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Tags donald trump , James Comey , Michael Flynn , Russia conspiracies , Trump administration , Trump controversies , Trump-Russia connections

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Old 10th May 2017, 10:52 AM   #441
SezMe
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
"No there is no distinction because "Hillary's handling of the email scandal" directly substantively caused the public's reaction to the scandal."

tell me what part of that crystal clear, unmistakably definitive answer you are having trouble with.
I hope you don't mind me jumping in here. Those words give me trouble. Can you say more?
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Old 10th May 2017, 10:56 AM   #442
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Originally Posted by SezMe View Post
I hope you don't mind me jumping in here. Those words give me trouble. Can you say more?
Sure, handling was part of a quote and in that usage includes things like her repeatedly changing her story, aka, lying about it.

which directly caused and substantively caused the public's reaction
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Old 10th May 2017, 10:59 AM   #443
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Originally Posted by jimbob View Post
The Nixon Library has tweeted the following
It is an affront to Nixon's legacy to be compared to the Orange Menace.
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Old 10th May 2017, 11:02 AM   #444
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
DOJ is claiming that Comey's claim that he asked for more money and resources for the Russian investigation is 100% false.

interesting....
Lets see...

We've got multiple major media outlets all reporting that a request for more resources took place. We've also got officials associated with congress that say requests were made.

On the other hand, from what I can see the "spokesman" saying that no request was made seems to be Ian Prior, who has only been with the DOJ for a month or 2. (So he came to the office after Trump was elected, and has served as Session's mouthpiece in the past.)

Given the amount (and quality) of evidence as presented on both sides, I think that it much more likely that Comey asked for the resources, and that Prior is just trying to cover up.

http://www.latimes.com/politics/wash...htmlstory.html

https://ballotpedia.org/Ian_Prior
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Old 10th May 2017, 11:05 AM   #445
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
Can I borrow your rather patronizing style? I understand your OPINION is that there was no "actual content of the scandal - was there any wrondoing in her handling of emails."

Your opinion is of course objectively wrong, of course.
In your opinion, of course...

Originally Posted by BobTheCoward View Post
Hacked voter databases: that isn't election wrongdoing. They could be hacked for reasons other than the election (identity theft). Hacking the databases with intent to alter the election is election wrongdoing.
25 of them with at least 4 known to be penetrated? And there certainly hasn't been any investigation that we know of to establish their non-effect on the election. At a bare minimum they are grounds to call it's legitimacy into question.

Quote:
Unsecured voting machines: Every unlocked doors is not evidence that a robbery took place.
We've known since the early-mid 2000s that EVMs are vulnerable to hacking/rigging and that has been PROVEN by an independent investigation conducted in part by Senator Zel Miller.

http://www.hackingdemocracy.com/

Also I'll refer you to the special election in GA's 6th District recently. Voter identification machines were stolen from several polling places in Fulton County, and a memory card that "didn't scan correctly" on the first pass went missing for some time. When found and re-scanned, Jon Ossoff's margin of victory in a VERY heavily Democratic area dropped below the 50% needed to outright win, forcing a runoff.

http://www.ajc.com/news/local-govt--...XaJwMbmNYCMwL/

http://www.fox5atlanta.com/news/249413136-story

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2017...-machines.html

I was following the FB coverage of Ossoff that night, and the official reports don't really begin to cover the irregularities that commenters were reporting. Fulton Co has apparently a long history of "dodgy" election issues.
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Old 10th May 2017, 11:06 AM   #446
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Originally Posted by Segnosaur View Post
Lets see...

We've got multiple major media outlets all reporting that a request for more resources took place. We've also got officials associated with congress that say requests were made.

On the other hand, from what I can see the "spokesman" saying that no request was made seems to be Ian Prior, who has only been with the DOJ for a month or 2. (So he came to the office after Trump was elected, and has served as Session's mouthpiece in the past.)

Given the amount (and quality) of evidence as presented on both sides, I think that it much more likely that Comey asked for the resources, and that Prior is just trying to cover up.

http://www.latimes.com/politics/wash...htmlstory.html

https://ballotpedia.org/Ian_Prior
I assume you misunderstood. They are reporting that Comey said he asked for more money and resources.

The DOJ is not disputing that he said it, they are saying he did not ask for it.
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Old 10th May 2017, 11:09 AM   #447
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
I assume you misunderstood. They are reporting that Comey said he asked for more money and resources.

The DOJ is not disputing that he said it, they are saying he did not ask for it.
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Old 10th May 2017, 11:10 AM   #448
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Originally Posted by sts60 View Post
Well, I'm sure there was a U.S. flag there as well, just not in that particular shot. But the sequence perfectly captured the contempt for Western democracy held by Putin's merry mob, and endorsed by Tillerson and Trump and the rest of their corrupt, kleptocratic gang.

You may share their viewpoint, or you may just be too concerned with jabbing at them libruls to notice. I don't really care; your posturing and concern trolling don't interest me. What does is the subversion of America's democracy and institutions by a hostile foreign power, and the active and passive enabling of it by a host of corrupt participants and useful idiots.
Who would have ever guessed that conservative Republicans who included members of the John Birch Society and cut their political teeth fighting the "Red Menace" would later be happy - if not eager - to get in bed with them? It's a stunning turn of events.
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Old 10th May 2017, 11:15 AM   #449
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Originally Posted by SezMe View Post
Who would have ever guessed that conservative Republicans who included members of the John Birch Society and cut their political teeth fighting the "Red Menace" would later be happy - if not eager - to get in bed with them? It's a stunning turn of events.
They hate Democrats even more, it seems.
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Old 10th May 2017, 11:16 AM   #450
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
Sure, handling was part of a quote and in that usage includes things like her repeatedly changing her story, aka, lying about it.

which directly caused and substantively caused the public's reaction
As you might expect, I disagree. Whether Clinton changed her story or not, the reason she had to keep talking about it was the incessant drip-drip-drip of email leaks from Wikileaks (read: Russians). The whole thing would have been a non-issue had that not taken place. Of course, Comey did yeoman service in assisting that dripping.
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Old 10th May 2017, 11:17 AM   #451
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
My favorite was when you said that they walked by a Russian flag into a White House office. Scary!

Look at the flag in the gif.

Then look at this.

http://img.112.international/origina.../02/261713.jpg
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Old 10th May 2017, 11:20 AM   #452
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Originally Posted by TraneWreck View Post
I think this may be the biggest immediate concern. I don't think Trump can stall investigations - it's too widely known now - but he could disappear some important stuff.
He's already stalled them via lack of funds.

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/fbi-d...ry?id=47318625

Removing Comey is just the last nail in the coffin. He's already demonstated he won't follow the laws protecting potential evidence.
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Old 10th May 2017, 11:21 AM   #453
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
DOJ is claiming that Comey's claim that he asked for more money and resources for the Russian investigation is 100% false.

interesting....
In other news, water is wet.

You aren't even trying BD. Sad.
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Old 10th May 2017, 11:22 AM   #454
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Originally Posted by C_Felix View Post
snip
The New York times is reporting that Comey told the Congress that he asked for more money and resources.

The DOJ is not denying that he told Congress that. they are denying that Comey asked Rosenstein for more money or more resources for the Russia investigation

pretty simple.
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Old 10th May 2017, 11:23 AM   #455
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
I assume you misunderstood. They are reporting that Comey said he asked for more money and resources.
Uhh, no.

From: http://www.latimes.com/politics/wash...htmlstory.html
Comey met last week with Rod Rosenstein, the new deputy attorney general, and asked for both money and personnel to pursue the Russia probe, according to two officials
...

One Democratic congressional aide said the request was for a “significant increase in resources.”



Notice there? Its not Comey saying "I asked for more resources". There are Multiple people (who are not Comey) who have said they were privy to Comey asking for more resources.


In other words, the evidence points it it happening as described. Comey asks for more resources, then Trump fires him.



Quote:
The DOJ is not disputing that he said it, they are saying he did not ask for it.
Which means that the DOJ spokesman who is disputing what was said is likely a lying sack of crap.
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Old 10th May 2017, 11:24 AM   #456
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Originally Posted by SezMe View Post
As you might expect, I disagree. Whether Clinton changed her story or not, the reason she had to keep talking about it was the incessant drip-drip-drip of email leaks from Wikileaks (read: Russians). The whole thing would have been a non-issue had that not taken place. Of course, Comey did yeoman service in assisting that dripping.
wikileaks was releasing Podesta's emails, not Clintons.
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Old 10th May 2017, 11:24 AM   #457
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Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
Is it possible you meant this?
No, I meant what I said. The DC regime is not a legitimate government. It does not have a provably clean claim to power.
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Old 10th May 2017, 11:25 AM   #458
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Originally Posted by ChristianProgressive View Post
In other news, water is wet.

You aren't even trying BD. Sad.
wait, are you denying that the DOJ is saying that it did not happen?

Because facts is facts.
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Old 10th May 2017, 11:26 AM   #459
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Originally Posted by uke2se View Post
It's not justified in the context in which it happened. Trump applauded Comey's actions. Also, that was almost a year ago. Firing Comey now is almost certainly not about his handling of the Clinton affair. Therefore, this does more than make Trump look bad. It makes it look like the safeguards of democracy in the US are under attack, and Congress is doing nothing about it.
Oh, I agree this wasn't about Clinton. But I see the timing as a plus. The safeguards of democracy in the U.S. were already under attack before Comey was fired. IMO it's a good thing Trump's timing looks so bad.

Comey wasn't the only guy in the FBI investigating Russia ties. There are still career prosecutors who have an interest in pursuing Trump ties to Russia. Unfortunately, IMO, the Russia thing is a wild goose chase. Trump publicly called on Russia to interfere in the election process. It was on TV. What can investigators find that's worse?
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Old 10th May 2017, 11:27 AM   #460
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Originally Posted by portlandatheist View Post
It is an affront to Nixon's legacy to be compared to the Orange Menace.
Nixon couldn't even get nominated by todays alt-right GOP.

FFS, we'd be better off with Nixon...which is a frightening thought.
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Old 10th May 2017, 11:30 AM   #461
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Originally Posted by Segnosaur View Post
Uhh, no.

From: http://www.latimes.com/politics/wash...htmlstory.html
Comey met last week with Rod Rosenstein, the new deputy attorney general, and asked for both money and personnel to pursue the Russia probe, according to two officials
...

One Democratic congressional aide said the request was for a “significant increase in resources.”



Notice there? Its not Comey saying "I asked for more resources". There are Multiple people (who are not Comey) who have said they were privy to Comey asking for more resources.


In other words, the evidence points it it happening as described. Comey asks for more resources, then Trump fires him.




Which means that the DOJ spokesman who is disputing what was said is likely a lying sack of crap.
No... they were CONGRESSIONAL officials who were told by Comey that he asked for more resources, they were obviously not in the meeting with Comey and his boss.

C'mon man.

the Times broke the story, here is what they say:

Quote:
Days before he was fired, James B. Comey, the former F.B.I. director, asked the Justice Department for a significant increase in resources for the bureau’s investigation into Russia’s interference in the presidential election, according to four congressional officials, including Senator Richard J. Durbin.

Mr. Comey made his appeal to Rod J. Rosenstein, the deputy attorney general, who also wrote the Justice Department’s memo that was used to justify the firing of Mr. Comey this week, the officials said.
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/05/10/u...-fbi.html?_r=0
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Old 10th May 2017, 11:32 AM   #462
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
wait, are you denying that the DOJ is saying that it did not happen?

Because facts is facts.
Actually, the spokesman for the DOJ, who was brought in after Trump was elected, and who has served as the mouthpiece for Sessions has said it did not happen. i.e. all we have it this point is a claim by a single individual (with ties to Trump) that it did not happen.

We do not have statements from people like Rosenstein (i.e. someone directly involved in the request) saying it did not happen. But we do have statements from others who were privy to the meeting who said a request was made.

So, either the DOJ spokesman is simply misinformed (since he can't be expected to know everything that happened in every meeting) or he's a lying sack of crap and is covering for Trump.
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Old 10th May 2017, 11:32 AM   #463
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Originally Posted by Minoosh View Post
Oh, I agree this wasn't about Clinton. But I see the timing as a plus. The safeguards of democracy in the U.S. were already under attack before Comey was fired. IMO it's a good thing Trump's timing looks so bad.

Comey wasn't the only guy in the FBI investigating Russia ties. There are still career prosecutors who have an interest in pursuing Trump ties to Russia. Unfortunately, IMO, the Russia thing is a wild goose chase. Trump publicly called on Russia to interfere in the election process. It was on TV. What can investigators find that's worse?
They can find financial ties between Trump and Putin. They can find documented evidence of outright treason, collaboration of the Trump campaign in the hack of the DNC, or even evidence of back-channels with the hackers, or those who ordered it.

You might have noticed, but it's become something of a national pastime interpreting what Trump means when he speaks. To his supporters, he always mean what they want him to mean. To those of us with some remaining sanity, he speaks BS. What he meant when he called on Russia to hack the Democrats can be explained away. Hard, documentary evidence, can't to the same extent.

After all this is over, provided the US retains a democratically elected government, people are going to go to court over this. Discovery for that process has started.
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Old 10th May 2017, 11:32 AM   #464
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
wait, are you denying that the DOJ is saying that it did not happen?

Because facts is facts.
No, I am saying that it is not in any way news that they deny it. Liars lie, thats what they do.

That you even bothered to post about their pathetically obvious, self-serving lie is just lazy.
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Old 10th May 2017, 11:33 AM   #465
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Originally Posted by ChristianProgressive View Post
No, I meant what I said. The DC regime is not a legitimate government. It does not have a provably clean claim to power.
Sorry, my mind blanked on the ' not'. It was like it wasn't there. But it was.
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Old 10th May 2017, 11:34 AM   #466
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
The New York times is reporting that Comey told the Congress that he asked for more money and resources.

The DOJ is not denying that he told Congress that. they are denying that Comey asked Rosenstein for more money or more resources for the Russia investigation

pretty simple.
Word salad.
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Old 10th May 2017, 11:34 AM   #467
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Originally Posted by Segnosaur View Post
Actually, the spokesman for the DOJ, who was brought in after Trump was elected, and who has served as the mouthpiece for Sessions has said it did not happen. i.e. all we have it this point is a claim by a single individual (with ties to Trump) that it did not happen.

We do not have statements from people like Rosenstein (i.e. someone directly involved in the request) saying it did not happen. But we do have statements from others who were privy to the meeting who said a request was made.

So, either the DOJ spokesman is simply misinformed (since he can't be expected to know everything that happened in every meeting) or he's a lying sack of crap and is covering for Trump.
The claim that they were privy to the meeting is utterly false

Rosenstein through the DOJ spokesman denied it.

C'mon folks, this is so *********** basic at this point.
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Old 10th May 2017, 11:38 AM   #468
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Originally Posted by C_Felix View Post
Word salad.
do you really not understand English?

Durbin told the Times that Comey said Comey asked Rosenstein for more money and resources.

Rosenstein through DOJ spox denies that Comey asked him for it.

These are literally undisputed facts regarding the issue.
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Old 10th May 2017, 11:38 AM   #469
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Quote:
“When asked what the parenthetical ‘C’ meant before a paragraph within the captioned email, [Clinton] stated she did not know and could only speculate it was referencing paragraphs marked in alphabetical order,” read the FBI’s notes from the interview.A “C” in parentheses in the body of an email is used to designate a specific paragraph as containing classified information.
This despite her training, her signing a document saying she understood this stuff, and of course no other letters of the alphabet appearing in the body of the text like that to even think its "referencing paragraphs in alphabetical order" because that's totally a thing.

But back to the topic at hand...
Comey's firing had nothing to do with Clinton and everything to do with freaking out about the FBI Trump-Russia investigation.
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Old 10th May 2017, 11:39 AM   #470
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Personally, I can't wait for new FBI director Nugent to get to the bottom of all of this.
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Old 10th May 2017, 11:40 AM   #471
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Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
Sorry, my mind blanked on the ' not'. It was like it wasn't there. But it was.
NP
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Old 10th May 2017, 11:41 AM   #472
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Originally Posted by Segnosaur View Post
Uhh, no.

From: http://www.latimes.com/politics/wash...htmlstory.html
Comey met last week with Rod Rosenstein, the new deputy attorney general, and asked for both money and personnel to pursue the Russia probe, according to two officials
...

One Democratic congressional aide said the request was for a “significant increase in resources.”



Notice there? Its not Comey saying "I asked for more resources". There are Multiple people (who are not Comey) who have said they were privy to Comey asking for more resources.


In other words, the evidence points it it happening as described. Comey asks for more resources, then Trump fires him.




Which means that the DOJ spokesman who is disputing what was said is likely a lying sack of crap.
Someone in the Trump administration that is a lying sack of crap? Say it isn't so.
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Old 10th May 2017, 11:46 AM   #473
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Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
Someone in the Trump administration that is a lying sack of crap? Say it isn't so.
It ain't so, the claim that the Congressional officials were privy to the meeting between Comey and his boss is a lie.
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Old 10th May 2017, 11:49 AM   #474
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The plot thickens.

Quote:
FBI chief sought more funds for Russia probe days before he was fired: NYT

Former FBI Director James Comey had requested additional funding and personnel for the agency's probe into alleged Russian interference in the 2016 presidential election just days before he was fired, the New York Times reported on Wednesday.

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-us...-idUSKBN186296
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Old 10th May 2017, 11:50 AM   #475
C_Felix
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
do you really not understand English?

Durbin told the Times that Comey said Comey asked Rosenstein for more money and resources.

Rosenstein through DOJ spox denies that Comey asked him for it.

These are literally undisputed facts regarding the issue.
Your point is, the DOJ is not disputing that Mr. Comey asked for more money, they are saying he did not ask for it.
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Old 10th May 2017, 11:53 AM   #476
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Quote:
But Sarah Isgur Flores, the Justice Department spokeswoman, said “the idea that he asked for more funding” for the Russia investigation was “totally false.”
So let me get this straight...

Flores, who is part of the Trump administration, and who has worked closely with Sessions (who earlier had recused himself from the Russian investigation), is someone you think can be trusted to give an honest accounting of a meeting she probably wasn't even at?

Do you notice a pattern here? Those who are saying that Comey asked for more resources include a wide range of people. The people who are claiming that it was a "lie" that Comey asked for more money are all involved with Trump in some way.
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Old 10th May 2017, 11:54 AM   #477
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Originally Posted by C_Felix View Post
Your point is, the DOJ is not disputing that Mr. Comey asked for more money, they are saying he did not ask for it.
Your point is, the DOJ is not disputing that Mr. Comey TOLD DURBIN AND OTHER ASSOCIATED CONGRESS CRITTERS THAT HE asked for more money, they are saying he did not ask for it.

See how simple that is?
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Old 10th May 2017, 11:56 AM   #478
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
It ain't so, the claim that the Congressional officials were privy to the meeting between Comey and his boss is a lie.
And you know that how? You think Comey and his staff as well as the White House never told a soul? Aren't you cute.
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Old 10th May 2017, 11:58 AM   #479
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Originally Posted by Segnosaur View Post
So let me get this straight...

Flores, who is part of the Trump administration, and who has worked closely with Sessions (who earlier had recused himself from the Russian investigation), is someone you think can be trusted to give an honest accounting of a meeting she probably wasn't even at?

Do you notice a pattern here? Those who are saying that Comey asked for more resources include a wide range of people. The people who are claiming that it was a "lie" that Comey asked for more money are all involved with Trump in some way.
Wow, at this point I can only assume you are deliberately misrepresenting the facts. there is no "wide range of people."
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Old 10th May 2017, 12:01 PM   #480
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Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
And you know that how? You think Comey and his staff as well as the White House never told a soul? Aren't you cute.
face palm.

I know because the Congress people who talked to the times were not at the meeting.

Learn what hearsay is.

Blown away by how obtuse people are.

Really, i am just laying out the facts of what the two sides of the dispute are, and people cannot understand something so simple.

Last edited by The Big Dog; 10th May 2017 at 12:14 PM.
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