM   #48
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Originally Posted by Mikemcc View Post
The hacks were more about the released information. The timing of the releases were a sublime operation, perfectly pitched and timed. They undoubtedly affected the election, but only because there was reason for them to. Clinton was unbelievably stupid in having a private e-mail server. Her own department has an excellent IT department and a generally good record in rebuffing attacks. She basically hung herself out to dry, the risk of revelation was far higher having the private server.

It's interesting how something good (revelation of questionable activities) at the wrong time (or right time, depending on your point of view) can actually result in a much worse situation.

You can blame the person or organization who did the questionable thing that was revealed. You can blame the person or organization that did the revealing.

Or you can blame both. And you can blame them equally, or to different degrees.

I choose to distribute the blame unequally, because I feel that the timing of the revelation will result in far more "damage" than the thing that was revealed ever could.
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Old 30th June 2017, 06:41 PM   #49
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Originally Posted by Bogative View Post
....
Does she name these so-called experts in authoritarianism? Can someone help out, I can't find them listed on her blog, am I just supposed to take her word as the undeniable truth?

One of them is Masha Gessen, a Russian immigrant who knows autocracy first-hand and who is scared for America. She has expressed particular concern about how Trump and his serfs will respond to his first real crisis:
http://www.slate.com/blogs/xx_factor...dangerous.html
http://www.nybooks.com/daily/2016/11...-for-survival/
http://www.politico.com/magazine/sto...nscript-214927
http://www.newyorker.com/news/news-d...ical-prisoners
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Old 30th June 2017, 06:58 PM   #50
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Originally Posted by Mikemcc View Post
I agree with that, but the revelations tainted her campaign at a crucial moment and she responded poorly. Looking back it is easy to distance these things. But, at the time, there wasn't the time for reasoned responses to alter voter view points. Many just saw a privileged woman, who's campaign had distain for basic IT security, had presided over a very poor security operation in Libya, and didn't engage well with the core voters (that bit repeated by May in the UK).
I'm not sure how she should have responded. The DNC and Podesta were the victims of crimes, and the resulting loot was used to make various lies and insinuations about her and her campaign. The story should always have been: who were the hackers and why did they do it, but because there are so many completely unscrupulous players in various positions of authority in US (right wing) media and politics, a focus was instead kept on the nothing-burger that was the actual hacked material, and lies were spun about it. It influenced enough people. These people might or might not be incurably stupid, but they sure acted stupidly in being influenced by this obvious plot.
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Old 30th June 2017, 07:23 PM   #51
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Originally Posted by uke2se View Post
If you'd read the blog, you'd note that the bullet points all link to news articles.
No they don't. Of the first five bullet points in the blog post I linked, two of them have no links, one of them goes to the Southern Poverty Law Center, another one goes to a real news source, NBC, and the fifth one goes to a news article about a hate crime perpetrated in Trump's name that was later proved to be a completely fabricated hoax.



Quote:
You could google it. There's quite a few experts in authoritarianism that has raised the red flag over Trump's actions.
I'm not going to Google it. She made the claim, she needs to back it up by providing sources for the opinions of some mysterious authoritarianism experts that she bases her opinions off of. This is another reason why the Washington Post should not be running opinion pieces of partisans based on anonymous sources, it's nothing more than trash.



Quote:
The SPLC is somehow not a trusted source now? Too "anti-anti-semitic" for your tastes?
Why would I trust them? They made their list of Trump inspired hate crimes without using any kind of scientific standards. Some of the accounts were based on secondhand reports, they have since admitted they published several hoaxes.





Quote:
You should write an article of all the hate crimes committed against white students, and then explain how that diminishes the hate crimes committed against non-white students.
It doesn't diminish the hate crimes committed against nonwhites. However, it completely diminishes any presumptions that the SPLC is anything other than an agenda driven organization willing to omit reported bias-crimes that doesn't fit their narrative. If they were an unbiased organization, they would've published all reported crimes.



Quote:
Maybe she believes rapes in colleges is a bad thing? Or are you saying it doesn't happen?
She claims that females nationwide being grabbed by the genitals is proof of Trump's authoritarianism. She provides zero proof that it happened, much less that it increased. I'm curious to know how that could be attributed to Trump's authoritarianism if it even happened.



Quote:
Yeah, there's no difference between half and none.
What number of skipped intelligence briefings delineates normal presidential behavior and authoritarianism?



Quote:
Someone ruling by twitter decree and avoiding the press is a sign of authoritarianism.
Do you have any of the so-called experts' evidence to back up your claim?

I consider myself very fortunate, I followed Trump's twitter account for a short time but I managed to escape his authoritarianism by clicking "unfollow."



Quote:
You're not very good at it. Also, isn't infowars.com a trusted right wing news outlet now?
No more so than some chick's opinion blog.



Quote:
Maybe you could say what news articles in the blog are particularly hysterical? Nobody else seems to be able to.
You betcha: Link.



Quote:
The world is leaving your kind behind. It's a welcomed divorce.
The kind that demands more than the opinions of a Hillary Clinton supporter to prove Donald Trump is ushering in totalitarianism regime?
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Old 30th June 2017, 08:04 PM   #52
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Originally Posted by Bob001 View Post
One of them is Masha Gessen, a Russian immigrant who knows autocracy first-hand and who is scared for America. She has expressed particular concern about how Trump and his serfs will respond to his first real crisis:
http://www.slate.com/blogs/xx_factor...dangerous.html
http://www.nybooks.com/daily/2016/11...-for-survival/
http://www.politico.com/magazine/sto...nscript-214927
http://www.newyorker.com/news/news-d...ical-prisoners


Thank you for the links. I read three of the articles(the politico transcript is too long to tackle on a Friday night). She seems to make some worthwhile points that we should watch out for in the future. The problem I have is with the Washington Post linking to Siskind's blog in which she claims that the things she disagrees with Trump politically about, or even finds distasteful, is proof of authoritarianism.
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Old 30th June 2017, 10:56 PM   #53
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Originally Posted by dudalb View Post
Not silly, but I just do not see America on the verge of becoming a dictatorship.
If I wanted do I could point at how some on the left seem ok with using violence to silence their opponents,which is just as bad.
Moral equivalence is no argument; it's childish finger pointing.
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Old 30th June 2017, 11:53 PM   #54
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While I have no doubt that The Orange Hair wants to betray his country and rule as an authoritarian, all the checks and balances seem to be working. The courts remain independent, the media reports what it likes and Congress doesn't seem in the thrall of the president. All in all, I think we're okay.
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Old 1st July 2017, 12:46 AM   #55
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Originally Posted by Bogative View Post
No they don't. Of the first five bullet points in the blog post I linked, two of them have no links, one of them goes to the Southern Poverty Law Center, another one goes to a real news source, NBC, and the fifth one goes to a news article about a hate crime perpetrated in Trump's name that was later proved to be a completely fabricated hoax.
The link I posted. I don't particularly care about any links you post.


Originally Posted by Bogative View Post
I'm not going to Google it. She made the claim, she needs to back it up by providing sources for the opinions of some mysterious authoritarianism experts that she bases her opinions off of. This is another reason why the Washington Post should not be running opinion pieces of partisans based on anonymous sources, it's nothing more than trash.
She's not a poster on a forum of right wing nit-pickers. She doesn't have to prove anything to you. Either google it or wallow in ignorance.


Originally Posted by Bogative View Post
Why would I trust them? They made their list of Trump inspired hate crimes without using any kind of scientific standards. Some of the accounts were based on secondhand reports, they have since admitted they published several hoaxes.
Don't trust them then. Nobody really cares.


Originally Posted by Bogative View Post
It doesn't diminish the hate crimes committed against nonwhites. However, it completely diminishes any presumptions that the SPLC is anything other than an agenda driven organization willing to omit reported bias-crimes that doesn't fit their narrative. If they were an unbiased organization, they would've published all reported crimes.
Yes, fighting hate is agenda driven and highly biased, especially against the right.


Originally Posted by Bogative View Post
She claims that females nationwide being grabbed by the genitals is proof of Trump's authoritarianism. She provides zero proof that it happened, much less that it increased. I'm curious to know how that could be attributed to Trump's authoritarianism if it even happened.
She doesn't claim that at all. You are lying.


Originally Posted by Bogative View Post
What number of skipped intelligence briefings delineates normal presidential behavior and authoritarianism?
So half is the same as none. Got it.


Originally Posted by Bogative View Post
Do you have any of the so-called experts' evidence to back up your claim?
Google it.

Originally Posted by Bogative View Post
I consider myself very fortunate, I followed Trump's twitter account for a short time but I managed to escape his authoritarianism by clicking "unfollow."
No, you haven't. He's your president.


Originally Posted by Bogative View Post
No more so than some chick's opinion blog.
I'd say quite a lot more so. Alex Jones is pally with your president, and the useful idiots that voted for Trump seems to enjoy infowars quite a bit.



Originally Posted by Bogative View Post
You betcha: Link.
Reporting on this blog is what's hysterical? How very meta.
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Old 1st July 2017, 12:47 AM   #56
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Originally Posted by Bogative View Post
Thank you for the links. I read three of the articles(the politico transcript is too long to tackle on a Friday night). She seems to make some worthwhile points that we should watch out for in the future.
So we shouldn't be watching for them now, is that what you're saying?
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Old 1st July 2017, 12:50 AM   #57
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Originally Posted by Craig4 View Post
While I have no doubt that The Orange Hair wants to betray his country and rule as an authoritarian, all the checks and balances seem to be working. The courts remain independent, the media reports what it likes and Congress doesn't seem in the thrall of the president. All in all, I think we're okay.
I see it very differently. Trump is in a position to stack lower courts with appointees vetted by the Federalist Society, and there's a good chance that he'll get to nominate one or two more SC judges before he's ousted. The media is under full assault by Trump and his drones, including the right wing media. Congress might hem and haw but they have done exactly nothing at all to curtail Trump's excesses.
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Old 1st July 2017, 03:09 AM   #58
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Originally Posted by Bob001 View Post
One of them is Masha Gessen, a Russian immigrant who knows autocracy first-hand and who is scared for America. She has expressed particular concern about how Trump and his serfs will respond to his first real crisis:
http://www.slate.com/blogs/xx_factor...dangerous.html
http://www.nybooks.com/daily/2016/11...-for-survival/
http://www.politico.com/magazine/sto...nscript-214927
http://www.newyorker.com/news/news-d...ical-prisoners
Knows autocracy first hand?
She moved to New York in 1981 when she was 14.
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Old 1st July 2017, 03:11 AM   #59
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Originally Posted by Beerina View Post
Wake me up when journalists start mysteriously, and not-so-mysteriously, dying, powerful opposition are railroaded into jail on minor or made-up charges, and a military helicopter attacks the Supreme Court who suspended the legislature to take it over themselves, then reversed themselves when they realized they went too far.


Isn't it a bit late by then?
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Old 1st July 2017, 04:47 AM   #60
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Originally Posted by Beerina View Post
Wake me up when journalists start mysteriously, and not-so-mysteriously, dying, powerful opposition are railroaded into jail on minor or made-up charges, and a military helicopter attacks the Supreme Court who suspended the legislature to take it over themselves, then reversed themselves when they realized they went too far.
Originally Posted by quadraginta View Post
Be a little late by then, wouldn't it?
Originally Posted by 3point14 View Post
Isn't it a bit late by then?

Maybe not for Beerina? That may be an outcome he desires and doesn't want to miss, which is why he's choosing to sleep until it occurs.

But seriously... Beerina's attitude is exactly like saying, "I refuse to do anything to improve my health until I have a heart attack."
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Old 1st July 2017, 07:08 AM   #61
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Originally Posted by uke2se View Post
Situation now is very different from when Bush was president.

Do you think him trying and failing to implement laws that go against US values (well, human values really) is an ok state of being, and that speaking up against it is being breathlessly hysterical?
I don't think speaking against any perceived wrong-doing is in any way hysterical, unless you're doing something truly ridiculous in your attempt to speak out, like some freedom-fighter.

That said, I honestly don't see this major meltdown. As others have stated, Trump trying to get things done, and Trump actually getting things done, are two different beasts entirely.

The world was buggered lonnnnng before Trump and it'll be buggered lonnnng after Trump. Same ****, different generation, imo.
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Old 1st July 2017, 07:15 AM   #62
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Originally Posted by Bob001 View Post
No, we didn't. GW Bush had been a successful two-term governor of Texas, and as the son of a President and grandson of a Senator his family had a long history of public service. Bush made some terrible misjudgments, but he made them within the range of normal political debate. Trump's contempt for the judiciary ("so-called judges") and the "fake news" media, his blatant racism, his demeaning our allies while pandering to our enemies, his undisguised corruption and his fundamental stupidity about basic matters of fact are unparalleled. No one could imagine that Bush could launch nuclear war out of pique; with Trump, we can't be sure.
The world was up in arms about Bush at the time, lol. You don't remember the massive outcry against him and Blair for all of their perceived wrongdoings? The "Not My President" t-shirts? Same ****, different day.

Everyone assumed the world was going to hell in a hand-basket when Bush was reigning supreme...Yet here we are, surviving. No doubt when Vince Mcmahon, of WWE fame, gets into office, you'll be wishing you still had Donald Flump.
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Old 1st July 2017, 07:34 AM   #63
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Originally Posted by Gilbert Syndrome View Post
The world was up in arms about Bush at the time, lol. You don't remember the massive outcry against him and Blair for all of their perceived wrongdoings? The "Not My President" t-shirts? Same ****, different day.

Everyone assumed the world was going to hell in a hand-basket when Bush was reigning supreme...Yet here we are, surviving. No doubt when Vince Mcmahon, of WWE fame, gets into office, you'll be wishing you still had Donald Flump.
You did have two wars and tens of thousands (hundreds of thousands, if not millions if you count civillian casualties) dead and wounded, and a severely damaged economy. But sure, the world didn't end. Seems like a low bar, but YMMV.

The situation now is still different, though. Bush wasn't mounting an all out assault on the concept of separation of power and the free press. Trump is.
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Old 1st July 2017, 07:38 AM   #64
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Originally Posted by uke2se View Post
You did have two wars and tens of thousands (hundreds of thousands, if not millions if you count civillian casualties) dead and wounded, and a severely damaged economy. But sure, the world didn't end. Seems like a low bar, but YMMV.

The situation now is still different, though. Bush wasn't mounting an all out assault on the concept of separation of power and the free press. Trump is.
The Iraq War also destabilized the region. There'd be no ISIS without it. The Bush/Blair alliance did significant damage to the world at large. If your going to compare everything to the end of the world then we're always doing better but that's a super low bar to set.
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Old 1st July 2017, 07:57 AM   #65
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Originally Posted by uke2se View Post
You did have two wars and tens of thousands (hundreds of thousands, if not millions if you count civillian casualties) dead and wounded, and a severely damaged economy. But sure, the world didn't end. Seems like a low bar, but YMMV.

The situation now is still different, though. Bush wasn't mounting an all out assault on the concept of separation of power and the free press. Trump is.
I don't think either is better or worse, really. I think Bush was as crooked as they come, and so is Trump. Imho, anyone who's getting into office is going to be crooked, which is why I don't concern myself with it.

Bush/Blair were horrendous bastards, and we can go back in history and see a trend of other horrendous bastards. Trump, imho, is merely yet another of many horrendous bastards, and no doubt there'll be more to come after him.

I get the worry, as we live in worrying times, but so did our parents, and their parents, and their parents parents. We hope our children won't have to live in worrying times, but I don't need a magic 8-ball to predict that they likely will.
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Old 1st July 2017, 08:03 AM   #66
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Originally Posted by Gilbert Syndrome View Post
I don't think either is better or worse, really. I think Bush was as crooked as they come, and so is Trump. Imho, anyone who's getting into office is going to be crooked, which is why I don't concern myself with it.

Bush/Blair were horrendous bastards, and we can go back in history and see a trend of other horrendous bastards. Trump, imho, is merely yet another of many horrendous bastards, and no doubt there'll be more to come after him.

I get the worry, as we live in worrying times, but so did our parents, and their parents, and their parents parents. We hope our children won't have to live in worrying times, but I don't need a magic 8-ball to predict that they likely will.
Yeah, things will be bad in the future as well, especially if people keep voting in people like Trump. You are missing my point though. The situation now is unlike any situation before, because what Trump and his cronies are doing is to attack the democratic institutions in the US. The closest we really get is Nixon, but even he had a lot of respect for democratic institutions. Trump has no such respect, and his cronies seem to a large extent be dead set on dismantling the checks and balances that exist to prevent them from instituting their agenda.

The 2016 elections were unfair - with massive foreign influence on top of gerrymandered districts and voter surpression. Future elections stand to be even less fair unless the GOP agenda is stopped pretty much immediately.
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Old 1st July 2017, 08:19 AM   #67
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Originally Posted by Stacko View Post
The Iraq War also destabilized the region. There'd be no ISIS without it. The Bush/Blair alliance did significant damage to the world at large. If your going to compare everything to the end of the world then we're always doing better but that's a super low bar to set.
And let's not forget the chaos Bush left behind in Lybia.
Or was that Clinton liberating syria, "We came we saw he died"-style?

I have come to the conclusion that I prefer republicans in the white house. Foreign policy doesn't change, but at least when a republican does it it gets protested.
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Old 1st July 2017, 08:27 AM   #68
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I doubt that I am the only one here olde enough to remember the rumors that Nixon was going to declare himself KING!.

But the threat I see today is from the other side, remaking America into something many think is Un-American.

Choose your rumors.
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Old 1st July 2017, 08:47 AM   #69
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Originally Posted by casebro View Post
I doubt that I am the only one here olde enough to remember the rumors that Nixon was going to declare himself KING!.

But the threat I see today is from the other side, remaking America into something many think is Un-American.

Choose your rumors.
There are none so blind as those who will not see.

And we don't have to rely on rumors about Trump.
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Old 1st July 2017, 10:11 AM   #70
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Originally Posted by magellan View Post
Knows autocracy first hand?
She moved to New York in 1981 when she was 14.
Yeah, she spent her childhood in Soviet Moscow, and she returned to work in Moscow as an adult for many years. She returned to the U.S. after butting heads with the government too many times.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Masha_Gessen
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Old 1st July 2017, 11:15 AM   #71
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Originally Posted by Bob001 View Post
Yeah, she spent her childhood in Soviet Moscow, and she returned to work in Moscow as an adult for many years. She returned to the U.S. after butting heads with the government too many times.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Masha_Gessen
Yes. And one might argue how "first hand" your experience of a government is up to the age of 14. I am fairly certain though that she wasn't allowed to vote or be elected when she was in the Soviet Union.

But as a former director for radio liberty she sure has first hand exprience in distributing propaganda.
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Old 1st July 2017, 12:47 PM   #72
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Originally Posted by uke2se View Post
Yeah, things will be bad in the future as well, especially if people keep voting in people like Trump. You are missing my point though. The situation now is unlike any situation before, because what Trump and his cronies are doing is to attack the democratic institutions in the US. The closest we really get is Nixon, but even he had a lot of respect for democratic institutions. Trump has no such respect, and his cronies seem to a large extent be dead set on dismantling the checks and balances that exist to prevent them from instituting their agenda.

The 2016 elections were unfair - with massive foreign influence on top of gerrymandered districts and voter surpression. Future elections stand to be even less fair unless the GOP agenda is stopped pretty much immediately.

I agree with GilbertSyndrome. Everyone thinks their generation has/had it tougher. The hysteria these days is at fever pitch, largely due to the press.

The country is full of spoiled whiny brats, of course they are going to think this is doomsday. I don't think I've ever used the term 'snowflake" but ya, that fits in this situation.

I'm concerned about the government, but then I always am. It's like the boy who cried wolf. Quit crying so gawdamn much and maybe people will actually listen. I'm really tired of sorting through the noise. I've never seen so much crying in my life, and the whole "end of the world" thing is no surprise when you consider the coddling PC movement.

"Oh my gawd Trump is dismantling the government, Hitler doom!" Never seen so much over the top silliness in my life.

Last edited by mgidm86; 1st July 2017 at 12:49 PM.
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Old 1st July 2017, 01:29 PM   #73
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I remember a former poster on the JREF saying that Bush (W) was going to end democracy in the USA. Now folks are crying wolf again.

Sad.
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Old 1st July 2017, 02:00 PM   #74
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Originally Posted by uke2se View Post
She's not a poster on a forum of right wing nit-pickers. She doesn't have to prove anything to you. Either google it or wallow in ignorance.
Exactly right, she's not a poster on a right-wing forum, she's someone given credibility by the Washington Post. She does behave like Alex Jones when she says that secret, anonymous experts say authoritarianism is running rife in the political system. You know who else says to "Google it" on a regular basis instead of providing direct sources? Alex Jones.




Quote:
Yes, fighting hate is agenda driven and highly biased, especially against the right.
The SPLC has such high standards of who and what they put on their extremist list that the far right wing extremist group change.org had to get behind a petition to force them to remove two people from the list anti-Muslim extremists. https://www.change.org/p/southern-po...lim-extremists




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She doesn't claim that at all. You are lying.
It's obvious you don't care about the links I post, Siskind claims that (unattributed) reports of genital grabbing is proof of Trump's authoritarianism in her blog.




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Siskind set the standard, not me.




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Google it.
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Old 1st July 2017, 02:20 PM   #75
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Originally Posted by casebro View Post
I doubt that I am the only one here olde enough to remember the rumors that Nixon was going to declare himself KING!.

I'm not old enough to remember Nixon, but I am old enough to remember nutty Christian doomsday preachers claiming that the next president of the United States was going to be the antichrist after George HW Bush's "New World Order" speech. I also remember claims that George W. Bush was going to launch a nuclear war against Iran and appoint himself dictator. I also remember when Obama was going to assassinate Trump and appoint himself to a third term.

The difference between now and then is I had to get that information from shortwave radio and conspiracy websites, now I can just go to the Washington Post instead.
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Old 1st July 2017, 02:24 PM   #76
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Originally Posted by mgidm86 View Post
I agree with GilbertSyndrome. Everyone thinks their generation has/had it tougher.
You're wrong. It may not be worse, but the situation today is unlike any before. Nobody knows how it will turn out because we haven't been here before.

But if we are just talking about 'tougher', compared to past generations we have never had it so good. Some us believe that we can continue to improve, but many want to return to the bad old days when things were tougher. I hope we can prevent that, but the ways things are going...

Quote:
I don't think I've ever used the term 'snowflake" but ya, that fits in this situation.
'snowflake'? Deplorable.
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Old 1st July 2017, 03:52 PM   #77
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Originally Posted by magellan View Post
Yes. And one might argue how "first hand" your experience of a government is up to the age of 14. I am fairly certain though that she wasn't allowed to vote or be elected when she was in the Soviet Union.

But as a former director for radio liberty she sure has first hand exprience in distributing propaganda.
So where do you think she is wrong in her assessments?
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Old 1st July 2017, 04:17 PM   #78
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Originally Posted by casebro View Post
I doubt that I am the only one here olde enough to remember the rumors that Nixon was going to declare himself KING!.
You must have moved in some peculiar circles.

Are you quite sure you don't remember hearing reports that other people were spreading and beleiving rumours that Nixon was going to declare himself King?

Are you at all sure that your perception of what those other people think isn't based on report rather than experience?
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Old 1st July 2017, 04:23 PM   #79
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Originally Posted by uke2se View Post
There are none so blind as those who will not see.

And we don't have to rely on rumors about Trump.
Trump is up-front, you have to give him that.

Sidebar : do you remember hearing rumours that Nixon was going to declare himself King? Are you old enough? I am, and was paying attention at the time, and do not share casebro's recollection.
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Old 1st July 2017, 04:33 PM   #80
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Originally Posted by Bob001 View Post
So where do you think she is wrong in her assessments?
That's not the point being made : her involvement with Radio Liberty brings her objection to propaganda per se into question.
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