ISF Logo   IS Forum
Forum Index Register Members List Events Mark Forums Read Help

Go Back   International Skeptics Forum » General Topics » Social Issues & Current Events
 


Welcome to the International Skeptics Forum, where we discuss skepticism, critical thinking, the paranormal and science in a friendly but lively way. You are currently viewing the forum as a guest, which means you are missing out on discussing matters that are of interest to you. Please consider registering so you can gain full use of the forum features and interact with other Members. Registration is simple, fast and free! Click here to register today.
Tags Florida incidents , school incidents , school shootings , shooting incidents

Reply
Old 16th July 2018, 04:13 AM   #281
smartcooky
Penultimate Amazing
 
smartcooky's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Nelson, New Zealand
Posts: 11,632
Originally Posted by Aridas View Post
This is somewhat tangential, but... arming 3 year olds is a great idea, right?

Sacha Baron Cohen and a bunch of Republicans, including Congresspeople, talk on the subject.
Originally Posted by Nessie View Post
The ease at which those people agree it is a good idea to arm children, is more evidence that too many Americans really do think the gun is the answer, not the problem.


Already a thread on this

http://www.internationalskeptics.com...d.php?t=330792
__________________
#THEYAREUS
The Mueller Report must be released to Congress in full - If Trump has nothing to hide, then he should also have nothing to fear!
smartcooky is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 16th July 2018, 09:15 AM   #282
Aridas
Crazy Little Green Dragon
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 5,077
Originally Posted by smartcooky View Post
Thank you, I hadn't seen that thread yet.
__________________
So sayeth the crazy little dragon.
Aridas is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 18th July 2018, 03:32 PM   #283
Captain_Swoop
Penultimate Amazing
 
Captain_Swoop's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 20,662
Arizona Senate candidate who killed his mother supports 'good guys' with guns

Wilson, one of two Republican candidates who attended the July 9 meeting, took the mic and told a story of how he shot and killed a crazed attacker in an act of self-defense while a teenager.

That attacker, it turned out, was his mother.

He was charged with the murder of his mother and sister, and soon after his arrest he confessed to those charges. He later recanted his confession and claimed he had amnesia about the events of the night in question.

He said his life story illustrates the importance of having "a good guy there with a gun" rather than gun-control legislation.

https://eu.azcentral.com/story/news/...her/790288002/
Captain_Swoop is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 19th July 2018, 05:15 PM   #284
autumn1971
Master Poster
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 2,731
Originally Posted by Captain_Swoop View Post
Arizona Senate candidate who killed his mother supports 'good guys' with guns

Wilson, one of two Republican candidates who attended the July 9 meeting, took the mic and told a story of how he shot and killed a crazed attacker in an act of self-defense while a teenager.

That attacker, it turned out, was his mother.

He was charged with the murder of his mother and sister, and soon after his arrest he confessed to those charges. He later recanted his confession and claimed he had amnesia about the events of the night in question.

He said his life story illustrates the importance of having "a good guy there with a gun" rather than gun-control legislation.

https://eu.azcentral.com/story/news/...her/790288002/
That is the most bizarre story I've heard in quite some time.
__________________
'A knave; a rascal; an eater of broken meats; a base, proud, shallow, beggardly, three-suited, hundred-pound, filthy, worsted-stocking knave; a lily-livered, action-taking knave, a whoreson, glass-gazing, superservicable, finical rogue;... the son and heir of a mongral bitch: one whom I will beat into clamorous whining, if thou deniest the least syllable of thy addition."'
-The Bard
autumn1971 is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 19th July 2018, 05:27 PM   #285
Captain_Swoop
Penultimate Amazing
 
Captain_Swoop's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 20,662
Shot his mother through the eye, smashed his sister's skull, burned the house down and buried the rifle.
Captain_Swoop is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 19th July 2018, 08:38 PM   #286
bruto
Penultimate Amazing
 
bruto's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Way way north of Diddy Wah Diddy
Posts: 24,025
So presumably he's going to run for Senate to provide further proof that a good guy with a gun should have shot him before?
__________________
I love this world, but not for its answers. (Mary Oliver)

Quand il dit "cuic" le moineau croit tout dire. (When he's tweeted the sparrow thinks he's said it all. (Jules Renard)
bruto is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 26th July 2018, 01:19 PM   #287
ponderingturtle
Orthogonal Vector
 
ponderingturtle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 46,417
Originally Posted by Captain_Swoop View Post
Shot his mother through the eye, smashed his sister's skull, burned the house down and buried the rifle.
As all good guys with guns do.
__________________
Sufficiently advanced Woo is indistinguishable from Parody
"There shall be no *poofing* in science" Paul C. Anagnostopoulos
Force ***** on reasons back" Ben Franklin
ponderingturtle is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 2nd August 2018, 10:11 AM   #288
crescent
Illuminator
 
crescent's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 3,002
The Stoneman-Douglas shooting resulted in a many younger people getting involved with gun control - the "Never Again" movement is very strongly youth focused, for example. March for Out Lives (the marches that occurred this past spring) and Never Again are closely connected.

They had a rally (March on the NRA) planned here in Denver, on this upcoming Saturday. Then this happened:

Threats cause student activists to reconsider Denver March on NRA this Saturday

Quote:
“We’ve had some bumps in the road,” Mikaela Lawrence, an incoming senior at Columbine High School said Tuesday before students decided the threats were too serious to ignore. “Just normal stuff like threats, but I think we’re going to be OK.”
Not clear from the article if the threat quoted in the article was the only threat or not.
crescent is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 2nd August 2018, 12:34 PM   #289
quadraginta
Becoming Beth
 
quadraginta's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Central Vale of Humility
Posts: 23,454
Originally Posted by crescent View Post
The Stoneman-Douglas shooting resulted in a many younger people getting involved with gun control - the "Never Again" movement is very strongly youth focused, for example. March for Out Lives (the marches that occurred this past spring) and Never Again are closely connected.

They had a rally (March on the NRA) planned here in Denver, on this upcoming Saturday. Then this happened:

Threats cause student activists to reconsider Denver March on NRA this Saturday

Quote:
“We’ve had some bumps in the road,” Mikaela Lawrence, an incoming senior at Columbine High School said Tuesday before students decided the threats were too serious to ignore. “Just normal stuff like threats, but I think we’re going to be OK.”
Not clear from the article if the threat quoted in the article was the only threat or not.

The saddest thing about that is a high school senior casually saying something like, “Just normal stuff like threats,".
__________________
"A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep."
quadraginta is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 2nd August 2018, 12:43 PM   #290
crescent
Illuminator
 
crescent's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 3,002
An update already: The march is still on:

“We will not be bullied into fear”: Denver’s March on NRA protest will continue Saturday, student activist says

Quote:
Denver’s March on the NRA protest organized by students is still planned for Saturday afternoon despite a group of young activists pulling out because of violent threats they received.

The local gun-control advocacy group Students Demand Action pulled their affiliation with the protest Wednesday night after a Tuesday night discussion about how to handle online violent threats the teens were receiving.

Ethan Somers, an 18-year-old activist from Evergreen, wanted to assure the community that the protest will continue.

“Every time we plan to stand up for students there is always a group or someone who thinks it is OK to threaten innocent lives,” Somers wrote in a statement. “There were talks of what do we do for all scenarios and one was to cancel the march/rally, however we will not be bullied into fear.”
I looks as if one of the organizing groups has pulled out, but the remaining groups are still going forward.
crescent is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 10th August 2018, 04:51 AM   #291
LTC8K6
Penultimate Amazing
 
LTC8K6's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Directly under a deadly chemtrail
Posts: 21,406
Has the reloading and the 6 (actually 5) shot magazines been mentioned before? I think I heard this before, but I could not find confirmation.

https://twitter.com/PatriciaMazzei/s...69437497409537
__________________
What a fool believes, no wise man has the power to reason away. What seems to be, is always better than nothing.

2 prints, same midtarsal crock..., I mean break?
LTC8K6 is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 31st December 2018, 06:39 AM   #292
Squeegee Beckenheim
Penultimate Amazing
 
Squeegee Beckenheim's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 24,228
Louis CK has decided that the way to come back after admitting to being a serial sexual assaulter is to mock Parkland survivors, as well as LGBT+ people, and children with developmental disabilities
__________________
I don't trust atoms. They make up everything.
Squeegee Beckenheim is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 1st January 2019, 11:31 AM   #293
Checkmite
Skepticifimisticalationist
 
Checkmite's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Gulf Coast
Posts: 23,723
Originally Posted by Squeegee Beckenheim View Post
I guess since being a sexual predator lost him the young-liberal crowd he previously tried to pander to, he's decided to try out the MAGA set. If anything, those folks have demonstrated repeatedly that as long as you say things they like they'll stick by you literally no matter what.
__________________
"¿WHAT KIND OF BIRD?
¿A PARANORMAL BIRD?"
--- Carlos S., 2002
Checkmite is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 4th June 2019, 07:09 PM   #294
AJM8125
Potsing Whiled Runk
Tagger
 
AJM8125's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 20,437
Bump.

Deputy Scot Petersen charged with 11 counts of child neglect, culpable negligence and perjury.

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/06/04/u...-peterson.html

Quote:
“I have no comment except to say rot in hell,” Fred Guttenberg, who emerged as an outspoken gun control activist after his daughter, Jaime, died in the attack, wrote on Twitter. “You could have saved some of the 17,” Mr. Guttenberg added, addressing Mr. Peterson. “You could have saved my daughter. You did not and then you lied about it and you deserve the misery coming your way.”
Well said, Mr Guttenberg.
__________________


The better you get, the harder you work.
AJM8125 is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th June 2019, 01:20 AM   #295
Planigale
Illuminator
 
Planigale's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 3,089
Originally Posted by AJM8125 View Post
Bump.

Deputy Scot Petersen charged with 11 counts of child neglect, culpable negligence and perjury.

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/06/04/u...-peterson.html



Well said, Mr Guttenberg.
This will be a very important court case. Previous cases have established that an individual LEO has no responsibility to protect an individual; this may be reversing this decision.

The choice of charges are also interesting; child neglect, clearly laws differ from state to state but I wonder if the intent was to put a responsibility on someone who was not in loco parentis to protect a child. In general there is not a requirement for you to risk your life to protect others even children and this is true for LEO. This could have broad consequences and I can see this being appealed, the police unions will be very concerned (as should others). The culpable negligence again seems to extend a duty to respond that did not previously exist and it is unclear in what way this will be limited to LEO, it could extend to other emergency services and responders. The perjury seems more cut and dried.

I imagine in the American system this is just an opening bid from the prosecution and it will be reduced in the process of a plea deal. If the case does not actually get tried then it will not set any precedents.

I can't help thinking there is an element of scapegoating and that there is a failure of command responsibility.
Planigale is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 6th June 2019, 11:50 PM   #296
Planigale
Illuminator
 
Planigale's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 3,089
This article makes the case better than I can for the 'dangerous' precedent this case my set.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-...eporting-story
There is a truism that difficult cases make bad law. This is perhaps an example. It may be politically expedient to bring charges against the officer concerned, but distorting the intent of a law to persecute (and prosecute) one individual whose behaviour is disapproved of is a form of lynch law.
Planigale is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 7th June 2019, 04:46 AM   #297
SuburbanTurkey
Graduate Poster
 
SuburbanTurkey's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2018
Location: Boston, USA
Posts: 1,554
Originally Posted by Planigale View Post
This article makes the case better than I can for the 'dangerous' precedent this case my set.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-...eporting-story
There is a truism that difficult cases make bad law. This is perhaps an example. It may be politically expedient to bring charges against the officer concerned, but distorting the intent of a law to persecute (and prosecute) one individual whose behaviour is disapproved of is a form of lynch law.
Seems exceedingly unlikely that these criminal neglect charges will be successful. The laws weren't written for these kinds of scenarios. A cop refusing to risk his own life to save a child from a gunman is not analogous to someone who endangers a child through neglect.

This cop's cowardice is a tragedy, but not a criminal matter. Stretching the law in order to express moral outrage is not a good idea.
__________________
Gobble gobble
SuburbanTurkey is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Reply

International Skeptics Forum » General Topics » Social Issues & Current Events

Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 02:25 PM.
Powered by vBulletin. Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.

This forum began as part of the James Randi Education Foundation (JREF). However, the forum now exists as
an independent entity with no affiliation with or endorsement by the JREF, including the section in reference to "JREF" topics.

Disclaimer: Messages posted in the Forum are solely the opinion of their authors.