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Old 5th August 2019, 12:13 PM   #1001
Captain_Swoop
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Originally Posted by Dr.Sid View Post
This howerboard can go several miles across or thousands feet up. Are you sure the ladder can do the same ?
One board per man is a lot of boards, not exactly stealthy approach, very visible and vulnerable target when they fly up in to the air. Very vulnerable when they land and have to unstrap themselves before they can start to fight.
How much training is required to fly one of these things with any degree of precision or reliability?

They are a gimmick
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Old 5th August 2019, 12:20 PM   #1002
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Originally Posted by Captain_Swoop View Post
One board per man is a lot of boards, not exactly stealthy approach, very visible and vulnerable target when they fly up in to the air. Very vulnerable when they land and have to unstrap themselves before they can start to fight.
How much training is required to fly one of these things with any degree of precision or reliability?

They are a gimmick
A cool gimmick, but yes.

Iron Man works because he has a seemingly infinite amount of fuel, a massive thrust to weight ratio, literally incredible armour, and amazing weapons.
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Old 5th August 2019, 12:50 PM   #1003
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So basically you're saying 'it's not worth pursuing, nothing useful can come from it, like, ever' ? Wow.
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Old 5th August 2019, 12:59 PM   #1004
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Originally Posted by Dr.Sid View Post
So basically you're saying 'it's not worth pursuing, nothing useful can come from it, like, ever' ? Wow.
I'm sure there are limited potential uses, and it is cool.

But there are probably cheaper ways of increasing the effectiveness of infantry.

On a battlefield, the lightly-armoured flying infantry would be competing against helicopters, drones, and aircraft - and people are often concerned about the surviability of helicopters in contested airspace, let alone something like this.


Outside a battlefield - what is the point?
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link is 2015 data (2013 Data below):
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US 16.4% of GDP of which 48.2% is public expenditure - 7.9% of GDP is public spending
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Old 5th August 2019, 01:26 PM   #1005
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Originally Posted by jimbob View Post
I'm sure there are limited potential uses, and it is cool.

But there are probably cheaper ways of increasing the effectiveness of infantry.

On a battlefield, the lightly-armoured flying infantry would be competing against helicopters, drones, and aircraft - and people are often concerned about the surviability of helicopters in contested airspace, let alone something like this.


Outside a battlefield - what is the point?
EMT services in rough terrain?

I dunno. Maybe places without a lot of infrastructure, where you can afford to strap one to the top of your Ambulance-Ute, and rapidly cross difficult obstacles to provide immediate care to people in need.

"I can't drive there, and the nearest helicopter is six hundred miles away, but this here flyboard gets me across the river *right now*."
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Old 5th August 2019, 01:28 PM   #1006
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
EMT services in rough terrain?

I dunno. Maybe places without a lot of infrastructure, where you can afford to strap one to the top of your Ambulance-Ute, and rapidly cross difficult obstacles to provide immediate care to people in need.
Now that might be something...if it's larger. A hover stretcher rather than board. Could see where that might be useful in some circumstances.
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Old 5th August 2019, 01:33 PM   #1007
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
EMT services in rough terrain?

I dunno. Maybe places without a lot of infrastructure, where you can afford to strap one to the top of your Ambulance-Ute, and rapidly cross difficult obstacles to provide immediate care to people in need.

"I can't drive there, and the nearest helicopter is six hundred miles away, but this here flyboard gets me across the river *right now*."
Oh, Civilian uses, yes.

Military ones, not so much.
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link is 2015 data (2013 Data below):
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US 16.4% of GDP of which 48.2% is public expenditure - 7.9% of GDP is public spending
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Old 5th August 2019, 01:41 PM   #1008
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Originally Posted by jimbob View Post
Oh, Civilian uses, yes.

Military ones, not so much.
Yeah. Though, maybe. Powered exoskeletons seem like they'd have a lot of military applications in the rear, in supply depots and motor pools. So perhaps flyboards might find similar use in streamlining or easing the manual effort in certain support roles. Though I can't think of any offhand.
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Old 5th August 2019, 02:34 PM   #1009
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Originally Posted by Dr.Sid View Post
So basically you're saying 'it's not worth pursuing, nothing useful can come from it, like, ever' ? Wow.
Where was that claimed?
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Old 5th August 2019, 02:42 PM   #1010
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Originally Posted by Captain_Swoop View Post
Where was that claimed?
So you are claiming you haven't claimed that ? Wow.
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Old 5th August 2019, 03:23 PM   #1011
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Originally Posted by Dr.Sid View Post
So you are claiming you haven't claimed that ? Wow.
It is objectively true that Captain_Swoop has not made that claim anywhere in this thread.
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Old 5th August 2019, 03:36 PM   #1012
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It's a solution looking for a problem.

At the moment, it can carry one highly trained pilot around ten miles, or 5 miles out and back. They just need to think of something really valuable for him to do when he gets there with no equipment.
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Old 5th August 2019, 03:38 PM   #1013
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Originally Posted by Jack by the hedge View Post
It's a solution looking for a problem.

At the moment, it can carry one highly trained pilot around ten miles, or 5 miles out and back. They just need to think of something really valuable for him to do when he gets there with no equipment.
Send him out two miles with a nuclear demolition charge.
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Old 5th August 2019, 03:39 PM   #1014
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Originally Posted by Dr.Sid View Post
So you are claiming you haven't claimed that ? Wow.
You know what might be more fun than breaking Swoop's balls?

Helping us brainstorm practical applications of the flyboard concept.
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Old 5th August 2019, 03:45 PM   #1015
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Originally Posted by Dr.Sid View Post
So you are claiming you haven't claimed that ? Wow.
I don't think they are a any use to the infantry. I never claimed they aren't any use at all.
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Old 5th August 2019, 03:56 PM   #1016
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Send him out two miles with a nuclear demolition charge.
If the nuke weighs less than 4 gallons of kerosene and your highly trained pilot is okay with suicide missions, perhaps. Maybe better off redesigning a flyboard air into a drone and getting rid of the heavy human pilot altogether.
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Old 5th August 2019, 04:40 PM   #1017
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Originally Posted by Jack by the hedge View Post
It's a solution looking for a problem.

At the moment, it can carry one highly trained pilot around ten miles, or 5 miles out and back. They just need to think of something really valuable for him to do when he gets there with no equipment.
Don't forget you need a special platform to take off from. I guess you may be able to land without a platform - though I've never seen Franky do that yet. Maybe the production version of the flyboard will be able to carry the extra weight of some three-foot long extendable telescopic legs. And I guess you might need a ladder anyway to climb up onto it once it's in its launch configuration given that you'll be wearing the awkward backpack containing the fuel and you'll need to reach down to connect the fuel and control umbilicals.
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Old 5th August 2019, 04:45 PM   #1018
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Are people still falling for this balderdash?
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Old 5th August 2019, 05:47 PM   #1019
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Originally Posted by Jack by the hedge View Post
If the nuke weighs less than 4 gallons of kerosene and your highly trained pilot is okay with suicide missions, perhaps. Maybe better off redesigning a flyboard air into a drone and getting rid of the heavy human pilot altogether.
I haven't done the math. I'm just thinking, broadly, reduce the range to increase the payload. It also doesn't necessarily have to be exactly the specs of this prototype. If the military (for example) did see value in it, they'd probably fund a much more efficient version.

Anyway, the smaller 'tactical' nukes can be deployed nearby without being a suicide mission. Put a hill between you and it and you're pretty safe.
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Old 6th August 2019, 05:08 AM   #1020
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Well, nukes that small can be artillery delivered, which is faster, cheaper, repeatable, and longer ranged. Hard to see a niche where a hover board would be the answer :/


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Old 6th August 2019, 05:29 AM   #1021
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Originally Posted by ceptimus View Post
Don't forget you need a special platform to take off from. I guess you may be able to land without a platform - though I've never seen Franky do that yet. Maybe the production version of the flyboard will be able to carry the extra weight of some three-foot long extendable telescopic legs. And I guess you might need a ladder anyway to climb up onto it once it's in its launch configuration given that you'll be wearing the awkward backpack containing the fuel and you'll need to reach down to connect the fuel and control umbilicals.
If I were to guess, a major reason for the landing platform may be to stop the engines from sucking in the cloud of dust and grit thrown up by the downblast. As I recall, the platform is usually a raised, open grid, which might also mean that landing on a solid flat surface is harder. Maybe a cushion of exhaust gases builds up below it near the ground, so when thrust is reduced to descend gradually, the board doesn't drop neatly all the way to the ground.
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Old 6th August 2019, 05:37 AM   #1022
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Originally Posted by Hellbound View Post
Well, nukes that small can be artillery delivered, which is faster, cheaper, repeatable, and longer ranged. Hard to see a niche where a hover board would be the answer :/
I think it would probably turn out that the weapon would be more likely to arrive at its target when fired from a gun rather than couriered there by a guy on a hoverboard. And that's just taking into account the board's likelihood of crashing. Presuming there are enemies opposed to your plan to deliver a nuke, one guy with a rifle, and a similar degree or training to use it as your flyboard guy has to use that, would put paid to your plan pretty swiftly.
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Old 6th August 2019, 05:43 AM   #1023
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Just by the way, in trying to Google how much fuel the Flyboard Air uses, I ran into a claim that its design abides by "FAA ultralight reg 14 CFR part 103" and this limits its fuel capacity to 5 gallons.

I haven't yet tracked that claim down to find the actual rule but it's possible that the cross-channel run required a refuelling stop not because of the board's inability to lift enough weight, but because regulation prevents it from carrying enough fuel.
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Old 6th August 2019, 06:27 AM   #1024
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Originally Posted by Jack by the hedge View Post
If I were to guess, a major reason for the landing platform may be to stop the engines from sucking in the cloud of dust and grit thrown up by the downblast. As I recall, the platform is usually a raised, open grid, which might also mean that landing on a solid flat surface is harder. Maybe a cushion of exhaust gases builds up below it near the ground, so when thrust is reduced to descend gradually, the board doesn't drop neatly all the way to the ground.
It's probably mostly to stop the engines sucking in debris as you say - but perhaps it's also more difficult for Franky to control the board when the engines are operating in a "ground effect" mode. If it were just the dust/debris thing then you'd expect Franky to take off and land from a hard paved surface that was brushed/washed clean prior to starting the engines - why would the team bother with the hassle and cost of transporting and setting up the take off/landing platform unless it's providing some really significant benefit?

I have a model plane with a jet turbine, and the exhaust gases are really hot - so maybe they wouldn't want to start up the engines directly above some paved surfaces even if they were clean - the surface would probably begin to melt after a few seconds. I suppose a concrete surface wouldn't melt but perhaps it might crack? Also an engine might flame out or suffer some other problems if the jet exhaust is too close to the ground and so creating more back pressure on the exhaust than the engine normally experiences.

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Old 6th August 2019, 06:30 AM   #1025
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Originally Posted by Hellbound View Post
Well, nukes that small can be artillery delivered, which is faster, cheaper, repeatable, and longer ranged. Hard to see a niche where a hover board would be the answer :/


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Good point.
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Old 6th August 2019, 04:57 PM   #1026
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Originally Posted by Jack by the hedge View Post
If I were to guess, a major reason for the landing platform may be to stop the engines from sucking in the cloud of dust and grit thrown up by the downblast. As I recall, the platform is usually a raised, open grid, which might also mean that landing on a solid flat surface is harder. Maybe a cushion of exhaust gases builds up below it near the ground, so when thrust is reduced to descend gradually, the board doesn't drop neatly all the way to the ground.
Oh yeah, ground effect can be a real bitch. Among other things, there's the possibility of the high-pressure region acting like a big ball, making keeping your balance even harder.
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Old 6th August 2019, 05:47 PM   #1027
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Originally Posted by WhatRoughBeast View Post
Oh yeah, ground effect can be a real bitch. Among other things, there's the possibility of the high-pressure region acting like a big ball, making keeping your balance even harder.
What I've seen he has special platform with grating for the floor he uses for take-offs and landings. But that was the old videos, not sure if solved the issue somehow. That's where the old style jetpack had certain advantage.
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Old 7th August 2019, 11:13 PM   #1028
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I'll bet that Hollywood is trying to squeeze scenes with something like the Flyboard into every upcoming action movie.
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Old 8th August 2019, 12:44 AM   #1029
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Whenever I see these things demonstrated, it's always over water, it seems.

I think using over land except for a trained stuntman maybe and being careful to never go very high off the ground, is probably not very safe. Over water is safer in case of a fall.
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Old 8th August 2019, 01:52 AM   #1030
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Franky's performance at Bastille Day was not over water.
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Old 8th August 2019, 07:40 AM   #1031
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And if you're going 100mph over water, or more than about ten metres above the water, that's not safe either. For his early tests, Franky stayed relatively low and relatively slow over water, and a rescue team used to follow him as best they could using jet skis or a motor boat. An engine failure wouldn't have threatened his life then except perhaps by drowning. He's obviously much more confident in his invention now: the way he's currently flying it, a major failure would most likely kill him or very seriously injure him. I know that there's supposed to be some redundancy - the board can apparently stay airborne with one motor out. But if he ran out of fuel when flying fast or high, or a fuel line became detached, or the turbine/compressor on one motor threw a blade that went through one or more of the other motors, or his throttle control system failed, or for many other failure modes, then he'd be in big trouble.

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Old 8th August 2019, 03:02 PM   #1032
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Originally Posted by jimbob View Post
A cool gimmick, but yes.

Iron Man works because he has a seemingly infinite amount of fuel, a massive thrust to weight ratio, literally incredible armour, and amazing weapons.
Iron Man works because we practice a willing suspension of disbelief.
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Old 11th August 2019, 04:52 AM   #1033
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https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/...second-attempt

Quote:
Franky Zapata crosses Channel by hoverboard at second attempt
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Old 13th August 2019, 02:32 PM   #1034
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Originally Posted by Steve001 View Post
Iron Man works because we practice a willing suspension of disbelief.
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Old 13th August 2019, 03:45 PM   #1035
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"Real". It's a cosplay skin on a completely different and much less advanced flying machine. Iron man? More like iron pander.
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