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Tags 2020 elections , donald trump , Mary Trump , presidential candidates , Trump controversies

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Old 10th July 2020, 08:13 AM   #121
blutoski
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Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
There's a lot of interesting stuff in there. What a horrible person:You'd think his wife (any of them) would have bought the kids some decent gifts despite Trump. Or maybe said wives picked out the gifts.
Rich people and gifts are weird.

Once when I was a kid, one of my yard work customers (I mowed lawns and pulled weeds for spending money) offered to pay my year end tip with a "collectible calendar" - I said sure. Mostly I was curious about what a collectible calendar actually was. I was thinking maybe car photos or something.

Turned out to be her free giveaway real estate agent promo calendar, with photos of herself standing in front of local houses she had been involved with selling. And it was from that year, meaning, given it was December, I could use it for another two weeks max.

To this day, I still don't know if she genuinely thought these were great gifts, whether she was just trying to see what she pull on a 10 year old, or if she just wasn't thinking at all and just dumping old inventory. Anyway, I just thanked her and called it a year.

Typical tip in those days was $2, which doesn't sound like a lot, but that was 1978, so maybe $25 in current dollars. I told my dad about it and he had some profane words, but we decided not to do anything. It definitely affected his opinion of her.
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Old 10th July 2020, 08:53 AM   #122
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I find that rich people didn't get to be rich by giving stuff away for free.

Comfortably off people are, in my experience, the most generous.
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Old 10th July 2020, 10:06 AM   #123
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Originally Posted by The Don View Post
I find that rich people didn't get to be rich by giving stuff away for free.

Comfortably off people are, in my experience, the most generous.
As ever Pratchett covered it - Molly the Queen of the Beggars "...befitting her position, she is required to beg others for the most extravagant goods, though even with her sheer hideousness few people are prepared to hand over a sixteen-room mansion to a beggar...."
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Old 10th July 2020, 10:20 AM   #124
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Apparently there is some debate about the value of a book whose author has "Ph.D." next to their name on the cover.

According to this alleged librarian on Quora, in their experience such books are generally not worth reading:

https://www.quora.com/Should-I-put-P...ver-of-my-book

The main argument seems to be that unless the Ph.D. is directly relevant to the subject matter, it amounts to an Appeal to Authority. Resorting to a logical fallacy to make sales is neither a good look for the author, nor a good sign about the value of their book.

I mention this not to cast aspersions on the book itself, though that is of course implied. Make of that what you will.

But logical fallacies are of general interest to this forum. Skeptics who are enthusiastic about this book may find it worthwhile to take note of the implied fallacy here.

Also I'm amused by the notion that Mary Trump is somehow a Doctor of the Philosophy of Donald Trumpism. Like she not only studied the subject enough to make her own way in the world on the strength of her knowledge (a Bachelor); and she not only mastered the extant body of knowledge and its application (a Master); but she also has contributed to expanding this body of knowledge with new insights and applications (a Doctor of Philosphy).
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Old 10th July 2020, 10:36 AM   #125
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Apparently there is some debate about the value of a book whose author has "Ph.D." next to their name on the cover.

According to this alleged librarian on Quora, in their experience such books are generally not worth reading:

https://www.quora.com/Should-I-put-P...ver-of-my-book

The main argument seems to be that unless the Ph.D. is directly relevant to the subject matter, it amounts to an Appeal to Authority. Resorting to a logical fallacy to make sales is neither a good look for the author, nor a good sign about the value of their book.

Mary Trump is a Ph.D. clinical psychologist. Her education is about as directly relevant to the subject as it possibly could be.
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Old 10th July 2020, 10:36 AM   #126
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At the very least I trust Mary Trump's account of her uncle's personal life and relationship with his family. I have no way of proving them true, but what she describes is consistent with his general character.

The most I can honestly say is.... sounds a lot like Donald Trump!
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Old 10th July 2020, 10:43 AM   #127
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Apparently there is some debate about the value of a book whose author has "Ph.D." next to their name on the cover.

According to this alleged librarian on Quora, in their experience such books are generally not worth reading:

https://www.quora.com/Should-I-put-P...ver-of-my-book

The main argument seems to be that unless the Ph.D. is directly relevant to the subject matter, it amounts to an Appeal to Authority. Resorting to a logical fallacy to make sales is neither a good look for the author, nor a good sign about the value of their book.

I mention this not to cast aspersions on the book itself, though that is of course implied. Make of that what you will.

But logical fallacies are of general interest to this forum. Skeptics who are enthusiastic about this book may find it worthwhile to take note of the implied fallacy here.

Also I'm amused by the notion that Mary Trump is somehow a Doctor of the Philosophy of Donald Trumpism. Like she not only studied the subject enough to make her own way in the world on the strength of her knowledge (a Bachelor); and she not only mastered the extant body of knowledge and its application (a Master); but she also has contributed to expanding this body of knowledge with new insights and applications (a Doctor of Philosphy).
Among who is there such a debate?

One doesn't need to be an authority to determine that Trump is a clown. Mary Trump is just one person in a long long line that thinks that.

Are you still defending the clown? What does this nutjob have to do for you to assess that you may have been wrong about him?
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Old 10th July 2020, 10:52 AM   #128
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Apparently there is some debate about the value of a book whose author has "Ph.D." next to their name on the cover.

According to this alleged librarian on Quora, in their experience such books are generally not worth reading:

https://www.quora.com/Should-I-put-P...ver-of-my-book

The main argument seems to be that unless the Ph.D. is directly relevant to the subject matter, it amounts to an Appeal to Authority. Resorting to a logical fallacy to make sales is neither a good look for the author, nor a good sign about the value of their book.

I mention this not to cast aspersions on the book itself, though that is of course implied. Make of that what you will.

But logical fallacies are of general interest to this forum. Skeptics who are enthusiastic about this book may find it worthwhile to take note of the implied fallacy here.

Also I'm amused by the notion that Mary Trump is somehow a Doctor of the Philosophy of Donald Trumpism. Like she not only studied the subject enough to make her own way in the world on the strength of her knowledge (a Bachelor); and she not only mastered the extant body of knowledge and its application (a Master); but she also has contributed to expanding this body of knowledge with new insights and applications (a Doctor of Philosphy).
I had to laugh at the advice given by this person on Quora whose own qualification is that she "works in a library". Talk about "appealing to authority"!

Frankly, you claim that your post is not intended to cast aspersions on Mary Trump's book. I think your intent was to do exactly that.
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Old 10th July 2020, 10:57 AM   #129
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I do have a little more respect for people who leave the PhD off of their name on publications.

Oh well.
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Old 10th July 2020, 11:01 AM   #130
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Originally Posted by Bob001 View Post
Mary Trump is a Ph.D. clinical psychologist. Her education is about as directly relevant to the subject as it possibly could be.
Is it a biography or a diagnosis?
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Old 10th July 2020, 11:08 AM   #131
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Is it a biography or a diagnosis?
Do you think it matters? I don't need a psychologist to tell me that Trump is a loon. I see homeless people ranting and raving that make better sense than the Donald.

You can follow the pied piper of insanity like a lemming if you choose.
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Old 10th July 2020, 11:16 AM   #132
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Originally Posted by The Don View Post
I find that rich people didn't get to be rich by giving stuff away for free.

Comfortably off people are, in my experience, the most generous.
A quite wealthy woman I did some work for announced she would stop paying me once I'd reached the low end of an estimate I had made for editing a self-published manuscript. The high end I cited was MUCH higher. She said I was great, worth every penny but she simply couldn't afford more. I think she wanted the "win" of cutting me off. She was shocked that I did not want to continue working for free to improve the manuscript. I just thanked her profusely and urged her to hire a copy editor, since she didn't want to pay me anymore. A mutual friend said she was obsessed with winning and that continuing to engage would just feed her narcissism.
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Old 10th July 2020, 11:17 AM   #133
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Is it a biography or a diagnosis?
Are you now backing off from the 'main argument' you present below in light of the fact that her qualification is directly related to the subject at hand?


Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
The main argument seems to be that unless the Ph.D. is directly relevant to the subject matter, it amounts to an Appeal to Authority.
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Old 10th July 2020, 11:42 AM   #134
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Originally Posted by Stacyhs View Post
I had to laugh at the advice given by this person on Quora whose own qualification is that she "works in a library". Talk about "appealing to authority"!

Frankly, you claim that your post is not intended to cast aspersions on Mary Trump's book. I think your intent was to do exactly that.
Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob001 View Post
Mary Trump is a Ph.D. clinical psychologist. Her education is about as directly relevant to the subject as it possibly could be.
Is it a biography or a diagnosis?
This response just confirms my opinion.
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Old 10th July 2020, 11:44 AM   #135
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Originally Posted by 3point14 View Post
Are you now backing off from the 'main argument' you present below in light of the fact that her qualification is directly related to the subject at hand?
It's really funny seeing Prestige first make the argument that a PHD in a non relevant field is worthless and then completely ignoring that Mary Trump's expertise is directly relevant.

I think the argument is also amusing considering the irony of continuing to listen to Trump about say the Pandemic instead of Dr. Faucci or the CDC.
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Old 10th July 2020, 11:49 AM   #136
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Originally Posted by 3point14 View Post
Are you now backing off from the 'main argument' you present below in light of the fact that her qualification is directly related to the subject at hand?
If the subject is a diagnosis, then the degree is directly related. If it's a biography, not so much.
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Old 10th July 2020, 11:54 AM   #137
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Need help moving those goalposts?
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Old 10th July 2020, 12:02 PM   #138
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Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza View Post
Need help moving those goalposts?
He keeps his on wheels.
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Old 10th July 2020, 12:38 PM   #139
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
If the subject is a diagnosis, then the degree is directly related. If it's a biography, not so much.
She’s Trump’s niece. Is that enough qualification to write a biography?
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Old 10th July 2020, 12:48 PM   #140
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Originally Posted by jeremyp View Post
She’s Trump’s niece. Is that enough qualification to write a biography?
She also has a master's degree in literature. That counts, too.
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Old 10th July 2020, 04:58 PM   #141
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Originally Posted by Stacyhs View Post
I would have, too. He showed himself to be a dishonest man who would screw over his own father in order to benefit himself...
I suspect fred trump probably (secretly?) admired that trait in his son. Didn't donald trump express admiration -- in a read-between-the-lines kind of way? -- about North Korean leader Kim Jong Un having a family member murdered in order to 'get to the top.'
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Old 10th July 2020, 05:46 PM   #142
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
If the subject is a diagnosis, then the degree is directly related. If it's a biography, not so much.
You've spent months arguing in the "Trump has a mental illness" thread that no ethical mental health professional would make a diagnosis without interviewing the subject in person. Now, suddenly it's OK if Mary Trump is making a diagnosis even if she's never professionally interviewed him as a psychologist? Or seen him in years?

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Old 10th July 2020, 05:53 PM   #143
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Originally Posted by Stacyhs View Post
You've spent months arguing in the "Trump has a mental illness" thread that no ethical mental health professional would make a diagnosis without interviewing the subject in person. Now, suddenly it's OK if Mary Trump is making a diagnosis even if she's never professionally interviewed him as a psychologist? Or seen him in years?

: jaw-dropp
Never said it was okay, just said it would be relevant.
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Old 10th July 2020, 06:01 PM   #144
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Never said it was okay, just said it would be relevant.
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Old 10th July 2020, 06:21 PM   #145
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Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza View Post
Need help moving those goalposts?
I think they're fine where they are. My only goal was to post an amusing sidebar about academic degrees next to author's names on book covers. The original positions of the posts were more than adequate for that purpose. Why? Do you think they should be somewhere else?
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Old 10th July 2020, 06:23 PM   #146
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
I think they're fine where they are. My only goal was to post an amusing sidebar about academic degrees next to author's names on book covers. The original positions of the posts were more than adequate for that purpose. Why? Do you think they should be somewhere else?
Uh huh. Sure. And I've got a bridge in Brooklyn I'll sell ya for real cheap.
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Old 10th July 2020, 06:25 PM   #147
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Originally Posted by jeremyp View Post
She’s Trump’s niece. Is that enough qualification to write a biography?
The way I see it, wanting to write a biography is more than enough qualification to write a biography. Doesn't necessarily mean it's going to be a *good* biography, though. And obvs being related to someone is no guarantee of quality in a biography. And - here's the thing - having a Ph.D. is also no guarantee. But you put it on the cover, and it gives the impression the writing in the book may be a cut above.
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Old 10th July 2020, 06:26 PM   #148
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Originally Posted by Bob001 View Post
She also has a master's degree in literature. That counts, too.
Counts towards what? Being a Master of Literature doesn't mean you're a good biographer. It may not even mean you're a good writer.
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Old 10th July 2020, 06:27 PM   #149
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Originally Posted by Stacyhs View Post
Where exactly do you imagine I moved the goalposts from?
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Old 10th July 2020, 06:30 PM   #150
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Originally Posted by Stacyhs View Post
Uh huh. Sure. And I've got a bridge in Brooklyn I'll sell ya for real cheap.
Not everything is about whatever bridge you have for sale, or whatever troll you imagine lives under it.
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Old 10th July 2020, 06:37 PM   #151
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
If the subject is a diagnosis, then the degree is directly related. If it's a biography, not so much.
Mary T's book isn't really a biography. It's more an expose and explanation of why Trump is what he is from her inside viewpoint.

Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Where exactly do you imagine I moved the goalposts from?
Not going down that rabbit hole with you.

Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Not everything is about whatever bridge you have for sale, or whatever troll you imagine lives under it.
Another example of your need to have the last word even when one is not required. Again, not going there with you. Ciao.
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Old 10th July 2020, 06:41 PM   #152
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Originally Posted by Stacyhs View Post
Stacy, please. Theprestige is right. He's saying that placing your title on a book when that title is irrelevant to the topic of said book is silly. That's entirely independant of whether diagnosis at a distance is possible or reasonable.
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Old 10th July 2020, 06:43 PM   #153
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Originally Posted by Stacyhs View Post
Mary T's book isn't really a biography. It's more an expose and explanation of why Trump is what he is from her inside viewpoint.
So the Ph.D. is neither here nor there.

Quote:
Not going down that rabbit hole with you.



Another example of your need to have the last word even when one is not required. Again, not going there with you. Ciao.
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Old 10th July 2020, 06:44 PM   #154
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Originally Posted by Belz... View Post
Stacy, please. Theprestige is right. He's saying that placing your title on a book when that title is irrelevant to the topic of said book is silly. That's entirely independant of whether diagnosis at a distance is possible or reasonable.
I disagree. But I don't care to argue it anymore. Which is why I didn't bother to even open his video.

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Old 10th July 2020, 07:04 PM   #155
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This question regarding Mary Trump putting her degree on the cover of the book is a red herring. I doubt a soul buying the book cares about the degree.

I don't need a clinical psychologist to tell me that Donald Trump has serious psychological problems. A fifth grader can see that the man is batcrap crazy.
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Old 10th July 2020, 07:23 PM   #156
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Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
This question regarding Mary Trump putting her degree on the cover of the book is red herring. I doubt a soul buying the book cares about the degree.

I don't need a clinical psychologist to tell me that Donald Trump has serious psychological problems. A fifth grader can see that the man is batcrap crazy.
I know you're using that in the popular slang meaning but psychopaths aren't crazy. That's one of the things that makes them so dangerous.
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Old 10th July 2020, 07:30 PM   #157
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Originally Posted by Stacyhs View Post
I know you're using that in the popular slang meaning but psychopaths aren't crazy. That's one of the things that makes them so dangerous.
Medical professionals don't use the word "crazy" at all. That said, I'm convinced that psychological problems are at the root of his issues.
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Old 10th July 2020, 08:34 PM   #158
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Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
This question regarding Mary Trump putting her degree on the cover of the book is a red herring. I doubt a soul buying the book cares about the degree.
Obviously the publisher thinks otherwise.
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Old 10th July 2020, 08:37 PM   #159
theprestige
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Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
I'm convinced that psychological problems are at the root of his issues.
That's true for everyone, though. What else would it be? Alien mind control rays?
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Old 10th July 2020, 09:12 PM   #160
acbytesla
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Obviously the publisher thinks otherwise.
So maybe I exaggerated. 5 people might buy the book because it was written by a Doctor.

Maybe the publisher put the title on because the author wanted it on. I spend a lot of time around people with doctorates. Most could care less if you refer to them as Doctor, yet some insist upon it.

Like you almost never meet someone with a degree from Harvard who won't tell you within 5 minutes upon meeting them.
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