All things Trump + Russia Part 4 - Page 9

Stacyhs · 28th July 2018, 11:05 AM

Originally Posted by Squeegee Beckenheim

I love how quickly and easily some have been manipulated into claiming that the Russians were actively helping Clinton win. I mean, it wasn't even a fortnight ago that Putin himself clearly and unequivocally said that he wanted Trump to win.

But not surprised. I honestly think that some of his base would remain loyal to him if he came out on a balcony and declared himself President for Life.

Foolmewunz · 28th July 2018, 11:24 PM

Originally Posted by BrooklynBaby

Hillary was holding up a Russian fur hat at one of her speeches. Guess it was just to hot to wear it.

This reminds me of the idiots at Loose Change who got all hyped up because 911 Truth was mentioned on South Park. Even after it was pointed out that they were being ridiculed, half of them still thought it was a sincere plug for their cause, arguing that the writers included the reference but were forced by the CIA or the Mounties or Cub Scouts to make it sound like they disagreed but they were really dedicated Truthers.

Hillary brought the hat to make fun of The Orange Menace. Like the bullets at Balaklava, I guess....

blutoski · 29th July 2018, 12:41 PM

Originally Posted by Minoosh

Plus, when do reporters get a chance to ask him tough questions? Probably never, in Russia.

Not anymore, anyway. There was a time... then he had them arrested, sometimes murdered.
The US sanctions he's trying to get removed were retaliation for a wave of journalist assassinations, not so much for Crimea.

Russian reporters read from government approved scripts these days.

blutoski · 29th July 2018, 12:43 PM

Originally Posted by Foolmewunz

This reminds me of the idiots at Loose Change who got all hyped up because 911 Truth was mentioned on South Park. Even after it was pointed out that they were being ridiculed, half of them still thought it was a sincere plug for their cause, arguing that the writers included the reference but were forced by the CIA or the Mounties or Cub Scouts to make it sound like they disagreed but they were really dedicated Truthers.

Hillary brought the hat to make fun of The Orange Menace. Like the bullets at Balaklava, I guess....

In their defense, there's no bad press.

Skeptics can be reminded of the results of James Randi's 'exposure' of Peter Popoff on TV: record donations to Popoff.

thaiboxerken · 29th July 2018, 07:42 PM

Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger

Waste of time. Unlike Trump, Putin is a very skilled liar and politician. Reporters get nowhere interviewing him.

Not true. Sometimes they get go underground, about 6ft. Others disappear to vacations at unknown locations.

Stacko · 30th July 2018, 07:36 AM

NEW: Giuliani just moved the goal posts in 2 big ways on Fox & CNN :
1. He's no longer claiming Trump didn't collude with Russia. He's claiming "collusion is not a crime."
2. He's not saying Trump did not know abt 2016 Russia mtg in advance. He's saying Trump did not ATTEND it.

Stacko · 30th July 2018, 04:04 PM

Another Dem senator targeted by Russian hackers.

Skeptic Ginger · 30th July 2018, 04:23 PM

Originally Posted by Stacko

Another Dem senator targeted by Russian hackers.

I'd think by now these guys would always check the credentials of people calling them. Good for Shaheen and her staff.

This was tried on McCaskill and was the same thing used to get into the DCCC computers:

Quote:

In that attempted attack, some of McCaskill’s staffers received realistic-looking email notices instructing them to change their password. The link included in the email went to a fake password-change portal set up to capture any password entered.

Who doesn't know not to click on links in emails? I never do. If I get something official looking that says 'click here' I always go the website to do any clicking.

BTW, none of these tricks got into Clinton's server, just sayin'.

Trebuchet · 30th July 2018, 05:43 PM

Originally Posted by Stacko

NEW: Giuliani just moved the goal posts in 2 big ways on Fox & CNN :
1. He's no longer claiming Trump didn't collude with Russia. He's claiming "collusion is not a crime."
2. He's not saying Trump did not know abt 2016 Russia mtg in advance. He's saying Trump did not ATTEND it.

1. Straw man. Nobody said it was. Conspiracy, on the other hand....
2. In person.

Skeptic Ginger · 30th July 2018, 06:34 PM

Originally Posted by Trebuchet

1. Straw man. Nobody said it was. Conspiracy, on the other hand....
2. In person.

1. Words games anyway, collusion and conspiracy are SYNONYMS.

2. And who gives a **** anyway if Trump was there in person. He made a big announcement before the meeting that he'd have the real dirt on Clinton in a few days.

thaiboxerken · 30th July 2018, 07:47 PM

Originally Posted by Stacko

NEW: Giuliani just moved the goal posts in 2 big ways on Fox & CNN :
1. He's no longer claiming Trump didn't collude with Russia. He's claiming "collusion is not a crime."
2. He's not saying Trump did not know abt 2016 Russia mtg in advance. He's saying Trump did not ATTEND it.

It follows all of the "fake news" apologetics by Trumpsters.
1. Deny it by calling it fake news
2. When evidence is shown it is true, talk about Hillary.
3. When people keep with it, say "you don't understand the facts correctly."
4. When they persist with facts, say that the "news" happened, but isn't wrong.
5. Claim it was fake news all along, changing the narrative to the new goal post.
6. Start over at step 1.

Squeegee Beckenheim · 31st July 2018, 01:30 AM

Newly leaked emails show Wikileaks wanted the Republicans to win the 2016 election

Aber · 31st July 2018, 04:09 AM

Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger

2. And who gives a **** anyway if Trump was there in person. He made a big announcement before the meeting that he'd have the real dirt on Clinton in a few days.

Because the suggestion is that he was listening in to the meeting via speakerphone. Although this is speculative, it is being driven by denials that he did not attend in person.

Which looks bad, given all his denials about the meeting, and because it shows that he thought at the time attending the meeting would look bad.

Skeptic Ginger · 1st August 2018, 12:01 PM

Originally Posted by Aber

Because the suggestion is that he was listening in to the meeting via speakerphone. Although this is speculative, it is being driven by denials that he did not attend in person.

Which looks bad, given all his denials about the meeting, and because it shows that he thought at the time attending the meeting would look bad.

In the scheme of things, this is trivial.

Bob001 · 1st August 2018, 02:31 PM

Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger

In the scheme of things, this is trivial.

Maybe. But if it could be proven that Trump knowingly sent his son and campaign manager to get Clinton dirt from the Russians, it contradicts everything he and all his cohorts have said about it. Won't be easy to explain away.

Stacyhs · 1st August 2018, 02:53 PM

Originally Posted by Bob001

Maybe. But if it could be proven that Trump knowingly sent his son and campaign manager to get Clinton dirt from the Russians, it contradicts everything he and all his cohorts have said about it. Won't be easy to explain away.

Trump meant to tell Jared he shouldn't meet the Russians. Those darn confusing single negatives!

quadraginta · 1st August 2018, 02:59 PM

Originally Posted by Stacyhs

Trump meant to tell Jared he shouldn't meet the Russians. Those darn confusing single negatives!

Who knew that third grade English would be so hard?

Skeptic Ginger · 1st August 2018, 03:11 PM

Originally Posted by Bob001

Maybe. But if it could be proven that Trump knowingly sent his son and campaign manager to get Clinton dirt from the Russians, it contradicts everything he and all his cohorts have said about it. Won't be easy to explain away.

I'm pretty sure that highlighted text is a given. No one needs Trump to have had the meeting on speaker phone. The latest now is that there was probably a pre-meeting meeting.

acbytesla · 1st August 2018, 03:11 PM

Originally Posted by Stacko

NEW: Giuliani just moved the goal posts in 2 big ways on Fox & CNN :
1. He's no longer claiming Trump didn't collude with Russia. He's claiming "collusion is not a crime."
2. He's not saying Trump did not know abt 2016 Russia mtg in advance. He's saying Trump did not ATTEND it.

For a guy who is supposed to be an attorney, this guy is an idiot.

Giuliani knows better than anyone that collusion is merely a synonym for conspiracy.

He also knows it doesn't matter that Trump didn't personally attend. If Trump approved securing and receiving dirt on Hillary Clinton from a foreign agents and or government and those agents or government went forward with the hacking of the DNC or Hillary he has committed the felony of conspiring to defraud the United States. PERIOD. Punishable by 5 years in prison.

It doesnt matter that he was joking or whatever lame ass excuse he puts forward. From my view Trump, Don Jr, Manafort, Kushner are all guilty of that conspiracy and Trump Sr is guilty of multiple counts of Obstruction as well. I would also bet there are dozens of other crimes associated with the Russian interference into the US election.

Squeegee Beckenheim · 2nd August 2018, 01:01 AM

Republican Senators shoot down an amendment that would have provided states with more funding for election security

The Don · 2nd August 2018, 02:15 AM

Originally Posted by acbytesla

For a guy who is supposed to be an attorney, this guy is an idiot.

Giuliani knows better than anyone that collusion is merely a synonym for conspiracy.

He also knows that if evidence is found that President Trump was engaged in a conspiracy, the response from the Trump Administration and legal team will be.

"See, we told you there was no collusion. It was a partisan witch hunt. They were looking for collusion and couldn't find any"

And enough of the US electorate will believe them for business to continue as normal.

Squeegee Beckenheim · 3rd August 2018, 12:34 AM

Treasury eases sanctions on Rusal

Safe-Keeper · 3rd August 2018, 05:01 PM

Originally Posted by thaiboxerken

It follows all of the "fake news" apologetics by Trumpsters.
1. Deny it by calling it fake news
2. When evidence is shown it is true, talk about Hillary.
3. When people keep with it, say "you don't understand the facts correctly."
4. When they persist with facts, say that the "news" happened, but isn't wrong.
5. Claim it was fake news all along, changing the narrative to the new goal post.
6. Start over at step 1.

Also, try your darndest to shut down every online discussion by just spamming insults and general noise.

Aridas · 3rd August 2018, 08:18 PM

Originally Posted by Squeegee Beckenheim

Treasury eases sanctions on Rusal

...Trump's being so tough on Russia! They totally wish Hillary was President now!

Squeegee Beckenheim · 4th August 2018, 12:56 AM

It's being reported that Maria Butina once claimed in class that she was an envoy between the Russian government and the Trump campaign

jimbob · 4th August 2018, 02:56 AM

This 538 article is interesting

https://fivethirtyeight.com/features...-troll-tweets/

Quote:

Why We’re Sharing 3 Million Russian Troll Tweets
By Oliver Roeder

Filed under Russia Investigation

Get the data on GitHub
When historians try to appraise Russia’s interference in the 2016 election, which historical artifacts will they use? Then-candidate Donald Trump’s speech imploring Russia to find Hillary Clinton’s emails, perhaps. The soccer ball Vladimir Putin gave President Trump at their summit in Helsinki probably merits inclusion. And then there are the tweets — millions of them.

Quote:

FiveThirtyEight has obtained nearly 3 million tweets from accounts associated with the Internet Research Agency. To our knowledge, it’s the fullest empirical record to date of Russian trolls’ actions on social media, showing a relentless and systematic onslaught. In concert with the researchers who first pulled the tweets, FiveThirtyEight is uploading them to GitHub so that others can explore the data for themselves.

Look at the spike in activity just before the Wikileaks release of the Clinton campaign emails

jimbob · 4th August 2018, 02:58 AM

Also from that

Quote:

Right Troll and Left Troll are the meat of the agency’s trolling campaign. Right Trolls behave like “bread-and-butter MAGA Americans, only all they do is talk about politics all day long,” Linvill said. Left Trolls often adopt the personae of Black Lives Matter activists, typically expressing support for Bernie Sanders and derision for Hillary Clinton, along with “clearly trying to divide the Democratic Party and lower voter turnout.” News Feeds are a bit of a mystery: They present themselves as local news aggregators, with names such as @OnlineMemphis and @TodayPittsburgh, and the news they link to is typically legitimate. Hashtag Gamers specialize in playing hashtag games (e.g., #LessInterestingBooks might give rise to the tweet “Waldo’s Right Here”); many of their tweets are harmless wordplay in the spirit of the games, but some are socially divisive, in the style of Right Trolls or Left Trolls. And Fearmongers, relatively rare in the data set, spread news about a fake crisis, such as salmonella-contaminated turkeys around Thanksgiving, or the toxic chemical fumes described at the beginning of the New York Times Magazine article about the Internet Research Agency.

Stacko · 5th August 2018, 06:47 AM

Trump now says that the Trump Tower meeting was, in fact, to get dirt on Hillary Clinton.

Last year, in a statement to the Times from Trump on behalf of his son, it claimed: "We primarily discussed a program about the adoption of Russian children."

We're almost to them conceding that they conspired with the Russians and hoping for the partisanship of the MAGAdooks to protect them.

The Don · 5th August 2018, 06:52 AM

Originally Posted by Stacko

Trump now says that the Trump Tower meeting was, in fact, to get dirt on Hillary Clinton.

Last year, in a statement to the Times from Trump on behalf of his son, it claimed: "We primarily discussed a program about the adoption of Russian children."

We're almost to them conceding that they conspired with the Russians and hoping for the partisanship of the MAGAdooks to protect them.

.......and IMO it will should they do so. They've been preparing the ground and right now the GOP will do anything he wants.

Collusion is not illegal and in any case they were working for the greater good - to MAGA.

Squeegee Beckenheim · 5th August 2018, 07:05 AM

Originally Posted by Stacko

Trump now says that the Trump Tower meeting was, in fact, to get dirt on Hillary Clinton.

Last year, in a statement to the Times from Trump on behalf of his son, it claimed: "We primarily discussed a program about the adoption of Russian children."

We're almost to them conceding that they conspired with the Russians and hoping for the partisanship of the MAGAdooks to protect them.

Why shouldn't he admit that? Giuliani has looked through the statutes and determined that collusion isn't a crime. It's a normal part of any campaign.

alfaniner · 5th August 2018, 09:34 AM

Originally Posted by Squeegee Beckenheim

Why shouldn't he admit that? Giuliani has looked through the statutes and determined that collusion isn't a crime. It's a normal part of any campaign.

It's (probably) not illegal if you are dealing with domestic entities. But with a foreign government? Nuh-uh. This is going to blow up big time.

Stacyhs · 5th August 2018, 02:30 PM

Originally Posted by alfaniner

It's (probably) not illegal if you are dealing with domestic entities. But with a foreign government? Nuh-uh. This is going to blow up big time.

One could normally safely assume so. But we are talking Trump supporters here. Not your normal bunch. The "pussy tape" would normally have sunk any candidate's campaign but not Trump's. Trump has survived many things that would have ended the chances for election of a normal candidate. The key word here is 'normal'. And that is something Trump is not in more than one way.

Skeptic Ginger · 5th August 2018, 02:33 PM

It was so obviously legal they all lied about it and changed their stories dozens of times.

Stacyhs · 5th August 2018, 03:23 PM

Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger

It was so obviously legal they all lied about it and changed their stories dozens of times.

You see that. I see that. Any logical person sees that. Trump's base will find some excuse to justify it. We've seen it over and over again from them as in "it was just locker room talk".

Armitage72 · 5th August 2018, 04:26 PM

We've already seen Trump supporters thanking Russia for helping to save them from Hillary. Why would that change?

Stacyhs · 5th August 2018, 06:06 PM

Originally Posted by Armitage72

We've already seen Trump supporters thanking Russia for helping to save them from Hillary. Why would that change?

This ability to twist bad things into good things belongs in the "you can't make this **** up" category.

Foolmewunz · 5th August 2018, 09:17 PM

So now, as the "neener neener neener collusion ain't a crime" defense fungus is being spread by the usual suspects, Trump gets another soldier to step up and fall on his sword. "Oh, that was me. Donnie Johnny really didn't say that, I'm just a millionaire attorney and I get so confused sometimes that I said the opposite of what really happened. I only neglected to bring it up before now because I got wrapped up in the playoffs (MLB, NFL, March Madness, NHL, NBA) and it slipped my mind to correct the record over the past fourteen months. What can I say? I'm an airhead, obviously. Why else would I be on this team."

Squeegee Beckenheim · 6th August 2018, 12:09 AM

Trump supporters photographed at rally wearing t-shirts which say "I'd rather be Russian than a Democrat"

WilliamSeger · 6th August 2018, 12:44 AM

Originally Posted by Squeegee Beckenheim

Trump supporters photographed at rally wearing t-shirts which say "I'd rather be Russian than a Democrat"

Trump's "red wave."

The Great Zaganza · 6th August 2018, 06:00 AM

Originally Posted by Squeegee Beckenheim

Trump supporters photographed at rally wearing t-shirts which say "I'd rather be Russian than a Democrat"

So can we ship all Trump supporters to Siberia - for their own sake, of course?

28th July 2018, 11:24 PM	#322
Foolmewunz Grammar Resistance Leader TLA Dictator Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Pattaya, Thailand Posts: 41,468	Originally Posted by BrooklynBaby Hillary was holding up a Russian fur hat at one of her speeches. Guess it was just to hot to wear it. This reminds me of the idiots at Loose Change who got all hyped up because 911 Truth was mentioned on South Park. Even after it was pointed out that they were being ridiculed, half of them still thought it was a sincere plug for their cause, arguing that the writers included the reference but were forced by the CIA or the Mounties or Cub Scouts to make it sound like they disagreed but they were really dedicated Truthers. Hillary brought the hat to make fun of The Orange Menace. Like the bullets at Balaklava, I guess....
	__________________ Ha! Foolmewunz has just been added to the list of people who aren't complete idiots. Hokulele It's not that liberals have become less tolerant. It's that conservatives have become more intolerable.

29th July 2018, 12:41 PM	#323
blutoski Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 12,369	Originally Posted by Minoosh Plus, when do reporters get a chance to ask him tough questions? Probably never, in Russia. Not anymore, anyway. There was a time... then he had them arrested, sometimes murdered. The US sanctions he's trying to get removed were retaliation for a wave of journalist assassinations, not so much for Crimea. Russian reporters read from government approved scripts these days.
	__________________ "Sometimes it's better to light a flamethrower than curse the darkness." - Terry Pratchett

29th July 2018, 12:43 PM	#324
blutoski Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 12,369	Originally Posted by Foolmewunz This reminds me of the idiots at Loose Change who got all hyped up because 911 Truth was mentioned on South Park. Even after it was pointed out that they were being ridiculed, half of them still thought it was a sincere plug for their cause, arguing that the writers included the reference but were forced by the CIA or the Mounties or Cub Scouts to make it sound like they disagreed but they were really dedicated Truthers. Hillary brought the hat to make fun of The Orange Menace. Like the bullets at Balaklava, I guess.... In their defense, there's no bad press. Skeptics can be reminded of the results of James Randi's 'exposure' of Peter Popoff on TV: record donations to Popoff.
	__________________ "Sometimes it's better to light a flamethrower than curse the darkness." - Terry Pratchett

29th July 2018, 07:42 PM	#325
thaiboxerken Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Sep 2001 Posts: 31,712	Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger Waste of time. Unlike Trump, Putin is a very skilled liar and politician. Reporters get nowhere interviewing him. Not true. Sometimes they get go underground, about 6ft. Others disappear to vacations at unknown locations.
	__________________ 1. He'd never do that. 2. Okay but he's not currently doing it. 3. Okay but he's not currently technically doing it. 4. Okay but everyone does it. 5. He's doing it, we can't stop him, no point in complaining about it. 6. We all knew he was going to do it which... makes it okay somehow. 7. It's perfectly fine that's he's doing it.

30th July 2018, 07:36 AM	#326
Stacko Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 10,837	NEW: Giuliani just moved the goal posts in 2 big ways on Fox & CNN : 1. He's no longer claiming Trump didn't collude with Russia. He's claiming "collusion is not a crime." 2. He's not saying Trump did not know abt 2016 Russia mtg in advance. He's saying Trump did not ATTEND it.

28th July 2018, 11:05 AM	#321
Stacyhs Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Mar 2016 Location: United States Posts: 18,031	Originally Posted by Squeegee Beckenheim I love how quickly and easily some have been manipulated into claiming that the Russians were actively helping Clinton win. I mean, it wasn't even a fortnight ago that Putin himself clearly and unequivocally said that he wanted Trump to win. But not surprised. I honestly think that some of his base would remain loyal to him if he came out on a balcony and declared himself President for Life.

30th July 2018, 04:04 PM	#327
Stacko Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 10,837	Another Dem senator targeted by Russian hackers.

30th July 2018, 04:23 PM	#328
Skeptic Ginger Nasty Woman Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 87,032	Originally Posted by Stacko Another Dem senator targeted by Russian hackers. I'd think by now these guys would always check the credentials of people calling them. Good for Shaheen and her staff. This was tried on McCaskill and was the same thing used to get into the DCCC computers: Quote: In that attempted attack, some of McCaskill’s staffers received realistic-looking email notices instructing them to change their password. The link included in the email went to a fake password-change portal set up to capture any password entered. Who doesn't know not to click on links in emails? I never do. If I get something official looking that says 'click here' I always go the website to do any clicking. BTW, none of these tricks got into Clinton's server, just sayin'.

30th July 2018, 05:43 PM	#329
Trebuchet Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Port Townsend, Washington Posts: 31,067	Originally Posted by Stacko NEW: Giuliani just moved the goal posts in 2 big ways on Fox & CNN : 1. He's no longer claiming Trump didn't collude with Russia. He's claiming "collusion is not a crime." 2. He's not saying Trump did not know abt 2016 Russia mtg in advance. He's saying Trump did not ATTEND it. 1. Straw man. Nobody said it was. Conspiracy, on the other hand.... 2. In person.
	__________________ Cum catapultae proscribeantur tum soli proscripti catapultas habeant.

30th July 2018, 06:34 PM	#330
Skeptic Ginger Nasty Woman Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 87,032	Originally Posted by Trebuchet 1. Straw man. Nobody said it was. Conspiracy, on the other hand.... 2. In person. 1. Words games anyway, collusion and conspiracy are SYNONYMS. 2. And who gives a **** anyway if Trump was there in person. He made a big announcement before the meeting that he'd have the real dirt on Clinton in a few days.

30th July 2018, 07:47 PM	#331
thaiboxerken Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Sep 2001 Posts: 31,712	Originally Posted by Stacko NEW: Giuliani just moved the goal posts in 2 big ways on Fox & CNN : 1. He's no longer claiming Trump didn't collude with Russia. He's claiming "collusion is not a crime." 2. He's not saying Trump did not know abt 2016 Russia mtg in advance. He's saying Trump did not ATTEND it. It follows all of the "fake news" apologetics by Trumpsters. 1. Deny it by calling it fake news 2. When evidence is shown it is true, talk about Hillary. 3. When people keep with it, say "you don't understand the facts correctly." 4. When they persist with facts, say that the "news" happened, but isn't wrong. 5. Claim it was fake news all along, changing the narrative to the new goal post. 6. Start over at step 1.
	__________________ 1. He'd never do that. 2. Okay but he's not currently doing it. 3. Okay but he's not currently technically doing it. 4. Okay but everyone does it. 5. He's doing it, we can't stop him, no point in complaining about it. 6. We all knew he was going to do it which... makes it okay somehow. 7. It's perfectly fine that's he's doing it.

31st July 2018, 01:30 AM	#332
Squeegee Beckenheim Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Dec 2010 Posts: 31,258	Newly leaked emails show Wikileaks wanted the Republicans to win the 2016 election
	__________________ I don't trust atoms. They make up everything.

31st July 2018, 04:09 AM	#333
Aber Graduate Poster Join Date: Apr 2011 Posts: 1,687	Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger 2. And who gives a **** anyway if Trump was there in person. He made a big announcement before the meeting that he'd have the real dirt on Clinton in a few days. Because the suggestion is that he was listening in to the meeting via speakerphone. Although this is speculative, it is being driven by denials that he did not attend in person. Which looks bad, given all his denials about the meeting, and because it shows that he thought at the time attending the meeting would look bad.
Aber Graduate Poster Join Date: Apr 2011 Posts: 1,687	Last edited by Aber; 31st July 2018 at 04:11 AM.

1st August 2018, 12:01 PM	#334
Skeptic Ginger Nasty Woman Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 87,032	Originally Posted by Aber Because the suggestion is that he was listening in to the meeting via speakerphone. Although this is speculative, it is being driven by denials that he did not attend in person. Which looks bad, given all his denials about the meeting, and because it shows that he thought at the time attending the meeting would look bad. In the scheme of things, this is trivial.

1st August 2018, 02:31 PM	#335
Bob001 Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: US of A Posts: 12,677	Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger In the scheme of things, this is trivial. Maybe. But if it could be proven that Trump knowingly sent his son and campaign manager to get Clinton dirt from the Russians, it contradicts everything he and all his cohorts have said about it. Won't be easy to explain away.

1st August 2018, 02:53 PM	#336
Stacyhs Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Mar 2016 Location: United States Posts: 18,031	Originally Posted by Bob001 Maybe. But if it could be proven that Trump knowingly sent his son and campaign manager to get Clinton dirt from the Russians, it contradicts everything he and all his cohorts have said about it. Won't be easy to explain away. Trump meant to tell Jared he shouldn't meet the Russians. Those darn confusing single negatives!

1st August 2018, 02:59 PM	#337
quadraginta Becoming Beth Join Date: May 2009 Location: Central Vale of Humility (USA, sort of) Posts: 26,177	Originally Posted by Stacyhs Trump meant to tell Jared he shouldn't meet the Russians. Those darn confusing single negatives! Who knew that third grade English would be so hard?
	__________________ "A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep." "Ninety percent of the politicians give the other ten percent a bad reputation."

1st August 2018, 03:11 PM	#338
Skeptic Ginger Nasty Woman Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 87,032	Originally Posted by Bob001 Maybe. But if it could be proven that Trump knowingly sent his son and campaign manager to get Clinton dirt from the Russians, it contradicts everything he and all his cohorts have said about it. Won't be easy to explain away. I'm pretty sure that highlighted text is a given. No one needs Trump to have had the meeting on speaker phone. The latest now is that there was probably a pre-meeting meeting.

1st August 2018, 03:11 PM	#339
acbytesla Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Dec 2012 Posts: 28,323	Originally Posted by Stacko NEW: Giuliani just moved the goal posts in 2 big ways on Fox & CNN : 1. He's no longer claiming Trump didn't collude with Russia. He's claiming "collusion is not a crime." 2. He's not saying Trump did not know abt 2016 Russia mtg in advance. He's saying Trump did not ATTEND it. For a guy who is supposed to be an attorney, this guy is an idiot. Giuliani knows better than anyone that collusion is merely a synonym for conspiracy. He also knows it doesn't matter that Trump didn't personally attend. If Trump approved securing and receiving dirt on Hillary Clinton from a foreign agents and or government and those agents or government went forward with the hacking of the DNC or Hillary he has committed the felony of conspiring to defraud the United States. PERIOD. Punishable by 5 years in prison. It doesnt matter that he was joking or whatever lame ass excuse he puts forward. From my view Trump, Don Jr, Manafort, Kushner are all guilty of that conspiracy and Trump Sr is guilty of multiple counts of Obstruction as well. I would also bet there are dozens of other crimes associated with the Russian interference into the US election.
	__________________ Just because I'm paranoid doesn't mean they're not out to get to me. .

2nd August 2018, 01:01 AM	#340
Squeegee Beckenheim Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Dec 2010 Posts: 31,258	Republican Senators shoot down an amendment that would have provided states with more funding for election security
	__________________ I don't trust atoms. They make up everything.

2nd August 2018, 02:15 AM	#341
The Don Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Sir Fynwy Posts: 31,377	Originally Posted by acbytesla For a guy who is supposed to be an attorney, this guy is an idiot. Giuliani knows better than anyone that collusion is merely a synonym for conspiracy. He also knows that if evidence is found that President Trump was engaged in a conspiracy, the response from the Trump Administration and legal team will be. "See, we told you there was no collusion. It was a partisan witch hunt. They were looking for collusion and couldn't find any" And enough of the US electorate will believe them for business to continue as normal.

3rd August 2018, 12:34 AM	#342
Squeegee Beckenheim Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Dec 2010 Posts: 31,258	Treasury eases sanctions on Rusal
	__________________ I don't trust atoms. They make up everything.

3rd August 2018, 05:01 PM	#343
Safe-Keeper Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Norway Posts: 10,395	Originally Posted by thaiboxerken It follows all of the "fake news" apologetics by Trumpsters. 1. Deny it by calling it fake news 2. When evidence is shown it is true, talk about Hillary. 3. When people keep with it, say "you don't understand the facts correctly." 4. When they persist with facts, say that the "news" happened, but isn't wrong. 5. Claim it was fake news all along, changing the narrative to the new goal post. 6. Start over at step 1. Also, try your darndest to shut down every online discussion by just spamming insults and general noise.
	__________________ "He's like a drunk being given a sobriety test by the police after being pulled over. Just as a drunk can't walk a straight line, Trump can't think in a straight line. He's all over the place."--Stacyhs "If you are still hung up on that whole words-have-meaning thing, then 2020 is going to be a long year for you." --Ladewig

3rd August 2018, 08:18 PM	#344
Aridas Crazy Little Green Dragon Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: East Coast, US Posts: 7,472	Originally Posted by Squeegee Beckenheim Treasury eases sanctions on Rusal ...Trump's being so tough on Russia! They totally wish Hillary was President now!
	__________________ So sayeth the crazy little dragon.

4th August 2018, 12:56 AM	#345
Squeegee Beckenheim Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Dec 2010 Posts: 31,258	It's being reported that Maria Butina once claimed in class that she was an envoy between the Russian government and the Trump campaign
	__________________ I don't trust atoms. They make up everything.

4th August 2018, 02:56 AM	#346
jimbob Uncritical "thinker" Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: UK Posts: 22,815	This 538 article is interesting https://fivethirtyeight.com/features...-troll-tweets/ Quote: Why We’re Sharing 3 Million Russian Troll Tweets By Oliver Roeder Filed under Russia Investigation Get the data on GitHub When historians try to appraise Russia’s interference in the 2016 election, which historical artifacts will they use? Then-candidate Donald Trump’s speech imploring Russia to find Hillary Clinton’s emails, perhaps. The soccer ball Vladimir Putin gave President Trump at their summit in Helsinki probably merits inclusion. And then there are the tweets — millions of them. Quote: FiveThirtyEight has obtained nearly 3 million tweets from accounts associated with the Internet Research Agency. To our knowledge, it’s the fullest empirical record to date of Russian trolls’ actions on social media, showing a relentless and systematic onslaught. In concert with the researchers who first pulled the tweets, FiveThirtyEight is uploading them to GitHub so that others can explore the data for themselves. Look at the spike in activity just before the Wikileaks release of the Clinton campaign emails
	__________________ OECD healthcare spending Expenditure on healthcare http://www.oecd.org/els/health-systems/health-data.htm link is 2015 data (2013 Data below): UK 8.5% of GDP of which 83.3% is public expenditure - 7.1% of GDP is public spending US 16.4% of GDP of which 48.2% is public expenditure - 7.9% of GDP is public spending

4th August 2018, 02:58 AM	#347
jimbob Uncritical "thinker" Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: UK Posts: 22,815	Also from that Quote: Right Troll and Left Troll are the meat of the agency’s trolling campaign. Right Trolls behave like “bread-and-butter MAGA Americans, only all they do is talk about politics all day long,” Linvill said. Left Trolls often adopt the personae of Black Lives Matter activists, typically expressing support for Bernie Sanders and derision for Hillary Clinton, along with “clearly trying to divide the Democratic Party and lower voter turnout.” News Feeds are a bit of a mystery: They present themselves as local news aggregators, with names such as @OnlineMemphis and @TodayPittsburgh, and the news they link to is typically legitimate. Hashtag Gamers specialize in playing hashtag games (e.g., #LessInterestingBooks might give rise to the tweet “Waldo’s Right Here”); many of their tweets are harmless wordplay in the spirit of the games, but some are socially divisive, in the style of Right Trolls or Left Trolls. And Fearmongers, relatively rare in the data set, spread news about a fake crisis, such as salmonella-contaminated turkeys around Thanksgiving, or the toxic chemical fumes described at the beginning of the New York Times Magazine article about the Internet Research Agency.
	__________________ OECD healthcare spending Expenditure on healthcare http://www.oecd.org/els/health-systems/health-data.htm link is 2015 data (2013 Data below): UK 8.5% of GDP of which 83.3% is public expenditure - 7.1% of GDP is public spending US 16.4% of GDP of which 48.2% is public expenditure - 7.9% of GDP is public spending

5th August 2018, 06:47 AM	#348
Stacko Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 10,837	Trump now says that the Trump Tower meeting was, in fact, to get dirt on Hillary Clinton. Last year, in a statement to the Times from Trump on behalf of his son, it claimed: "We primarily discussed a program about the adoption of Russian children." We're almost to them conceding that they conspired with the Russians and hoping for the partisanship of the MAGAdooks to protect them.

5th August 2018, 06:52 AM	#349
The Don Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Sir Fynwy Posts: 31,377	Originally Posted by Stacko Trump now says that the Trump Tower meeting was, in fact, to get dirt on Hillary Clinton. Last year, in a statement to the Times from Trump on behalf of his son, it claimed: "We primarily discussed a program about the adoption of Russian children." We're almost to them conceding that they conspired with the Russians and hoping for the partisanship of the MAGAdooks to protect them. .......and IMO it will should they do so. They've been preparing the ground and right now the GOP will do anything he wants. Collusion is not illegal and in any case they were working for the greater good - to MAGA.

5th August 2018, 07:05 AM	#350
Squeegee Beckenheim Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Dec 2010 Posts: 31,258	Originally Posted by Stacko Trump now says that the Trump Tower meeting was, in fact, to get dirt on Hillary Clinton. Last year, in a statement to the Times from Trump on behalf of his son, it claimed: "We primarily discussed a program about the adoption of Russian children." We're almost to them conceding that they conspired with the Russians and hoping for the partisanship of the MAGAdooks to protect them. Why shouldn't he admit that? Giuliani has looked through the statutes and determined that collusion isn't a crime. It's a normal part of any campaign.
	__________________ I don't trust atoms. They make up everything.

5th August 2018, 09:34 AM	#351
alfaniner Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Sorth Dakonsin Posts: 24,896	Originally Posted by Squeegee Beckenheim Why shouldn't he admit that? Giuliani has looked through the statutes and determined that collusion isn't a crime. It's a normal part of any campaign. It's (probably) not illegal if you are dealing with domestic entities. But with a foreign government? Nuh-uh. This is going to blow up big time.
	__________________ Science is self-correcting. Woo is self-contradicting.

5th August 2018, 02:30 PM	#352
Stacyhs Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Mar 2016 Location: United States Posts: 18,031	Originally Posted by alfaniner It's (probably) not illegal if you are dealing with domestic entities. But with a foreign government? Nuh-uh. This is going to blow up big time. One could normally safely assume so. But we are talking Trump supporters here. Not your normal bunch. The "pussy tape" would normally have sunk any candidate's campaign but not Trump's. Trump has survived many things that would have ended the chances for election of a normal candidate. The key word here is 'normal'. And that is something Trump is not in more than one way.

5th August 2018, 02:33 PM	#353
Skeptic Ginger Nasty Woman Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 87,032	It was so obviously legal they all lied about it and changed their stories dozens of times.

5th August 2018, 03:23 PM	#354
Stacyhs Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Mar 2016 Location: United States Posts: 18,031	Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger It was so obviously legal they all lied about it and changed their stories dozens of times. You see that. I see that. Any logical person sees that. Trump's base will find some excuse to justify it. We've seen it over and over again from them as in "it was just locker room talk".

5th August 2018, 04:26 PM	#355
Armitage72 Philosopher Join Date: Mar 2012 Location: Rochester, NY Posts: 5,263	We've already seen Trump supporters thanking Russia for helping to save them from Hillary. Why would that change?