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Tags 2020 elections , Elizabeth Warren , Massachusetts politics , presidential candidates , racial categorization , racial isssues

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Old 15th October 2018, 07:13 AM   #241
varwoche
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Originally Posted by Drewbot View Post
Conspiracy theorist?

She put 'NATIVE AMERICAN' on her bio at Harvard based on .0039 ancestry...
There's a range of what her Native American background is, and you've latched onto the bottom number of that range for some reason. Not that it matters, other than if you're calling someone out for stretching the truth, it's best not to stretch the truth.
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Old 15th October 2018, 07:23 AM   #242
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Originally Posted by Drewbot View Post
Conspiracy theorist?

She put 'NATIVE AMERICAN' on her bio at Harvard based on .0039 ancestry...
You clearly indicated going conspiracy theorist as your first option.

Last edited by johnny karate; 15th October 2018 at 07:25 AM.
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Old 15th October 2018, 07:24 AM   #243
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Originally Posted by varwoche View Post
There's a range of what her Native American background is, and you've latched onto the bottom number of that range for some reason. Not that it matters, other than if you're calling someone out for stretching the truth, it's best not to stretch the truth.
I'd like someone to demonstrate how Warren stretched the truth.
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Old 15th October 2018, 07:25 AM   #244
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Bustamante said that Warren’s test results show the “vast majority” of her ancestry is European, but that “the results strongly support the existence of an unadmixed Native American ancestor,” likely 6-10 generations ago.

Wait, wait, wait... she released this to SUPPORT her claim? That is hilarious.

And leftists are buying it?

Hey our family lore is that 6 to 10 generations ago someone might have been an Indian!

Oh mercy....

I am proud of my I am proud of my 1/64nd to 1/1024th Native South American ancestry too!

Last edited by The Big Dog; 15th October 2018 at 07:28 AM.
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Old 15th October 2018, 07:28 AM   #245
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
Bustamante said that Warren’s test results show the “vast majority” of her ancestry is European, but that “the results strongly support the existence of an unadmixed Native American ancestor,” likely 6-10 generations ago.

Wait, wait, wait... she released this to SUPPORT her claim?
Whoa. Lookit those goal posts go!

https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/...83/267/e8a.gif
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Old 15th October 2018, 07:30 AM   #246
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
Bustamante said that Warren’s test results show the “vast majority” of her ancestry is European, but that “the results strongly support the existence of an unadmixed Native American ancestor,” likely 6-10 generations ago.

Wait, wait, wait... she released this to SUPPORT her claim? That is hilarious.

And leftists are buying it?

Hey our family lore is that 6 to 10 generations ago someone might have been an Indian!

Oh mercy....
Warren claims Native American heritage.

Scientific evidence establishes she has Native American heritage.

TBD thinks it's silly to believe science.
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Old 15th October 2018, 07:32 AM   #247
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I suppose Trump will pay up that $1 million now.
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Old 15th October 2018, 07:32 AM   #248
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
Bustamante said that Warren’s test results show the “vast majority” of her ancestry is European, but that “the results strongly support the existence of an unadmixed Native American ancestor,” likely 6-10 generations ago.

Wait, wait, wait... she released this to SUPPORT her claim? That is hilarious.

And leftists are buying it?

Hey our family lore is that 6 to 10 generations ago someone might have been an Indian!

Oh mercy....

I am proud of my I am proud of my 1/64nd to 1/1024th Native South American ancestry too!
As I understand it the claim was both grandparents on one side had some native American ancestry. This would be consistent with that.
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Old 15th October 2018, 07:33 AM   #249
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Originally Posted by johnny karate View Post
Warren claims Native American heritage.

Scientific evidence establishes she has Native American heritage.

TBD thinks it's silly to believe science.
No I think it is silly to claim that one has Native American history because maybe someone 6 to 10 generations ago might have been native American. I guess you are not seeing how absolutely ludicrous that is?
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Old 15th October 2018, 07:34 AM   #250
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Originally Posted by Upchurch View Post
Whoa. Lookit those goal posts go!

https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/...83/267/e8a.gif
That was literally my first post in the thread!

That is amazing!
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Old 15th October 2018, 07:34 AM   #251
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Quote:
Detecting DNA for Native Americans is particularly tricky because there is an absence of Native American DNA available for comparison. This is in part because Native American leaders have asked tribal members not to participate in genetic databases.

The amount of genetic data that is available from Native Americans is sparse.

To make up for the dearth of Native American DNA, samples from Mexico, Peru, and Colombia were used to stand in for Native American.

The Boston Globe (Oct 15, 2018)

"The bad news for Pocahontas: she’s gotta swap the headdress for a sombrero. Señorita Warren."

-- James Woods (Oct 15, 2018)
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Old 15th October 2018, 07:35 AM   #252
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Originally Posted by johnny karate View Post
Warren claims Native American heritage.

Scientific evidence establishes she has Native American heritage.

TBD thinks it's silly to believe science.
Conservatives find this confusing.

See, Elizabeth Warren claims Native Heritage. She is mocked and derided for her claim.

She submits evidence that backs her claim. She is mocked and derided by conservatives for telling the truth.

Conservatives, who are dishonest, and lie all the time, are easily confused by evidence and facts.

Since conservatives lie all the time, they assume that the other side is constantly lying as well, even when faced with evidence that they are not.
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Old 15th October 2018, 07:38 AM   #253
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
No I think it is silly to claim that one has Native American history because maybe someone 6 to 10 generations ago might have been native American. I guess you are not seeing how absolutely ludicrous that is?
It doesn't matter how many generations back it is. It is still native American history.15 generations should would have been late 1600s. If you are the product of one coupling back then, that is ancestry.
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Old 15th October 2018, 07:40 AM   #254
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
No I think it is silly to claim that one has Native American history ancestry because maybe someone 6 to 10 generations ago might have been native American. I guess you are not seeing how absolutely ludicrous that is?
FIFY.

Warren claimed to have Native American ancestry. Warren provides scientific evidence of her Native American ancestry. Where is the ludicrous part?
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Old 15th October 2018, 07:40 AM   #255
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Originally Posted by johnny karate View Post
I've highlighted the relevant part of my post for you.

And please bear in mind that the right wing crank from where River gets his "information" claims that 90% of the planet's population can trace their ancestry to Native Americans.

Do you think 90% of the planet's population has Native American ancestry?
Unless you are engaged in a semantic argument, I miss the point of your highlight. People, even Native Americans, can move about the world and spawn children in other locations.

I have European ancestry and have never set foot in Europe.

As for River and his sources, I have no argument with you.
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Old 15th October 2018, 07:41 AM   #256
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
No I think it is silly to claim that one has Native American history because maybe someone 6 to 10 generations ago might have been native American. I guess you are not seeing how absolutely ludicrous that is?
The talking point issued from the Republicans Smear Machine was that she was lying.

At what point between then and after Warren proved she was telling the truth did you decide that her claiming Native American heritage at all is ludicrous?
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Old 15th October 2018, 07:42 AM   #257
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This has to be the dumbest thread topic. The DNA test results were always going to be meaningless on countless levels. I have always thought that Warren providing the DNA test results is just playing Trump's game. I would have replied to the Orange Pustule, "I'll produce them the moment Trump releases his tax returns that he promised to release. But maybe there is a good reason for Warren to do this and that is it becomes ancient news before the next election.
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Old 15th October 2018, 07:43 AM   #258
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Originally Posted by beren View Post
Unless you are engaged in a semantic argument, I miss the point of your highlight. People, even Native Americans, can move about the world and spawn children in other locations.

I have European ancestry and have never set foot in Europe.

As for River and his sources, I have no argument with you.
Perhaps there is a misunderstanding in my use of the word “peoples”. I was referring to population groups, not individual people.
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Old 15th October 2018, 07:43 AM   #259
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
Bustamante said that Warren’s test results show the “vast majority” of her ancestry is European, but that “the results strongly support the existence of an unadmixed Native American ancestor,” likely 6-10 generations ago.

Wait, wait, wait... she released this to SUPPORT her claim? That is hilarious.

And leftists are buying it?

Hey our family lore is that 6 to 10 generations ago someone might have been an Indian!

Oh mercy....

I am proud of my I am proud of my 1/64nd to 1/1024th Native South American ancestry too!

The error you are making is that you do not know what Warren's actual claim was. This evidence fully supports every claim I have ever heard her make.

Perhaps you can link to some claim that this evidence does not support?

For the record, if you only response is "she changed her ethnicity in her bio" then don't bother. That dog won't hunt unless you can show she claimed to more than she actually is.
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Old 15th October 2018, 07:44 AM   #260
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Originally Posted by johnny karate View Post
Perhaps there is a misunderstanding in my use of the word “peoples”. I was referring to population groups, not individual people.
I see, interpreted it differently. We are talking at cross purposes. Carry on.
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Old 15th October 2018, 07:45 AM   #261
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I... don't... care. I don't understand why Elizabeth Warren thought her homeopathic level of Native Americaness was something any of us were the least bit interested in and I don't care that the Republicans think it's a hill to die defending.

There is no angle to approach this discussion from that isn't stupid.
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Old 15th October 2018, 07:45 AM   #262
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
That was literally my first post in the thread!

That is amazing!
Yours was merely representative.
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Old 15th October 2018, 07:45 AM   #263
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
No I think it is silly to claim that one has Native American history because maybe someone 6 to 10 generations ago might have been native American. I guess you are not seeing how absolutely ludicrous that is?
My ancestors from England were in Maryland 10 or more generations ago (circa 1645). I guess it's ludicrous to claim I have British ancestry. At which generation was it still ok? And what do I say now if asked where my ancestors immigrated from?
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Old 15th October 2018, 07:46 AM   #264
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Originally Posted by beren View Post
The error you are making is that you do not know what Warren's actual claim was. This evidence fully supports every claim I have ever heard her make.

Perhaps you can link to some claim that this evidence does not support?

For the record, if you only response is "she changed her ethnicity in her bio" then don't bother. That dog won't hunt unless you can show she claimed to more than she actually is.
How about the claim that marking an ethnic background on a document based on family stories is poor character?
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Old 15th October 2018, 07:51 AM   #265
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Originally Posted by BobTheCoward View Post
How about the claim that marking an ethnic background on a document based on family stories is poor character?
Has Warren made that claim?
Otherwise I don't see her having a burden to support it.
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Old 15th October 2018, 07:52 AM   #266
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didn't she claim that she had a descendant from the Delaware or Cherokee tribes?

Yeah, no.
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Old 15th October 2018, 07:52 AM   #267
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Originally Posted by River View Post
Not sure this is reliable but found this.
This article looks like it was rewritten since I last read it. He's dropped the percentages and 10 generation bit and has come back with "you can't trust Democrats" routine.
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Old 15th October 2018, 07:57 AM   #268
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Originally Posted by beren View Post
Has Warren made that claim?
Otherwise I don't see her having a burden to support it.
It is a claim about the claim she made on that document. Her evidence at the time was flimsy.
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Old 15th October 2018, 07:57 AM   #269
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
didn't she claim that she had a descendant from the Delaware or Cherokee tribes?

Yeah, no.
In this thread, Big Dog is going to pretend that he highly values pinpoint accuracy in the statements of politicians. This is, of course, not the case. Rather, he only values slurring Democrats in any way possible.
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Old 15th October 2018, 07:58 AM   #270
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Originally Posted by BobTheCoward View Post
Quote:
Bustamante said that Warren’s test results show the “vast majority” of her ancestry is European, but that “the results strongly support the existence of an unadmixed Native American ancestor,” likely 6-10 generations ago.
As I understand it the claim was both grandparents on one side had some native American ancestry. This would be consistent with that.
Furthermore, if a 'generation' is 25-30 years, that would put the time frame of her native ancestory somewhere around the early 1800s. While that may be outside 'living' memory, it is certainly not ancient history. I know people who have built family trees that go back that far.
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Old 15th October 2018, 07:59 AM   #271
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Originally Posted by I Am The Scum View Post
In this thread, Big Dog is going to pretend that he highly values pinpoint accuracy in the statements of politicians. This is, of course, not the case. Rather, he only values slurring Democrats in any way possible.
In this thread, we are going to pretend that tu quoque is an actual argument that is worth consideration.

This is, of course, not the case. Rather, leftists only value slurring other posters in any way possible.
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Old 15th October 2018, 08:00 AM   #272
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Originally Posted by Segnosaur View Post
Furthermore, if a 'generation' is 25-30 years, that would put the time frame of her native ancestory somewhere around the early 1800s. While that may be outside 'living' memory, it is certainly not ancient history. I know people who have built family trees that go back that far.
I've got much of mine way past that. Mind you, the major work was not done by me.
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Old 15th October 2018, 08:03 AM   #273
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Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
I... don't... care. I don't understand why Elizabeth Warren thought her homeopathic level of Native Americaness was something any of us were the least bit interested in and I don't care that the Republicans think it's a hill to die defending.

There is no angle to approach this discussion from that isn't stupid.
Tell that to Trump, who has repeatedly attacked her based on her claims of Native american ancestry.

He even offered her $1 million if she took a DNA test.

If we didn't have Stubby McBonespurs sitting in the white house, Warren's genetic history probably wouldn't have been an issue. Trump made it so.
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Old 15th October 2018, 08:04 AM   #274
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Originally Posted by Segnosaur View Post
Tell that to Trump, who has repeatedly attacked her based on her claims of Native american ancestry.

He even offered her $1 million if she took a DNA test.

If we didn't have Stubby McBonespurs sitting in the white house, Warren's genetic history probably wouldn't have been an issue. Trump made it so.
Okay well you made noise at half of what I said.

Trump made it is an issue, but for him to do that she would have at least first made it a... point I guess.
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Old 15th October 2018, 08:05 AM   #275
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Originally Posted by I Am The Scum View Post
In this thread, Big Dog is going to pretend that he highly values pinpoint accuracy in the statements of politicians. This is, of course, not the case. Rather, he only values slurring Democrats in any way possible.
Warren's claim is that her parents had to elope because her Father's family didn't like her Mother's family because of alleged Native blood. So they eloped, from Oklahoma.

I don't particularly care for Warren, but she's used this story about the overwhelming nature of bigotry in those days, not for any benefit of her own.

Meanwhile, House Majority Leader Kevin McCarthy claims indian ancestry that is much more suspect, is a member of a fake tribe, and has gained minority contracts from this connection. https://splinternews.com/top-house-r...rom-1829750894
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Old 15th October 2018, 08:06 AM   #276
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Originally Posted by Segnosaur View Post
Furthermore, if a 'generation' is 25-30 years, that would put the time frame of her native ancestory somewhere around the early 1800s. While that may be outside 'living' memory, it is certainly not ancient history. I know people who have built family trees that go back that far.
You forget that she was born in 1949, which would place six generations back at 1795. That creates so many problems with the Cherokee/delaware claim.

ETA: 1795 is pretty close to early 1800s though, but I wanted to call specific attention to the issues around the trail of tears.

Last edited by BobTheCoward; 15th October 2018 at 08:08 AM.
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Old 15th October 2018, 08:07 AM   #277
quadraginta
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Originally Posted by Slings and Arrows View Post
"The bad news for Pocahontas: she’s gotta swap the headdress for a sombrero. Señorita Warren."

-- James Woods (Oct 15, 2018)

Because Native Americans from south of the border aren't Real Native Anericans™.

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Old 15th October 2018, 08:08 AM   #278
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Originally Posted by quadraginta View Post
Because Native Americans from south of the border aren't Real Native Anericans™.

Yeah. They crossed the border that didn't exist yet to take jobs from real Native Americans and have anchor babies.
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Old 15th October 2018, 08:08 AM   #279
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post

Wait, wait, wait... she released this to SUPPORT her claim? That is hilarious.
The thing is - THIS IS EXACTLY WHAT SHE CLAIMED ALL ALONG!!

It was the conservatives who made a big deal of it - not her. She never claimed to have very much native ancestry at all. She had family lore of a native ancestor some generations back, she mentioned that, and conservatives and Republicans freaked out because she looks white.

Guess what? She told the truth, the genetics support her claim.

But hey, gotta move those goalposts, don't you?

Last edited by crescent; 15th October 2018 at 08:11 AM.
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Old 15th October 2018, 08:08 AM   #280
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Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
Trump made it is an issue, but for him to do that she would have at least first made it a... point I guess.
No, a political opponent first made a ...point of it when digging into her background looking for dirt. The history has been outlined in the thread.
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