Drag Shows!! - Page 4

The Great Zaganza · 15th December 2022, 10:13 AM

It's always a slippery slope if the OTHERS do it.

Resume · 15th December 2022, 10:16 AM

Quote:

Because not wanting your young children exposed to cross-dressing freaks . . .

Better keep 'em away from churches, priests, pastors, bishops . . .

ETA: And Monty Python, especially Monty Python.

bruto · 15th December 2022, 10:17 AM

Originally Posted by 3point14

Except, of course, the freedom to put on clothes of the opposite sex and talk to children. Unless, of course, you're a lady, in which case wear clothes of the opposite sex all you like.

I continue to believe this is all mental.

So far...

Craig4 · 15th December 2022, 10:17 AM

Originally Posted by sarge

I have two Cobra Golds under my belt and I never accidentally had sex with a Thai boy.

As long as you enjoyed it and there was mutual consent, that's all that matters.

bluesjnr · 15th December 2022, 10:19 AM

Originally Posted by sarge

I have two Cobra Golds under my belt and I never accidentally had sex with a Thai boy.

I hear ya bro....

Armitage72 · 15th December 2022, 11:02 AM

Originally Posted by bruto

So far...

I remember AM radio raving lunatic Michael Savage vehemently criticizing a politician in California (a Democrat, naturally) because she wore jeans in public.

Skeptic Ginger · 15th December 2022, 11:12 AM

Originally Posted by Warp12

So are you saying that parents should not have a voice in a what their children are exposed to? That it is ok to actively attempt to silence them? The particular objection is hardly the main point, here.

Unless the position is, "I approve of xyz, therefore nobody else is deserving of a voice".

Taking that last sentence: "I disapprove of xyz, therefore nobody else is deserving of a voice".

Who is being silenced again?

Parents who want to stop drag shows for kids such as the one where men in drag read books to kids at the library

Why don't these parents just intervene with their own kids instead of everyone's?

xjx388 · 15th December 2022, 11:13 AM

Originally Posted by Warp12

Sure it does. The intent is to overload the content in order to drown out the voices of the concerned. Eventually this invariably leads to the "tip line" becoming unviable.

Besides you have already fairly well stated that you think it is ok to silence their voices, anyway.

When this group gets a tip, the plan is that they will go protest and/or try to get the show shut down.

This group is attempting to silence the voices of parents who want to take their kids to these shows.

Fight fire with fire, I say.

Look, these concerned parents are not my ******* parents. Control your own kids and stay away from mine.

Skeptic Ginger · 15th December 2022, 11:18 AM

Originally Posted by Warp12

No, I don't support the universal ban you mention. I support parents having a voice, and I support age-appropriate restrictions be in place for such events.

Age appropriate by whose opinion?

Originally Posted by Warp12

But again, this is more about the whole concept of silencing parental concerns, imo. It is a common liberal theme, these days. My individual concerns about Drag Queens are minor in the grand scheme, and I have no interest in continuously debating them.

Round and round you go ignoring other's point and repeating yours.

It's a common right-wing theme, force everyone to follow alt-right Christian beliefs by making everyone comply via laws, regulations and other forms of interference.

shemp · 15th December 2022, 11:23 AM

Originally Posted by sarge

I have two Cobra Golds under my belt and I never accidentally had sex with a Thai boy.

So, it was intentional?

Gulliver Foyle · 15th December 2022, 11:51 AM

Originally Posted by bluesjnr

I always find this accusation interesting. Would you care to share exactly what unacceptable feelings or impulses Warp12 is attributing to someone else and what it is he is avoiding confronting?

He did say he loved the first couple of series. To love the first couple of seconds of a Brendan O'Carroll show you first need to have your sense of humour surgically removed.

Don't forget RTÉ inflicted him on us for years before he moved across the water.

autumn1971 · 15th December 2022, 12:18 PM

Originally Posted by Warp12

Hilarious. So you figure their concern, about say, a completely unrestricted Drag Queen event at a public venue..is entirely unreasonable? So you figure the best thing to do is silence their voices? That'll teach 'em to be concerned about their kids, right?

Interesting.

How wrong could this post be? How are parents being silenced?

Not “How are parents being exposed to opinions they don’t like”

Not “how are parents being forced to take their kids to drag shows”

How, in your Warped mind, (not meant to be offensive, just couldn’t resist the pun,) has the government silenced these parents’ ability to have their message heard?
I’ve just now heard about their opinion on a “leftist” forum, how did the silencing of every parent fail to prevent me from hearing their concerns?

Warp12 · 15th December 2022, 12:23 PM

Originally Posted by autumn1971

How wrong could this post be? How are parents being silenced?

Not “How are parents being exposed to opinions they don’t like”

Not “how are parents being forced to take their kids to drag shows”

How, in your Warped mind, (not meant to be offensive, just couldn’t resist the pun,) has the government silenced these parents’ ability to have their message heard?
I’ve just now heard about their opinion on a “leftist” forum, how did the silencing of every parent fail to prevent me from hearing their concerns?

I think you may be confused about the debate. Nobody said the government was attempting to silence them. Maybe read through the thread; it has all been discussed.

Carrot Flower King · 15th December 2022, 12:24 PM

And it's not an awfully long time ago that boy children wore dresses and had long curls and wore pink...

I must say that going to drag shows like panto and church never made me want to wear a skirt: my legs are too long and shaving them would result in huge bloodshed...

And I once had a colleague who did a great act as Marilyn Monroe (especially good as he was of Italian extraction and had somewhat olive skin) and it never made me (blond and pale) want to dress up as Jane Russell.

deadrose · 15th December 2022, 12:43 PM

A bit surprised nobody's brought up the incident down the road from us - I was pretty sure it made national news at least. The local taproom (which is family friendly) has had a monthly drag storytime for over a year. A few weeks ago, some anti-drag folks found out and announced a big protest outside the taproom. The next day, someone fired shots at their front window.

The original protest group cancelled, as it was not their intention to cause violence, the few protestors were greatly outnumbered by counter-protestors, and storytime went on as usual. I bet a lot of patrons are choosing seats away from the windows now, though.

Honestly, shooting up a business because of a drag story hour? What is the difference between the reader showing up as a drag queen, a clown, a princess, or a purple dinosaur? It's all just dress-up to the kids. It's only weird when you make it so.

I honestly don't know how people miss that they're being led by the nose to the Right Wing Outrage of the Week, whether it's satanic panics, her emails, children being trafficked by furniture sales, drag queens, gay teachers... the list is endless, and every time one loses steam they just start another.

Please note: No, I will NOT get sidetracked into discussing every other right wing outrage. This thread is for drag performers. You know, like the Pythons and Milton Berle.

Norman Alexander · 15th December 2022, 12:44 PM

I suspect everyone has missed the point about these conservatives wanting to stop drags reading to kids. It's the "reading to kids" part, not the drag.

Heaven knows, they might read them some filth, like classic American children's literature such as Tom Sawyer and Huckleberry Finn, or exciting modern literature like Dr Suess. Or stories about children and people in other countries. And that might trigger an impulse to be curious and read more, and find out more about more stuff, and broaden their minds!

No, this shall not stand, sayeth the conservatives! Education is anathema! The children might learn about something more than the limited, biased, nasty ******* tripe they as parents know. Then the kids will not grow up to be those parents.

So better to shame the drags who read to their kids than admit they can't read themselves.

Carrot Flower King · 15th December 2022, 12:52 PM

Just think back to the days when we only had 2 TV channels here and yet drag performers, or other performers dragging up, were regularly on mainstream comedy and light entertainment shows (Dick Emery, Danny La Rue - a favourite of my paternal grandmother, who also loved the camp of the Staurday afternoon wrestling - Les Dawson and..and...)It's amazing that we aren't just a bunch of out and out queens, isn't it?

Upchurch · 15th December 2022, 12:53 PM

Originally Posted by Warp12

Nobody said the government was attempting to silence them.

In fact, nobody is attempting to silence them.

Venom · 15th December 2022, 01:35 PM

Oh stfu with the "concerned parents". They are brainwashed parents.

How was this never a problem before until rightwing pundits made it one?

mgidm86 · 15th December 2022, 02:47 PM

Originally Posted by Upchurch

No, but calling them freaks might.

I don't ignore people who disagree with me, I ignore haters, instigators and people who have nothing of value to add. Anyone calling them freaks...I just don't need to engage with that person. Someone like that adds nothing to a discussion or to my own life.

MarkCorrigan · 15th December 2022, 02:54 PM

Originally Posted by Warp12

Bob, do you think there is a possibility that some of these shows are unrestricted? Or that a child might attend without parental consent, or with someone besides a parent or legal guardian? Do you think parents can be all places, at all times?

Well no, but you still haven't explained why it's an issue.

Originally Posted by Warp12

By your logic why do we need to restrict alcohol, tobacco,

Physically dangerous and chemically addictive. How is this equitable with drag shows?

Originally Posted by Warp12

movies?

Potentially psychologically damaging. How is that equitable with drag shows?

Originally Posted by Warp12

After it is just a simple matter of the parent handling such matters at all times, right? Honestly, I find your argument ridiculous and not worthy of further consideration.

Does your back hurt? I reckon you should get a sports massage or something man, carrying all that straw can't be good for you.

Originally Posted by Warp12

And you still haven't explained why it is acceptable to attempt to silence the voices of concerned parents, as some here seem to be advocating.

Because their "concern" is utterly ludicrous and without merit?

Just because some loony bigot is "concerned" that their child might learn that gay people and drag queens are actually, you know, people, doesn't mean their concern is valid nor worthwhile.

Please explain what the possible danger is from children attending a drag show.

mgidm86 · 15th December 2022, 03:10 PM

It's already been pointed out that movies are not restricted at all. There are no laws against minors walking into an R-rated movie. You don't need to ask him again, he won't answer anyways.

Libraries and drag shows are the targets. Not movies with the graphic depictions of death, or the hatred shown by many of the characters, or the cussing, or the boobies.

Movies for some reason are not the problem. Wanna watch John Wick murder hundreds of people? Go ahead! But don't you DARE go to the LIBRARY!

******* libr....lol I can't even say it...libraries and....BWAHAHAHA DRAG SHOWS are the concern!

Not the shot up schools. Mother ******* silence there.

Stacyhs · 15th December 2022, 03:21 PM

Originally Posted by Donal

If we can take a break from feeding the trolls who are successfully derailing another thread, what addresses can we report?

I heard there was a big drag event going on at 1010 Colorado Street in Austin.

jimbob · 15th December 2022, 03:43 PM

I've split the blackface discussion to

http://www.internationalskeptics.com...d.php?t=363530

Posted By:jimbob

Robin · 15th December 2022, 03:50 PM

Originally Posted by Warp12

It just makes you wonder what kind of man gets up in the morning and decides, "I'm going to dress like a woman, to flamboyant excess, and hopefully find some young kids to hang out with". it

I don't know about today, back in the sixties they were called pantomime performers. Sometimes Widow Twsnkey was the local Presbyterian minister.

Quote:

Well, if so, why are these weirdos doing it? For what benefit?

In the case of pantomime it was called "entertainment"

Quote:

We all know to what "benefit". To normalize such abnormal behaviors at a very early age. I mean, that is the best case scenario, I suppose.

I may have mentioned my Conservative voting, Daily Express reading, Church of Scotland attending great aunts back in the sixties who would sit down with us kids and watch Danny la Rue on the telly. They loved Danny la Rue.

I suppose you would claim they were grooming us.

Oh, by the way, are these people alleging that drag acts are 'grooming' the same ones that sex up their five year olds for those 'beauty pageants'?

Stacyhs · 15th December 2022, 03:55 PM

Originally Posted by deadrose

A bit surprised nobody's brought up the incident down the road from us - I was pretty sure it made national news at least. The local taproom (which is family friendly) has had a monthly drag storytime for over a year. A few weeks ago, some anti-drag folks found out and announced a big protest outside the taproom. The next day, someone fired shots at their front window.

The original protest group cancelled, as it was not their intention to cause violence, the few protestors were greatly outnumbered by counter-protestors, and storytime went on as usual. I bet a lot of patrons are choosing seats away from the windows now, though.

Honestly, shooting up a business because of a drag story hour? What is the difference between the reader showing up as a drag queen, a clown, a princess, or a purple dinosaur? It's all just dress-up to the kids. It's only weird when you make it so.

I honestly don't know how people miss that they're being led by the nose to the Right Wing Outrage of the Week, whether it's satanic panics, her emails, children being trafficked by furniture sales, drag queens, gay teachers... the list is endless, and every time one loses steam they just start another.

Please note: No, I will NOT get sidetracked into discussing every other right wing outrage. This thread is for drag performers. You know, like the Pythons and Milton Berle.

Re the highlighted: BINGO! If the right-wing doesn't have something new to be outraged by, afraid of, or offended by...they just invent one. I think that they aren't happy unless they're unhappy.

crescent · 15th December 2022, 03:56 PM

Originally Posted by deadrose

This thread is for drag performers. You know, like the Pythons and Milton Berle.

Originally Posted by Norman Alexander

I suspect everyone has missed the point about these conservatives wanting to stop drags reading to kids. It's the "reading to kids" part, not the drag.

They should just cancel the reading and show movies and old TV shows. Wholesome stuff like:

Tootsie
Mrs. Doubtfire.
Some Like it Hot
Bosom Buddies (remember that one? It made Tom Hanks a star!!)
Victor Victoria?
Priscilla, Queen of the Desert (both the U.S. and Au. versions)?
Any of the Aunt Madea movies (12 of them!)
M*A*S*H
every second Monty Python skit
Damn near anything with Milton Berle
Every third Benny Hill skit
....and many, many more.

But by all means, lets keep pretending that there's real meat to the drag show outrage.
Keep ignoring that drag has been an acceptable sort of entertainment for centuries.
Keep pretending that "drag" is synonymous with transgender (it's not) or homosexuality (not that either).
Keep equating outrageous sexuality at gay pride parades with drag (not the same thing at all!).
Keep pretending that it's not just another moral panic ginned up by the perpetually outraged right-wing/pseudoChristian fundie social influence machine.

Which is fine, really.

Until - until the violence starts. Which it already has here where I live - Colorado. Any my daughter hangs out with the transgender kids at school. And they go to "gay club" after school to get the emotional support they need in a society like ours.

And if that perpetually outrage machine starts directing violence towards a group of people that includes my daughter? Then I get upset and deal with it. I'm a non-violent person, there's no threat of violence in what I say. But if it comes to spamming a stupid website? I'm down with that.

Stacyhs · 15th December 2022, 04:05 PM

My daughter has non-binary, transgender and gay friends. None of them has attempted to groom her or changed her in any way from whom she's always been.

Frankly, all these 'concerned' parents are just Karens who think they not only have the right, but duty, to stick their damn noses into other people's business. --------------- 'em.

tyr_13 · 15th December 2022, 04:41 PM

Originally Posted by TragicMonkey

Since when does drag = trans anyway? Drag is gay men dressing up like women, not people thinking they are women (whether validly or not is, apparently, a matter of contention).

Pretty sick that Texas, awash in guns and school shootings, thinks that the real danger is dudes in dresses. How many kids were killed this year because of drag?

In the minds of right wingers, drag is 'grooming' for sexual assault or being made trans.

Look at how one Texas bill defines 'drag':

"Drag performance" means a performance in which a
performer exhibits a gender identity that is different than the
performer's gender assigned at birth using clothing, makeup, or
other physical markers and sings, lip syncs, dances, or otherwise
performs before an audience for entertainment.

This bill would means a trans man telling a stand-up set at a place that allows the consumption of alcohol would make that place be defined as a 'sexual oriented business'. That would in turn mean such a place would have to totally ban anyone under the age of eighteen from entering and pay the state $5 per customer quarterly.

They equate drag to things like strip shows that are sexual. And they equate being trans with performing drag.

[This bill and the intersection with drag does intersect with trans gender issues here, and I think it's valid information for this thread, if not, oh well, I get a flag I guess.]

Stout · 15th December 2022, 05:14 PM

Originally Posted by tyr_13

In the minds of right wingers, drag is 'grooming' for sexual assault or being made trans.

That's the general idea for sure with the real problem being that finding sexualized content involving children is damn near impossible.

Here's Sara Gonzales' bit thing. This is the one that got her on Tucker Carson's show. Problem is it's fake. This wasn't an all ages show, having it was advertised as sexualized content and one parent brought one child, Gonzales filmed it and misrepresented it.

acbytesla · 15th December 2022, 05:15 PM

Originally Posted by crescent

They should just cancel the reading and show movies and old TV shows. Wholesome stuff like:

Tootsie
Mrs. Doubtfire.
Some Like it Hot
Bosom Buddies (remember that one? It made Tom Hanks a star!!)
Victor Victoria?
Priscilla, Queen of the Desert (both the U.S. and Au. versions)?
Any of the Aunt Madea movies (12 of them!)
M*A*S*H
every second Monty Python skit
Damn near anything with Milton Berle
Every third Benny Hill skit
....and many, many more.

But by all means, lets keep pretending that there's real meat to the drag show outrage.
Keep ignoring that drag has been an acceptable sort of entertainment for centuries.
Keep pretending that "drag" is synonymous with transgender (it's not) or homosexuality (not that either).
Keep equating outrageous sexuality at gay pride parades with drag (not the same thing at all!).
Keep pretending that it's not just another moral panic ginned up by the perpetually outraged right-wing/pseudoChristian fundie social influence machine.

Which is fine, really.

Until - until the violence starts. Which it already has here where I live - Colorado. Any my daughter hangs out with the transgender kids at school. And they go to "gay club" after school to get the emotional support they need in a society like ours.

And if that perpetually outrage machine starts directing violence towards a group of people that includes my daughter? Then I get upset and deal with it. I'm a non-violent person, there's no threat of violence in what I say. But if it comes to spamming a stupid website? I'm down with that.

Also
Birdcage
La Cage aux Folles
Soap
Junior
Big Momma's House
Tyler Perry's movies
Ladybugs
The Crying Game
Back to the Future II
Ed Wood
The Boondock Saints
The Nutty Professor
Dallas Buyer's Club
The Danish Girl
There are lots more.

It should be noted that men played the roles of females in plays during the Elizabethen era.

It's amazing how people get offended over nothing.

Stacyhs · 15th December 2022, 05:17 PM

People don't get offended over nothing. They CHOOSE to be offended over nothing because it fits their agenda.

dudalb · 15th December 2022, 05:21 PM

Originally Posted by crescent

They should just cancel the reading and show movies and old TV shows. Wholesome stuff like:

Tootsie
Mrs. Doubtfire.
Some Like it Hot
Bosom Buddies (remember that one? It made Tom Hanks a star!!)
Victor Victoria?
Priscilla, Queen of the Desert (both the U.S. and Au. versions)?
Any of the Aunt Madea movies (12 of them!)
M*A*S*H
every second Monty Python skit
Damn near anything with Milton Berle
Every third Benny Hill skit
....and many, many more.

But by all means, lets keep pretending that there's real meat to the drag show outrage.
Keep ignoring that drag has been an acceptable sort of entertainment for centuries.
Keep pretending that "drag" is synonymous with transgender (it's not) or homosexuality (not that either).
Keep equating outrageous sexuality at gay pride parades with drag (not the same thing at all!).
Keep pretending that it's not just another moral panic ginned up by the perpetually outraged right-wing/pseudoChristian fundie social influence machine.

Which is fine, really.

Until - until the violence starts. Which it already has here where I live - Colorado. Any my daughter hangs out with the transgender kids at school. And they go to "gay club" after school to get the emotional support they need in a society like ours.

And if that perpetually outrage machine starts directing violence towards a group of people that includes my daughter? Then I get upset and deal with it. I'm a non-violent person, there's no threat of violence in what I say. But if it comes to spamming a stupid website? I'm down with that.

Hell, you forgot the original cross dresser play, "Charlie's Aunt".,

The Atheist · 15th December 2022, 05:40 PM

Originally Posted by Lothian

I am interested to know as someone who has worn a 'frock' on many occasiond. I am sure many a child would see my kilt as a skirt.

Or, if you're in the South Pacific, lavalavas.

Every Sunday, pretty well every make Pasifika over 12 will be wearing a skirt.

Disgraceful!

arthwollipot · 15th December 2022, 05:52 PM

Originally Posted by Warp12

That is a rather simplistic analysis, imo. Like saying a scat fetish is just a variation on pooping.

Uh, you do realise that transvestitism is not the same thing as drag queening, right?

deadrose · 15th December 2022, 06:09 PM

Oh and if we're using that definition of drag, kiss Marlene Dietrich goodbye. No more old movies for you!

Norman Alexander · 15th December 2022, 06:10 PM

Originally Posted by arthwollipot

Uh, you do realise that transvestitism is not the same thing as drag queening, right?

No, he doesn't. Or, at the least, he wants them to be the same.

acbytesla · 15th December 2022, 06:17 PM

Originally Posted by deadrose

Oh and if we're using that definition of drag, kiss Marlene Dietrich goodbye. No more old movies for you!

Betty Davis
and
Jack Benny too.

How is this Texas law not a violation of the First Amendment?

ZiprHead · 15th December 2022, 06:19 PM

Originally Posted by Mike!

Man, I miss the 60's and 70's, you'd never see a man on TV dressed up and acting like a lady...

YouTube Video This video is not hosted by the ISF. The ISF can not be held responsible for the suitability or legality of this material. By clicking the link below you agree to view content from an external website.

I AGREE

Don't forget Milton Berle and Bugs Bunny.

Warp12 · 15th December 2022, 06:21 PM

Originally Posted by arthwollipot

Uh, you do realise that transvestitism is not the same thing as drag queening, right?

Yes. Did I claim otherwise? Not sure where you got that from. The point was that referring to Drag Queens as a slight variation of clowns is, imo, a very simplistic analysis. Perhaps even disingenuous. Especially based on some of the "mission-statements" I've read.

I have repeatedly stated that my primary concern is the voices of concerned parents being silenced. This is a common trend with liberals, these days. To downplay, discredit, and flat-out try to take away the voices of conservative parents. As usual, it is front-and-center in this thread, too.

15th December 2022, 10:13 AM	#121
The Great Zaganza Maledictorian Join Date: Aug 2016 Posts: 19,546	It's always a slippery slope if the OTHERS do it.
	__________________ "The only true paradise is paradise lost" Marcel Proust

15th December 2022, 10:16 AM	#122
Resume Troublesome Passenger Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 21,565	Quote: Because not wanting your young children exposed to cross-dressing freaks . . . Better keep 'em away from churches, priests, pastors, bishops . . . ETA: And Monty Python, especially Monty Python.
	__________________ "Choose your leaders with wisdom and forethought. To be led by a coward is to be controlled by all that the coward fears… To be led by a liar is to ask to be told lies." -Octavia E. Butler Last edited by Resume; 15th December 2022 at 10:18 AM.

15th December 2022, 10:17 AM	#123
bruto Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Way way north of Diddy Wah Diddy Posts: 34,262	Originally Posted by 3point14 Except, of course, the freedom to put on clothes of the opposite sex and talk to children. Unless, of course, you're a lady, in which case wear clothes of the opposite sex all you like. I continue to believe this is all mental. So far...
	__________________ Like many humorless and indignant people, he is hard on everybody but himself, and does not perceive it when he fails his own ideal (Molière) A pedant is a man who studies a vacuum through instruments that allow him to draw cross-sections of the details (John Ciardi)

15th December 2022, 10:17 AM	#124
Craig4 Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: I live in a swamp Posts: 26,764	Originally Posted by sarge I have two Cobra Golds under my belt and I never accidentally had sex with a Thai boy. As long as you enjoyed it and there was mutual consent, that's all that matters.
	__________________ Fight like a Ukrainian. Last edited by Craig4; 15th December 2022 at 10:21 AM.

15th December 2022, 10:19 AM	#125
bluesjnr Professional Nemesis for Hire Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Home. Posts: 10,969	Originally Posted by sarge I have two Cobra Golds under my belt and I never accidentally had sex with a Thai boy. I hear ya bro....
	__________________ "OTP? I don' need no steenkin' OTP!"

15th December 2022, 11:02 AM	#126
Armitage72 Philosopher Join Date: Mar 2012 Location: Rochester, NY Posts: 7,668	Originally Posted by bruto So far... I remember AM radio raving lunatic Michael Savage vehemently criticizing a politician in California (a Democrat, naturally) because she wore jeans in public.

15th December 2022, 11:12 AM	#127
Skeptic Ginger Nasty Woman Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 93,401	Originally Posted by Warp12 So are you saying that parents should not have a voice in a what their children are exposed to? That it is ok to actively attempt to silence them? The particular objection is hardly the main point, here. Unless the position is, "I approve of xyz, therefore nobody else is deserving of a voice". Taking that last sentence: "I disapprove of xyz, therefore nobody else is deserving of a voice". Who is being silenced again? Parents who want to stop drag shows for kids such as the one where men in drag read books to kids at the library Why don't these parents just intervene with their own kids instead of everyone's?

15th December 2022, 11:13 AM	#128
xjx388 Moderator Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 11,318	Originally Posted by Warp12 Sure it does. The intent is to overload the content in order to drown out the voices of the concerned. Eventually this invariably leads to the "tip line" becoming unviable. Besides you have already fairly well stated that you think it is ok to silence their voices, anyway. When this group gets a tip, the plan is that they will go protest and/or try to get the show shut down. This group is attempting to silence the voices of parents who want to take their kids to these shows. Fight fire with fire, I say. Look, these concerned parents are not my ******* parents. Control your own kids and stay away from mine.
xjx388 Moderator Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 11,318	__________________ Hello.

15th December 2022, 11:18 AM	#129
Skeptic Ginger Nasty Woman Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 93,401	Originally Posted by Warp12 No, I don't support the universal ban you mention. I support parents having a voice, and I support age-appropriate restrictions be in place for such events. Age appropriate by whose opinion? Originally Posted by Warp12 But again, this is more about the whole concept of silencing parental concerns, imo. It is a common liberal theme, these days. My individual concerns about Drag Queens are minor in the grand scheme, and I have no interest in continuously debating them. Round and round you go ignoring other's point and repeating yours. It's a common right-wing theme, force everyone to follow alt-right Christian beliefs by making everyone comply via laws, regulations and other forms of interference.

15th December 2022, 11:23 AM	#130
shemp a flimsy character...perfidious and despised Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Out back preparing the bunker for the next Civil War Posts: 53,808	Originally Posted by sarge I have two Cobra Golds under my belt and I never accidentally had sex with a Thai boy. So, it was intentional?
	__________________ "Yes, I'll be around for many more centuries. You, meanwhile, will have long ago been turned into value dog food, despite your express wishes to the contrary." -- JihadJane

15th December 2022, 11:51 AM	#131
Gulliver Foyle Graduate Poster Join Date: Dec 2014 Location: Cork baaaiii Posts: 1,296	Originally Posted by bluesjnr I always find this accusation interesting. Would you care to share exactly what unacceptable feelings or impulses Warp12 is attributing to someone else and what it is he is avoiding confronting? He did say he loved the first couple of series. To love the first couple of seconds of a Brendan O'Carroll show you first need to have your sense of humour surgically removed. Don't forget RTÉ inflicted him on us for years before he moved across the water.

15th December 2022, 12:18 PM	#132
autumn1971 Illuminator Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 4,087	Originally Posted by Warp12 Hilarious. So you figure their concern, about say, a completely unrestricted Drag Queen event at a public venue..is entirely unreasonable? So you figure the best thing to do is silence their voices? That'll teach 'em to be concerned about their kids, right? Interesting. How wrong could this post be? How are parents being silenced? Not “How are parents being exposed to opinions they don’t like” Not “how are parents being forced to take their kids to drag shows” How, in your Warped mind, (not meant to be offensive, just couldn’t resist the pun,) has the government silenced these parents’ ability to have their message heard? I’ve just now heard about their opinion on a “leftist” forum, how did the silencing of every parent fail to prevent me from hearing their concerns?
autumn1971 Illuminator Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 4,087	__________________ 'A knave; a rascal; an eater of broken meats; a base, proud, shallow, beggardly, three-suited, hundred-pound, filthy, worsted-stocking knave; a lily-livered, action-taking knave, a whoreson, glass-gazing, superservicable, finical rogue;... the son and heir of a mongral bitch: one whom I will beat into clamorous whining, if thou deniest the least syllable of thy addition."' -The Bard

15th December 2022, 12:23 PM	#133
Warp12 Banned Join Date: Feb 2013 Location: USA Posts: 7,583	Originally Posted by autumn1971 How wrong could this post be? How are parents being silenced? Not “How are parents being exposed to opinions they don’t like” Not “how are parents being forced to take their kids to drag shows” How, in your Warped mind, (not meant to be offensive, just couldn’t resist the pun,) has the government silenced these parents’ ability to have their message heard? I’ve just now heard about their opinion on a “leftist” forum, how did the silencing of every parent fail to prevent me from hearing their concerns? I think you may be confused about the debate. Nobody said the government was attempting to silence them. Maybe read through the thread; it has all been discussed.

15th December 2022, 12:24 PM	#134
Carrot Flower King Illuminator Join Date: Mar 2020 Location: Northumberland, UK Posts: 3,610	And it's not an awfully long time ago that boy children wore dresses and had long curls and wore pink... I must say that going to drag shows like panto and church never made me want to wear a skirt: my legs are too long and shaving them would result in huge bloodshed... And I once had a colleague who did a great act as Marilyn Monroe (especially good as he was of Italian extraction and had somewhat olive skin) and it never made me (blond and pale) want to dress up as Jane Russell.

15th December 2022, 12:43 PM	#135
deadrose Illuminator Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: the wet side of the mountains Posts: 3,903	A bit surprised nobody's brought up the incident down the road from us - I was pretty sure it made national news at least. The local taproom (which is family friendly) has had a monthly drag storytime for over a year. A few weeks ago, some anti-drag folks found out and announced a big protest outside the taproom. The next day, someone fired shots at their front window. The original protest group cancelled, as it was not their intention to cause violence, the few protestors were greatly outnumbered by counter-protestors, and storytime went on as usual. I bet a lot of patrons are choosing seats away from the windows now, though. Honestly, shooting up a business because of a drag story hour? What is the difference between the reader showing up as a drag queen, a clown, a princess, or a purple dinosaur? It's all just dress-up to the kids. It's only weird when you make it so. I honestly don't know how people miss that they're being led by the nose to the Right Wing Outrage of the Week, whether it's satanic panics, her emails, children being trafficked by furniture sales, drag queens, gay teachers... the list is endless, and every time one loses steam they just start another. Please note: No, I will NOT get sidetracked into discussing every other right wing outrage. This thread is for drag performers. You know, like the Pythons and Milton Berle.

15th December 2022, 12:44 PM	#136
Norman Alexander Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Nov 2014 Location: Dharug & Gundungurra Posts: 14,227	I suspect everyone has missed the point about these conservatives wanting to stop drags reading to kids. It's the "reading to kids" part, not the drag. Heaven knows, they might read them some filth, like classic American children's literature such as Tom Sawyer and Huckleberry Finn, or exciting modern literature like Dr Suess. Or stories about children and people in other countries. And that might trigger an impulse to be curious and read more, and find out more about more stuff, and broaden their minds! No, this shall not stand, sayeth the conservatives! Education is anathema! The children might learn about something more than the limited, biased, nasty ******* tripe they as parents know. Then the kids will not grow up to be those parents. So better to shame the drags who read to their kids than admit they can't read themselves.
	__________________ _{...our governments are just trying to protect us from terror. In the same way that someone banging a hornets’ nest with a stick is trying to protect us from hornets. Frankie Boyle, Guardian, July 2015}

15th December 2022, 12:52 PM	#137
Carrot Flower King Illuminator Join Date: Mar 2020 Location: Northumberland, UK Posts: 3,610	Just think back to the days when we only had 2 TV channels here and yet drag performers, or other performers dragging up, were regularly on mainstream comedy and light entertainment shows (Dick Emery, Danny La Rue - a favourite of my paternal grandmother, who also loved the camp of the Staurday afternoon wrestling - Les Dawson and..and...)It's amazing that we aren't just a bunch of out and out queens, isn't it?

15th December 2022, 12:53 PM	#138
Upchurch Papa Funkosophy Join Date: May 2002 Location: St. Louis, MO Posts: 33,602	Originally Posted by Warp12 Nobody said the government was attempting to silence them. In fact, nobody is attempting to silence them.
	__________________ "There is nothing more deceptive than an obvious fact." -- Sherlock Holmes. "It’s easier to fool people than to convince them that they have been fooled." -- Mark Twain, maybe.

15th December 2022, 01:35 PM	#139
Venom Philosopher Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: United States Posts: 6,091	Oh stfu with the "concerned parents". They are brainwashed parents. How was this never a problem before until rightwing pundits made it one?

15th December 2022, 02:47 PM	#140
mgidm86 Philosopher Join Date: Jan 2003 Posts: 8,624	Originally Posted by Upchurch No, but calling them freaks might. I don't ignore people who disagree with me, I ignore haters, instigators and people who have nothing of value to add. Anyone calling them freaks...I just don't need to engage with that person. Someone like that adds nothing to a discussion or to my own life.
mgidm86 Philosopher Join Date: Jan 2003 Posts: 8,624	__________________ Why bother?

15th December 2022, 02:54 PM	#141
MarkCorrigan ¡No pasarán! Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Слава Україні Posts: 11,471	Originally Posted by Warp12 Bob, do you think there is a possibility that some of these shows are unrestricted? Or that a child might attend without parental consent, or with someone besides a parent or legal guardian? Do you think parents can be all places, at all times? Well no, but you still haven't explained why it's an issue. Originally Posted by Warp12 By your logic why do we need to restrict alcohol, tobacco, Physically dangerous and chemically addictive. How is this equitable with drag shows? Originally Posted by Warp12 movies? Potentially psychologically damaging. How is that equitable with drag shows? Originally Posted by Warp12 After it is just a simple matter of the parent handling such matters at all times, right? Honestly, I find your argument ridiculous and not worthy of further consideration. Does your back hurt? I reckon you should get a sports massage or something man, carrying all that straw can't be good for you. Originally Posted by Warp12 And you still haven't explained why it is acceptable to attempt to silence the voices of concerned parents, as some here seem to be advocating. Because their "concern" is utterly ludicrous and without merit? Just because some loony bigot is "concerned" that their child might learn that gay people and drag queens are actually, you know, people, doesn't mean their concern is valid nor worthwhile. Please explain what the possible danger is from children attending a drag show.
	__________________ Naturalism adjusts it's principles to fit with the observed data. It's a god of the facts world view. -joobz When I give food to the poor, they call me a Saint. When I ask why the poor have no food, they call me a Communist. - Hélder Câmara

15th December 2022, 03:10 PM	#142
mgidm86 Philosopher Join Date: Jan 2003 Posts: 8,624	It's already been pointed out that movies are not restricted at all. There are no laws against minors walking into an R-rated movie. You don't need to ask him again, he won't answer anyways. Libraries and drag shows are the targets. Not movies with the graphic depictions of death, or the hatred shown by many of the characters, or the cussing, or the boobies. Movies for some reason are not the problem. Wanna watch John Wick murder hundreds of people? Go ahead! But don't you DARE go to the LIBRARY! ***** libr....lol I can't even say it...libraries and....BWAHAHAHA DRAG SHOWS are the concern! Not the shot up schools. Mother ***** silence there.
mgidm86 Philosopher Join Date: Jan 2003 Posts: 8,624	__________________ Why bother?

15th December 2022, 03:21 PM	#143
Stacyhs Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Mar 2016 Location: United States Posts: 29,387	Originally Posted by Donal If we can take a break from feeding the trolls who are successfully derailing another thread, what addresses can we report? I heard there was a big drag event going on at 1010 Colorado Street in Austin.

15th December 2022, 03:50 PM	#145
Robin Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 14,758	Originally Posted by Warp12 It just makes you wonder what kind of man gets up in the morning and decides, "I'm going to dress like a woman, to flamboyant excess, and hopefully find some young kids to hang out with". it I don't know about today, back in the sixties they were called pantomime performers. Sometimes Widow Twsnkey was the local Presbyterian minister. Quote: Well, if so, why are these weirdos doing it? For what benefit? In the case of pantomime it was called "entertainment" Quote: We all know to what "benefit". To normalize such abnormal behaviors at a very early age. I mean, that is the best case scenario, I suppose. I may have mentioned my Conservative voting, Daily Express reading, Church of Scotland attending great aunts back in the sixties who would sit down with us kids and watch Danny la Rue on the telly. They loved Danny la Rue. I suppose you would claim they were grooming us. Oh, by the way, are these people alleging that drag acts are 'grooming' the same ones that sex up their five year olds for those 'beauty pageants'?

15th December 2022, 03:55 PM	#146
Stacyhs Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Mar 2016 Location: United States Posts: 29,387	Originally Posted by deadrose A bit surprised nobody's brought up the incident down the road from us - I was pretty sure it made national news at least. The local taproom (which is family friendly) has had a monthly drag storytime for over a year. A few weeks ago, some anti-drag folks found out and announced a big protest outside the taproom. The next day, someone fired shots at their front window. The original protest group cancelled, as it was not their intention to cause violence, the few protestors were greatly outnumbered by counter-protestors, and storytime went on as usual. I bet a lot of patrons are choosing seats away from the windows now, though. Honestly, shooting up a business because of a drag story hour? What is the difference between the reader showing up as a drag queen, a clown, a princess, or a purple dinosaur? It's all just dress-up to the kids. It's only weird when you make it so. I honestly don't know how people miss that they're being led by the nose to the Right Wing Outrage of the Week, whether it's satanic panics, her emails, children being trafficked by furniture sales, drag queens, gay teachers... the list is endless, and every time one loses steam they just start another. Please note: No, I will NOT get sidetracked into discussing every other right wing outrage. This thread is for drag performers. You know, like the Pythons and Milton Berle. Re the highlighted: BINGO! If the right-wing doesn't have something new to be outraged by, afraid of, or offended by...they just invent one. I think that they aren't happy unless they're unhappy.

15th December 2022, 03:56 PM	#147
crescent Philosopher Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: Colorado Posts: 5,316	Originally Posted by deadrose This thread is for drag performers. You know, like the Pythons and Milton Berle. Originally Posted by Norman Alexander I suspect everyone has missed the point about these conservatives wanting to stop drags reading to kids. It's the "reading to kids" part, not the drag. They should just cancel the reading and show movies and old TV shows. Wholesome stuff like: Tootsie Mrs. Doubtfire. Some Like it Hot Bosom Buddies (remember that one? It made Tom Hanks a star!!) Victor Victoria? Priscilla, Queen of the Desert (both the U.S. and Au. versions)? Any of the Aunt Madea movies (12 of them!) MASH every second Monty Python skit Damn near anything with Milton Berle Every third Benny Hill skit ....and many, many more. But by all means, lets keep pretending that there's real meat to the drag show outrage. Keep ignoring that drag has been an acceptable sort of entertainment for centuries. Keep pretending that "drag" is synonymous with transgender (it's not) or homosexuality (not that either). Keep equating outrageous sexuality at gay pride parades with drag (not the same thing at all!). Keep pretending that it's not* just another moral panic ginned up by the perpetually outraged right-wing/pseudoChristian fundie social influence machine. Which is fine, really. Until - until the violence starts. Which it already has here where I live - Colorado. Any my daughter hangs out with the transgender kids at school. And they go to "gay club" after school to get the emotional support they need in a society like ours. And if that perpetually outrage machine starts directing violence towards a group of people that includes my daughter? Then I get upset and deal with it. I'm a non-violent person, there's no threat of violence in what I say. But if it comes to spamming a stupid website? I'm down with that.
	Last edited by crescent; 15th December 2022 at 03:59 PM.

15th December 2022, 04:05 PM	#148
Stacyhs Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Mar 2016 Location: United States Posts: 29,387	My daughter has non-binary, transgender and gay friends. None of them has attempted to groom her or changed her in any way from whom she's always been. Frankly, all these 'concerned' parents are just Karens who think they not only have the right, but duty, to stick their damn noses into other people's business. --------------- 'em.

15th December 2022, 04:41 PM	#149
tyr_13 Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 17,534	Originally Posted by TragicMonkey Since when does drag = trans anyway? Drag is gay men dressing up like women, not people thinking they are women (whether validly or not is, apparently, a matter of contention). Pretty sick that Texas, awash in guns and school shootings, thinks that the real danger is dudes in dresses. How many kids were killed this year because of drag? In the minds of right wingers, drag is 'grooming' for sexual assault or being made trans. Look at how one Texas bill defines 'drag': "Drag performance" means a performance in which a performer exhibits a gender identity that is different than the performer's gender assigned at birth using clothing, makeup, or other physical markers and sings, lip syncs, dances, or otherwise performs before an audience for entertainment. This bill would means a trans man telling a stand-up set at a place that allows the consumption of alcohol would make that place be defined as a 'sexual oriented business'. That would in turn mean such a place would have to totally ban anyone under the age of eighteen from entering and pay the state $5 per customer quarterly. They equate drag to things like strip shows that are sexual. And they equate being trans with performing drag. [This bill and the intersection with drag does intersect with trans gender issues here, and I think it's valid information for this thread, if not, oh well, I get a flag I guess.]
	__________________ Circled nothing is still nothing. "Nothing will stop the U.S. from being a world leader, not even a handful of adults who want their kids to take science lessons from a book that mentions unicorns six times." -UNLoVedRebel Mumpsimus: a stubborn person who insists on making an error in spite of being shown that it is wrong Last edited by tyr_13; 15th December 2022 at 04:45 PM.

15th December 2022, 05:14 PM	#150
Stout Philosopher Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 5,339	Originally Posted by tyr_13 In the minds of right wingers, drag is 'grooming' for sexual assault or being made trans. That's the general idea for sure with the real problem being that finding sexualized content involving children is damn near impossible. Here's Sara Gonzales' bit thing. This is the one that got her on Tucker Carson's show. Problem is it's fake. This wasn't an all ages show, having it was advertised as sexualized content and one parent brought one child, Gonzales filmed it and misrepresented it.
Stout Philosopher Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 5,339

15th December 2022, 05:15 PM	#151
acbytesla Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Dec 2012 Posts: 31,385	Originally Posted by crescent They should just cancel the reading and show movies and old TV shows. Wholesome stuff like: Tootsie Mrs. Doubtfire. Some Like it Hot Bosom Buddies (remember that one? It made Tom Hanks a star!!) Victor Victoria? Priscilla, Queen of the Desert (both the U.S. and Au. versions)? Any of the Aunt Madea movies (12 of them!) MASH every second Monty Python skit Damn near anything with Milton Berle Every third Benny Hill skit ....and many, many more. But by all means, lets keep pretending that there's real meat to the drag show outrage. Keep ignoring that drag has been an acceptable sort of entertainment for centuries. Keep pretending that "drag" is synonymous with transgender (it's not) or homosexuality (not that either). Keep equating outrageous sexuality at gay pride parades with drag (not the same thing at all!). Keep pretending that it's not* just another moral panic ginned up by the perpetually outraged right-wing/pseudoChristian fundie social influence machine. Which is fine, really. Until - until the violence starts. Which it already has here where I live - Colorado. Any my daughter hangs out with the transgender kids at school. And they go to "gay club" after school to get the emotional support they need in a society like ours. And if that perpetually outrage machine starts directing violence towards a group of people that includes my daughter? Then I get upset and deal with it. I'm a non-violent person, there's no threat of violence in what I say. But if it comes to spamming a stupid website? I'm down with that. Also Birdcage La Cage aux Folles Soap Junior Big Momma's House Tyler Perry's movies Ladybugs The Crying Game Back to the Future II Ed Wood The Boondock Saints The Nutty Professor Dallas Buyer's Club The Danish Girl There are lots more. It should be noted that men played the roles of females in plays during the Elizabethen era. It's amazing how people get offended over nothing.
	__________________ Just because I'm paranoid doesn't mean they're not out to get to me. .

15th December 2022, 05:17 PM	#152
Stacyhs Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Mar 2016 Location: United States Posts: 29,387	People don't get offended over nothing. They CHOOSE to be offended over nothing because it fits their agenda.

15th December 2022, 05:21 PM	#153
dudalb Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Sacramento Posts: 57,771	Originally Posted by crescent They should just cancel the reading and show movies and old TV shows. Wholesome stuff like: Tootsie Mrs. Doubtfire. Some Like it Hot Bosom Buddies (remember that one? It made Tom Hanks a star!!) Victor Victoria? Priscilla, Queen of the Desert (both the U.S. and Au. versions)? Any of the Aunt Madea movies (12 of them!) MASH every second Monty Python skit Damn near anything with Milton Berle Every third Benny Hill skit ....and many, many more. But by all means, lets keep pretending that there's real meat to the drag show outrage. Keep ignoring that drag has been an acceptable sort of entertainment for centuries. Keep pretending that "drag" is synonymous with transgender (it's not) or homosexuality (not that either). Keep equating outrageous sexuality at gay pride parades with drag (not the same thing at all!). Keep pretending that it's not* just another moral panic ginned up by the perpetually outraged right-wing/pseudoChristian fundie social influence machine. Which is fine, really. Until - until the violence starts. Which it already has here where I live - Colorado. Any my daughter hangs out with the transgender kids at school. And they go to "gay club" after school to get the emotional support they need in a society like ours. And if that perpetually outrage machine starts directing violence towards a group of people that includes my daughter? Then I get upset and deal with it. I'm a non-violent person, there's no threat of violence in what I say. But if it comes to spamming a stupid website? I'm down with that. Hell, you forgot the original cross dresser play, "Charlie's Aunt".,
	__________________ Pacifism is a shifty doctrine under which a man accepts the benefits of the social group without being willing to pay - and claims a halo for his dishonesty. Robert Heinlein.

15th December 2022, 05:40 PM	#154
The Atheist The Grammar Tyrant Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 33,265	Originally Posted by Lothian I am interested to know as someone who has worn a 'frock' on many occasiond. I am sure many a child would see my kilt as a skirt. Or, if you're in the South Pacific, lavalavas. Every Sunday, pretty well every make Pasifika over 12 will be wearing a skirt. Disgraceful!
	__________________ The point of equilibrium has passed; satire and current events are now indistinguishable.

15th December 2022, 05:52 PM	#155
arthwollipot Observer of Phenomena Pronouns: he/him Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Ngunnawal Country Posts: 80,811	Originally Posted by Warp12 That is a rather simplistic analysis, imo. Like saying a scat fetish is just a variation on pooping. Uh, you do realise that transvestitism is not the same thing as drag queening, right?
	__________________ Слава Україні! Героям Слава! 20220224 - 20230224

15th December 2022, 06:09 PM	#156
deadrose Illuminator Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: the wet side of the mountains Posts: 3,903	Oh and if we're using that definition of drag, kiss Marlene Dietrich goodbye. No more old movies for you!