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12th August 2021, 09:16 AM | #81 |
Penultimate Amazing
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It certainly seems like an admission of mens rea to me. If your defense is that you applied a moral calculus and decided upon what you believed was the least harmful course of action, that calculus is subject to adjudication by a judge or jury. Lawyers tell me that murder has a special status in criminal law because the degree to which the calculus is legally justified results in a difference in the charge. In any case, if the actus rea is admitted, then I would think it really just devolves into sentencing rhetoric. If the father admits a culpable state of mind, then his only recourse is to plead for a lighter sentence in light of what his beliefs were at the time.
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12th August 2021, 11:40 AM | #82 |
Skepticifimisticalationist
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Gulf Coast
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I'm not so sure I can agree with that. Radicalization is a thing after all, and I think it would be a mistake to undersell how adopting a body of belief can alter a person's moral limits. The whole point of the fantastically evil claims QAnon makes about its villains is exactly that, to justify an extreme response to the "threat" that would not be justified in the case of more mundane crimes.
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"¿WHAT KIND OF BIRD? ¿A PARANORMAL BIRD?" --- Carlos S., 2002 |
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12th August 2021, 01:38 PM | #83 |
Penultimate Amazing
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12th August 2021, 04:16 PM | #84 |
Penultimate Amazing
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"Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect" -Mark Twain "Half of what he said meant something else, and the other half didn't mean anything at all" -Rosencrantz, on Hamlet |
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12th August 2021, 09:00 PM | #85 |
Crazy Little Green Dragon
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: East Coast, US
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It might be more helpful to think of Q-Anon as one of the more dangerous CT sets when it comes to radicalization of the susceptible and the results of such. Sure, the base conditions need to be met in the first place for people to be susceptible, but just being susceptible alone isn't going to radicalize people. With that said, though, in this case, it's pretty obvious that there was already something seriously wrong to start with and with that in mind, I'm just not going to blindly trust the claims of the murdering dad at face value.
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So sayeth the crazy little dragon. |
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12th August 2021, 10:16 PM | #86 |
Crazy Little Green Dragon
Join Date: Sep 2011
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To poke at the "Vote Republican to protect the Children" angle of the Q-Anon CTs...
Republican strategist becomes newest Trump supporter charged with 10 counts of child sex trafficking Yet again, it's a Republican working to harm the children in exactly the ways that Democrats are being accused of without evidence or even rational basis. |
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So sayeth the crazy little dragon. |
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13th August 2021, 05:32 AM | #87 |
Philosopher
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 7,895
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It's not just QAnon's Influence It's the lack of hope and despair many People feel.
Take the Nashville Bomber, I met him in 2005 at the Nashville state fair, he was upset his competitors were hurting his Alarm security business and he couldn't offer Cellular Alarm systems just wired systems. So he was Promoting the Cell phones cause Cancer theories. He even Joked That I was one of the Lizard people, because of my live demonstration of what I could do with a Chainsaw. Fast forward a few years and his mind must have snapped, he must have started believing the stuff he was saying was real. Sad it seems like he was a nice guy in 2005. |
13th August 2021, 05:37 AM | #88 |
Fiend God
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: In a post-fact world
Posts: 96,875
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Despair at what? Things aren't exactly terrible right now.
Cult and conspiracy behaviour seems more out of a desire to "fit in" a group of some sort after the person rejects society at large. There might be many reasons for this, but right now the right-wing in the US seems to reject it because the brown and black people aren't being kept down anymore. |
13th August 2021, 06:14 AM | #89 |
Philosopher
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Posts: 7,895
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There is a lot of Dispare in Rual America that people can't get ahead working anymore, that there is no fairness no American Dream.
That has turned into anger and Resentment. Doomerism I see it everywhere, sad really, people are losing hope in this Pandemic and turning to religion and conspiracy theories ignoring Science logic and wisdom. |
13th August 2021, 06:17 AM | #90 |
Fiend God
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13th August 2021, 06:31 AM | #91 |
Philosopher
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Number one, No not good paying Jobs. Many blame big banks and Government for the mess they are in.
Number two, It's all economic and More they hate modern society, and technology because it costs them so much to have it. Case in point some loggers I know who bought a 250,000 dollar machine they couldn't repair themselves, and the cost of Repairing it cost them a farm they got in a revolutionary War grant. Many feel modern technology is a cheat, no right to repair, no help from big Companies they view it as corruption of the system. |
13th August 2021, 06:45 AM | #92 |
Fiend God
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: In a post-fact world
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That's rather vague. What's "good-paying"? And regardless, why can't they get such jobs?
Quote:
Quote:
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13th August 2021, 08:22 AM | #93 |
Crazy Little Green Dragon
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: East Coast, US
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Location's probably the number one answer there. A number of people are not in a position where they can easily move. As for what counts as a "good-paying" job, well... many look back at how boomers were popularized as doing. Single income supports getting a decent house and raising a family without falling into long-term debt.
Even moreso when they're exposed to, for example, Fox's grievance propaganda all the time. As it stands, though, their blame is not completely unfounded, even if it doesn't tell the whole story by a long shot. Depends on the specifics. If, for example, they actually could have fixed it with relatively little cost had they been contractually/legally allowed to do so, that really compounds how maddening it is. Emotions work on somewhat less directly rational logic, regardless. |
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So sayeth the crazy little dragon. |
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13th August 2021, 10:15 AM | #94 |
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13th August 2021, 11:05 AM | #95 |
Crazy Little Green Dragon
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So sayeth the crazy little dragon. |
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13th August 2021, 04:08 PM | #96 |
Philosopher
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13th August 2021, 05:46 PM | #97 |
Muse
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Belz, there are places in the US where there are no "good-paying jobs", unless you are related to someone who can put you on the payroll. The county where I grew up, in Southeast Tennessee, and where all my Trump-loving relatives still live, has NO factory jobs left. Since those were almost all the "good-paying jobs" in the county for folks with a high-school education, they have to drive to other counties for any work that pays better than fast-food or Wal-Mart.
Thirty-five years ago, I moved to Nashville for just that reason. I wanted to work in IT. But everyone can't move to an urban area and make it. |
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"Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away." - Philip K. Dick |
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16th August 2021, 11:09 AM | #98 |
Troublesome Passenger
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Hey Bubba, where's Trump? I thought Q said he'd be back? Also, where's Q?
Maybe (snicker) Amazing Polly knows. Bwahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah ahahaha!!! Another CTer fail. |
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Like as the waves make towards the pebbled shore, So do our minutes hasten to their end . . . WS |
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19th August 2021, 06:30 AM | #99 |
Quixoticist
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: ON Canada
Posts: 5,480
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Let's check in on the current state of QAnon thought.
She's taking calls! That's a violation! While dead.... no wait a clone! No wait... (reddit.com) Lol, they're still buffoons. |
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"Every saint has a past and every sinner has a future." - Oscar Wilde |
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10th September 2021, 07:21 AM | #100 |
Master Poster
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https://www.wesh.com/article/lakelan...riley/37528237
I’ve used spoiler tags because this story is pretty upsetting and enraging. QAnon fans - this is what happens when you spread lies and stupid fantasies about stuff which you don’t understand. It’s all fun and games until this week’s latest loon snaps. You bear a small but not infinitesimal amount of responsibility for this. Sure, you’ll never be convicted in any court, but please have a think about this before you repost some nonsense or start ‘just asking questions’. |
10th September 2021, 07:44 AM | #101 |
Penultimate Amazing
Join Date: Apr 2018
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Apparently the gunman who shot a family of five during a home invasion was a "Save the Children" crank, thought that trafficked children were in the house.
Quote:
https://thehill.com/blogs/blog-brief...ex-trafficking |
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10th September 2021, 08:02 AM | #102 |
Philosopher
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It's like a more horrifying version of when a heavily armed former Marine wearing a skull mask and a vest emblazoned with "Phantom Patriot" invaded the Bohemian Grove because people like Alex Jones had convinced him that Satanic rituals and human sacrifices were happening there. Nobody was killed that time.
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10th September 2021, 08:04 AM | #103 |
Self Employed
Remittance Man Join Date: Nov 2009
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"But just let other people believe what they want, why do you have to be right about everything, it's not hurting anyone..."
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"If everyone in the room says water is wet and I say it's dry that makes me smart because at least I'm thinking for myself!" - The Proudly Wrong. |
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15th September 2021, 01:27 PM | #104 |
Penultimate Amazing
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Pacifism is a shifty doctrine under which a man accepts the benefits of the social group without being willing to pay - and claims a halo for his dishonesty. Robert Heinlein. |
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15th September 2021, 06:00 PM | #105 |
Penultimate Amazing
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Could follow up with this (reasons why fraud was highly impossible):
https://www.washingtonpost.com/opini...p-lying-fraud/ |
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"Reality is what's left when you cease to believe." Philip K. Dick |
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9th October 2021, 06:35 PM | #106 |
Quixoticist
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In the "How the Mighty Have Fallen" category, this is perhaps the most plausible hypothesis QAnons have ever come up with.
Michael Flynn refutes QAnon claims that he worships Satan during guest appearance on Christian YouTube channel (businessinsider.com)
Quote:
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"Every saint has a past and every sinner has a future." - Oscar Wilde |
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11th October 2021, 02:02 AM | #107 |
Skepticifimisticalationist
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Another case of a parent losing custody of a child, deciding that the courts and any relatives the child was placed with must be members of the Evil Worldwide Childeating Cabal, and finding a sympathetic network of Qnuts willing to help them plan and execute an actual kidnapping in order to "rescue" their child. This one however comes to us [url=https://www.arkansasonline.com/news/2021/oct/10/qanon-beliefs-fuel-child-kidnap-plot-in-france/#.YWMU0Zj_Yug.twitter]from France[/i], with a sophisticated kidnapping plan, bankrolled by a French Qnut expat living in Malaysia, to abduct a young girl from her custodial grandmother and quickly transport the child and the Qmom out of the country. The plan succeeded quite well initially, but luckily the child was rescued by the police in Switzerland and the mother and her Q-friends have all been arrested, awaiting their respective trials.
It has long been known that Q-beliefs have metastasized beyond the borders of the United States to find footholds in every corner of the world - sometimes altered and adapted to fit local conditions and circumstances and sometimes amazingly not changed at all, complete with intact Trump-as messiah personality-cult aspects. With this child abduction though it now becomes evident that the violent-criminal aspects of QAnon have begun to spread internationally as well. |
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"¿WHAT KIND OF BIRD? ¿A PARANORMAL BIRD?" --- Carlos S., 2002 |
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11th October 2021, 05:34 AM | #108 |
Quixoticist
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: ON Canada
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I fixed your link:
https://www.arkansasonline.com/news/...lot-in-france/ I don't know if any details matter to conspiracists. They seem to have the sheer will to accept any stupid, paranoid, anti-authority, alt fact BS that comes around. This knows no borders. |
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"Every saint has a past and every sinner has a future." - Oscar Wilde |
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11th October 2021, 01:43 PM | #109 |
Philosopher
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The jobs that built that part of the country are gone. Some relocated overseas while others where in industry which phased out due to obsolescence. Textiles, manufacture, agriculture, warehouse, shipping/trucking, railroads are either gone or automated to the point where the "Joe Jobs" no longer exist.
Look up Gary, Indiana. It was once home to a thriving community of lower-middle class who worked in furniture factories. When those factories closed most of the white people moved out and the place is a post-apocalyptic wasteland. And then the union jobs are fewer meaning even if you land a factory job it won't come with healthcare or a pension. The irony os that most of those effected voted for candidates who facilitated the loss of those jobs with NAFTA, and in some cases over-reaching regulation.
Quote:
The problem is the disconnect between shopping at Walmart because it's cheaper, and the factory you work at closing because people are buying the identical Chinese-made competitor's product at Walmart. Literally shooting yourself in the foot with your shopping choices. Either way, you have a growing population of people who are being ignored by one political party being coopted by the other political party who has made a deal with the devil. |
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Disingenuous Piranha |
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12th October 2021, 06:51 AM | #110 |
"más divertido"
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Small nitpicks, for information only. When Gary had a population of 120,000, around a quarter of them worked at the US Steel Gary Works, once the largest steel mill in the world. By 1968, the ethnic Europeans who were losing their union jobs were also participating in white flight.
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12th October 2021, 01:17 PM | #111 |
Penultimate Amazing
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Pacifism is a shifty doctrine under which a man accepts the benefits of the social group without being willing to pay - and claims a halo for his dishonesty. Robert Heinlein. |
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15th October 2021, 11:38 AM | #112 |
Quixoticist
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Location: ON Canada
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They're at it again.
November 11 all it's finally happen. 🤣 Source military. (reddit.com) It's going to happen this time, for suresies. |
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"Every saint has a past and every sinner has a future." - Oscar Wilde |
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15th October 2021, 12:21 PM | #113 |
Troublesome Passenger
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Like as the waves make towards the pebbled shore, So do our minutes hasten to their end . . . WS |
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15th October 2021, 12:24 PM | #114 |
"más divertido"
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Those were cement milkshakes, not cement floats.
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17th October 2021, 04:25 PM | #115 |
Skepticifimisticalationist
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"¿WHAT KIND OF BIRD? ¿A PARANORMAL BIRD?" --- Carlos S., 2002 |
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19th October 2021, 06:10 AM | #116 |
Philosopher
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19th October 2021, 07:24 AM | #117 |
No longer the 1
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As human right is always something given, it always in reality reduces to the right which men give, "concede," to each other. If the right to existence is conceded to new-born children, then they have the right; if it is not conceded to them, as was the case among the Spartans and ancient Romans, then they do not have it. For only society can give or concede it to them; they themselves cannot take it, or give it to themselves. |
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19th October 2021, 11:56 AM | #118 |
Graduate Poster
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Surface tension will do if it's still a powder
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27th October 2021, 07:34 PM | #119 |
Quixoticist
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Location: ON Canada
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I'm shocked, I say.
This QAnon Influencer Accuses Democrats of Being Pedophiles. He Hides His Own Conviction With an Alias (rightwingwatch.org)
Quote:
Quote:
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"Every saint has a past and every sinner has a future." - Oscar Wilde |
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27th October 2021, 07:54 PM | #120 |
Troublesome Passenger
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Like as the waves make towards the pebbled shore, So do our minutes hasten to their end . . . WS |
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