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Tags classified information , donald trump , national security issues , Trump controversies

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Old 16th May 2017, 03:47 AM   #281
Alphaba
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Originally Posted by The Don View Post
They couldn't take the blame themselves so they would blame others.
Sure, organizations have a penchant to do that. But intelligence agencies or departments are a very peculiar kind of organization. For them, taking the blame might be an opportunity (e.g. to evict persons considered as not sufficiently competent).

Originally Posted by The Don View Post
I suspect that it would be *known* within the intelligence services that information had been known but not shared.
Out of the Five Eyes, I wouldn't count on that.
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Old 16th May 2017, 03:51 AM   #282
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Originally Posted by Stacko View Post
If not for the Washington Post story, the Russians would have devastating kompromat on the president. He lacks the cognitive faculties to execute the duties of his office. He should resign but he won't. The cabinet should be considering the using the 25th Amendment but they won't.
Why? he is popular with republicans why would you think the legislature would go along with the 25th amendment?

Until republicans get fed up with this disgrace, and there is no sign of that happening they are not going to do anything.
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Old 16th May 2017, 04:07 AM   #283
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The Telegraph reported in January that U.S. spies 'warned Israel not to share intelligence with Trump' Is any ally going to be willing to share sensitive information with the U.S. with Trump in the loop now?
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Old 16th May 2017, 04:11 AM   #284
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Someone is tweeting a defense on his twitter. Grammar is too good to be the Orange Menace. It's going the Nixon route, "It's not illegal when the President does it."
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Old 16th May 2017, 04:12 AM   #285
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Originally Posted by TofuFighter View Post
brace yourself for what your first clue is.

Trump:
“I see NATO as a good thing.” (Washington Post, March 21, 2016)
“I think NATO is obsolete.” (ABC News, March 27, 2016)

In favor of invading Iraq? “Yeah, I guess so.” (The Howard Stern Show, September 11, 2002)
“It looks like a tremendous success from a military standpoint.” (Fox Business, March 21, 2003)
“The war’s a mess.” (Washington Post, March 25, 2003)

Barack Obama is “a strong guy who really knows what he wants.” (Fox News, February 9, 2009)
“Here’s a man that not only got elected, I think he’s doing a really good job.” (CNN, April 15, 2009)
“He’s been a horrible president.” (Fox News, April 14, 2011)
“Barack Obama has been the worst president ever.” (Fox News, April 14, 2011)

Do you think there would ever be any benefit in pointing out to Trump how completely and frequently he contradicts himself?
When the facts change he changes his mind. All rational people do. "What do you do sir?"

Thanks to all the left wing loons for the most entertaining thread for a while. Oh and the Deep-staters too.

Last edited by acementhead; 16th May 2017 at 04:14 AM. Reason: Spurious quotation mark removed.
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Old 16th May 2017, 04:15 AM   #286
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Originally Posted by ferd burfle View Post
Loose cannon Trump pulls the rug out from under McMaster, Tillerson and logger in 3, 2, 1...
Now. The one thing I don't get about people working for him is why they continue to sacrifice their reputations for him. It's a scorpion and frog situation and they don't remove the bodies of the frogs when you go in to interview for a job.
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Old 16th May 2017, 04:16 AM   #287
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It is unfortunate to watch CNN allowing that complete idiot Allan Dershowitz make the claim that this is the worst act of a sitting US president. Ever.
When Dershowitz expands, rationality contracts.
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Old 16th May 2017, 04:17 AM   #288
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Originally Posted by Stacko View Post
Someone is tweeting a defense on his twitter. Grammar is too good to be the Orange Menace. It's going the Nixon route, "It's not illegal when the President does it."


So they admit that he did do it.

And lol at it taking 10 minutes to come up with the second half.
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Old 16th May 2017, 04:24 AM   #289
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Originally Posted by acementhead View Post
Thanks to all the left wing loons for the most entertaining thread for a while. Oh and the Deep-staters too.
Dear Leader just confirmed that the story is true.
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Old 16th May 2017, 04:26 AM   #290
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Originally Posted by Samson View Post
It is unfortunate to watch CNN allowing that complete idiot Allan Dershowitz make the claim that this is the worst act of a sitting US president. Ever.
When Dershowitz expands, rationality contracts.
Yeah, I can't stand Dershowitz either. He's really only interested in promoting himself.
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Old 16th May 2017, 04:27 AM   #291
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Originally Posted by Tony Stark View Post
http://i.imgur.com/fw1r4zu.png

So they admit that he did do it.

And lol at it taking 10 minutes to come up with the second half.
McMaster undercut, apologists undercut. How predictable.

Water-carriers need to learn that spewing fake news on a knee jerk basis isn't going to cut it, thanks to President Diahreah Mouth himself. That's a tad bit satisfying.
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Old 16th May 2017, 04:29 AM   #292
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Michael Morell hit the nail on head last year.

Quote:
....Even more important, the character traits he has exhibited during the primary season suggest he would be a poor, even dangerous, commander in chief.

These traits include his obvious need for self-aggrandizement, his overreaction to perceived slights, his tendency to make decisions based on intuition, his refusal to change his views based on new information, his routine carelessness with the facts, his unwillingness to listen to others and his lack of respect for the rule of law.

The dangers that flow from Mr. Trump’s character are not just risks that would emerge if he became president. It is already damaging our national security.

President Vladimir V. Putin of Russia was a career intelligence officer, trained to identify vulnerabilities in an individual and to exploit them. That is exactly what he did early in the primaries. Mr. Putin played upon Mr. Trump’s vulnerabilities by complimenting him. He responded just as Mr. Putin had calculated.
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Old 16th May 2017, 04:31 AM   #293
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Originally Posted by ponderingturtle View Post
In this case it is true, the president can not commit treason in this regard. Anyone else and they would be going away for a very long time.

It is like with conflicts of interest and all kinds of ethical rules that apply to everyone in the administration but the president.
While the rules are different for the President I'm not sure this is entirely true.
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Old 16th May 2017, 04:31 AM   #294
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Originally Posted by Cl1mh4224rd View Post
I'm actually uncomfortable with that situation for the simple fact that it would certainly be sneered at and spit upon as an entirely left-driven action. While being the correct course of action in my opinion, it would only give certain individuals on the right even more reason to pull away.
It's better to remove the cancerous tumor before it kills the nation. Trump needs to be out of there before he starts WWIII.
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Old 16th May 2017, 04:33 AM   #295
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Ironman beat me but here's the story linky.
Believes he is within his rights to leak top secret info, emails pah!
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Old 16th May 2017, 04:35 AM   #296
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Originally Posted by Tony Stark View Post
http://i.imgur.com/fw1r4zu.png

So they admit that he did do it.

And lol at it taking 10 minutes to come up with the second half.
How betrayed must McMaster, Tillerson and Powell feel now? What was the point of sending them out last night to deny the story?
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Old 16th May 2017, 04:38 AM   #297
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Gonna start calling these post-official denial Trump confessions a "reverse Shaggy."

"Hell yeah it was me!"
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Old 16th May 2017, 04:39 AM   #298
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Originally Posted by Stacko View Post
lol, I was just going to post that.
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Old 16th May 2017, 04:43 AM   #299
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Originally Posted by PhantomWolf View Post
Is there precedent for revoking a president's security clearance?
I think it's a process called "impeachment".
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Old 16th May 2017, 04:56 AM   #300
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Originally Posted by Mycroft View Post
I think it's a process called "impeachment".
GOP won't do it because impeachment, followed by disclosure, will be far more damaging than what we have at the moment - allegations, many of which seem to have basis in fact but none of which have been legally proved - which can be written off as leftist whining and/or fake news.


edited to add...

This is just business as usual for the Trump White House. Expect it to be bumped off the front pages by something else the GOP will be too chicken to bring him to book for in about 3 days time - allegations of business fraud, another claim of sexual assault, more allegations of being tapped by the Obama administration.....

Last edited by The Don; 16th May 2017 at 05:09 AM.
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Old 16th May 2017, 05:11 AM   #301
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Originally Posted by The Don View Post
edited to add...

This is just business as usual for the Trump White House. Expect it to be bumped off the front pages by something else the GOP will be too chicken to bring him to book for in about 3 days time - allegations of business fraud, another claim of sexual assault, more allegations of being tapped by the Obama administration.....
This week is the start of a trip to Saudi Arabia, Israel, and the Vatican. Imagine what could happen.
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Old 16th May 2017, 05:12 AM   #302
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Originally Posted by The Don View Post
GOP won't do it because impeachment, followed by disclosure, will be far more damaging than what we have at the moment - allegations, many of which seem to have basis in fact but none of which have been legally proved - which can be written off as leftist whining and/or fake news.
Relax, Washington doesn't move this fast. In all likelihood impeachment will have to wait until after the mid-term election. Trump is already a substantial drag on GOP numbers, so it can be expected DNC will take the House and reduce GOP majority in the Senate. If the Democrats can make this election about Trump they could even have a shot at majority in both houses (though this is unlikely because so few GOP senators are up for reelection, most are DNC). At that point impeachment becomes a very real possibility.

Trump would have to do several more ever more bizarre missteps before GOP majority would impeach him. This isn't impossible, but it is unlikely - because worse missteps than what he's already done are difficult, not because I trust him so.

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Old 16th May 2017, 05:12 AM   #303
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Why Trump met with the Russians: Putin asked him to
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Old 16th May 2017, 05:12 AM   #304
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Originally Posted by The Don View Post
GOP won't do it because impeachment, followed by disclosure, will be far more damaging than what we have at the moment - allegations, many of which seem to have basis in fact but none of which have been legally proved - which can be written off as leftist whining and/or fake news.


edited to add...

This is just business as usual for the Trump White House. Expect it to be bumped off the front pages by something else the GOP will be too chicken to bring him to book for in about 3 days time - allegations of business fraud, another claim of sexual assault, more allegations of being tapped by the Obama administration.....
The disclosure and the damage to the GOP WILL happen. It's just a matter of when, and how damaging it will be. The longer they wait, the more damaging it will be. Though by now it's far beyond the point that it matters for most key players.
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Old 16th May 2017, 05:17 AM   #305
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Originally Posted by elgarak View Post
The disclosure and the damage to the GOP WILL happen. It's just a matter of when, and how damaging it will be. The longer they wait, the more damaging it will be. Though by now it's far beyond the point that it matters for most key players.
It depends on what the disclosure is. If it's as big or bigger than what we currently imagine then sure, if not it could be a dud if they wait for long enough for the hype to exceed any rational imagination.

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Old 16th May 2017, 05:18 AM   #306
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Originally Posted by McHrozni View Post
Relax, Washington doesn't move this fast. In all likelihood impeachment will have to wait until after the mid-term election. Trump is already a substantial drag on GOP numbers, so it can be expected DNC will take the House and reduce GOP majority in the Senate. If the Democrats can make this election about Trump they could even have a shot at majority in both houses (though this is unlikely because so few GOP senators are up for reelection, most are DNC). At that point impeachment becomes a very real possibility.

Trump would have to do several more ever more bizarre missteps before GOP majority would impeach him. This isn't impossible, but it is unlikely - because worse missteps than what he's already done are difficult, not because I trust him so.

McHrozni
It's asking a lot for the Democrats to overcome the Gerrymandering in the House. I know that the GOP spread their advantage thinly but it would still require a considerable swing to the Democratic Party for them to overcome the estimated 7% advantage that Gerrymandering has conferred to the GOP.
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Old 16th May 2017, 05:20 AM   #307
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Originally Posted by The Don View Post
GOP won't do it because impeachment, followed by disclosure, will be far more damaging than what we have at the moment - allegations, many of which seem to have basis in fact but none of which have been legally proved - which can be written off as leftist whining and/or fake news.
Yes, and most of them will still be singing "the wheels on the bus go round and round" as they plunge over the cliff in 2018.
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Old 16th May 2017, 05:21 AM   #308
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Another confirmation this isn't fake news. Because you know, it isn't fake news the media just made up if people really did leak it to the Washington Post.
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Old 16th May 2017, 05:23 AM   #309
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Originally Posted by acementhead View Post
When the facts change he changes his mind. All rational people do. "What do you do sir?"

Thanks to all the left wing loons for the most entertaining thread for a while. Oh and the Deep-staters too.
Happy to keep you entertained.

Presumably you're referring to the occasions such as photographic evidence of crowd sizes, etc, where he absorbed the facts and changed his position. Or people cheering on rooftops. Millions of illegal voters?
Nope. You'd be very hard pressed to prove your position that Trump is simply adjusting to the facts, rather than whatever he happens to be feeling, or who he wants to impress, at any given time.

Also, since you mention it, may I ask you to explain what the 'deep-staters' here have done to earn the title. Or is this just a hit-and-run post?
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Old 16th May 2017, 05:26 AM   #310
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Originally Posted by McHrozni View Post
It depends on what the disclosure is. If it's as big or bigger than what we currently imagine then sure, if not it could be a dud if they wait for long enough for the hype to exceed any rational imagination.

McHrozni
The behavior of some of the GOP leaders throughout the last few months is, to me, not explainable except by personal involvement, and self-protection.
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Old 16th May 2017, 05:28 AM   #311
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Originally Posted by elgarak View Post
The behavior of some of the GOP leaders throughout the last few months is, to me, not explainable except by personal involvement, and self-protection.
It is also possible that if Trump is a criminal that they don't want it to get out because it would be hugely damaging to their worthless party.
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Old 16th May 2017, 05:32 AM   #312
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If President Obama had done this he would be praised as a great humanitarian by many here and as an excellent diplomat who was helping improve Russian US relations by sharing information that could prevent another airline terrorist disaster. Another group would have been condemning him for releasing state secrets.

If in fact sharing this intel puts lives at risk probably he was wrong to share it. But in that case the ones who really put lives at risk are the people who leaked the information and the paper for printing it.
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Old 16th May 2017, 05:34 AM   #313
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Originally Posted by acementhead View Post
When the facts change he changes his mind. All rational people do. "What do you do sir?"

Thanks to all the left wing loons for the most entertaining thread for a while. Oh and the Deep-staters too.
Please enlighten me: What happened to NATO between March 21 and March 27, so it went from "a good thing" to "obsolete" in six days?

And the Iraq war was a "tremendous success" one day but a "mess" four days later?
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Old 16th May 2017, 05:36 AM   #314
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Originally Posted by Tony Stark View Post


Another confirmation this isn't fake news. Because you know, it isn't fake news the media just made up if people really did leak it to the Washington Post.
Until today, I hadn't heard of the "kettle defence" but Trump seems to be employing it.
  • He didn't tell the Russians anything classified
  • As President, he has the power to declassify information so he couldn't have told the Russians anything classified
  • The real story, and outrage, is that the information on him telling the Russians classified material was leaked
  • The WaPo is wrong to spread these leaked lies
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Old 16th May 2017, 05:37 AM   #315
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Originally Posted by eeyore1954 View Post
If President Obama had done this he would be praised as a great humanitarian by many here and as an excellent diplomat who was helping improve Russian US relations by sharing information that could prevent another airline terrorist disaster. Another group would have been condemning him for releasing state secrets.

If in fact sharing this intel puts lives at risk probably he was wrong to share it. But in that case the ones who really put lives at risk are the people who leaked the information and the paper for printing it.
I can't agree with your last paragraph. If information that compromised US (or its allies) assets was leaked to Russians, those lives are at risk regardless of leaks.
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Old 16th May 2017, 05:39 AM   #316
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Originally Posted by eeyore1954 View Post
If President Obama had done this he would be praised as a great humanitarian by many here and as an excellent diplomat who was helping improve Russian US relations by sharing information that could prevent another airline terrorist disaster. Another group would have been condemning him for releasing state secrets.

If in fact sharing this intel puts lives at risk probably he was wrong to share it. But in that case the ones who really put lives at risk are the people who leaked the information and the paper for printing it.
Nonsense. Trump is giving away intel because he thinks it makes him seem cool to his Russian buddies. There is no diplomacy in Trump's mind, no strategy, only a need to feed his tiny ego.
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Old 16th May 2017, 05:42 AM   #317
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Originally Posted by TofuFighter View Post
I can't agree with your last paragraph. If information that compromised US (or its allies) assets was leaked to Russians, those lives are at risk regardless of leaks.
He also would be responsible for giving the information but putting it in the open is more dangerous and in my opinion more irresponsible.
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Old 16th May 2017, 05:42 AM   #318
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The Washington Post didn't really give any details about what Trump told the Russians beyond that it was about ISIS plotting to blow up airliners with laptops. And it wasn't a huge secret that there was some kind of plot about that since the US is planning on banning people from carrying laptops on planes traveling to the US.

ETA: He told the Russians what city the plot was detected in. But the WaPo didn't report which one it was.

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Old 16th May 2017, 05:43 AM   #319
eeyore1954
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Originally Posted by thaiboxerken View Post
Nonsense. Trump is giving away intel because he thinks it makes him seem cool to his Russian buddies. There is no diplomacy in Trump's mind, no strategy, only a need to feed his tiny ego.
Luckily you are able to read his mind.
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Old 16th May 2017, 05:44 AM   #320
phiwum
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Originally Posted by Aepervius View Post
Bob, you need to get out of your hole. Come to the world. Come where all of us live. And accept this fundamental problem with politic.

Like it or not, EVERY SINGLE TIME you support something to be legal in this forum, without added disclaimer that this is morally repugnant and should be properly made illegal or unconstitutional, you are EFFECTIVELY telling everybody it is OK to do it.

Sure I understand you think those are two different things. Legality and morality. But the real world is unfortunately more black and white when it comes to such argument. That battle was lost long ago.

Every. Single. Time. You. Say. Something. Is. Legal. But. Do. Not. Condemn. It. You. Are. Effectively. Telling. Us. You. Are. OK. With. It.

Clear ?

ETA: This is not a personal attack or at least not written as such. it is a simple statement that most people will simply jump to that conclusion. If you don't believe me go to the average person in the street, and tell them torture is fairly legal. present them the same argument you presented here.
Utter nonsense.

Grownups know the difference between "this is legal" and "this is acceptable". Bob's primary problem is his fantastic notion of legality, not that his readers can't tell the difference between law and morality.
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